Tristita Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Almost battlemaster Assassin (Shadows mirror) I see no problems here. I don't feel overpowered like operatives or sorcorers but I feel effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knifewrench Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Bads who don't know how to play the class make it look bad. Pros who know how to play the class make it look like a gosh darn monster on the battlefield. It's just that simple. Unfortunately there are many, many bads and so few pros. I get so much hate in Huttball because of the very high utility of this class when properly specced into tank & madness. Enemy just recovered the ball on their half and is making a trip back to center. Grip them into a pyre and stunlock them. Get ball back and sprint without opposition to the goal. I'm about to get stunned or gripped or knocked back at what would be a very inopportune moment for me. Cloak of Skill Fire. Rooted. Force Speed (with tank talent) Knockback is down but enemy is just standing on the edge of a platform. Spike out of combat boots them off almost comedically. These are just a few examples of all the bastardly things you can get away with as a Shadow/Assassin. And any time I hear complaints about sorcerers or missile spam I imagine that these people are either specced incorrectly or they do not have the gear for the firepower. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyrkur Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Maybe it changes at level 50 and Expertise, but my Shadow Strike (Maul) crits people for up to 4k(rare, ~3.2-3.5k on average) at level 40. I've yet to test out the recommended Infiltration spec for Burst through Project+Force Breach, but I've had decent success just backstabbing people to death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeratulz Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Maybe it changes at level 50 and Expertise, but my Shadow Strike (Maul) crits people for up to 4k(rare, ~3.2-3.5k on average) at level 40. I've yet to test out the recommended Infiltration spec for Burst through Project+Force Breach, but I've had decent success just backstabbing people to death. At my Shadow Strike crits for 3.2k -4k against other level 50 players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tristita Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Maybe it changes at level 50 and Expertise, but my Shadow Strike (Maul) crits people for up to 4k(rare, ~3.2-3.5k on average) at level 40. I've yet to test out the recommended Infiltration spec for Burst through Project+Force Breach, but I've had decent success just backstabbing people to death. What changes at 50 and expertise are stats and expertise lol 50 force energy for 4k damage is pathetically horrible. Maul (shadow Strike) is not worth using without w/e your proc is called active. Shock is the best force energy - damage ratio, followed by V. Slash (whatever your direct damage attack endline tree is called in your backstabby tree). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sirolos Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Strengths: You can run away from fights because you will be getting your azz kicked 90% of the time. That is, IF you can get force cloak to actually work (it doesn't about 50% of the time). Weaknesses: Everything. It's a melee class with no gap closers, weak burst, light armor and always force starved. Your Weaknesses is wrong. Its a melee class yes. But you have a pull a ranged stun a melee Knockdown a AoE knock back Force Speed Combat Stealth Interrupt and a slow.. This melee class when played right can do very decent in a 1v1 The only classes that really give you trouble would be a vanguard /powertech or a Healer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wintersnight Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Just wondering if they were good. What are their strengths and weaknesses? They rock if you're Tracer Missile spec Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrunchyGremlin Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I have a 27 infiltration shadow and i often hit #1 on the medals list. started PvPing with this shadow at about 15. I have a 27 sentinel as well and the shadow is much better at getting medals. My current medal record with this shadow is 9. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiussat Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Your Weaknesses is wrong. Its a melee class yes. But you have a pull a ranged stun a melee Knockdown a AoE knock back Force Speed Combat Stealth Interrupt and a slow.. This melee class when played right can do very decent in a 1v1 The only classes that really give you trouble would be a vanguard /powertech or a Healer You don't have a pull in all specs and not in the spec I played (infiltration, which is what 90% of people play). The melee knockdown only works from stealth. Can't use it in combat. The AoE knockback is much weaker than the assassin counter-part. I have noticed this a lot. Often times mine will fire and not even work, no one budges. You get combat stealth once every 2 minutes. By far, shadow is the weakest class in the game. This is not to say some people don't play it effectively (they do) but if you compare it to all other classes, it is weak. No way around it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nomaar Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Who cares anyway. I have unsubbed and am happy to go on my merry way. Yet here you still are, trolling away merrily all over the place. I guess saying good-bye is never easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knifewrench Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 (edited) You don't have a pull in all specs and not in the spec I played (infiltration, which is what 90% of people play). The melee knockdown only works from stealth. Can't use it in combat. The AoE knockback is much weaker than the assassin counter-part. I have noticed this a lot. Often times mine will fire and not even work, no one budges. You get combat stealth once every 2 minutes. By far, shadow is the weakest class in the game. This is not to say some people don't play it effectively (they do) but if you compare it to all other classes, it is weak. No way around it. Melee knockdown works if you are specced for it in tank. A knockback's usability is not limited to the distance it launches people. I use it a lot of the time to break up crowds and interrupt spellcasting. It is possible to do a combination of pull, stun, knockback to send the person where you need them to go if you really need them to go get pushed off that badly. The post after mine points out something I missed to refute: Whitebar = nothing works on them except warrior roots. And just like PvE, there is at least one cookie cutter spec that you have to go if you want to be successful. Going full DPS spec seems silly to me as you are playing in a game where you are going to get attacked and you have the weakest armor available. Essentially, if you are not as or more equipped than a scoundrel/op you will just be their handicapped cousin. You also have a stance that turns that into the equivalent of heavy armor. Being a tank spec does not limit you to just damage reduction as you can tell you have a couple of major DPS boosts in the tank tree like permanent regen increase and shock procs. Edited January 23, 2012 by Knifewrench Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fizzlechip Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 (edited) "The AoE knockback is much weaker than the assassin counter-part. I have noticed this a lot. Often times mine will fire and not even work, no one budges." Ever heard of Resolve? Learn your class and stop QQ. If an enemy has full resolve you CAN'T stun,cc or knockback Edited January 23, 2012 by Fizzlechip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiussat Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 "The AoE knockback is much weaker than the assassin counter-part. I have noticed this a lot. Often times mine will fire and not even work, no one budges." Ever heard of Resolve? Learn your class and stop QQ. If an enemy has full resolve you CAN'T stun,cc or knockback I find it hard to believe that all 5 people in my area have full resolve bars and thus don't budge. But, OK, if you say so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthOvertone Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 (edited) Love my Shadow in PvP, DPS/Tank Spec. Strength, of course, is Stealth. Being able to gain the initiative in a fight is a huge advantage. Weakness is our goofed up defensive stats; Def/Shield/Absorb. These are pretty much useless in PvP against an opponent that is aware of existing game mechanics. My Shadow has done much better in PvP since he scrapped Tanking gear and began using DPS gear instead. Really fun to play. Ever heard of Resolve? Learn your class and stop QQ. If an enemy has full resolve you CAN'T stun,cc or knockback Except Resolve doesn't always work as intended. Took 3 different SSs yesterday in WZs where I had a full Resolve bar but was still CC'd. Bug reported all 3. Edited January 23, 2012 by DarthOvertone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andymantium Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Bads who don't know how to play the class make it look bad. Pros who know how to play the class make it look like a gosh darn monster on the battlefield. It's just that simple. Unfortunately there are many, many bads and so few pros. This can be said of any class, imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kellindell Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Depends on your definition of good. Some people judge that by how much damage you have at the end of the game. Some judge it by how much pressure a class puts on someone in a solo fight. Some judge it by team play. Now, my shadow is only 25, so i can assume it gets better. But right now im balance specced, and the array of tricks I have is unreal. First off, its virtually impossible to cap something if I am around. My force breach is an AOE, my force in balance is an AOE and both of them have a huge radius, and both of them debuff you. On top of that you have your AOE knock back. You also have an instant cast dot, which of you spread around means people cant cap when you are dead, and you get a second dot/root at 31 talents. You also have an array of utility. Instant cast force lift that stuns if you end it, so essentially you can use your regular stun, force lift them and hit them before they catch another heal and they get stunned again. And when you get spinning kick, you open with that. Its a better stunlock then an operative, but you just dont get the damage they do to close the deal. Also dont forget, you can guard people, not only good for team play, but if you are being selfish you can squeeze 3 extra medals out of a match with it. Your sprint is also amazing. It can get you away from a fight, or help you juggle doors in voidstar. In a game where mounts arent allowed in PvP being the only class with an on demand sprint is AMAZING. And dont forget stealth, this allows you to guard points without people knowing it, allows you to approach a point, sap someone and cap. Allows you to get set up for a pass in hutt ball. Also you can vanish, which means if you dont feel like dying to piss someone off, just vanish. It has a ton of other utility uses in objective based PvP, but that one is my favorite. Vanish, grab the red buff, grab the green buff (heal) and go back into the fight. Or use your OOC heal. They may not appear to be useful on charts, but MAN shadows are amazing in pvp if you play to win and you play for the objective not for selfish reason or to run around and pad numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hethroin Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 You don't have a pull in all specs and not in the spec I played (infiltration, which is what 90% of people play). The melee knockdown only works from stealth. Can't use it in combat. The AoE knockback is much weaker than the assassin counter-part. I have noticed this a lot. Often times mine will fire and not even work, no one budges. You get combat stealth once every 2 minutes. By far, shadow is the weakest class in the game. This is not to say some people don't play it effectively (they do) but if you compare it to all other classes, it is weak. No way around it. Hi, I'm speced for PVE DPS and have a hard time in PVP, this class is weak. While the PVE DPS spec may work fine for some, it works better when you are in a group and not trying to rambo anything on your own. Shadows as a class are probably the least kiteable melee in the game given that they have force speed, force slow, some have pull while others have low slash with a higher uptime on force slow, or a 30m instant mez and a second 30m stun. Basically, in any spec, if people are consistently "getting away" you're doing it wrong. Yes, hutt ball is probably a bit of a pain on a non-pull-speced shadow, but it's not any easier on a sentinel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samoore Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I am new to MMOs, and I currently have a lvl31 Infiltration Spec Shadow. I have finished top in badges several times, but it can be very unforgiving when I am not on top of things. When you make a mistake, you look like you suck. When you understand what all of your abilities do and are on top of procs, cool-downs, etc. you can really kick some booty. Stat tracking is great for knowing what you can do, but I think there is more to be said about know how to get and stay in a good funk. And that has more to do with the player than the character. I doubt there is any lvl50 class that a beginner could play that would roll on any experienced player playing in top form. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblongship Posted January 23, 2012 Author Share Posted January 23, 2012 I've played my shadow to endgame and done a lot of pvp with it now so will post my feelings. 1) Infiltration shadows. I love playing infiltration shadow. However, get it into your mind that you are not a rogue! You have no openers like scoundrels / ops. What you do have, however, is the potential for high burst, decent sustained dps and a hell of a lot of utility. What you'll be doing a lot of as inf spec is maintaining force slow (snare) on your target so you can't be kited and then watching your procs. We have two main procs: circling shadows and find weakness. These two dramatically reduce the force cost of two of your main skills. If you don't watch for these procs, you'll run out of force very quick and then die. However, perma-snare, decent sustained dps and a lot of CC makes you one of the best 1v1 classes around. Time your skills and clickies right and you can also do massive burst. Where your weakness lies is in squishiness and having to watch procs. Your *signature* skill - your backstab - costs half your force and does bugger all damage unless you get the find weakness proc. Then it does much better damage and has 50% armour penetration. But, always watching your procs is both hard and irritating. 2) Kinetic Hybrid Shadow For the last week I've been playing as a hybrid tank. I have 23 points spec into kinetic tree which gives me most of the tanking utility and defensiveness. The other 18 are spent in balance which gives me another instant CC, a decent ranged AoE plus a proc that gives instant cast / 0 force DoT. This build is all about being a nuisance! You'll have a lot of survivability but due to the mechanics of kinetic ward you'll still drop if focused. Like all tanks, guard your healer/dps and taunt like mad. Next its about utility and DoTs. You have lots of CC to stop runners, still have your interupt, taunts to reduce damage to teammates and on top of that you now have 30m AoE to interupting turret/door captures and an instant cast DoT to further interupt. Lastly, you have your "pull" mechanic which makes you the perfect person to act as assist target. I'm loving my kinetic hybrid atm but I do miss my effective DPS (can still post great numbers but as it is more dots/aoe a lot of it gets healed through). So, in short, Shadows are great. However, so much of it is about CC/Utility and watching for procs that the majority I meet are pretty rubbish. Its hard to play but if you figure out your utility and procs early on then it becomes easy to play and easy to win with! Thank you for this very well written post. It helped me out a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrunchyGremlin Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 (edited) speaking of squeezing out extra medals the shadow has a range 30m taunt, mind controll, that prevents 30% damage unless they attack the shadow. only last 6 secs with a 12 sec cooldown. I spawn that all the time. It gives me around 5k+ damage protection every WZ. basically 1 free medal. Edited January 23, 2012 by CrunchyGremlin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
settledown Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Shadows are great, especially tankadows. Kinetic/Deception hybrids are quite useful and fun to play it seems. Shadow/Assassin takes half a brain to do decently with, so that's probably where most of the complaints come from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djpravda Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Shadow Assassin PvP ownage http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=To-k7ZaZGmA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToeTags Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Shadow Assassin PvP ownage http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=To-k7ZaZGmA By Ownage, you mean out gearing most people, never really getting focus on by more then 1-2 players, getting max hits of like 6k?, and..... lastly fighting a decently geared anni mara and having to run and get a healing buff only to almost die again if help didnt show? Not sure how highly you think of yourself. But this movie shows nothing that a player who actually knows what there looking at would deem impressive. Sure its -decent- damage, sure you can lock down undergeared healers, any class can pull the numbers and outcome you showed. Sry, but your movie is nothing to keep trying to brag about.... in multiple forums now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblongship Posted January 23, 2012 Author Share Posted January 23, 2012 What crew skills should I take as a shadow? Now that Biochem has been nerfed a little....and frankly I was tired of picking flowers on all my characters lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grapenut Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 FYI -PVP favors the ranged in this game. Be prepared to be knocked around like a ping pong ball. With no gap closer you be annoyed. I have a lvl 48 shadow. I do warzones a lot. I used to think infiltration line is good, but I am thinking tank kinetic is better with the force pull and defense. I do get 7-9 medals. Mostly from being a tank, paladin and damage absorb ones. I am sure if planets align and if you can click your skills and they go off I could do more dps. But the problem with trying to hit anyone who runs around in circles, keeping on target and figuring out if your procs are up can be a full time job. Roll a bh/commando or sage. ranged seems more rewarding at this time. I do think force jump is awesome, if you want to be a jedi go guardian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts