What's with the talent trees? Blatant copy of WOW

[Spynnal]

I'm beginning to see that WoW has been and always will be the only game that has ever existed for all eternity. Fact: Vanilla WoW started at the big bang.

 

 

One of WoW's biggest strengths, imho, was stealing every other good idea previous games had, and polishing them. So it isn't surprising so much gets credited to them. But yeah, WoW was only what it was because of what came before too.

[Anelitt]

Oh lookie, another disgrunted WoW fan who thinks that Blizzard invented the entire RPG genre and everything that goes along with it...

 

Whats your opnion then on the fact that every single talent in my tree is a copy of wow talents, old ones even?

 

Are you saying that any innovation or new talent whasoever is impossible and any mmo with talent trees by default can only copy other mmo's 1:1?

[archifikoss]

I know I'm low level (20 on most of my characters) but I don't 'feel' like a certain spec. I hated the fact that in WOW when I wanted to be frost Mage I had to go really deep into the tree to feel like a frost mage. Same with warriors fury etc.

 

I want to feel like a scrapper or sawbones etc. Like I said I don't 'feel' like one early on. Again it was something that irked me WOW and after so long they changed it in Cataclysm and I liked it. Some people didn't but it was a nice change.

 

Some of the early talents see, useless for scoundrel > scrapper and Shadow > infiltration. Or am I missing something?

 

Hmmm, I disagree here. As a Sniper I felt the part almost immediately, what with my portable cover and shiny new sniper rifle It does take a while to "grow" into the spec though, I'm still getting there!

 

However I feel like there's not much choice in the talent system... They're basically quite streamlined. At least one can experiment with hybrid builds for solo play, for the heck of it

[Keii]

WoW copied the talent trees from Diablo 2. However, they copied the talent trees for Diablo 2 from somewhere else.

[RoadtoArkham]

Whats your opnion then on the fact that every single talent in my tree is a copy of wow talents, old ones even?

 

Are you saying that any innovation or new talent whasoever is impossible and any mmo with talent trees by default can only copy other mmo's 1:1?

 

I disagree. I extensively played Rogues and Warlocks and I have yet to see a carbon copy of their talents. Some aspects have been carried over, yes, but it only makes sense for certain classes and builds.

[Heathlr]

I know I'm low level (20 on most of my characters) but I don't 'feel' like a certain spec. I hated the fact that in WOW when I wanted to be frost Mage I had to go really deep into the tree to feel like a frost mage. Same with warriors fury etc.

 

I want to feel like a scrapper or sawbones etc. Like I said I don't 'feel' like one early on. Again it was something that irked me WOW and after so long they changed it in Cataclysm and I liked it. Some people didn't but it was a nice change.

 

Some of the early talents see, useless for scoundrel > scrapper and Shadow > infiltration. Or am I missing something?

 

Honestly I don't think people like the OP even deserve our replies and won't be playing long enough to have a valid opinion.

 

The advanced class system alone should make it feel different than WoW, 2 separate, permanent directions with 3 talent trees each, 1 tree balanced and shared between both ACs.

 

Funny how you can't please everyone. Cataclysm is regarded by most to be the worst WoW expansion, and although I'm still subbed to WoW, it has gone noticeably downhill since WotLK.

 

I know this is a somewhat elitist point of view, but the OP is showing clear signs of a "Wrath baby," and one of the reasons that WoW has been driven into the ground by the complaining noobs on the forums. Go make another thread complaining about the fact that there's no LFG tool. Let's not try to ruin this game too, eh?

[Kourage]

WRONG

 

 

They stole it from AoC!

no it was LOTRO !

no it was EQ !

[JDTC]

the other day i made a human character

 

then i realized thye stole this from wow

 

:mad::mad: cancelled

[Heathlr]

And another thing, I'm tired of seeing these posts on the forums and people talking in the low level general chats about how this game copied WoW, blah blah blah.

 

Ok, WoW copied EQ2 and every other MMO or MMORPG on the market at the time, and upgraded. No different than what SWTOR has done. They're all games of the same genre, of course they're going to have some similarities.

 

That must mean that BF and CoD suck because they're clear copies of CS and Goldeneye right? Ya, and that Sonic the Hedgehog. Just another wannabe Mario sidescroller.

 

Criticizing games in the same genre of copying each other is beyond ignorant.

[Lowestofthekeys]

Whats your opnion then on the fact that every single talent in my tree is a copy of wow talents, old ones even?

 

Are you saying that any innovation or new talent whasoever is impossible and any mmo with talent trees by default can only copy other mmo's 1:1?

 

Just a question... which talents are exactly like the old WoW talents?

[DarthBroom]

Honestly I don't think people like the OP even deserve our replies and won't be playing long enough to have a valid opinion.

 

The advanced class system alone should make it feel different than WoW, 2 separate, permanent directions with 3 talent trees each, 1 tree balanced and shared between both ACs.

 

Funny how you can't please everyone. Cataclysm is regarded by most to be the worst WoW expansion, and although I'm still subbed to WoW, it has gone noticeably downhill since WotLK.

 

I know this is a somewhat elitist point of view, but the OP is showing clear signs of a "Wrath baby," and one of the reasons that WoW has been driven into the ground by the complaining noobs on the forums. Go make another thread complaining about the fact that there's no LFG tool. Let's not try to ruin this game too, eh?

 

BioWare is doing it so great on it's own. The ruining part. Or maybe it's our fault for rushing to end-game finding that it's a 1:1 copy of WoW:TBC, except it is broken beyond reason with gamebreaking bugs from several months in beta.

 

Have you even read most of the developers posts? Many essential features is in the design stage.

 

This game is great for casual gamers though, I can't deny that. I guess you'll have to give this game a couple of months or maybe a year until it has a sustainable end-game that's worth subscribing for but that will be too late since Diablo 3, an unreleased game seems more promosing than $300 million SWTOR, it has better PvP and PvE.

[Bullwrath]

the other day i made a human character

 

then i realized thye stole this from wow

 

:mad::mad: cancelled

 

+1 internet 4U

[sharkfinsix]

Weird wrong quote ended up in my quote text.

 

anyways

 

WOW copied games before it. Games before copied games before, and the cycle goes on.

Edited January 12, 2012 by sharkfinsix

[Liquid_Drano]

I know I'm low level (20 on most of my characters) but I don't 'feel' like a certain spec. I hated the fact that in WOW when I wanted to be frost Mage I had to go really deep into the tree to feel like a frost mage. Same with warriors fury etc.

 

I want to feel like a scrapper or sawbones etc. Like I said I don't 'feel' like one early on. Again it was something that irked me WOW and after so long they changed it in Cataclysm and I liked it. Some people didn't but it was a nice change.

 

Some of the early talents see, useless for scoundrel > scrapper and Shadow > infiltration. Or am I missing something?

 

No.... please no. You had to put 31 points into those before venturing off into another tree which is complete hogwash.

 

This is how it should be. Let people put points in as they see fit. In any tree they want. When Cata did that EVERYONE had the same builds. So lame. No experimentation, no creativity from the player.

 

And Blizzard didn't create the talent tree.............. stop saying WoW clone..

[Heathlr]

BioWare is doing it so great on it's own. The ruining part. Or maybe it's our fault for rushing to end-game finding that it's a 1:1 copy of WoW:TBC, except it is broken beyond reason with gamebreaking bugs from several months in beta.

 

Have you even read most of the developers posts? Many essential features is in the design stage.

 

This game is great for casual gamers though, I can't deny that. I guess you'll have to give this game a couple of months or maybe a year until it has a sustainable end-game that's worth subscribing for but that will be too late since Diablo 3, an unreleased game seems more promosing than $300 million SWTOR, it has better PvP and PvE.

 

Thing is...this game has more endgame content than WoW did on it's release. Only problem is, WoW didn't have WoW to compete with when it released. Meaning they could take their time releasing new content because of lack of competition.

[NasherUK]

First of all wow stole the idea from older games and simplified it. Why do people keep thinking features in MMOs started with wow? Nothing in wow is original appart from the name, it's all been done before.

 

Second, wow's talent trees are very basic. Theres is room for making a hybrid or unique build as most of your points have to go in 1 tree where about 20% of the talents are pointless (after 7 years they somehow manage to make it worse).

Edited January 12, 2012 by NasherUK

[DarthTenor]

OK WOW is the first MMO I ever played more than a month.

 

I've played Rift WAR And CoH this systems were different than wow.

 

WAR had tees but it was implemented differently. At least in WAR I felt like a Rifleman than going deep into the tree.

 

Rift had their skills trees uniquely done where most of the the new abilities were acquired through the trees itself.

 

 

COH had different take on the tree system as well.

 

Look I can understand that there is nothing new to the talent system in MMO's even D2 but i would like to feel a certain spec rather than wait till I'm 30 or greater to actually experience what the spec is like. That's all I was asking.

[Slightlycampana]

I haven't played enough of this game to know, yet, but are hybrid specs (i.e. speccing into two trees with roughly 50:50 or 65:35) viable?

[mikekdn]

the other day i made a human character

 

then i realized thye stole this from wow

 

:mad::mad: cancelled

 

WoW invented humans

[Anelitt]

Just a question... which talents are exactly like the old WoW talents?

 

Every. Single. One. Of all my trees (sorcerer)

 

If u want me to list one of them np, ill just do the one i am currently specced in, Lighting tree:

 

Tier 1:

 

- convection (2,4,6% dmg increase on select spells)

Dont think i need to elaborate further? as cookie cutter copy as can be.

 

-Reserves: Increases max force

Old arcane mage +healer talent.

 

-Electric induction: Force cost decrease of spells.

Every healer had those in wow.

 

Tier 2:

 

- Lightning Spire: increases range of some spells.

Copy of stoneage caster range talents wow used to have.

 

- Exsanguinate: Increases dot duration 3/6 sec.

SW: pain talent from wow.

 

- Subversion: Pushback reduction + slightly increased regen.

Every caster spec has those in wow.

 

- Lightning barrier: Increased absorb of shield.

Disc priest talent copy.

 

Tier 3:

 

- Supression: cooldown reduction on CC.

Copy of shaman Hex talent.

 

- Chain lightning.

Yeah no further explanation needed.

 

- Lightning barrage: Force lightning ticks 2 as fats when procced.

1:1 copy of the old mage talent missile barrage:

 

- Electric bindings: Root on aoe.

This is improved cone of cold, added on a slightly different aoe though.

 

Tier 4:

 

- Lightning storm: Chance on nuke to make chainlightning instant.

Ele shammy talent.

 

- Lightning effusion: Crits reduce force cost of next two spells.

This would be clearcasting

 

-Backlash: Shield CCs nearby enemys when ending.

- This is Shattered barrier. frostmage talent.

 

Tier 5:

 

-Forked Lightning: Chance on nuke to make a second nuke for diminished dmg.

1:1 copy of lightning overload.

 

- Conduction: Forked lightning increase dmg by 1% stacks 3 times.

1:1 copy of ret pala talent.

 

- Polarity shift: 20% haste for 10 sec.

This is frostmage talent icy veins.

 

Tier 6:

 

- reverberating force: Increases crit dmg by 10/20/30/40/50%

Ancient wow talent all casters sued to have and was scrapped.

 

Tier 7:

 

- Thundering blast: Nuke that auto crits with dot on mob.

This would be a direct copy of Lava burst of eleshammys.

 

 

There you got it, without exeption all talents are direct knockoffs. I could make the same list with my two other talent trees.

 

The OP has a valid concern and all he gets is blind fanboys hating and telling that all mmo's are equal talent tree wise.

 

Is anyone seriously gonna argue that it is to much to expect even just 1(!) new spell when buying an mmo?

 

Why would anyone downplay this and act as if it is fine so no changes are made by devs?

Please tell me i must know lol.

Edited January 12, 2012 by Anelitt

[Karast]

Lol.

 

Wow did not invent that style of talent system. Its pretty generic and can be found in many different games. Wow was not the first MMO or game with talent trees just fyi.

 

Although I do think it would have been better if they did a more rift like system with the skill trees and the advanced classes.

 

Or like warhammer and have the points spent in a tree increase the level of the ability. If swtor was the same way we wouldn't have the problem of people just spamming the base rank heals on the hybrids that we have at the moment.

 

Wow didn't invite the wheel it just introduced a lot of people to it.

[Anelitt]

Lol.

 

Wow did not invent that style of talent system. Its pretty generic and can be found in many different games. Wow was not the first MMO or game with talent trees just fyi.

 

Although I do think it would have been better if they did a more rift like system with the skill trees and the advanced classes.

 

Or like warhammer and have the points spent in a tree increase the level of the ability. If swtor was the same way we wouldn't have the problem of people just spamming the base rank heals on the hybrids that we have at the moment.

 

Wow didn't invite the wheel it just introduced a lot of people to it.

 

I agree with what you say, ofc wow has not invented the talent tree system, but thats not the argument here.

 

Look at the post above yours.

 

Do you really think copying every single talent 1:1 from another game is ok?

[PjPablo]

Every. Single. One. Of all my trees (sorcerer)

 

If u want me to list one of them np, ill just do the one i am currently specced in, Lighting tree:

 

Tier 1:

 

- convection (2,4,6% dmg increase on select spells)

Dont think i need to elaborate further? as cookie cutter copy as can be.

 

-Reserves: Increases max force

Old arcane mage +healer talent.

 

-Electric induction: Force cost decrease of spells.

Every healer had those in wow.

 

Tier 2:

 

- Lightning Spire: increases range of some spells.

Copy of stoneage caster range talents wow used to have.

 

- Exsanguinate: Increases dot duration 3/6 sec.

SW: pain talent from wow.

 

- Subversion: Pushback reduction + slightly increased regen.

Every caster spec has those in wow.

 

- Lightning barrier: Increased absorb of shield.

Disc priest talent copy.

 

Tier 3:

 

- Supression: cooldown reduction on CC.

Copy of shaman Hex talent.

 

- Chain lightning.

Yeah no further explanation needed.

 

- Lightning barrage: Force lightning ticks 2 as fats when procced.

1:1 copy of the old mage talent missile barrage:

 

- Electric bindings: Root on aoe.

This is improved cone of cold, added on a slightly different aoe though.

 

Tier 4:

 

- Lightning storm: Chance on nuke to make chainlightning instant.

Ele shammy talent.

 

- Lightning effusion: Crits reduce force cost of next two spells.

This would be clearcasting

 

-Backlash: Shield CCs nearby enemys when ending.

- This is Shattered barrier. frostmage talent.

 

Tier 5:

 

-Forked Lightning: Chance on nuke to make a second nuke for diminished dmg.

1:1 copy of lightning overload.

 

- Conduction: Forked lightning increase dmg by 1% stacks 3 times.

1:1 copy of ret pala talent.

 

- Polarity shift: 20% haste for 10 sec.

This is frostmage talent icy veins.

 

Tier 6:

 

- reverberating force: Increases crit dmg by 10/20/30/40/50%

Ancient wow talent all casters sued to have and was scrapped.

 

Tier 7:

 

- Thundering blast: Nuke that auto crits with dot on mob.

This would be a direct copy of Lava burst of eleshammys.

 

 

There you got it, without exeption all talents are direct knockoffs. I could make the same list with my two other talent trees.

 

The OP has a valid concern and all he gets is blind fanboys hating and telling that all mmo's are equal talent tree wise.

 

Is anyone seriously gonna argue that it is to much to expect even just 1(!) new spell when buying an mmo?

 

Why would anyone downplay this and act as if it is fine so no changes are made by devs?

Please tell me i must know lol.

 

I see your tree and raise you this:

 

(Another poster created this, not me)

 

http://i.imgur.com/kET1L.jpg

[ferroz]

lol..the "funny" thing about "talent" "trees" is that most tree levels have only 5 POINTS to "choose" from. Which of course 9 out of 10 times mean there's no choice whatsoever, because you're ending up taking all 5 points....

you don't have to spend 5 points per tier... you can spend 7 points in t1 and 3 in t2 and then start spending points in t3

[Tahana]

Neither did WoW for the majority of its existence.

 

And now its going to no tree and pick some fluff for flavor abilities.. nice. Hello Kitty Adventure Isle anyone?