I was one of those that felt that Marauder was pretty gimped... but I think we are just very gear dependent. Now that I am 9/14 pieces champion geared I own face. I end up in the top 3 or even #1 on damage fairly often, and that is when playing well, not just hunting for damage. I am also predominantly Carnage specced. not Rage. The Rage marauders put up bigger numbers because of Slam, but if I fight a Rage marauder 1v1 I eat him alive, he stands no chance. Part of it is picking targets, true. If i predominantly jump guys that are at 80-70% HP, they have blown some cooldowns and I can kill them in one rotation without them being able to hit me back much at all. We are still a little squishier than I think we ought to be, and it would DEFINITELY be nice to have some more utility, like a non-channeled stun or a knockback (yes, knockback is useful for a melee class that has force charge). Let me put it this way. Damage is not our problem, utility is. There is nothing we really bring to a team that other people can't bring. Our team buffs are nice, but not THAT impressive. Bloodthirst is a 5 minute CD and only lasts for 15 seconds... c'mon man. I say all this knowing that there is a caveat, I am 9/14 champ geared and I am in warzones where probably 70% of the people are below 50. When there is a 50's only bracket I will see if I still perform as well. It might be that the only reason I am doing so well now is because I outgear most people. ...However, it might not.

The class is weak. Also level 50 and have champ gear. What people are saying about Mara being weak is right. Yes, we can do good damage, but not better than any other class. We SHOULD be able to do more damage than any other class every single time because we are one of only 2 classes (the other being sniper) who can't spec into anything but DPS. Snipers also get medium armor, a knockback, and a stun and do ranged damage. You Mara fanboys can't pretend that this class has parity. Played well it can do well, yes. But you shouldn't have to be the best player out of 20 to do top damage against lower level people with less talent who are playing other classes. Marauder has the least utility and the least defensive abilities of any class in the game.

If you spec for the stealth/melee combat on your op you will faceroll any marauder dumb enough to go toe-to-toe with you.

Every other class has a stun or a knockback/knockdown (actually they have both). Marauders are the only class with neither. We lack the survivability of most other classes because we lack heals (I don't think we should have them) and we don't have much armor or defense. If you are not going to be very survivable and you are not going to have the tools that every other class has then you should have the most dps because you have none of the utility that the other classes have. a lot of our abilities need a tweak. Take Ravage: it does a lot of damage and it is great, but even if you talent it to root the person, probably 30-40% of the time that person just does their knockback and interrupts it. If you go up another tree to make it uninterruptible, it no longer roots, and they just amble away while you wave your lightsabers in the air. You shouldn't be able to be knockbacked when performing ravage. Force Camo: I pop it but half the time people still shoot me while I'm invisible and running away. and 4 seconds of +30% run speed while invisible doesn't even get you far enough to be out of range of a ranged stun or force charge from the guy you were fighting. Massacre: it should replace Vicious Slash, but it doesn't really, because if you are auto-hitting with ataru, vicious slash does more damage. For a talent that you have to spend 31 points to reach... Massacre should do as much base damage as Vicious Slash and give the Ataru extra hit. You paid enough to get there. Force Choke: either we need a REAL stun or force choke needs to no longer be channeled. Smash: should do a knockback/knockdown. Those changes would go a long way toward putting us on par with everyone else. We also should probably have heavy armor. Just think... Mercs get heavy armor, they get a knockback, they get a ranged stun, and they can even heal. the only other Class that can fill no other role but pure DPS (sniper) gets a knockback. I believe they also get a stun. They also wear medium armor but they are RANGED. Marauders are great and i love them... But they need work man. They are not on par with the other classes. I liked the suggestion that our offhand does 100% damage and ahs 100% accuracy. You could dump every other suggestion of they just did that and it should even us out.

Speccing into rage and spamming Smash near the doors in Voidstar does not make you a good player. It makes you a Marauder who peppers lots of people with lighter damage and puts up over 400k damage. You are not good, you are just AoE padding your damage. I ALSO easily do over 100k damage on my level 13 BH in warzones, and he is a powertech with his 4 measly talents in the tank tree. Damage does not mean you are really being useful, but that powertech does that much damage, has no problem killing people, and survives far longer. BH are better. That is that. They have heavy armor, they have a knockback, they have a stun, they can heal if they are merc. Marauder has none of those things and does not dps significantly higher than a merc.

We don't have anything other classes drool over. The one thing we have that is really good that no one has is the fury buffs, but those are not enough to put us on par with the utility of other classes. Every other class has a stun or a knockback/knockdown (actually they have both). Marauders are the only class with neither. We lack the survivability of most other classes because we lack heals (I don't think we should have them) and we don't have much armor or defense. If you are not going to be very survivable and you are not going to have the tools that every other class has then you should have the most dps because you have none of the utility that the other classes have. a lot of our abilities need a tweak. Take Ravage: it does a lot of damage and it is great, but even if you talent it to root the person, probably 30-40% of the time that person just does their knockback and interrupts it. If you go up another tree to make it uninterruptible, it no longer roots, and they just amble away while you wave your lightsabers in the air. You shouldn't be able to be knockbacked when performing ravage. Force Camo: I pop it but half the time people still shoot me while I'm invisible and running away. and 4 seconds of +30% run speed while invisible doesn't even get you far enough to be out of range of a ranged stun or force charge from the guy you were fighting. Massacre: it should replace Vicious Slash, but it doesn't really, because if you are auto-hitting with ataru, vicious slash does more damage. For a talent that you have to spend 31 points to reach... Massacre should do as much base damage as Vicious Slash and give the Ataru extra hit. You paid enough to get there. Force Choke: either we need a REAL stun or force choke needs to no longer be channeled. Smash: should do a knockback/knockdown. Those changes would go a long way toward putting us on par with everyone else. We also should probably have heavy armor. Just think... Mercs get heavy armor, they get a knockback, they get a ranged stun, and they can even heal. the only other Class that can fill no other role but pure DPS (sniper) gets a knockback. I believe they also get a stun. They also wear medium armor but they are RANGED. Marauders are great and i love them... But they need work man. They are not on par with the other classes.

Then you must be playing crappy sorcs. I am a level 50 marauder with some champ gear and lvl 50 sorcs, if they are good, are damn near indestructible to us.

I have the level 50 champion pvp chest. If you opt to hide your head slot in the social tab in preferences, it puts your hood up. If you show your helmet there is no hood.

Later in teh game you will definitely want to use Quinn.

My Marauder is level 50 and has some champ gear now. The game is well balanced enough that we can compete, but it takes a much better player to be competitive with a marauder than other classes. I can outperform my level 50 marauder with my level 13 powertech in warzones half the time. We are awfully squishy for wearing medium armor and being melee, and for being one of only 2 advanced classes that can ONLY go dps, we don't seem to be compensated by having higher dps than other classes. Marauders lack the utility of other classes. Marauder is a very weak class, but in a relatively balanced game. They need a tweak. They are not unplayable, but they are definitely the bottom of the barrel. savage kick and pommel strike need to work in pvp. Force Camo needs to be 6-8 seconds. in 4 seconds you don't even get far enough away to avoid being charged or shot again when it ends. I also seem to be targeted and shot while still invisible quite frequently. Our damage needs to be, only ever so slightly, tweaked upward. Undying Rage is fine. most abilities seem fine, just a little weak. It's not that we can't do good damage... but we can't do the type of damage we should be doing as the only class besides sniper that can't pick up some healing or some tanking. And we are also dealing with primarily ranged classes, all of whom seem to have knockbacks and ranged stuns. We cant be on top of people all the time so we should be just a tad more gnarly when we are.

I have a level 50 marauder with some champ gear. The game is well balanced enough that we can play, but we are by far the least useful class in the game. we lack the punch that should go with being one of only 2 advanced classes (other being sniper) that can only fulfill a dps role. Also, considering we wear medium armor, i also feel squishier than most lvl 50 sorcs i try to fight. We just aren't there. If played very well, a Marauder can still compete, but a Marauder player shouldn't have to be in the top 10% of players to compete with people in the 50%.

I have a 50 marauder with some champ gear now. I definitely feel like a wimp in pvp. I can usually put up better numbers on my level 13 powertech. We do better in games other than huttball... but thats what... like 1/25 games. We take more damage than sorcerers do at 50 and we cant do enough damage to really hurt people that badly. I almost never get the 2.5k damage for a single hit medal. I was playing against an operative in pvp earlier and he absolutely WRECKED me in melee. He'd do almost half my hp with his opener and kill me before his first stun wore off. on many of our abilities the cooldowns are either too long or the effects are too short. Force camoflauge: 4 sec is too short. In 4 seconds of running away i get just far enough away for them to lightning bolt me or force charge me again immediately, so its worthless half the time. savage kick and pommel strike also need to work in pvp. No idea why they don't. considering that we are one of only 2 classes in the game (the other being sniper) that can ONLY fulfill a dps roll, it does not feel like we are being compensated with more damage, and we also die insanely easily.

I have so many hotkeys on my marauder it isn't even really that fun to play anymore and I STILL have more new abilities to get. This is not such a problem on my sorcerer or powertech, but it's a big one on the marauder. If you are worried about people making 1-button macros, make the in-game macro builder only able to combine 2-3 abilities.

That says it all.

well I have not seen a level 50 yet. And my Marauder is valor rank 13 and I have literally done ONE pvp match with my bounty hunter. the numbers don't add up.

This is just like Mythic, in Warhammer my Ironbreaker was purely tank specced and he annihilated everyone. They want people with tank specs to feel viable in pvp and have fun, so the damage differential is negligible. But if a pure DPS character only outdamages a a tank character by 5-10% while a tank character has 50-60% more mitigation, what do you think is going to happen? Warhammer pvp actually sucked, because my ironbreaker could have a pocket warrior priest and the 2 of us LITERALLY woudl post up under the enemy spawn point and wipe out their whole team as they came out. I don't want to see that in SWtoR.

Yes I am aware, but regardless of buff, a higher-level character should outperform lower. He has mroe talents increasing his damage, his gear contributes more. Even with the buff, higher-level characters should be stronger. Not to mention a tank character with NO damage increasing talents out-damaging a pure damage character.

My level 11 Powertech specced into defense with his 2 talent points just did more damage and won more medals in a single PVP match than my level 27 Marauder has ever done... AND IT WAS MY FIRST PVP MATCH PLAYING AS MY POWERTECH NOUGH SAID.

I really want to see macros in this game. Not 1-button-does-all stupid stuff. As a matter of fact I would be thrilled if they made it so you could just drag and drop skill icons and limited the number of abilities that can be combined in a macro to 2. Fixes the problem of having people make 1 button characters but allows to to reduce the amount of redundant hotkeys you have. I hate having 2 hotkeys for 2 snares, both with 12 sec cooldowns. That sort of thing.

I was wondering this too. I was going annihilation for the bleed heals and the improved force charge. however, Carnage looks like it is more burst dps and Ataru would be really good for running down kiting enemies. Also, Annihilation just keeps coming up with more and more abilities until you have more hotkeys than you ahve keys on teh board. At least carnage introduces new abilities that replace older ones.