Ghaiana Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 As much as I loved WoW in the early years, I'm not wanting WoW. First: I don't understand anyway why people on the one hand complain that this game is too much as WoW and on the other hand that is not enough like WoW. Bioware clearly introduced some innovations on WoW's model: voice over, stories, companions that actually matter, moddable gear, a way better crafting system. They also implemented a lot of the good things of other MMO's like several starting zones, enough quests to level up without having to grind mobs, questtrackers, an auction house system, crafting, dungeons etc. Those are standard MMO features that most people expect these days. They also left the paved path by WoW through not implementing macro's, add-ons and a lfd tool. Why? Because those things are only wanted by a part of the community, be it small or big, but they always cause discussions in any MMO. Features that are not wanted by the overwhelming majority should not be implemented beforehand. I think they took a wise decision on not implementing those features on launch. Time will show if they are really needed, when those that only came for a little diversion of other games have left and the real and lasting playerbase is known. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gadzuki Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Ok first off, stop flaming the OP. He went to work about an hour ago and isn't here to defend himself. Second point that I need to make is that I have never played WoW. That said, I do, in part, agree with the original post. I think the game would benefit from SOME add-ons, macros, etc. and definitely a customisable UI. I played EQ2 for about 6 years and regularly used all of these features. I had Profit UI (a downloaded custom UI that was pretty much an essential for any serious healer), used ACT to track the parse and macros to target specific players and inform group/raid members that I was using a certain ability (I would only ever have a /raidsay command on something like an in-combat rez to save time) and I believe that without these features playing would have been a dull, laborious slog. In my opinion some implementation of these features would would increase my enjoyment of the game. The bad side of things like macros can be experienced in Rift PvP were you come up against a one-click-hero who has a /all melee abilities macro and another macro shouting that you're a hacker when you kill them. Another word of warning from my experience in Rift, Trion allowed their player base to practically bully them into implementing all sorts of changes. Every 2 days there was another patch nerfing this class or the next because of QQing in the forums and it pretty much ruined every class. I really like SW and I am loving the rich story that goes with the inevitable MMO quests (kill x amount of x, find x amount of x, go speak to x) and the CHOICE of these features would enrich my enjoyment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheHauntingBard Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 (edited) Hallo thar fanboy, I would like to introduce you to a concept called SUBJECTIVITY, which describes how one individual's experience of a thing can be different to another's. I would also like to introduce you to the ARGUMENTUM AD POPULUM, this is a well-known logical fallacy which deals with claims of superiority based on numbers - the number of people that do a thing has no bearing at all on the quality or relative value of the thing. I would like you to provide me with a single objective argument that WoW is better, remembering that you cannot make objective assessments based on subjective experience, and you cannot resort to logical fallacies. I'll be impressed if you manage it. That isn't entirely fair what you ask him, even when you discuss something involving subjectivity . You still set up certain boundaries to avoid the argument ' the wall is white the wall is black'. If you purely speak in subjectivity and objectivity you will need to balance with logic. The next example will also show that bringing in that kind of arguments isn't a good idea, especially since you will have to dig through gaming history. Anyway here it goes for the sake of fun. Note: This is not about my own subjective opinion. WOW and Bioware both have LFG tool. Ask your self this, what is the purpose of a LFG tool in a MMO. Remind you assuming that one is more social is subjectivity and so is stating 'it builds a community' Even if a dev stats ' we think . Just stop right there that's an assumption so we ignore it. Bioware stated the LFG tool is to find people to do quests/flash points, it's intended purpose is there for not subjective. The end purpose of a LFG tool is to find a group faster than grouping with out a LFG tool. If that was not the intention there would be a clear absence of the tool. The essence of a LFG is to speed up grouping, there for the end destination is a faster and more efficient method. Numbers will show that the WOW tool will for fill that purpose faster and more efficient. There for WOW is has a more efficient and better LFG tool. Since WOW's LFG tool is more efficient in terms of numbers and time it makes WOW a better game since it succeeds in achieving it's goal more efficient than SWTOR. Edited January 9, 2012 by TheHauntingBard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flowerslayer Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 I see all these posts with people complaining because SWTOR doesn't have parsers and add ons like WOW. I have to ask myself why they need these things? I play computer games to relax and have fun. I don't worry about whether I'm the top DPSer in my party, I don't need to know the minutia of every second of game play. I'm here to have FUN. It's rare in any of these posts that anyone from the make-TOR-more-like-WOW camp ever mentions having fun playing WOW or TOR. Silly me, I started playing computer games with the original Zork, and all this time I thought it was about having fun. Apparently I've been doing it wrong for over 30 years. Oh, btw, the original poster says he hasn't played WOW since last August, so maybe he doesn't much like WOW any more either. Yeah, youre mister superior alright. Want a cookie? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I_like_black Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 If you love WoW so much, why did you leave? Was it the pandas? Yeah they're a bit much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flunkorg Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 (edited) If you love WoW so much, why did you leave? No game can keep you playing forever. And its a fact that if you play something for too long you eventually get burned out on it. Its kinda like temporary bordum. Most people will just play something else for a bit then come back to what ever they where playing. People have tendencies to missunderstand me because people like you (sorry) turned it into an insult. When I say "You should probably play WoW" I mean it in a good way. I don't want people to play a game they don't like. Don't like TOR? Well, thats perfectly fine. But if you want WoW so much then just play it. Theirs no shame in that lol As gamers, we should be playing what we enjoy playing. Edited January 9, 2012 by flunkorg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurnea Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 I see all these posts with people complaining because SWTOR doesn't have parsers and add ons like WOW. I have to ask myself why they need these things? I play computer games to relax and have fun. I don't worry about whether I'm the top DPSer in my party, I don't need to know the minutia of every second of game play. I'm here to have FUN. Fun, as you might gather, is subjective. There are people that can go into an MMO and happily mouse-click away without feeling any need to use keyboard shortcuts, ui adjustments, etc. And there are people that go into almost any game and want to get into the nitty-gritty of playing to the best of their performance. Some prefer a game of Calvin-ball, others prefer a good game of chess where they're examining most of the strategems and gambits while doing so. Nothing's right or wrong with either way, it's all how people enjoy themselves. It's rare in any of these posts that anyone from the make-TOR-more-like-WOW camp ever mentions having fun playing WOW or TOR. Silly me, I started playing computer games with the original Zork, and all this time I thought it was about having fun. Apparently I've been doing it wrong for over 30 years. I've been having fun with video games for near 30 years, and I've enjoyed PC games like WoW as well as games completely unlike WoW. There's nothing right or wrong about one's approach to how they enjoy a game. Oh, btw, the original poster says he hasn't played WOW since last August, so maybe he doesn't much like WOW any more either. Or maybe after 7 years, it was simply time to move on? I personally enjoyed WoW a lot, but seeing as how I've always enjoyed Bioware games and felt the need for something fresh, I decided to give TOR a try. Thus far it's been a fun game, but there are some things from WoW I miss and would like to see implemented. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiddeth Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 I would rather this game go down as the worse MMO in history that have it turn into a crappy WoW in space. You want WoW in space go to the blizzard forums and beg them... the simple fact is there are more people playing the game and not complaining about it than there are people doing so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantiszz Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 That said, I do, in part, agree with the original post. I think the game would benefit from SOME add-ons, macros, etc. and definitely a customisable UI. I've said before, if something ends up being useful for a high percentage of the population then I think it should be integrated into the game. Macros on rift were a joke, most of the time my shaman would rotate through 1-3 buttons depending on the situation. However on warhammer online, 99% of the population had an addon for which zones were locked down, after 2 years Mythic still kept their own crap interface that most people removed from the UI and used the addon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truga Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 From a 5-year WoW player who likes this game a lot-- Some of the WoW-like things that could benefit this game: 1. Guild Vault 2. "Naming of Pets" (companions) 3. Making the Guid page a bit more useful than just a spreadsheet These things wouldn't make it "WoW" they would just be a smart thing to do. Peace. I can support this list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mechavomit Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Okay, I want WoW with lighsabers too. I don't want anything super-innovative, I'm comfortable with what's alredy is. And I know a lot of people who bought this game because it seemed like WoW with lightsabers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krisslanza Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 By OP's logic, every game should be called "World of Warcraft" then tack on what game it is. Like... "World of Warcraft: The Old Republic""World of Warcraft: Tera"etc. Because clearly, WoW is the pinnacle of everything forever, and not something that is slowing killing the genre. Most games in other genres are praised for being innovative, or trying something new. If you try that in the MMO genre? Then your game is seen as some giant, flaming failure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigaus Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 (edited) I just wish WoW nerds would go back to their game and leave us alone. For some odd reason the WoW people think Blizzard was the first who did the first mmo game which is wrong and sad at the same time. WoW is actually not a good mmo game and ToR is actually not of a good mmorpg game either. I wish people would have seen a real mmorpg sandbox game like Ultima Online in the old days.. Companies should copy that game, not the WoW ****. a game does not have to be a sandbox to be a 'real' MMO. I also hear there is this game called "minecraft" that the sandbox kids are wearing out. As proven by WoW, most of us enjoy theme park style gaming in the MMO genre, and there is nothing wrong with games being tailored to the market's desires. You're in the minority and shouldn't really expect any big developer with $$$$ to cater to your niche as you don't have the numbers to justify the investment. There are plenty of sandbox games out there, but sandbox games have crappy endgames with nothing to do. I'll pass and play Skyrim when I feel like some real immersion. Edited January 9, 2012 by Bigaus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kalexkhan Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 This game already is wow in space. Everything I can do in swtor I can do in wow. Accept for the space combat, and I don't see people playing this all that much to make this game worth while. Dual spec, instance finders, ui mods, it's all coming.... If wow has it, this game wants it. This is why I'm leaving. I got tired of that style of gaming years ago. The story is good enou to make this game worth the box price, but not a sub. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurnea Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Most games in other genres are praised for being innovative, or trying something new. If you try that in the MMO genre? Then your game is seen as some giant, flaming failure. Arcade fighting games are consistently grounded in what made them popular to begin with. You might see some new characters or options between each iteration of Street Fighter, Tekken, Soul Caliber, or Virtua Fighter, but the gameplay consistently stays true to what came before. FPS games have largely simply evolved the gameplay engines, with little actual innovation in regards to core gameplay mechanics. Whether it be Battlefield, CoD, Tribes, etc, it always comes down to move, aim, and shoot. Anything that radically departs from this typically establishes such a game as being in a different genre. Regardless, no one's saying that a new, innovative game would necessarily be bad, simply that there are players who can be satisfied without innovation and blatantly want WoW with lightsabers and Bioware's storyline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excedrin Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 (edited) i say: NO to addons HELL NO! to macros DEFINATELY HELL NO! to LFD tool. All this game needs is a LFG channel that is accessible across all planets....problem solved. addons = L2P - If you need addons to play your class, you are doing it wrong. macros = L2P - If you need macros to play your class, you are also doing it wrong. /topic I always find it highly ironic that people tell those asking for customization and macros to "l2p" when they are by and large more effective players with or without addons or macros anyways. Trust me, this game isn't hard buddy. It's very, very, VERY easy. It will not be made more or less easy by the inclusion of mouseovers or more customizable frames, it will just be made less tiresome to handle. But keep saying "l2p" like these players aren't already better than you, like a little chant to make yourself feel safe. By OP's logic, every game should be called "World of Warcraft" then tack on what game it is. Like... "World of Warcraft: The Old Republic" "World of Warcraft: Tera" etc. Because clearly, WoW is the pinnacle of everything forever, and not something that is slowing killing the genre. Most games in other genres are praised for being innovative, or trying something new. If you try that in the MMO genre? Then your game is seen as some giant, flaming failure. You probably believe that CoD killed shooters by expanding the market too. Edited January 9, 2012 by Excedrin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vordy Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 (edited) a game does not have to be a sandbox to be a 'real' MMO. I also hear there is this game called "minecraft" that the sandbox kids are wearing out. As proven by WoW, most of us enjoy theme park style gaming in the MMO genre, and there is nothing wrong with games being tailored to the market's desires. You're in the minority and shouldn't really expect any big developer with $$$$ to cater to your niche as you don't have the numbers to justify the investment. There are plenty of sandbox games out there, but sandbox games have crappy endgames with nothing to do. I'll pass and play Skyrim when I feel like some real immersion. Imo lvling doesnt belong in mmorpgs, just look how Ultima Online did, did you call that boring when your char was done before EA took it over? No, the game just started then, same as Eve Online. Edited January 9, 2012 by Vordy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thugari Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 This rubbish annoys the hell out of me. If you want WOW so mush then go and play it. This IS a different game, it's call Star Wars. This says it plain as day. +1 for you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sykologist Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 It is just like wow, first of all that's a really stupid first reason, secondly wow has a story and the characters have depth. Here's a big ole LOL for that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crawlbox Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 (edited) I don't really have a problem with a LFD/G tool, because it makes leveling faster, and I don't necessarily want to spend an hour finding a group to do a 30 minute FP in which I may or may not get gear that will only last me a few levels in the early parts of the game anyway. But, it doesn't really kill anything IMO because as "dungeons" become more difficult, or you get into Ops, pugs rarely work well anyway, so you wont use the LFD as much anyway. But some people want to play more casually, and know that they can run an FP or two without having to spam general chat, where they have to fight through the noise of "arrow to the knee" jokes and "man wow is better than this" chatter on /1. So I am all for the LFD tool. Macros... I don't really care. If they are built into the games UI, then great, because it doesn't give someone an unfair advantage, because EVERYONE has it. Which brings me to add-ons... I HATE add-ons. Almost as much as I loved them. In wow, I had at least 30 add ons running at all times, from damage meters to threat meters, inventory and auction house helpers. And it made the game SOOOO much easier. But there are several problems that I have with addons: 1. Provides an unfair advantage -- a single UI has the benefit of leveling the playing field, where everyone has the same tools as everyone else. This is just the basic structure of any game. Every sport in existance, every board game... ALL of them, have one thing in common -- balance. Same number of players per team, same opportunities for all players to win. Add-ons skew balance, and that is never good. You could argue that everyone has the same opportunities to download those add-ons, but that is like bringing 6 dice to a monopoly game and saying that its an addon, so it's part of the rules now. EDIT: I wasn't finished. I guess I need to find the "Post a reply" add-on... But I guess I quit.. Edited January 9, 2012 by Crawlbox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anelitt Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 I agree. An MMO with the Starwars universe but WoW's quality, combat and experience would be awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gridge Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 This is absolutely the last thing I want. If I wanted to play WOW (which I did for a long time) I would still be playing it, and I wish all those who miss it would just go back to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rollcageuk Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 I agree. An MMO with the Starwars universe but WoW's quality, combat and experience would be awesome. ROFL, have you been on WOW recently. It's a graveyard for the most part. Players login, do their quest of the day, do their raid, log out..that's it. Look outside IF/ORG, the entire servers are deserted. You can run from one side of the server to the other and see iterally no-one! If WOW, even with all it's bells and whistles was released today, it would fail like a bomb. Most of the player base are purely the hardcore who can't stand the thought of giving up on something they have invested their entire little lives on and can't stand the though of their character falling behind. WOW is not a good game, not since BC has it been a good game, and as a result it is now hemorraging subs. The fact they are offering a game that could do very well on it's own merits(D3) for free as a bribe is testimony to that. The fact they have resorted to creating an expansion featuring characters from a childs film is testimony to that. The fact the last expansion was just the current world set on fire is testimony to that. Blizzard know this, even they have given up on it. The Trailer for Pandaville uses 100% gameplay engine footage. Look at the trailers for previous expansions and compare it to Pandaria...it sucks, Blizzard know it, a large part of the playerbase know it and the quicker you know it, the better WOW has some good mechanics but some of the decisions Blizzard have made on quality, combat and experience have killed it e.g. Level of Addons and LFD. So, in summary, No, I don't want WOW with addons, and neither do a lot of other people, because frankly, WOW has sucked since WOTLK was released. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jobedy Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 (edited) I WANT WOW WITH LIGHTSABERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They're bringing out kung-fu panda's with dark/light 'force' power in 5.0, Jedi Panda's ftl (lol) Go knock yourself out Edited January 9, 2012 by Jobedy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTuloJr Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Well now. This thread devolved into the typical fanboy immature shout-down. Might as well shut it down and lock it, mods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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