Please walk me through how PvP will be less toxic in 7.2?

[Blakinik]

Everything you said on the Livestream tells me PvP will become the most toxic cesspool ever.  You are throwing hardcore PvPers with casual players and the net result will be a bunch of Toxic try hards yelling at people who don't give a crap.  This is a recipe for disaster.

 

Please tell me how I am wrong with this?  Are you removing  win/lose and its an "everyone gets a medal!" type politically correct thing?  Will there be a "X is bullying me" button?  I'm curious.

 

Blak

[Nee-Elder]

33 minutes ago, Blakinik said:

  You are throwing hardcore PvPers with casual players and the net result will be a bunch of Toxic try hards yelling at people who don't give a crap. 

uhh  where you been?  That ^ happens  ALREADY  everyday  lol

Don't worry though, cuz the pvp *cream*  always rises to the Top  no matter what.

Edited November 9, 2022 by Nee-Elder
Reason: wonder when 'leaderboards' page go byebye

[budgetcanoee]

tbh i would assume it will get more toxic? Or maybe this update will make the ranked players leave (I probably will). Either way hope its fun for those who stay

[septru]

28 minutes ago, Blakinik said:

You are throwing hardcore PvPers with casual players

any "hardcore pvpers" are going to quit

[Llacertus]

Like 90% of the ranked players will leave, and the people that play only for pvp will unsub because you don't need a sub to pvp anymore.

[septru]

Just now, Llacertus said:

Like 90% of the ranked players will leave, and the people that play only for pvp will unsub because you don't need a sub to pvp anymore.

even if I wasn't a ranked pvper I'd be insulted by 7.2

 

PvP is competitive. Rewards should be earned with skill, not grinded with playtime.

 

Not to mention, even if you don't play PvP you can spend a couple billion credits to just "catch up." What an insult. 

[Nee-Elder]

Just now, septru said:

PvP is competitive. Rewards should be earned with skill,

i agree with you (who wouldn't? )  but i mean  c'mon  everyone knows  win-trading & speed-hacking = "skill"  for most Rankers .

[Llacertus]

1 minute ago, septru said:

even if I wasn't a ranked pvper I'd be insulted by 7.2

 

PvP is competitive. Rewards should be earned with skill, not grinded with playtime.

 

Not to mention, even if you don't play PvP you can spend a couple billion credits to just "catch up." What an insult. 

I had this same talk with a friend just now. The fact that none of the rewards mean anything now is probably the worst part. Before even if you had a bronze flag it mean you were at least an average pvper in a dying game. In this next patch it'll be worth absolutely nothing. Its worth the same of respect as the manhunter title. Literally no one cares.

[Llacertus]

4 minutes ago, Nee-Elder said:

i agree with you (who wouldn't? )  but i mean  c'mon  everyone knows  win-trading & speed-hacking = "skill"  for most Rankers .

Just because there are a few bad apples doesn't mean you chop down the whole tree though. Removing ranked just removed any reason for players to get better and work towards something of some value. The fact that this change was even considered proves bioware has completely stopped caring about pvp. I wouldn't be surprised if pvp is removed all together in 6 months to a year.

Edited November 9, 2022 by Llacertus

[Nee-Elder]

2 minutes ago, Llacertus said:

 The fact that none of the rewards mean anything now is probably the worst part.

oh you mean just like with people like me who purchased THIS--> https://forums.swtor.com/topic/925406-collector-edition-vendor-access-is-a-slap-to-collectors/

Welcome to 2022, the 'Age of Everything for Everyone'

Just now, Llacertus said:

Just because there are a few bad apples doesn't mean you chop down the whole tree though.

That's a fair point and i hear ya.

[JediMasterAlex]

9 minutes ago, Llacertus said:

Just because there are a few bad apples doesn't mean you chop down the whole tree though. Removing ranked just removed any reason for players to get better and work towards something of some value. The fact that this change was even considered proves bioware has completely stopped caring about pvp. I wouldn't be surprised if pvp is removed all together in 6 months to a year.

The problem is that Bioware completely stopped moderating ranked pvp, and they were clearly unwilling to expend ANY resources to start moderating it again. Obviously I would much rather have ranked and rewards that need to be earned. The fact that anyone can earn the new season "rewards" makes them worthless. But these changes make sense. Bioware stopped caring about pvp long ago.

Edited November 9, 2022 by JediMasterAlex

[septru]

15 minutes ago, Llacertus said:

Just because there are a few bad apples doesn't mean you chop down the whole tree though.

let me be clear. I'm disappointed that they got rid of ranked, but not mad. 

 

I'm mad that you literally get the rewards by just participating. Skill is literally irrelevant now to earning rewards entirely. 

Edited November 9, 2022 by septru

[timovdt]

like gonna repeat what i said before bioware deleted my post (twice now )

this is not only bad for pvp but pve aswel don't think this won't impact there it wil impact pve aswel as regs balace will leak into pve

and certain specs will just become completly unviable for harder hm's to nims for 99.99% of the playerbase that does not have 3 of  the best dps in the game to carry there meme class

[RikuvonDrake]

this is great for pvp, am very happy with the changes, removing ranked was a no-brainer and will benefit the whole player population, with no more class nerfs due to players performing well with them in such a narrow gameplay type like group ranked. and considering there weren't even enough eligible characters for last seasons rewards, is not really a big loss

[xxSHOONYxx]

Ranked and competitive on most games is inherently toxic. I don't pvp and sometimes i even read on gen chat on fleet people s**t talking others because of a pvp match. Case in point minutes after the pvp revamp anouncement someone posting in the forum insulting and calling for people's heads and that they should not work anymore.
If that toxicity didn't exist ranked would probably have not been removed

[septru]

Just now, xxSHOONYxx said:

If that toxicity didn't exist ranked would probably have not been removed

that toxicity literally exists in regs. 

[Nee-Elder]

3 minutes ago, RikuvonDrake said:

this is great for pvp,

, removing ranked was a no-brainer and will benefit the whole player population,

Same thing i been saying for years yep ,  most recently here--> https://forums.swtor.com/topic/925524-fixing-swtors-pvp-problem/#comment-9725213

[Faltun]

The skill you need to be good in swtor is lower by each patch, there are clones in the game for a long time, they dumb down the combat system by every patch and reduce the possible skill gap between good and bad players. Soon we re gonna have like 4 abilities 0 skill based def cd so a good player wont be able to beat a bad one, so the bad one wont get offended. We re living in a world like this. Horrible. They remove all the skill all the thinking all the planning from all the games. So bad players can achive the same things as good players without use their brain or put in any effort.

This is one of the worst thing that could happen to SWTOR. They re killing the game anyway, soon they will shut down the servers. I think for old school players like myself it would be better to see this game dead already.... This current SWTOR has nothing to do what it was in the past.

Edited November 9, 2022 by Faltun

[Llacertus]

6 minutes ago, xxSHOONYxx said:

Ranked and competitive on most games is inherently toxic. I don't pvp and sometimes i even read on gen chat on fleet people s**t talking others because of a pvp match. Case in point minutes after the pvp revamp anouncement someone posting in the forum insulting and calling for people's heads and that they should not work anymore.
If that toxicity didn't exist ranked would probably have not been removed

Toxicity will exist in any game mode where stakes are involved. The higher the stakes, the more the toxicity. The logical approach to this is usually just to limit the toxicity and impose penalties on players for bad behavior. You are not supposed to kill the whole game mode just because a minority of the players are mean to each other.  The problem with swtor isn't that the toxicity existed. The problem is that it wasn't punished at all. Most ranked players are not toxic, its just the ones that are don't get banned.

[Prapcaster]

12 minutes ago, xxSHOONYxx said:

Ranked and competitive on most games is inherently toxic. I don't pvp and sometimes i even read on gen chat on fleet people s**t talking others because of a pvp match. Case in point minutes after the pvp revamp anouncement someone posting in the forum insulting and calling for people's heads and that they should not work anymore.
If that toxicity didn't exist ranked would probably have not been removed

Literally everything you said was wrong. I've been queueing on and off ranked since it was first added to the game. Wanna know how many times people have been genuinely toxic to me? Zero times that I can remember. Wanna know how many times someone in regs has called me names or racist/homophobic slur in regs? I'd say at least 7/10 matches I queue for. Ranked has never been the problem regstars in the ranked queue have been the problem.

[Nee-Elder]

4 minutes ago, Llacertus said:

Toxicity will exist in any game mode where stakes are involved. 

The problem is that it wasn't punished at all.

So then this was just a lie or window-dressing? --> https://forums.swtor.com/topic/881858-how-to-report-cheating-and-win-trading

( And i ask that question sincerely, not sarcastically )

4 minutes ago, Prapcaster said:

 I've been queueing on and off ranked since it was first added to the game.

So have i , as a "casual"  PVPer  who plays 99% in the pvp instances on every planet.

And for me, especially as a HEALER  who gets ganked 1st  lol  ,  i've experienced just as much  toxicity in  Ranked as in  Regs.

Difference is, i enjoy it.   Nothing more entertaining than a rage-fueled  PVP'er in a video game.

[Llacertus]

10 minutes ago, Nee-Elder said:

So then this was just a lie or window-dressing? --> https://forums.swtor.com/topic/881858-how-to-report-cheating-and-win-trading

A bit of both. Off the top of my head I can think of several players caught on video either throwing, win trading, or hacking that were never banned despite reports being sent in. I can't name them because I believe it would be against the rules of conduct. But some of the are so notorious for win trading that you can google search them, and reports about their cheating will come up. I'm sure there's many more that I don't know about.

 

 

Edited November 9, 2022 by Llacertus

[limenutpen]

SR has been a problem since it was introduced in Swtor.  Toxic behaviour is the least of the problems, I would say. 

Bots, Speed Hecks, Win-Trading, Que-Syncing would be the top of the ladder, followed by other inventions by the some shenigans. 

Then there was the game issues from Swtor, QueSyncing, advantage to Steath classes since day one, and Skill-Imbalance between players that sometimes happens between the teams.

I am not surprised they throw SR under the bus, it was written on the wall since a few years, and they also said it in a stream, that they did not like how it worked. 

And recent Skill-set changes showed that SR was going to be killed.  The way we are at the moment is the only viable classes are Sins and Operatives, the rest are under the bus.... 

The game ranking community started to go down when Ranked-WarZones was abandoned.  It never got better in Arena whatever people say.

Arena is a game, which those who knew how to get around it (playing each class at good/high level is the most important asset).  And then sometimes you get that your class is OP and you can get good in this game.

What I am surprised it that BW is not trying to push some sort of TR....   But BW has since some years stop trying to care for PvP.

Some of it is there fault, and some of it is also the players base fault....

[Samcuu]

Agree with many of the sentiments here. I've never win traded in ranked, but many ranked players have admitted to me that they did so for the rewards. So as much as u want to say that ppl should be rewarded for their skill, it kind of defeats the purpose when ppl where just win trading for the rewards anyways. 

Exploits and classes being unbalanced were the biggest issues in ranked imo. I only played 2 ranked seasons religiously (mostly because I dont have time to do hundreds of ranked matches and let's be honest here the population of ranked players past season 3 was dwindling anyways, so having to sit around for pops or swapping servers in the early days to catch win traders, takes a lot of time and effort). In season 9 I was about 17 rating away from gold and started getting exploited by stealth classes who would go out of the map and avoid acid after their team had been beaten. I played about 200 matches that year and got screwed thanks to the exploits. I never played ranked seriously again. 

That's just an anecdote, but I still agree that there should be some type of leader board with extra rewards so that the ppl who care that much about having "competitive" play are rewarded.

Edited November 9, 2022 by Samcuu

[Prapcaster]

28 minutes ago, Nee-Elder said:

 

So have i , as a "casual"  PVPer  who plays 99% in the pvp instances on every planet.

And for me, especially as a HEALER  who gets ganked 1st  lol  ,  i've experienced just as much  toxicity in  Ranked as in  Regs.

Difference is, i enjoy it.   Nothing more entertaining than a rage-fueled  PVP'er in a video game.

Okay that's fair other people can have differen't experiences. But with that said what does deleteing ranked do for toxicity if you've had the same toxicity in regs? If anything this will add to it.