It's time to stop forcing the Quesh Storyline onto people.

[SteveTheCynic]

18 hours ago, cannibithobbal said:

The issue is not with being forced to PLAY the mission (you can abandon it whenever), it is with not even being able to GO to Quesh to do the next step in the class story unless you are at a high enough level to pick up the mission, forcing you to do side content to level up that you may not want to do if you don't want to interrupt the flow of playing through the story straight through.

Having to go do other side stuff to level up more should be optional,

This isn't ESO.  Level Sync caps your level downwards-only (ESO raises your effective fighting level, but not you ability list), so if you don't level up enough, when you go down to Quesh (er, assuming you could, of course), you'd get rapidly slaughtered, in true Murder-Death-Kill style, by even the slightest opponent on the surface, and you wouldn't even be able to scratch their armour in return.

18 hours ago, cannibithobbal said:

but because Quesh locks you out based on level and the class story doesn't give enough xp it basically isn't.  Either class story should give more xp or Quesh quest should be entirely optional, or both, imo

The XP from the class story is, by design that someone from BioWare explained at the time, not enough.  You're supposed to also run at least the <Story Arc> missions to stay at level.

[cannibithobbal]

5 minutes ago, SteveTheCynic said:

This isn't ESO.  Level Sync caps your level downwards-only (ESO raises your effective fighting level, but not you ability list), so if you don't level up enough, when you go down to Quesh (er, assuming you could, of course), you'd get rapidly slaughtered, in true Murder-Death-Kill style, by even the slightest opponent on the surface, and you wouldn't even be able to scratch their armour in return.

I believe I mentioned already, but I have beaten level 50 stuff at level 43, it is absolutely doable to be underleveled and not get slaughtered, if you have the right build.  I am not saying it is always advisable, and I get why the game is trying to force you to be at level, but depending on build you do not actually have to be, and playing underleveled on purpose can also be a fun challenge.

 

5 minutes ago, SteveTheCynic said:

The XP from the class story is, by design that someone from BioWare explained at the time, not enough.  You're supposed to also run at least the <Story Arc> missions to stay at level.

I assumed as much, that it was clearly deliberate, but, I wish it wasn't.  Especially when you have loads of characters, you only want to play those identical planetary arc missions so many times haha

[SteveTheCynic]

3 minutes ago, cannibithobbal said:

I believe I mentioned already, but I have beaten level 50 stuff at level 43, it is absolutely doable to be underleveled and not get slaughtered, if you have the right build.  I am not saying it is always advisable, and I get why the game is trying to force you to be at level, but depending on build you do not actually have to be, and playing underleveled on purpose can also be a fun challenge.

Beating 50s at 43 is, historically, impossible because you can't (couldn't?) damage enemies if you are (were?) more than five levels below their level.

[cannibithobbal]

1 hour ago, SteveTheCynic said:

Beating 50s at 43 is, historically, impossible because you can't (couldn't?) damage enemies if you are (were?) more than five levels below their level.

It's very possible they have changed it recently, I am fairly new to the game so idk how it was in the past.  (or it's not intended that you can but currently broken?  lol always possible)  But as of now at least though I can definitely damage enemies 7 levels above me, just.... a bit slowly sometimes (and if they can heal then I am kind of screwed because I can't damage enough to make up for it lol).  I do always have companion at 50 and I pop a lot of protection and heal abilities though which helps.

[Quendorite]

On 4/24/2023 at 10:57 PM, MortenJessen said:

I dont get it. If you dont want to play the game's content, then why play?? I play chess. I cant say to my opponent; Lets start from this position (of course I am winning) because I cant be arsed to play the opening.

Because people aren't asking not to play, they are asking not to be forced to accept a mission to continue their story, regardless of whether they want to complete the mission at that point in time or not.

[Nev_aria]

You aren't required to do the planet.    You only have to accept the quest for long enough to take the shuttle planetside, then you can drop it.

[MortenJessen]

6 hours ago, Quendorite said:

they are asking not to be forced to accept a mission to continue their story

 

6 hours ago, Quendorite said:

Because people aren't asking not to play

In that order, it means precisely what you did not say: The players dont want to play the game. 

There is a reason the missions is there. It is a part of the game. Do it and move on. It is a downwards spiral, because I dont like Tython, Kaas, Taris, Balmorra, Alderaan, Corellia, Hoth, Voss.... (I actually like all those planets), but when is enough enough? Just stop complaining about content. Play Solitare instead.

[jeszikaLD]

1 hour ago, MortenJessen said:

 

In that order, it means precisely what you did not say: The players dont want to play the game. 

There is a reason the missions is there. It is a part of the game. Do it and move on. It is a downwards spiral, because I dont like Tython, Kaas, Taris, Balmorra, Alderaan, Corellia, Hoth, Voss.... (I actually like all those planets), but when is enough enough? Just stop complaining about content. Play Solitare instead.

I think you are missing some very important details here. Unlike the vast majority of planets, Quesh automatically assigns the player the Quesh Planet Arc. Other planets have the planet arc available but it is not automatically given to you. 

This could be an issue to those that use Class Mission Specific XP boosts since the planet arc quests appear the same as the class mission quests, many think they're continuing the class story when it is actually the planet arc; and in this example, a class mission XP boost would be wasted. Conversely, the planet arc XP would be earned at the normal rate, even though the player may not be aware that the purple quests abruptly changed from class to planet arc.

People are not asking for content to be removed, they are asking that the game no longer "randomly" automatically assign the Quesh planet arc and instead behave like almost every other planet and have the planet arc available to the player to pick up when and if they want to but not force it into their mission log.

[MortenJessen]

55 minutes ago, jeszikaLD said:

I think you are missing some very important details here. Unlike the vast majority of planets, Quesh automatically assigns the player the Quesh Planet Arc. Other planets have the planet arc available but it is not automatically given to you. 

This could be an issue to those that use Class Mission Specific XP boosts since the planet arc quests appear the same as the class mission quests, many think they're continuing the class story when it is actually the planet arc; and in this example, a class mission XP boost would be wasted. Conversely, the planet arc XP would be earned at the normal rate, even though the player may not be aware that the purple quests abruptly changed from class to planet arc.

People are not asking for content to be removed, they are asking that the game no longer "randomly" automatically assign the Quesh planet arc and instead behave like almost every other planet and have the planet arc available to the player to pick up when and if they want to but not force it into their mission log.

I dont even know what you try to say here?? Do quests they dont know what is because of the colour of a boost?? Do the quest, get moving, no problem. It was always there, regardless of players now being in a rush to reach "the vaunted" endgame land. Newsflash: You lot all say you dont like doing "origin" content anymore because it gets repetitive... But you are in such a hurry to get to level 80 on the umpthenth toon to spam Spammer Station 100 times for the BiS gear?? Something you have already done on a million toons before. Because it is less repetitive?? I am not sure I can follow you guys logic (if there is one), nor am I sure I want to try, because it looks to me like .... Nah.

[Ardrossan]

I don't recall where I read this but Quesh was the first planet the original team built, which is why it has a lot of associated weirdness to it: no heroics, very small planet for vanilla, no companion influence in convos (except for the class stories), and the weirdness with the inoculation. My impression is that they were testing out a lot of little ideas and then the game was finished they either forgot about it, ran out of money, or the coding was too spaghettified to mess with. Maybe all three. The latter is probably why they won't do anything about the inoculation quest. 

On 4/25/2023 at 1:07 PM, SteveTheCynic said:

Beating 50s at 43 is, historically, impossible because you can't (couldn't?) damage enemies if you are (were?) more than five levels below their level.

They must be using their lvl 50 companion to damage enemies; as you note, their toon would not be able to damage red-lined enemies 5+ levels above them, but comps are much stronger than they were when underleveling was more common. 

[cannibithobbal]

4 hours ago, Ardrossan said:

They must be using their lvl 50 companion to damage enemies; as you note, their toon would not be able to damage red-lined enemies 5+ levels above them, but comps are much stronger than they were when underleveling was more common. 

I always take a level 50 companion everywhere, 100%.  But while they almost certainly did some damage and definitely helped, I was also taking enough extra damage from being squishy that they were pretty much constantly healing me, they did not have the time to do all that much attacking, I was definitely also doing damage 😅  unless T7 actually just has a secret Emperor-destroying cannon that one shot him between constant heals or something (maybe he does?  idk, cheeky lil chrome dome).....  honestly though, regardless of whether it was me or the companion, I was still able to play and win at 6 levels under, so, I say my point about being able to play Quesh just fine if they would let us still stands 😉

(and yeah, I know they probably won't actually change anything about the Quesh mission, especially if you are right about the spaghetti code - wouldn't surprise me at all - but still, if they did it wouldn't hurt anyone and would be an improvement to people who wanna barrel through even if it means living dangerously lol  so, it would be nice)

[Quendorite]

On 4/29/2023 at 12:28 AM, MortenJessen said:

There is a reason the missions is there. It is a part of the game. Do it and move on. It is a downwards spiral, because I dont like Tython, Kaas, Taris, Balmorra, Alderaan, Corellia, Hoth, Voss.... (I actually like all those planets), but when is enough enough? Just stop complaining about content. Play Solitare instead.

Yeah, but none of those planets ask you to complete, or even accept, the planetary arc missions: they are there, and you can either do them or not. Las time I checked you can do through Kaas without the need to deal with the Revanites, for instance, without even acknowledging their existence (which then is reflected in the Revan FP and in SoR through dialogue).

 

People aren't saying "please, give us less content", people are saying "please, let us choose what content we want to engage in."

[MortenJessen]

1 hour ago, Quendorite said:

People aren't saying "please, give us less content"

Well, why 

 

1 hour ago, Quendorite said:

people are saying "please, let us choose what content we want to engage in

So you are saying people are saying "give us less content" just using other words. Because if players get to choose....  guess what??

[Quendorite]

54 minutes ago, MortenJessen said:

So you are saying people are saying "give us less content" just using other words. Because if players get to choose....  guess what??

What?

As far as I know, these things are completely 100% absolutely optional:

- Class story

- Expansions

- Planetary arcs

- Bonus missions

- Normal missions

- Exploration missions

- Bonus planetary arcs

- Heroic missions

- Crafting

- Scavenging

- Crew skills

- Operations

- Flashpoints

- PvP and GSF

- Uprisings

- Trading

- Playing space barbie

- Conquest

- Creating or being a member of a guild

- Etc please don't make me add more stuff

 

^ Are players not doing any of that just because they can choose not to? What makes the Quesh mission special that it is required, while the rest of stuff here isn't?

[MortenJessen]

17 minutes ago, Quendorite said:

What makes the Quesh mission special that it is required, while the rest of stuff here isn't?

Does not answer the question:

1 hour ago, MortenJessen said:

Because if players get to choose....  guess what??

Because if you take a look at the forum, runs a few pages back, name me ONE type of content that has not been suggested removed from the game or made optional so players can skip it at leisure... Please.

It is a slope that needs no pushing to start sliding down. So because you/the players are too focussed on getting to 80 that they wont do content, you actually remove the reason to play the game, and hence the reason for BW to make new content.

  

17 minutes ago, Quendorite said:

What makes the Quesh mission special that it is required, while the rest of stuff here isn't?

It is a natural part of the story progression. All planets are. The real difference is that back in the days before X12 EXP, you needed to be at a certain level to be able to survive progression, and Quesh is placed there. It was a sort of  a gate. Because after Quesh it got harder with chapter 2, and players had to play content to level (back in the good old days). Just because players now outlevel content from level 1, does not mean that content should be optional. See my question above.

Edited April 30, 2023 by MortenJessen
Correcting spelling and grammar.

[Quendorite]

7 minutes ago, MortenJessen said:

Does not answer the question:

1 hour ago, MortenJessen said:

I believe that right before that question there is a long list of content that's optional yet people do, though. Which answers the question perfectly: some people will do it, some won't, some will do it at some point outside of the normal flow of things, some people will ask to remove it and nobody will pay attention to that because Planetary Arcs are ingrained into the game. In fact, if it wasn't compulsory to accept, all of the people who want to get it removed wouldn't bat an eye, because they could simply ignore it.

 

9 minutes ago, MortenJessen said:

It was a sort of  a gate

What is preventing now (or back in 1.0) my level 15 character who has just got a ship from travelling to Corellia? And right now, to Ossus or Onderon? There are no gates in the game, except for that one, and it's bothersome because it's out of place. If all story planets (or at least more: like Voss, Belsavis, or Corellia, it'd make sense for those 3 to be closed until the story asks the PC to go there) had some sort of limitation we could at least argue "well, that's how the game works." But no, it isn't, so it is an artificial restriction.

[MortenJessen]

14 minutes ago, Quendorite said:

What is preventing now

Nothing.

 

14 minutes ago, Quendorite said:

or back in 1.0

Nothing.

 

17 minutes ago, Quendorite said:

I believe that right before that question there is a long list of content that's optional yet people do, though.

True

17 minutes ago, Quendorite said:

Which answers the question perfectly

No. 

Because you explain it perfectly your self:

18 minutes ago, Quendorite said:

 and it's bothersome

Attitude my man, attitude. If players get to make choices, they would not play the game at all, they would want a lvl 80 with 336 gear and a free set of "wings". Dont ever give players the choice. They are lazy. And as it is, too many players cant even play their class when they get to meet the rest of us in endgame content. Force them to play as much of the game as possible to learn. Stop complaining.

[Quendorite]

11 minutes ago, MortenJessen said:

Force them to play as much of the game as possible to learn.

Honestly, if doing every single mission out there (so all planetary arcs + all bonus arcs + all normal/exploration + all heroic missions) at least once would ensure that 10% of the players reached level 80 knowing a basic rotation, I'd be all for it.

 

It does not. 

[MortenJessen]

11 minutes ago, Quendorite said:

It does not. 

True, but then they would not reach level 80 either. Problem solved. Because next step after not learning to play, is to dump down "selected content the player wants to play for the reward" to fit the lack of abilities.