Thormart Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 or you can only defect after you hit level cap... and basically you get a story that forks. you can ether affirm your allegiance to the side you started out with... or you can defect. Still forces them to write twice the amount of stories in the expansion pack though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kerkat Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 Playing as a Sith Sorcerer, I don't find the light/dark choices really that different. Dark choices mean outright murder. The Light choices given aren't really chivalrous or good hearted but more exploitive of the situation. So my sorcerer is light side but still not a very nice or good character. Choices that Khem Vaal likes are even more bizarre. It seems he only likes it if you boast about your power. So if you pick light side while crowing about how powerful you are, Khem love you long time baby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SgtFrog Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 Dark Jedi =/= sith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cryptoling Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 Let me put it to you in real world terms. Look at those few individuals in blackwater and that incident in Iraq. Total dark side points for killing those civilians. Did the join Al-Qaeda because they decided to be murdering scum? No, they didn't. Just because someone makes some dark choices during a war doesn't mean that they would defect to the other side. Sure they could have written something like that into the game but I think that goes against design and I hope they make it so you can never faction transfer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeweledleah Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 Still forces them to write twice the amount of stories in the expansion pack though well.. this game IS all about the story if anything, they could consolidate them. same story for force users vs non force users. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrigOrion Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 The simple explanation is that they haven't made any cartoons for defecting yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tremk Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 People are always complaining that the game needs to stay true to the canon of the Star Wars Universe, yet we see in this game players playing Jedis turning completely to the darkside as a Jedi. In my opinion that is just wrong. It should force you to switch alliances and make you a Sith. Anyone else agree with this? republic and empire are political affiliations light side dark side is your character's personality and conscience or lack there of Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AirshipGirl Posted January 1, 2012 Author Share Posted January 1, 2012 (edited) You don't understand Star Wars canon. Please stop using the word. The Empire and Republic are POLITICAL entities. There is no evil/good distinction between the two. If you're a purely neutral 3rd party viewer, you'd feel nothing for the Republic or Empire. BEING A MEMBER of either makes the OTHER your enemy. The Empire sees itself as doing what is good for the Empire and the same applies to the Republic. Neither are evil. There are several conversations in game that illustrate how the Empire believes what it is doing is for the greater good. Its just a differing viewpoint. Dark Side vs. Light Side is a morality choice. Dark Side is usually evil. They are not necessarily Sith. Sith was a species (is a species in TOR) that intermingled with the outcast Dark Side Force users following the Battle of Corbos. Eventually Sith came to mean members of this offshoot culture instead of the race itself. Again - not inherently evil. Over the 3,000+ years since the Old Republic Sith came to be exclusively Dark Side Force users as you see in SW E1. The Empire was abolished in strict form and the Republic ruled, roughly. Palpatine takes over, converts the Republic to an Empire in E4 and there's no need to call it the "Sith Empire" because it encompasses the known galaxy, not just those who sprang from the initial merger of the Sith people and Dark Side outcasts. I do understand the canon, and yes I know that the Republic and Imp are political entities. What I am saying is that no Jedi that goes darkside should remain in the Jedi Order and no Sith that goes lightside should remain as Sith aka Dark Jedi. They should be forced to switch sides. Sith that go light should become Jedi and Jedi that go dark should become Sith/aka Dark Jedi. Also, the Jedi Order in this game sides with the Republic, and the Sith sides with the Imp, so yes a faction change would be required as well. Bioware made this game that way. Edited January 1, 2012 by AirshipGirl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luckmann Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 It is wrong and goes against the canon. Dark Jedi(aka also known as Sith even in the expanded Universe) are Sith, not Jedi. So as such they do not have place in the Jedi order at all. The player that decided to go darkside should have to switch sides and play their character out as a Sith. No. You have no idea what you're talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thormart Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 well.. this game IS all about the story if anything, they could consolidate them. same story for force users vs non force users. God no. I like the storyline structure as it is. Keep each class seperate and unique in terms if personal story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeweledleah Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 I do understand the canon, and yes I know that the Republic and Imp are political entities. What I am saying is that no Jedi that goes darkside should remain in the Jedi Order and no Sith that goes lightside should remain as Sith aka Dark Jedi. They should be forced to switch sides. Sith that go light should become Jedi and Jedi that go dark should become Sith/aka Dark Jedi. sigh. Jedi deny emotions. Sith embrace and use them. THAT is the difference. it has nothing to do with their affiliation, or alignment. a Jedi who embraces emotions - will be dark side. but it doesn't make them evil or disloyal to the republic and they shouldn't be forced to switch sides just becasue they are not good little vulcans. never mind non force using classes. Han Solo for example. pretty sure he would have been dark side aligned. and yet, he was still pretty firmly allied with a republic, especially by the end of the series. likewise, Sith that make light side decisions are not necessarily abandoning their emotions or suddenly want to help the republic. My Sith at least makes light side decisions becasue she'd rather use people then kill them. a dead resource is a wasted resource. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aznthecapn Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I do understand the canon, and yes I know that the Republic and Imp are political entities. What I am saying is that no Jedi that goes darkside should remain in the Jedi Order and no Sith that goes lightside should remain as Sith aka Dark Jedi. They should be forced to switch sides. Sith that go light should become Jedi and Jedi that go dark should become Sith/aka Dark Jedi. Also, the Jedi Order in this game sides with the Republic, and the Sith sides with the Imp, so yes a faction change would be required as well. Bioware made this game that way. Dark Jedi ARE NOT SITH. How many people have to tell you you're wrong before you stop trying to convince people of a lie? Jedi are Jedi because they were trained by the Jedi Temple. Not because they choose the Light Side of the Force. Same thing in the inverse with Sith and the Sith Order. You do not understand canon. At all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrigOrion Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I think the light points/dark points mechanic is poorly implemented. For one thing, it should only apply to Jedi and Sith classes. Half the game's classes don't have any Force affiliation of any kind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarianz Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 People are always complaining that the game needs to stay true to the canon of the Star Wars Universe, yet we see in this game players playing Jedis turning completely to the darkside as a Jedi. In my opinion that is just wrong. It should force you to switch alliances and make you a Sith. Anyone else agree with this? At least know what you're talking about before posting so many dumb replies to people, seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnoggyMack Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I do understand the canon Did you click the wookiepedia link you were given? It explains it all right there. As well as many other people telling you that in canon, dark jedi are NOT sith. There is a very big distinction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aznthecapn Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I think the light points/dark points mechanic is poorly implemented. For one thing, it should only apply to Jedi and Sith classes. Half the game's classes don't have any Force affiliation of any kind. The Force is all around us. It affects and emanates from all living things. There are even Force users who are not strong enough in the Force to warrant being Jedi or Sith (there's a quest referencing this on Balmorra, not sure if its a class quest or not). Your actions dictate what part of the Force influences you more. Whether or not you can actually control the Force is a moot point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SarahLivia Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I've been wondering about similar things myself, actually. It seems one of the popular SW storylines is about the Jedi that turns to the dark side. Or the Sith/Dark Jedi (call them whatever. I recognize the difference, it's just not relevant right now) finding their redemption. It could be neat to allow a Jedi with all these darkside points to defect. While I understand the idea of a Jedi who's fallen to the darkside remaining with the republic, I wonder why the Jedi Order would actually keep them around and not dismiss them at the very least. There's an easy answer though: The character is clearly good at what they do, being a player character, and when you're fighting a war perhaps it's not the wisest to dismiss one of your best combatants. It's war. Horrible things happen. The Dark/Light points in this game aren't as great as they've been in other Star Wars games where the choices actually affect the outcome and lead to different endings. I admit I haven't finished any class story completely yet, so maybe there's still differences, but in things like KOTOR the ending was rather different. It feels to me that light or dark still leads to the same things. Don't get me wrong, I'm enjoying the illusion of choice in the game, it's just not as strong as in other games. There's been a reference or two in the Sith Inq storyline that 'many a Sith have been created from corrupted Jedi', mostly during the Taris class quests. Anyway this has gone on for a bit and I guess I'm just saying the option to to play a character who starts as a Jedi with the Republic and actually falls to the dark side to join the Sith Empire would be neat. As would the ability to be a Sith that redeems themselves and joins the republic. I don't think it should be forced if you're too dark or light because punishing people for these choices isn't the greatest idea, but allowing it as an option sometime down the road would be nifty. In regards to the non-force wielding characters, I have no idea! Dark/Light points seem kind of artifical on them and the idea of the republic trooper or smuggler full of dark points doesn't seem too far fetched. See above -- It's war, horrible things happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaddaq Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) I do understand the canon, and yes I know that the Republic and Imp are political entities. What I am saying is that no Jedi that goes darkside should remain in the Jedi Order and no Sith that goes lightside should remain as Sith aka Dark Jedi. They should be forced to switch sides. Sith that go light should become Jedi and Jedi that go dark should become Sith/aka Dark Jedi. Also, the Jedi Order in this game sides with the Republic, and the Sith sides with the Imp, so yes a faction change would be required as well. Bioware made this game that way. Hello, This is patently false. Anakin murdered women and children after his mother died, and remained in the Jedi order. He broke Jedi traditions and took a relationship and had a child, and was still in the Jedi order. He didn't leave the Jedi until he murdered Jedi. Edited January 2, 2012 by Shaddaq Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quesa Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 As with any culture, religion or belief, there are varying degrees of gray areas. I've always thought of as being light someone who makes a decision based on non-emotional logic. Purging emotions to make moral choices, which can be good or bad. A dark person uses emotion as a primary source in their decision making process even though those decisions could have good or bad outcomes. The point is, you can't look at the universe as if it's black and white, rather a multitude of hues and colors which you get to make the decisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hiro-Protagonist Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I am sure that there were Ally soldiers in WWII that were strongly anti-semitic. This didn't make them German, nor were they forced to fight for the Axis powers. What side you fight on and your personally morality are two different things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P-Funk Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 It is wrong and goes against the canon. Dark Jedi(aka also known as Sith even in the expanded Universe) are Sith, not Jedi. So as such they do not have place in the Jedi order at all. The player that decided to go darkside should have to switch sides and play their character out as a Sith. Right, because if you started slipping to the dark side you totally couldn't lie or manipulate your actions to appear as if you weren't a dark jedi. Look at Annakin's fall. He was slaughtering women and children, executing prisoners, giving in to his hate left right and centre, and he still managed to stick it out to the end as one of the good guys, and all along he also wasn't evil and trying to tear down the Republic, he was just acting very misguided. There are some stories in the EU that show Jedi falling and not being noticed as they hide it well, and there is always the Grey Jedi who sits in the middle acting out of a personal sense of morality. You want all Jedi to be pure goody two shoes never wavering from the purest of the pure behavior? Sounds like you want Star Trek The Next Generation before Gene Roddenberry died when he stated that Starfleet captains NEVER EVER do ANYTHING evil or bad which of course made the show at that stage extremely boring and typical. When he died and they opened it up to more dark and confused morality tales you suddenly get a much richer story. Fact is that extreme good and evil is such a boring story. It would get old really fast. It wouldn't be entertaining and you'd never have to make a decision because canon would decide for you. You might think its against canon but I disagree. Without a murky subjective morality this would be a pretty boring story to play. Most acclaimed writers and filmmakers would agree with this perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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