Please stop insulting the devs

[Sarova]

I don't really think people are "insulting" the devs, they are just wanting answers which they refuse to answer as most of us can see the handwriting on the wall. It is actually like they are killing the game but that really is not insulting the dev's.

There is a post in the PTS forums in which a member has posted something absolutely vile aimed at the Devs. I will not link to it, however it is out-of-order and the poster deserves a ban. The Devs must be super busy working on 7.0 because they've not dealt with it yet.

 

I agree somewhat with the OP of this thread; posting about our displeasure about the various changes (especially with some constructive feedback about how a change affects your character, playstyle etc.,) is fine. I'm British - we excel at queueing, talking about the weather, eye rolling about our politicians' latest shenanigans & moaning - so I'm going to moan about changes that have a big effect on my gameplay (looking at you hateful new inventory). Personal insults directed at specific named individuals are something else entirely and have no place in feedback. I've not seen this lately other than in the thread I mentioned.

[CheesyEZ]

tbf, saying someone should be fired isn't a personal attack. it's a comment on the person's performance/competence.

 

saying he should be sexually assaulted or he should die or something...well that's different. clearly, imo. but w/e.

Edited November 6, 2021 by CheesyEZ

[MystyqeofXev]

The Devs must be super busy working on 7.0 because they've not dealt with it yet.

 

Or they don't read the PTS forums.

[Ner_idia]

In all fairness - aside from "insulting" the devs - I'm beginning to think they don't play their own game..

 

That was obvious to me years ago, as many of the changes that have been put forward would never have made it to live.

[Sarova]

The Devs must be super busy working on 7.0 because they've not dealt with it yet.

 

Or they don't read the PTS forums.

I have hope! I think they do read the PTS as there have been changes in the latest update that reflected some of the feedback. Well mine anyway which was nice to see.

[SaerethDL]

we are not insulting the devs, we are just trying to make clear to them, that their actions will cause reactions from us....if their goal is to strip the game of its complexity, maybe they gotta live with the reactions and be unemployed in a few months, thats how economy works.they gotta understand we don't to play their game, but they need us to play their game to safe their jobs...

 

stop speaking for me.. and stop saying "we". I like most of these changes and I think there will be a lot of people that agree with me once they give it a chance after launch. The fact is a lot of people don't like change, the same was said about 4.0 to 5.0 and 5.0 to 6.0.. a lot of people didn't want 6.0 and I'm seeing some of those same people now defend 6.0. Lets try it out first, bioware will be the first people to know if the update brings in more subscribers or loses more subscribers, not you.

[kage_goomba]

stop speaking for me.. and stop saying "we". I like most of these changes and I think there will be a lot of people that agree with me once they give it a chance after launch. The fact is a lot of people don't like change, the same was said about 4.0 to 5.0 and 5.0 to 6.0.. a lot of people didn't want 6.0 and I'm seeing some of those same people now defend 6.0. Lets try it out first, bioware will be the first people to know if the update brings in more subscribers or loses more subscribers, not you.

 

You'd have a case if you bothered to read what he said.

[SaerethDL]

You'd have a case if you bothered to read what he said.

 

what I said still stands, re-reading it a third time won't change that.

[kage_goomba]

what I said still stands, re-reading it a third time won't change that.

 

whatever helps you sleep at night.

Edited November 7, 2021 by kage_goomba

[velvet_illusionZ]

stop speaking for me.. and stop saying "we". I like most of these changes and I think there will be a lot of people that agree with me once they give it a chance after launch. The fact is a lot of people don't like change, the same was said about 4.0 to 5.0 and 5.0 to 6.0.. a lot of people didn't want 6.0 and I'm seeing some of those same people now defend 6.0. Lets try it out first, bioware will be the first people to know if the update brings in more subscribers or loses more subscribers, not you.

 

you are free to like and play this mess, your choice. but don't I have the same choice and I don'T like it and won'T play it. And I think lots of folks feel the same. if too many feel the same the game will die out rather soon, cause it doesn'T generate enough income to keep it going.economic basics. we do not complain cause we like complaining, we do complain cause we/I care deeply about this game and want it alive and well.

[Bullyabass]

They know what they are doing and they know the risks associated with them..

 

https://kotaku.com/how-biowares-anthem-went-wrong-1833731964

[TrixxieTriss]

https://kotaku.com/how-biowares-anthem-went-wrong-1833731964

 

Touché

[casirabit]

stop speaking for me.. and stop saying "we". I like most of these changes and I think there will be a lot of people that agree with me once they give it a chance after launch. The fact is a lot of people don't like change, the same was said about 4.0 to 5.0 and 5.0 to 6.0.. a lot of people didn't want 6.0 and I'm seeing some of those same people now defend 6.0. Lets try it out first, bioware will be the first people to know if the update brings in more subscribers or loses more subscribers, not you.

 

The people I have seen in the forums are not the type just to complain because of the changes. They been here since launch and 99% of them do not like to complain, yet there are things that BW are doing that could be killing the game. What is funny is during one of the tests on PTS, I actually took the time to compare the skills on the sentinel that we have now and what we are going to have when this launch and actually said they were not bad but after the latest few posts they have killed the enjoyment for the game for me. My guild is a small guild and if double the conquest we have to get per character, what are they doing to the guild conquest. Will we be able to reach the goals to get the encryptions to unlock our rooms on our guild ship? It doesn't seem that we will. So you see it is not that everyone wants to complain, in fact most of us were ready to see what happens until the latest posts.

 

BW will never admit they did anything wrong, just not what they do. They seem to not care about anyone but maybe the ones that do nightmare operations. Gearing characters that don't do operations, good luck and yea I have tested this on the PTS as I am not one to just complain without testing it. I have 14 alts and it seems now BW wants to punish people who have alts like that and the funny part is from what I can tell there are a ton of people that have double or more what I have.

 

So maybe instead of thinking everyone just wants to complain to complain, you might look at what we are seeing they are doing.

[MystyqeofXev]

Paying customers have every right to complain.

 

If EA tied job security to subs and not CM income, Devs would be singing a different tune.

[CheesyEZ]

BW will never admit they did anything wrong, just not what they do.

this is true enough.

 

They seem to not care about anyone but maybe the ones that do nightmare operations.

no. and there is something to be said about top down systems. high end gear tiers are designed for progression raiding. they are dolled-out slowling in end-game content so that it takes longer for players to chew through end-game content. players doing solo quests cannot get the same high-end gear going out in raids because that would break the progression system...and not just for NiM. NiM is an outlier. just basic, normal/heroic/master content is the place where progression gear is so important. SM exists for "everyone else."

 

I'm not sure why BW feels the need to make all gear a grind. but they do. they've been adamant about it no matter who is in charge.

 

Gearing characters that don't do operations, good luck and yea I have tested this on the PTS as I am not one to just complain without testing it.

this is bothersome. I do not think players doing solo or sub-OPs content should receive top tier gear. however, that's a matter of gear scaling. I find locking set bonuses (or the equivalent in 7.x or any system) behind one form or another to be archaic and flat wrong. but limiting solo players to "green" ilvl "set bonus" gear while MM content grants the same set bonus in "blue" tier, and NiM grants "purple"? that's the best thing that could ever happen in the game as regards stratifying gear grinds.

 

the only problem I see is they then need to cap ilvl when someone with purple tier jumps into content designed for blue or green tier. this is an issue that WoW never figured out, and I'm afraid no matter what ppl here think about WoW, Blizzard is much better at adapting to problems, tweaking, and even making wholesale changes than BW.

 

finally, if your issue is truly about not doing Ops (regardless of difficulty level), then solos should absolutely not get the same tier gear that is dolled-out slowly for progression raiding (again, not NiM, but not that bs Conquest SM either). however, there should be access to the same bonuses and so forth. just not gear of the same ilvl magnitude. iunno what BW is doing here. like...they seem to have figured out the ilvl color scheme outlined above, but why they'd lock actual "set bonuses/legos" behind one specific content is beyond me. it's just BW being BW, and it's nothing new or unexpected from them at this point...10 years later.

 

I have 14 alts and it seems now BW wants to punish people who have alts like that and the funny part is from what I can tell there are a ton of people that have double or more what I have.

how is that not also the case in 6.x? 1-5, I had some 26 characters across 3 servers. I actively played all but 6 of them. sure. I passed gear between mirrored classes, but I still geared every class and spec (except sorc and sniper, which I just don't like the play styles). my point is this: 6.x was disastrous for me. gearing melted my credit account and my will to gear. gaining ilvl and even tech frags wasn't difficult. it was just a transparent credit sink, and different specs required different armor sets in ways I didn't even have to consider previously. iunno. maybe you're a billionaire? 6.x left me playing just a 3 classes and 4 specs. and even those weren't min/maxed with proper augs b/c jfc, that's expensive...even though I make it all myself.

[merovejec]

Devs are not stupid, but sometimes they do make strange additions to the game.

[hillerbees]

I don't see many insulting the team - in fact most of us are very fond of them and their efforts and shared passion for the game.

 

However:

 

The fact that they have just openly admitted that renown and amps and so forth are not having the intended consequences show that they do make mistakes. We are all human but the command system was poor from the get go and only got worse as it moved to renown.

 

Our time and money invested in this game is what pays the bills at BioWare and EA. They are in the entertainment industry, its their job to entertain us. If they do that successfully they gain an income stream month after month and hopefully grow their business. Its important to listen to your customers...you don't always have to agree with them 100% but you can't ignore them either. There are other games and other forms of entertainment.

 

The devs need to communicate more with us. Every time I see gold posts announcing more content or live streams allowing players to communicate directly I see see interest in the game increase...numbers present in the game swell. When there is silence in the forums and elsewhere numbers start dropping.

 

I do wish the team every success. I am fearful about 7.0 on one hand and on the other hand 10 years in we still have a game that is being worked on and that gives me hope. Back when we worried about resources going to Anthem and our game went quiet was a real low point. I am hopeful that the powers that be see we are still a strong community and that they back their players and consider strongly their actions.

 

Best of luck to them.

[TrixxieTriss]

 

no. and there is something to be said about top down systems. high end gear tiers are designed for progression raiding. they are dolled-out slowling in end-game content so that it takes longer for players to chew through end-game content. players doing solo quests cannot get the same high-end gear going out in raids because that would break the progression system...and not just for NiM. NiM is an outlier. just basic, normal/heroic/master content is the place where progression gear is so important. SM exists for "everyone else."

 

I'm not sure why BW feels the need to make all gear a grind. but they do. they've been adamant about it no matter who is in charge.

 

this is bothersome. I do not think players doing solo or sub-OPs content should receive top tier gear. however, that's a matter of gear scaling. I find locking set bonuses (or the equivalent in 7.x or any system) behind one form or another to be archaic and flat wrong. but limiting solo players to "green" ilvl "set bonus" gear while MM content grants the same set bonus in "blue" tier, and NiM grants "purple"? that's the best thing that could ever happen in the game as regards stratifying gear grinds.

 

One of the things that pisses me off the most about this new system is “ONLY” Ops players will have access to the Moddable gear vendor to be able to min-max their gear!

 

Every other player in the game will lose access to something we’ve been able to do for 8-9 years.

 

Why the hell couldn’t BioWare have added one of these BiS vendors to each gearing tree.

 

Add one for the pvpers and one for people who do conquest and one for people who play flash points. Why is it the BioWare have only given the Ops guys this option to BiS the best gear for their type of play style.

 

I think that’s where a lot of the hostility is coming from people who don’t play Ops. I know it is one of the major reasons I unsubbed and I know I’m not along.

 

The other issue for me is tying the gearing to weeklies that Bioware will reset on us if we don’t complete them in a week. Basically they will f*** over all our time spent towards our own gear progression if we can’t finish them in the time “BioWare” now designates.

 

I really don’t mind having different gear tracks. What I mind is being told what I have to play if I want to be able to customise my own damn stats. And I don’t want my time played to go to waste if I can’t finish my weeklies in a week.

 

This whole system is unjustified and unfair to the majority of the player base. That is why I have unsubbed. BioWare only pay attention when it hurts them financially. If more people protested before this launches, then maybe they will make changes.

Edited November 7, 2021 by TrixxieTriss

[GweedoBane]

They are already working on ME4 and DA4. Plus the leadership shakeups over the last few years due to the scandals havn't helped much.

 

But I agree with you, where is the business mindset of "make our players mad so they leave." compared to "make our players happy so they stay and either continue to pay money or have a higher chance of paying money." Wouldn't people go for the latter mindset? Yet so so SO many devs atm (different companies) seem to go for the former......

 

My 2cents quite a lot of designers/developers simply just won't let go of their creative dreams at the expense of everything else. Some decisions do seem rather strange (but make sense in their creative world). I akin them to being sometimes like tortured artists - their vision at all costs. Also as someone else stated I don't think they actually play their own game, or not very much anyways.

 

Another gear system overhaul.....change for the sake of change perhaps? That seems to be common in the world these days with some new guy up the chain probably wanting to make his/her mark or legacy so it's overhaul time (again). This is certainly prevalent in the corporate world.

[Dmnqwk]

Like making us stop playing 🙄

 

Where is the business sense there? Unless certain BioWare elements want the game to fail so they can personally be moved elsewhere in BioWare or EA.

 

The business sense is you, personally, stop paying while a number greater than 1 begins/continues because of it.

 

It's a common fallacy people think they are right, their opinions are correct because people they spend time with agree or that the forums are a fair demographic. Just understand that they are expecting people who post a lot on the forums to leave while those busy enjoying the game stay.

[MystyqeofXev]

Another gear system overhaul.....change for the sake of change perhaps? That seems to be common in the world these days with some new guy up the chain probably wanting to make his/her mark or legacy so it's overhaul time (again). This is certainly prevalent in the corporate world.

 

Military as well. However, there is a false premise with "change for change's sake". You're assuming one, the last guy in your seat did everything (or somethings) wrong, and two, that CFCS is going to have a net positive out.

 

IOW "shaking things up" simply to do so often leads to deleterious results.

 

Rule of thumb for new section heads, leaders, etc., unless something being done is against the law, corporate policy, or presents a safety hazard - make no changes for 30 days. See how the organization functions, who is or are the leaders, (even those not in a leadership position), observe, and listen.

 

I have never seen "we're changing things - ' because' " work out either as the person intended, or as quickly reverted back when secondary effects took place.

[MystyqeofXev]

It's a common fallacy people think they are right

 

Ignorant people think they are always right, smart people are full of doubt.

 

Those arguing against some of 7.0 changes aren't arguing from a position of correctness, we don't see the numbers (not like we did in WoW, when Blizzard shamefully tried to downplay and hide the subs hemorrhaging).

 

We also don't know the metrics they use to evaluate success. CM sales vs subs vs ?.

 

We're "arguing" because the changes are limiting choice, both in gearing and play. I'm not saying you FF14 the game (something New World should've done), but Cowboy up NOW, or pay the (possible) price later.

 

Tie the success of 7.0 to people's jobs and I guarantee systems will change.

[Elessara]

I haven't posted much lately and so I haven't said much with regards to 7.0. Heck, I haven't even been playing much lately.

 

I like the sound of the class changes .. combat styles? Whatever. I do NOT like pruning abilities. I do NOT like the sound of the new gearing system. Restricting moddable shells to just OPs seems like an asinine move. I also liked being able to get BiS gear even if I didn't need it. That said, if I like the story and I can get gear that's good enough to do the story without making it an annoying slog then I will stay.

 

I think it's a bad move restricting BiS to OPs though. And, even though I personally hate PVP, I am concerned about how this gearing method will affect those who enjoy PVP.

[jedmac]

Here is a simple insult: that 70 dollar every six month for a subscription that I paid over the last 10 years is done. Wow, what a wonderful 10 anniversary. Your changes limited players choices. What a great concept. You hide modifiable gear behind a wall. What a great concept. You don't listen to your player base. What a great concept.

[CheesyEZ]

This whole system is unjustified and unfair to the majority of the player base. That is why I have unsubbed. BioWare only pay attention when it hurts them financially. If more people protested before this launches, then maybe they will make changes.

 

when I think of "the majority of the player base," what comes to mind to me is, "oh. right. the only players still here that are for the RP and the space barbie stuff b/c this game produces actual new content about as quickly as a neutron star is born."

Edited November 7, 2021 by CheesyEZ