Bounty Hunters/Troopers need to be tweaked.

[killercheesepuff]

I just want to get this out of the way, I DO NOT want a nerf for these classes, just at the state they are in now it just feels very off. I have two main issues, the first is with Tracer Missle/Grav Spam for Mercs/Commando's. Yes it can be interrupted, but they have other abilities that hit almost as hard or harder for that pitiful 4 second interrupt (I'm not sure if its the same for other classes, I'm a sage.) I know it can be LoS'd and CC'd and whatever, thats not my problem with the ability. My problem is that by using one, maybe 2 or three abilities Merc's can out DPS me using at least 6. I don't think they should have less DPS I just wish they had to work harder to get it. Spamming 1 ability forinstnt win is just plain stupid. I'm not sure exactly what should be tweaked, I'm not entirely familiar with Merc Abilities, perhaps one of the many Merc's/Commando's can help me on this.

 

My second point is healing. Dear god, I never thought there would be a time where a Healer can tank better than a Tank. This isn't a problem with all BH healers, but it still stands that healers should be squishy on their own no questions asked. I had two absolutly horrible experiences fighting a BH healer which, I will admit, was semi a product of his biochem/buff spaming (Nerf this too please) as I saw his Rakata buff. I have had two seperate occasions where, me and 2 other Dps's literally spent almost 30 seconds trying to kill a single BH healer. No other healers, no tank that put guard on him nothing. just him and his fat *** tanking damage from 3 lvl 50, 50, and 49's all with CC'ing, interrupts and stims. Eventually we gave up and instntly he switched to DpS mode somehow and proceeded to do 9k damage to me in 2 cool downs. WHAT. I'm not even sure what ability he was using just that one sec I'm full health and the next I have 30% even with my Force armor up. It was even worse when he was in a group and it was impossible to stop the heals. This seriously needs to be looked at, I'm not saying I'm the best player, but if 3 max/almost max's players can't kill one guy on his own something is seriously wrong. Sorry for the rant, I'm sure people will point out how wrong I as or something.

[BobaFurz]

PvP is a joke right now

[Aethyrprime]

I just want to get this out of the way, I DO NOT want a nerf for these classes, just at the state they are in now it just feels very off. I have two main issues, the first is with Tracer Missle/Grav Spam for Mercs/Commando's. Yes it can be interrupted, but they have other abilities that hit almost as hard or harder for that pitiful 4 second interrupt (I'm not sure if its the same for other classes, I'm a sage.) I know it can be LoS'd and CC'd and whatever, thats not my problem with the ability. My problem is that by using one, maybe 2 or three abilities Merc's can out DPS me using at least 6. I don't think they should have less DPS I just wish they had to work harder to get it. Spamming 1 ability forinstnt win is just plain stupid. I'm not sure exactly what should be tweaked, I'm not entirely familiar with Merc Abilities, perhaps one of the many Merc's/Commando's can help me on this.

 

My second point is healing. Dear god, I never thought there would be a time where a Healer can tank better than a Tank. This isn't a problem with all BH healers, but it still stands that healers should be squishy on their own no questions asked. I had two absolutly horrible experiences fighting a BH healer which, I will admit, was semi a product of his biochem/buff spaming (Nerf this too please) as I saw his Rakata buff. I have had two seperate occasions where, me and 2 other Dps's literally spent almost 30 seconds trying to kill a single BH healer. No other healers, no tank that put guard on him nothing. just him and his fat *** tanking damage from 3 lvl 50, 50, and 49's all with CC'ing, interrupts and stims. Eventually we gave up and instntly he switched to DpS mode somehow and proceeded to do 9k damage to me in 2 cool downs. WHAT. I'm not even sure what ability he was using just that one sec I'm full health and the next I have 30% even with my Force armor up. It was even worse when he was in a group and it was impossible to stop the heals. This seriously needs to be looked at, I'm not saying I'm the best player, but if 3 max/almost max's players can't kill one guy on his own something is seriously wrong. Sorry for the rant, I'm sure people will point out how wrong I as or something.

As long as BH/Troopers are allowed to wear tank gear and still heal at great efficiency they will be the king of all healers and the best pvp tank and a top dps all in the same bucket of tears. It's sad that I had to explain to one of my guild mates who is a lvl 50 champ geared dps BH:Merc that the reason the troopers we face don't die nearly as easy as he does is this one factor.. Healer in Tank gear = OP!

 

It is quite obvious when you encounter one because it takes a small raid force to kill them. If you come across a trooper/bh that does not die like a normal person you can guess this is likely the case.

Edited January 12, 2012 by Aethyrprime

[Kelticfury]

Eventually we gave up and instntly he switched to DpS mode somehow and proceeded to do 9k damage to me in 2 cool downs.

 

2 hits for ~4.5k.... I don't think that is beyond the reach of any class. Sounds like 3 bads attacking 1 good.

[Kjetl]

Ok, if they also nerf lightning/project spamming and static shield...

 

The toughest group in the game, with the best survivability is a group of sorcs (haven't seen any sages do this, but, uh, they are mirrors after all).

 

Plus, commandos and mercs are not tanks, they are dps / heal hybrids. The tanks are powermechs and vanguards.

 

Having said all this, rocket/grav round spamming IS very annoying, especially when you interrupt it only to have the spam begin again INSTANTLY.

Edited January 12, 2012 by Kjetl

[Kelticfury]

As long as BH/Troopers are allowed to wear tank gear and still heal at great efficiency they will be the king of all healers and the best pvp tank and a top dps all in the same bucket of tears. It's sad that I had to explain to one of my guild mates who is a lvl 50 champ geared dps BH:Merc that the reason the troopers we face don't die nearly as easy as he does is this one factor.. Healer in Tank gear = OP!

 

It is quite obvious when you encounter one because it takes a small raid force to kill them. If you come across a trooper/bh that does not die like a normal person you can guess this is likely the case.

 

So you are advocating what exactly? That the heavy armor classes no longer get heavy armor? Or perhaps take the healing skill tree away? Or maybe its just that the guy you couldn't take down was using stims and stacking buffs?

 

Do you even know?

[Aethyrprime]

So you are advocating what exactly? That the heavy armor classes no longer get heavy armor? Or perhaps take the healing skill tree away? Or maybe its just that the guy you couldn't take down was using stims and stacking buffs?

 

Do you even know?

 

Not one guy. Many many many encounters with many different troopers using this. Also BH's using this as we fight both sides in huttball as imps. If I were to make a suggestion it would be to make bounty hunters/troopers wear medium armor for their dps/healing spec just like mauraders vs juggies. It isn't that hard of a concept to grasp. I didn't think I needed to spell it out, but, there ya go. Now it's all spelled out in perfect engrish.

Edited January 12, 2012 by Aethyrprime

[ThanMazus]

Ok, if they also nerf lightning/project spamming and static shield...

 

The toughest group in the game, with the best survivability is a group of sorcs (haven't seen any sages do this, but, uh, they are mirrors after all).

 

Plus, commandos and mercs are not tanks, they are dps / heal hybrids. The tanks are powermechs and vanguards.

 

Having said all this, rocket/grav round spamming IS very annoying, especially when you interrupt it only to have the spam begin again INSTANTLY.

 

What kind of interrupt are you using that wears off INSTANTLY?

[Braydop]

Calm down!!!!!! evert class is op in their own way, BH and Troopers have an op ability, tracer/grav missile and wear heavy armor, scoundrels, operatives are killers in stealth but are squishy when on the defence, scorcs/sages have massive range on their spells. if a class is built properly they are op, every class can be op stop crying because you got beaten by one player who was better built than yours simple. everyone wants every other class nerfed but their own, so they can dominate pvp and say their class is the best. SIMPLE

[Viikuna]

Commandos/Merc's cannot use Shield Generators, which means that the only defensive stat they gain from tank gear is Defense itself.

 

- PvP Tank gear gives about 153 defense, which i believe adds about 7% to ranged and melee avoidance.

 

- Fully PvP tank geared Commando/Merc would have about 12% melee and ranged avoidance. (5% base)

 

- Sage/Sorc got base avoidance of 10% for melee and ranged.

 

I would say that the case here is that the hard to kill commandos/mercs you've faced have just been nearly or fully PvP geared with high expertise + biochem stuff, while the people trying to kill him have had few or no PvP gear / poor gear in general.

 

Just a guess

Edited January 12, 2012 by Viikuna

[CHRISGG]

please don't make nerf threads if you blanket the entire class rather than actually know the name of the AC

[Aethyrprime]

Commandos/Merc's cannot use Shield Generators, which means that the only defensive stat they gain from tank gear is Defense itself.

 

- PvP Tank gear gives about 153 defense, which i believe adds about 7% to ranged and melee avoidance.

 

- Fully PvP tank geared Commando/Merc would have about 12% melee and ranged avoidance. (5% base)

 

- Sage/Sorc got base avoidance of 10% for melee and ranged.

 

I would say that the case here is that the hard to kill commandos/mercs you've faced have just been nearly or fully PvP geared with high expertise + biochem stuff, while the people trying to kill him have had few or no PvP gear / poor gear in general.

 

Just a guess

Nope. Fully geared vs fully 3 fully geared. Just a correction!

[DarthBloodloss]

I agree that BH is strong in DPS. But we have almost zero utility. If the BH is spamming tracer missile on you, you are getting off the hook easy. The BH damage rotation consists of 4 (or 5) attacks.

 

Tracer Missile - Slightly debuffs the targets defense, slightly buffs the BH defense

 

Rail Shot - Stronger than Tracer Missile, can be used on the run, gets damage boost from Tracers (in addition to the tracer debuff)

 

Unload - Stronger than Tracer Missile, Tracer Missile has a 30% chance to proc an effect where it clears the cooldown of Unload and boosts the next Unloads damage by 30%. This is a pretty mean attack because it basically hits 2 or 3 times in 1 use

 

Heatseeker Missile - Strongest attack we have. Can be used on the run, and any crits do an extra 30% damage on top of the mega crit from a Merc in the first place (mine will be +115%)

 

The normal attack rotation would be:

 

Tracer, Tracer, Tracer

Heatseeker

Unload

Tracer, Tracer

Rail Shot

Tracer, Tracer

Unload

Tracer, Tracer

Heatseeker

Unload

Railshot

Tracer, Tracer

 

The 5th attack I mentioned is Rapid Shots. Its our only attack that causes no heat. (Our only "free to use" attack") Most people will use it alot in PvE, but in PvP there is no need to hold back.

[Durzaka]

Nope. Fully geared vs fully 3 fully geared. Just a correction!

 

if 3 fully geared dps cant kill one healer, the problem is with the dps, entirely.

[BegaTasty]

BH are not that tough, I had a 39 BH jump me yesterday when I was 37-8 JK. He died, I was still at full HP...They dont hit that hard at all

[harkain]

heavy armor is about 5-6% more defence than medium armor, you actually think it makes a huge difference ? Tank stats does not work in pvp so its not like you can inflate your protection with defence either and the healer cannot use a shield gen.

 

I tried to make sense here but then a sorc came and spammed force lightning and killed me (litteraly the only 1 spell class)

[Dooger]

if you can pressure someone using medium length cast time abilities in pvp..

[Avindra]

I agree that BH is strong in DPS. But we have almost zero utility. If the BH is spamming tracer missile on you, you are getting off the hook easy. The BH damage rotation consists of 4 (or 5) attacks.

 

Tracer Missile - Slightly debuffs the targets defense, slightly buffs the BH defense

 

Rail Shot - Stronger than Tracer Missile, can be used on the run, gets damage boost from Tracers (in addition to the tracer debuff)

 

Unload - Stronger than Tracer Missile, Tracer Missile has a 30% chance to proc an effect where it clears the cooldown of Unload and boosts the next Unloads damage by 30%. This is a pretty mean attack because it basically hits 2 or 3 times in 1 use

 

Heatseeker Missile - Strongest attack we have. Can be used on the run, and any crits do an extra 30% damage on top of the mega crit from a Merc in the first place (mine will be +115%)

 

The normal attack rotation would be:

 

Tracer, Tracer, Tracer

Heatseeker

Unload

Tracer, Tracer

Rail Shot

Tracer, Tracer

Unload

Tracer, Tracer

Heatseeker

Unload

Railshot

Tracer, Tracer

 

The 5th attack I mentioned is Rapid Shots. Its our only attack that causes no heat. (Our only "free to use" attack") Most people will use it alot in PvE, but in PvP there is no need to hold back.

 

Isnt stun/mez and heals utility ?? Oh and knockback ?

 

20% armor reduction to your oponent doesnt seem that slight. Also 10% damage reduction is pretty nice too. All from spamming your DPS missile.

Edited January 12, 2012 by Avindra

[Avindra]

Quote:

 

Honestly, interrupting a commando isn't even that big of a deal unless they are bad.

 

When I get interrupted what do I do? Do slightly less damage for a moment and hit charged bolts (unless I'm focusing a tank, then it actually accomplished something by making me switch to attacks that hit their shield) OR I just hit full auto if it's up. Both potentially hit just as hard or harder than Grav round, depending on the debuffs on the target.

 

The spec is completely stupid. If someone half competent is using it, it's ridiculous. I hope it gets nerfed or they buff assault so I don't feel compelled to play this braindead spec.

 

Gunnery gets:

 

Huge turret damage/burst

10 seconds shaved off knockback CD (15 sec cd with set bonus)

Knockback added to Stockstrike (6 sec cd)

Small heal on ammo recharge (if you take it, it's really small).

A proc to make my full auto hit 30% harder, when I get this proc I sticky+full auto a sorc and a lot of times I can drop them in the duration of full auto. It can crit for upwards of 2.5k (a tick) without juicing the damage with buff stacking.

 

Assault gets:

 

Big damage on assault plastique (upgrade to sticky grenade) but it loses it's aoe component and it still has a 15 second cd

Shorter CD on all defensive cd's when getting hit. This one is actually really useful, makes your CD's available almost every skirmish.

25 second CD on knockback (25 with set bonus)

No knockback on stockstrike

No pushback resistance on any castable damaging ability.

 

There's just no reason to spec Assault at the moment except for flavor. You don't need to play that smart to get kills with Gunnery, I regularly facetank marauders/assassins and win. Just kinda silly I can do that.

 

50 Commando - Atreus - Hyperspace Cannon (PVE West Coast)

Because there's more to PVP than open world PVP.

 

End Quote.

 

This came from someone playing Commando which is the mirror of Merc.

[Nezrik]

if 3 fully geared dps cant kill one healer, the problem is with the dps, entirely.

 

bad players will always be bad.

[Huggy]

This is a screenshot at the end of a warzone match, Sorcerers have no room to talk.

 

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j398/Huggie1974/Screenshot_2012-01-09_16_28_33_512538.jpg

 

Sorcerer with 601174 damage and 86552 healing.

[Avindra]

Dotting up everyone and aoe gets high numbers especially in voidstar where you get 2 rounds worth of damage to apply. Just AoE the doors.

 

Your 33 kills for 150k vs his 44 kills for 610k, unless they have 4 times more HP than the people you killed it was just aoe damage from your team standing at the doors.

Edited January 12, 2012 by Avindra