PatJoB Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 I really enjoy that people view 116k credits as a 'few'. I understand money isn't something that is hard to get in the game, and is in fact normal to see 'large' amounts of money at a time. As a Sith Sorceror, I enjoy to DPS in Madness spec, I use this for flashpoints, soloing, PvP, etc. I am also one of two healers in the guild at the moment, so I more often than not am needed as a healer for flashpoints. Respeccing two or three times a day is very expensive, and with the price resetting only once a week, the process is going to cost me into the millions weekly without dual-spec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasterOfFunk Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 Dual-spec should only allow you to change specs within your class. No way, should it ever allow you to change Adv. Classes. That is just a silly wish list of nonsense; would completely contradict the class design of this game. Wouldn't have a reason for ACs whatsoever. I think people (specifically in this thread) are confused on what others are trying to explain. Dual-spec within ACs: sure, why not. Dual-spec ACs: ...just no Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slightlycampana Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 (edited) I set up a poll for dual speccing. Edit: still can't link results, will update them here. Edited January 7, 2012 by Slightlycampana Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lethality Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 (edited) Dual-spec should only allow you to change specs within your class. No way, should it ever allow you to change Adv. Classes. That is just a silly wish list of nonsense; would completely contradict the class design of this game. Wouldn't have a reason for ACs whatsoever. I think people (specifically in this thread) are confused on what others are trying to explain. Dual-spec within ACs: sure, why not. Dual-spec ACs: ...just no No, we're not confused. At least I'm not. Obviously and definitely, no switching advanced classes. But in addition, since you can already re-spec by traveling to the Skill Mentor and paying credits, there's no need for a "dual spec" system in the game. It only serves to cheapen the choices made in building your character, and you're much quicker to switch them out than to find a favorite build/role and stick to it. It's a class-based RPG. The classes have to mean something. Edited January 6, 2012 by Lethality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caonimah Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 (edited) No, we're not confused. At least I'm not. Obviously and definitely, no switching advanced classes. But in addition, since you can already re-spec by traveling to the Skill Mentor and paying credits, there's no need for a "dual spec" system in the game. It only serves to cheapen the choices made in building your character, and you're much quicker to switch them out than to find a favorite build/role and stick to it. It's a class-based RPG. The classes have to mean something. Have you addressed why you are against others having this convenience or is it something deep down inside you that you cant seem to express? Are you OK with how they did modding in the game or would you have preferred to have to run all the way back to a main quest hub/fleet to switch pieces around? Edited January 6, 2012 by Caonimah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BizzyBonez Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 honestly, what is the point of CHOOSING A CLASS / SPEC at the start and 10th level of the game if you don't want to play that class? christ. if you want to roll a healer, then roll a healer. if u want to roll a dps, then roll a dps. this is a MMORPG....the RPG standing for roll playing game. i picked a healer to start with because i wanted to be a healer. if i want to be a dps, i will then make a dps and switch between characters accordingly to what i want to persue. that is what these games are and why they allow the ability to make multiple characters per server. this is why there is a respec option. this costs funds. if u want to change the way your character is, then u have to pay a penalty for it. if u decided to respec 40 times then u are an idiot. Some people like to PVP as DPS and Heal as PVE. Some specs allow for it so maybe... maybeee Its for the best to allow the person to play how it should be? That or make respecs free and can do it anywhere in the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lethality Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 Have you addressed why you are against others having this convenience or is it something deep down inside you that you cant seem to express? Are you OK with how they did modding in the game or would you have preferred to have to run all the way back to a main quest hub/fleet to switch pieces around? It's been addressed by myself and others many times. Here it is again. The game's core design is based on classes that have different roles and abilities. The nature of a class based RPG is that your character is built to do specific things that other characters can not do (or do as well.) You then work as a team, together, to overcome challenges. By you being able to slot any ability on a whim, it devalues the class construct and eventually the game design will suffer because the developers will consider this mechanic when designing content. So yes - this feature directly affects me wether I use it or not. You can already re-spec whenever you want - hoof it to a Skill Mentor. It has to be more than flipping a switch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasterOfFunk Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 No, we're not confused. At least I'm not. Obviously and definitely, no switching advanced classes. But in addition, since you can already re-spec by traveling to the Skill Mentor and paying credits, there's no need for a "dual spec" system in the game. It only serves to cheapen the choices made in building your character, and you're much quicker to switch them out than to find a favorite build/role and stick to it. It's a class-based RPG. The classes have to mean something. Never said you were confused specifically. My point on that comment was that some people are raising their pitch forks towards the OP thinking he/she wants dual-spec ACs, not dual-spec within ACs. They could support the same thing but still go hostile towards the OP. Anyways, I don't mind dual-spec within the trees. It isn't going to effect my gameplay. However, it isn't that expensive to respec already (it could even be free again-takes time though). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lorthor Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 It's been addressed by myself and others many times. Here it is again. The game's core design is based on classes that have different roles and abilities. The nature of a class based RPG is that your character is built to do specific things that other characters can not do (or do as well.) You then work as a team, together, to overcome challenges. By you being able to slot any ability on a whim, it devalues the class construct and eventually the game design will suffer because the developers will consider this mechanic when designing content. So yes - this feature directly affects me wether I use it or not. You can already re-spec whenever you want - hoof it to a Skill Mentor. It has to be more than flipping a switch. You think it affects you, when really it doesn't. I shouldn't have to pay every time i want to go from a PvE healer to a PvP dps. Really who wants to re spec multiple times per day just to enjoy their class? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lethality Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 You think it affects you, when really it doesn't. I shouldn't have to pay every time i want to go from a PvE healer to a PvP dps. Really who wants to re spec multiple times per day just to enjoy their class? Your spec should be your role the majority of the time. It's lucky enough you can switch them at all, but you should absolutely NOT be able to switch them at the drop of a hat. On the odd chance you want/need to, then BioWare has given you a way to do so. Obviously the design intention is not to have players switching on and off 10 times a day. Why do you think they don't have this in the game already? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penguinbreeder Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 Your spec should be your concern and my spec should be my concern. Respecs and multiple specs please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caonimah Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 It's been addressed by myself and others many times. Here it is again. The game's core design is based on classes that have different roles and abilities. The nature of a class based RPG is that your character is built to do specific things that other characters can not do (or do as well.) You then work as a team, together, to overcome challenges. By you being able to slot any ability on a whim, it devalues the class construct and eventually the game design will suffer because the developers will consider this mechanic when designing content. So yes - this feature directly affects me wether I use it or not. You can already re-spec whenever you want - hoof it to a Skill Mentor. It has to be more than flipping a switch. Well then, you and others that ascribe to this ideology seem to forget that there just isn't enough of one particular role to satisfy the needs of the others that cant, or refuse to play a different role. Even worse is that the person that comes to deliver them from that problem has to be burden with paying a respec cost and the inconvenience of having to go to fleet every time the needs arises. This is one of the reasons why WoW introduced the concept of dual spec. Its one of the reasons why Rift built their entire game around it and why GW2 will discard the whole notion of roles all together. Its archaic design that hampers the vast majority of players and only seem to satisfy the people that actively like to suffer in their games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graveland Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 Dual spec would be nice, not all of us have time to log 10+ hours a day to farm especially with the servers constantly going down. I have a PvP spec and a PvE spec and yes they are mutually exclusive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lethality Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 (edited) Well then, you and others that ascribe to this ideology seem to forget that there just isn't enough of one particular role to satisfy the needs of the others that cant, or refuse to play a different role. Even worse is that the person that comes to deliver them from that problem has to be burden with paying a respec cost and the inconvenience of having to go to fleet every time the needs arises. This is one of the reasons why WoW introduced the concept of dual spec. Its one of the reasons why Rift built their entire game around it and why GW2 will discard the whole notion of roles all together. Its archaic design that hampers the vast majority of players and only seem to satisfy the people that actively like to suffer in their games. You know what might make me ok with it? If there was some kind of bonus or additional progression for those that stay with a spec longer. Some way to be "better" than someone who switches in and out of it all the time. SOmething like "32 days since the last accident!" which would reset to zero when you change your spec, giving up your bonuses. In other words, a "skill based" progression system based on your spec. The longer you use it, the better you get at it. What does everyone think of this idea? Edited January 6, 2012 by Lethality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lorthor Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 Obviously the design intention is not to have players switching on and off 10 times a day. Why do you think they don't have this in the game already? They haven't for the same reason there isn't a lot of features in the game yet, such as being able to search for a specific item on the GTN, or rated WZs. By your logic looks like we will never have rated pvp or any updates to functionality because it's not in the game yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lethality Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 They haven't for the same reason there isn't a lot of features in the game yet, such as being able to search for a specific item on the GTN, or rated WZs. By your logic looks like we will never have rated pvp or any updates to functionality because it's not in the game yet. This is something they already have the technology built to do, just as they do for switching Advanced Classes. James Ohlen told me this directly in an interview. So, they CHOSE not to implement it because they clearly lean toward not desiring it for their game. Let me see if I get this right: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gohlar Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 I'd like to see dual spec. Variety is fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparckus Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 (edited) So, they CHOSE not to implement it because they clearly lean toward not desiring it for their game. Just like they chose not to implement a Mac version of the game? Edited January 7, 2012 by Sparckus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voodh Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Dual spec will be great. Ac respec would be great, with high restrictions, real money, 1M credits or time restrictions (several months). I won't roll another toon of the same class with the possibility of an ac respec in a near furure, and i'm not the only one. In fact i won't up another toon to lvl 50 anymore, one time is enough. Dual spec will arrive for sure, the system as it is now is not right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lethality Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Just like they chose not to implement a Mac version of the game? You mean like how they are? http://www.askajedi.com/2012/01/02/mac-version-of-the-old-republic-coming-soon-massively-reports/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penguinbreeder Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 At this point Bioware is holding off dual spec because Lethality and a couple of his homies argue for 50 pages against it in just a single thread, and they are rightfully worried about what he might do if they put it in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparckus Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 You mean like how they are? http://www.askajedi.com/2012/01/02/mac-version-of-the-old-republic-coming-soon-massively-reports/ “We’ve done a lot of Mac ports before of our games. We haven’t announced any details yet for The Old Republic, but we know that’s an important and large audience.” Isn't a confirmation that they're doing it. Good to see you don't apply your own logic when its something that YOU would like implemented: So, they CHOSE not to implement it because they clearly lean toward not desiring it for their game. As a side note I don't care either way if a Mac client is released or not (would like a Linux version but as ever I wont hold my breath), I'm merely pointing out hypocrisy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lethality Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 “We’ve done a lot of Mac ports before of our games. We haven’t announced any details yet for The Old Republic, but we know that’s an important and large audience.” Isn't a confirmation that they're doing it. Big difference between dual specs (tech they have right now, and could have included) and creating a Mac version. It's pretty clear that there's one coming, just as I always said there'd be no way they wouldn't. Silly not to do it simultaneously, but that's a different thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CactusCat Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 (edited) Big difference between dual specs (tech they have right now, and could have included) and creating a Mac version. It's pretty clear that there's one coming, just as I always said there'd be no way they wouldn't. Silly not to do it simultaneously, but that's a different thread. I'm pretty sure they've made it very clear that they know Dual-Spec is something players want, and they have been looking into implementing something to deal with the situation. This was through Stephen Reid and what not. And just because the tech is already there, but not yet implemented, does not logically leap to "they have no plans to implement it". There could be any number of reasons for them holding it back. Correlation does not imply causation. Edited January 7, 2012 by CactusCat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparckus Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 Big difference between dual specs (tech they have right now, and could have included) and creating a Mac version. Your right, one requires minimum coding time, the other will divert the devs from fixing bugs and adding new features for a considerable time. Dual spec was confirmed as something they wanted to add soon after release, a Mac client is a hmm maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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