Thanks for ruining the game.

[R-Smith]

Just recently resubbed to the game with my wife. Was a loyal subscriber for the first five years of the games' history. Then moved on to other games, but got the itch to come back and wife and I resubbed. Wife decided she wanted to do something nice for me and so got the headstrong apprentice armor and a black dye mod that she was going to give me as surprise gift tomorrow - only to realize that we likely can't afford the in-game taxes on the trade for her to gift it to me. We used to trade items between the two of us since she first joined the game about a year after it launched. So now she's stuck with an in-game armor she doesn't want (and can't gift to me) and so it will just sit in her inventory until hell freezes over.

You know what else will not happen until hell freezes over? Either of us buying anything on the cartel market ever again and either of us renewing our subscription at the end of this month.

Let me be clear. We LOVED playing this game together. When we both had extended vacation days, we'd sometimes spend 10+ hours doing story missions with whatever characters we played. When we weren't playing the game, we talked about the game. Made jokes about the game (Your name is Weeznod, nobody's going to take you seriously. "The sith want to destroy the Revanites - but they can't find them unless they take the taxi to the secret Revanite compound on Dromund Kas that nobody's supposed to know about. "Oh, you do have the token!", creepy space children in the sweres of Coruscant, etc. etc.) We laughed so hard sometimes, we cried. It was great. The game was great. The stories were great. The characters were great.

You've killed that.

In an effort to crush a problem YOU created by allowing gold spammers to operate from practically day one, item resellers from reselling items for over-inflated prices (really? items on the GTN for BILLIONS of credits?!!!!). You made it so we didn't have to outfit companions and dumbed down combat (who plays tanks anymore), so crafting became largely pointless, but even then, we were still having fun being back - we played around with our old strongholds, restarted new versions of our favorite characters and started exploring a galaxy far far away all over again.

But now my wife can't even give me a gift in game without you taking your cut? 

What's next utility bills if we leave the lights on in our strongholds? You're already charging for fast travel - but how about some ship maintenance fees?  

How about GROCERY bills. Bowdaar eats a lot and he's always hanging out in the kitchen of my freighter.

But you've managed to suck whatever nostalgia driven fun my wife and I still had for this game out of us. Congratulations.

So, for what it's worth I guess I should thank you for saving me $15 a month.



 

[Samcuu]

The solution is having ur wife put it on the gtn for 1k credits or whatever arbitrary number and then just buying it immediately. Not a great solution but a solution nonetheless. Either that or trading it in the guild bank if u two have been in the same guild for at least 30 days. 

Anyways its a necessary evil to have the trade tax. And it's working...prices have dropped by two or three fold on every item in the game. Hypercrates were selling on fleet for 6b credits or more just several months ago, with creds just changing hands and not leaving the game at all. 

As far as fixing the gifting issue I'm pretty sure the devs have said they are trying to come up with a solution to that. I can see the outrage of maybe a stranger trying to give you something nice because it would be harder to coordinate the gtn hand off but if u and ur wife are sitting in the same room or whatever it should be pretty simple ngl. 

Edited September 22, 2023 by Samcuu

[voshara]

By putting it on the gtn don't you run the risk of losing it to someone else?

[Samcuu]

2 minutes ago, voshara said:

By putting it on the gtn don't you run the risk of losing it to someone else?

Yes but the risk has to be extremely small. Someone will have to be searching for the exact item you are placing on the gtn within the 5 seconds it takes your friend or whoever to snatch it up. That's why I'm saying if ur on voice or in the same house and u are trading an item that very few ppl are actively looking for, should never get sniped in that manner. 

[TrixxieTriss]

21 minutes ago, voshara said:

By putting it on the gtn don't you run the risk of losing it to someone else?

@R-Smith There is another work around. If both people belong to the same guild for a month, you can trade it through the guild bank because there aren’t any fees. Just check with the Guild Manager first to make sure they have it setup to do that. 

Edited September 22, 2023 by TrixxieTriss

[Samcuu]

I also just tested sending an item COD in the mail to a friend. It was an Arcan mask and those are pretty pricey. I put it in an email COD for 5 credits and it charged me a fee of 100 credits to send it. That might be a solution as well. Never sent it so idk if the receiving party would get charged an insane fee but worth a shot to give it a try if ur worried about losing the item on the gtn. 

Edited September 22, 2023 by Samcuu

[xordevoreaux]

1 hour ago, Samcuu said:

The solution is having ur wife put it on the gtn for 1k credits

Trixie has the solution. I'd never recommend for half a second someone putting something on the GTN that they've spent money on they really don't have.
The problem at the moment is that even with both players in a guild, it'd be 30 days before the guild vault is useful.

[Saeten]

Your post is laborious and lengthy and funny at parts. To say they've ruined the game is nonsensical as others have posted workarounds and fixes for your game ending complaints that are not valid. If you had asked about how to do this, or read more about the change, instead of assuming the worst, you would have had a better experience and still enjoy the game. I'm sorry you are unable to see beyond the basic "I Can't Do This Anymore" mentality. F2P and Preferred is still available to you even if you don't sub. I hope you can view this comment as a critique to your doom post and can come back to play. the community can help you.

[Samcuu]

Btw I just checked the COD mail solution and it works perfectly. Sent the Anakin armor set to a friend and put 1k credits COD. Got charged 100 credits to send and the charge was 80 credits to recieve the COD email plus the 1k asking price. So yeah just send the item COD and charge like 5 credits. Should work fine for gifting. 

Edited September 22, 2023 by Samcuu

[Samcuu]

39 minutes ago, xordevoreaux said:

The problem at the moment is that even with both players in a guild, it'd be 30 days before the guild vault is useful.

Only if they join a guild specifically for this purpose. The 30 day waiting period is so ppl can't join a guild and g quit immediately to circumvent the tax. If they've been in a guild together since they unsubbed they will be able to do the swap immediately, again as long as they have privileges. Hopefully most guilds have set up a tab in the guild bank for this purpose. 

Edited September 22, 2023 by Samcuu

[Spikanor]

first of all do you not read the patch note's each time there bring it out or expension note's.

if you have read the patch note's from 7.3.1 then you know there was a trade tax.

its the same when you not come to the forum and read the devs post about the update's and chance there are going to do.

so this part is more also your own fault for not reading the update/expension patch note's.

 

what also can help is make your own guild and have in total 8 toons in it and wait 30 day's then you can use the guild bank to trade with each other without paying the trade tax fee.

[ZUHFB]

1 hour ago, Spikanor said:

first of all do you not read the patch note's each time there bring it out or expension note's.

if you have read the patch note's from 7.3.1 then you know there was a trade tax.

its the same when you not come to the forum and read the devs post about the update's and chance there are going to do.

so this part is more also your own fault for not reading the update/expension patch note's.

 

what also can help is make your own guild and have in total 8 toons in it and wait 30 day's then you can use the guild bank to trade with each other without paying the trade tax fee.

what

its not on them that trading has a tax? casual players do not read AND should NOT need to read the patchnotes! The tax is only a thing because the devs neglegted the game for too long, having casual players deal with this... weird things is a big deal. People should not need to find workarounds like gbanks

players can suggest/complain about whatever they want, regardless of dev posts. You have no right to tell them what they can't type

why defend a bad change from bioware, stop white knighting for a company! trading tax is nothing but bad, GTN tax is good though, trading is player interaction and should be rewarded by avoiding the tax.

[Spikanor]

18 minutes ago, ZUHFB said:

what

its not on them that trading has a tax? casual players do not read AND should NOT need to read the patchnotes! The tax is only a thing because the devs neglegted the game for too long, having casual players deal with this... weird things is a big deal. People should not need to find workarounds like gbanks

players can suggest/complain about whatever they want, regardless of dev posts. You have no right to tell them what they can't type

why defend a bad change from bioware, stop white knighting for a company! trading tax is nothing but bad, GTN tax is good though, trading is player interaction and should be rewarded by avoiding the tax.

defend then what a joke you are telling.

i got 2 warnings from then and there are all about more complaining about the bugs part this game has a lot from.

and if you look is good on a other thread that somebody has make that is really defending the devs then you read i not one of then at all.

so thats part we have think clear up.

 

if you not read the patchnotes at all then its your choose but do not complain on the forum that there add something in the game without you know it at all.

this trade tax is there own fault to creat the inflation problem in the first place.

it was bioware that has boost the credit rewards a lot for to long and has also remove a lot of credit sinks from the game at the same time so its there own fault to creat it.

 

i never ever defence the devs at all since there have mess things to much up like the 7.0 expension what was a big reason i have quit back then after few weeks of the launch.

edit: i not know about you but the reason there is also maybe a trade tax is since there not like it when people give things free to other players thats why there is maybe also a trade tax to stop that also.

Edited September 22, 2023 by Spikanor

[Whykara]

The trade tax being as high as the GTN tax is dumb, I agree. GTN provides a service that makes it easier to sell your items, and no one has ever complained about being taxed for that. But direct trades, especially with the intention to sell an item, require more effort from both parties. Especially with the increasing of the GTN cap to 3bil they should seriously rethink the trade tax. I'm not saying they should completely abolish it, as this will likely result in the resurgence of a black market, but the direct trade taxes should at least be halved. This way you would still take credits out of the game, but at the same time wouldn't punish gifts as hard. And sellers would have to choose if they want to go through the trouble of chat trading to save a few bucks or just take the convenient route and post their stuff on the GTN. 

[Jazulfi]

12 minutes ago, Spikanor said:

defend then what a joke you are telling.

i got 2 warnings from then and there are all about more complaining about the bugs part this game has a lot from.

and if you look is good on a other thread that somebody has make that is really defending the devs then you read i not one of then at all.

so thats part we have think clear up.

 

if you not read the patchnotes at all then its your choose but do not complain on the forum that there add something in the game without you know it at all.

this trade tax is there own fault to creat the inflation problem in the first place.

it was bioware that has boost the credit rewards a lot for to long and has also remove a lot of credit sinks from the game at the same time so its there own fault to creat it.

 

i never ever defence the devs at all since there have mess things to much up like the 7.0 expension what was a big reason i have quit back then after few weeks of the launch.

Coming back to SWTOR after a long break is overwhelming enough, and it's supposed to be a fun exciting experience, not like prepping for a bloody job interview. This is someone's recreation time and there should be no obligation to wade through (possibly) years of patch notes just to get up to speed with things.

There's no reason for you to be so hostile and rude to the OP, other than to feel superior at being perm on the forums and knowing the game better. Well done you, have a prize.

The OP is disappointed about a game you BOTH love. If you want SWTOR to survive long into the future, you should hope it's systems are welcoming and useful to everyone, so all kinds of players with different amounts of time and expectation find it easy and fun to play.

Stop being an insufferable grumpy-pants, perhaps think of positive ways to help the OP, and encourage them back to sub next month because you're doing an utterly rubbish job of it at the moment.

Edited September 22, 2023 by Jazulfi

[Spikanor]

6 minutes ago, Jazulfi said:

There's no reason for you to be so hostile and rude to the OP, other than to feel superior at being perm on the forums and knowing the game better. Well done you, have a prize.

i only told that there have add a trade tax in the patch note's from 7.3.1 and there have been 2 dev threads about it also on the forum to give feedback about it for the first time.

if you not know about that in the first place then its more your own fault for not reading it since a lot of players have know it all and have give feedback about it so its not a suprice that a lot know about the trade tax.

that part is his own fault more.

and also we give him a lot of tips to still trade with his wife for free without the trade tax its his choose if he wane listing or not to it.

so there is no hostile and rude about it.

 

10 minutes ago, Jazulfi said:

The OP is disappointed about a game you BOTH love. If you want SWTOR to survive long into the future, you should hope it's systems are welcoming and useful to everyone, so all kinds of players with different amounts of time and expectation find it easy and fun to play.

we are all disappointend about this game we all love there are destroying by doing things it not needs.

the 7.0 expension is the best exemple to show how big the disappointend is people have.

1 hour new story line, a new armor system nobody has ask for, destroy the crafting system good, the 10 years anniversary promice, have screw up a lot of players up with there delay 1 week before launch day.

there is a long list i can add how worse the 7.0 expension is.

and also there bad habit there have with each new expension there never learn for some reason to things right from the start and not fix it few update's later when there add new things in the game.

and then i have not start about the bugs part since there not have fix most of the bugs still we have report all like the 10 year old pet bug and a lot of other years old bugs it still has.

18 minutes ago, Jazulfi said:

Stop being an insufferable grumpy-pants, perhaps think of positive ways to help the OP, and encourage them back to sub next month because you're doing an utterly rubbish job of it at the moment.

i have give him some tips to deal with it.

make a guild with your toons and wait 30 day's and use your own guild bank to trade stuff with each other without paying the trade tax its easy solution a lot have give him all.

[ZUHFB]

57 minutes ago, Spikanor said:

if you not know about that in the first place then its more your own fault for not reading it since a lot of players have know it all and have give feedback about it so its not a suprice that a lot know about the trade tax.

that part is his own fault more.

No its not, a new / returning player doesn't read the forums, there is new content and things to do, they shouldn't need to read the forums or patchnotes, nevermind finding that information isn't easy, especially not for new players!

 

1 hour ago, Spikanor said:

make a guild with your toons and wait 30 day's and use your own guild bank to trade stuff with each other without paying the trade tax its easy solution a lot have give him all.

are you nuts? waiting 30 days? Pretty sure they would rather just quit after realizing they have to wait 30 days just to avoid tax!

Imagine buying a new AAA title, but no, you have to wait 30 days to enjoy it while everybody else is playing - how would that make you feel? Miserable, like you wasted your money.

idk why you have to be so rude in everything you say, that and the fact that you didn't have to say anything... Even if you actually believe what you typed, that every player should read forums and dev tracker etc., you could've just gone on with your day instead of kicking an already down and possibly sad/angry person by telling them its their own fault.

[Spikanor]

2 minutes ago, ZUHFB said:

idk why you have to be so rude in everything you say, that and the fact that you didn't have to say anything... Even if you actually believe what you typed, that every player should read forums and dev tracker etc., you could've just gone on with your day instead of kicking an already down and possibly sad/angry person by telling them its their own fault.

if you not wane read the patch note's or any devs threads at all its fine by me.

but then not start to complain later on there have add things you not like since you not know about it from the start.

since there have been talking about the trade tax and mail tax all since may 1 from this year.

its the same with the chance there have add in the August 28 thread.

and we are now in september almost 1 month later since there have release the info about the chance there going to do so its notting new anymore.

if you not wane read the patchnote's then do that but not come back later on the forum and complain you have done something wrong since you not know about it at all since you not wane read any patchnote's that part is your own fault then.

 

13 minutes ago, ZUHFB said:

are you nuts? waiting 30 days? Pretty sure they would rather just quit after realizing they have to wait 30 days just to avoid tax!

then this thread is something for you then https://forums.swtor.com/topic/930942-remove-the-30-days-wait-to-access-guild-bank-please/#comment-9775560

 

[Pirana]

10 hours ago, R-Smith said:

Just recently resubbed to the game with my wife. Was a loyal subscriber for the first five years of the games' history. Then moved on to other games, but got the itch to come back and wife and I resubbed. Wife decided she wanted to do something nice for me and so got the headstrong apprentice armor and a black dye mod that she was going to give me as surprise gift tomorrow - only to realize that we likely can't afford the in-game taxes on the trade for her to gift it to me. We used to trade items between the two of us since she first joined the game about a year after it launched. So now she's stuck with an in-game armor she doesn't want (and can't gift to me) and so it will just sit in her inventory until hell freezes over.

You know what else will not happen until hell freezes over? Either of us buying anything on the cartel market ever again and either of us renewing our subscription at the end of this month.

Let me be clear. We LOVED playing this game together. When we both had extended vacation days, we'd sometimes spend 10+ hours doing story missions with whatever characters we played. When we weren't playing the game, we talked about the game. Made jokes about the game (Your name is Weeznod, nobody's going to take you seriously. "The sith want to destroy the Revanites - but they can't find them unless they take the taxi to the secret Revanite compound on Dromund Kas that nobody's supposed to know about. "Oh, you do have the token!", creepy space children in the sweres of Coruscant, etc. etc.) We laughed so hard sometimes, we cried. It was great. The game was great. The stories were great. The characters were great.

You've killed that.

In an effort to crush a problem YOU created by allowing gold spammers to operate from practically day one, item resellers from reselling items for over-inflated prices (really? items on the GTN for BILLIONS of credits?!!!!). You made it so we didn't have to outfit companions and dumbed down combat (who plays tanks anymore), so crafting became largely pointless, but even then, we were still having fun being back - we played around with our old strongholds, restarted new versions of our favorite characters and started exploring a galaxy far far away all over again.

But now my wife can't even give me a gift in game without you taking your cut? 

What's next utility bills if we leave the lights on in our strongholds? You're already charging for fast travel - but how about some ship maintenance fees?  

How about GROCERY bills. Bowdaar eats a lot and he's always hanging out in the kitchen of my freighter.

But you've managed to suck whatever nostalgia driven fun my wife and I still had for this game out of us. Congratulations.

So, for what it's worth I guess I should thank you for saving me $15 a month.



 

You and the wife move on, things aren't going to get better here, which continues to be true with almost every update that gets released. You missed the jacked prices on QT, notably for new players, another huge mistake, only for them to actually listen to the player base and scale the prices. Then another dropped ball with their recent map change to QT. One thing is sure, whoever runs this outfit will get exactly what they deserve, well, some of that already occurred, but the rest will follow as well.

There are workarounds as mentioned here in this thread for avoiding the penalties, but it should never come have to that. What it boils down to is extremely poor management with people that have almost no inkling on how to run a business. Move on, don't waste your money here, there are far better MMO's on the market. 

[Lord_Malganus]

48 minutes ago, Pirana said:

 Move on, don't waste your money here, there are far better MMO's on the market. 

Agree 1000%.

[Toraak]

11 hours ago, R-Smith said:

Just recently resubbed to the game with my wife. Was a loyal subscriber for the first five years of the games' history. Then moved on to other games, but got the itch to come back and wife and I resubbed. Wife decided she wanted to do something nice for me and so got the headstrong apprentice armor and a black dye mod that she was going to give me as surprise gift tomorrow - only to realize that we likely can't afford the in-game taxes on the trade for her to gift it to me. We used to trade items between the two of us since she first joined the game about a year after it launched. So now she's stuck with an in-game armor she doesn't want (and can't gift to me) and so it will just sit in her inventory until hell freezes over.

You know what else will not happen until hell freezes over? Either of us buying anything on the cartel market ever again and either of us renewing our subscription at the end of this month.

Let me be clear. We LOVED playing this game together. When we both had extended vacation days, we'd sometimes spend 10+ hours doing story missions with whatever characters we played. When we weren't playing the game, we talked about the game. Made jokes about the game (Your name is Weeznod, nobody's going to take you seriously. "The sith want to destroy the Revanites - but they can't find them unless they take the taxi to the secret Revanite compound on Dromund Kas that nobody's supposed to know about. "Oh, you do have the token!", creepy space children in the sweres of Coruscant, etc. etc.) We laughed so hard sometimes, we cried. It was great. The game was great. The stories were great. The characters were great.

You've killed that.

In an effort to crush a problem YOU created by allowing gold spammers to operate from practically day one, item resellers from reselling items for over-inflated prices (really? items on the GTN for BILLIONS of credits?!!!!). You made it so we didn't have to outfit companions and dumbed down combat (who plays tanks anymore), so crafting became largely pointless, but even then, we were still having fun being back - we played around with our old strongholds, restarted new versions of our favorite characters and started exploring a galaxy far far away all over again.

But now my wife can't even give me a gift in game without you taking your cut? 

What's next utility bills if we leave the lights on in our strongholds? You're already charging for fast travel - but how about some ship maintenance fees?  

How about GROCERY bills. Bowdaar eats a lot and he's always hanging out in the kitchen of my freighter.

But you've managed to suck whatever nostalgia driven fun my wife and I still had for this game out of us. Congratulations.

So, for what it's worth I guess I should thank you for saving me $15 a month.



 

The better solution is to be in the same guild. If your in a guild for 30 days you can use the Gbank and avoid the taxes. Just have you both on at the same time and make sure you both have access to the guild bank to withdraw items.

[LD_Little_Dragon]

'Be in the same guild' is a terrible workaround.  New players, actual brand new players, are not going to be in a guild, and with the 30 day wait period to use the bank (which is not available to ftp/preferred players without the CC unlock) then it's useless for helping player retention.  It also means that gifting your friends, who may not be in same guild, is no longer possible.  Playing games on the GTN is also time-consuming, a nuisance, and a risk. 

What exactly has taxing zero credit trades helped if there are so many workarounds?  Everything you can do with your friends then strangers making trades can also do.  Serious traders for multi-billion type items are more likely to take the time and effort to do the workarounds then someone who just wants to gift some mounts/armors/whatever to friends or strangers.

Gifting things to new players, or just giving away that ops deco to someone in your pug group, was just a nice perk to the game.  As it is I just keep things now even if I don't want them, don't need the credits for selling them, and sometimes I'll just destroy things if they're not worth the time and effort of putting them up on the GTN.

Taxing trades involving credits was fine, but taxing zero credit trades?  Incredibly bad idea.

Edited September 22, 2023 by LD_Little_Dragon

[Jazulfi]

3 minutes ago, LD_Little_Dragon said:

'Be in the same guild' is a terrible workaround.  New players, actual brand new players, are not going to be in a guild, and with the 30 day wait period to use the bank (which is not available to ftp/preferred players without the CC unlock) then it's useless for helping player retention.  It also means that gifting your friends, who may not be in same guild, is no longer possible.  Playing games on the GTN is also time-consuming, a nuisance, and a risk. 

What exactly has taxing zero credit trades helped if there are so many workarounds?  Everything you can do with your friends then strangers making trades can also do.  Serious traders for multi-billion type items are more likely to take the time and effort to do the workarounds then someone who just wants to gift some mounts/armors/whatever to friends or strangers.

Gifting things to new players, or just giving away that ops deco to someone in your pug group, was just a nice perk to the game.  As it is I just keep things now even if I don't want them, don't need the credits for selling them, and sometimes I'll just destroy things if they're not worth the time and effort of putting them up on the GTN.

Taxing trades involving credits was fine, but taxing zero credit trades?  Incredibly bad idea.

Agree agree x a million. Didn't have any like buttons left.

And the pointlessness is made worse by the glaringly obvious credit sinks available - like subscriber appearance changes etc etc - which they haven't implemented.

[Toraak]

5 minutes ago, Jazulfi said:

Agree agree x a million. Didn't have any like buttons left.

And the pointlessness is made worse by the glaringly obvious credit sinks available - like subscriber appearance changes etc etc - which they haven't implemented.

of course they won't do that. They'll never make things that cost CC's (meaning Profit for Broadsword) be changed to charging credits. Swtor was created to make a profit, so removing things that make them Real $ and change it to costing players credits would be a bad decision.

Edited September 22, 2023 by Toraak

[felleto]

The taxation is sooooo bad. My wife hates it to the core. She does enjoy the rush of tax evading through the GTN though 😆