PSYCHOBLITZ Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 the auto guild transfer system should be stopped as keeping up a sub in times like this can be an issue also guilds should never be tied to a sub system as this system gives ownership to inactive or even low ranking members these members are that way because the GM doesn't trust them with leadership of any type usually for good reason now if a GM is gone for like 6 months i recommend a vote be sent to the officers in the guild so they can take over but for small guilds this current system is a detriment to there survival as it can lead to the random transfer to strip the guilds bank and items and then just disband it and block the GM or officers witch if the bank is striped can lead to real-world money loss as many guilds put outfit or weapons or mounts from the cartel market in the banks to give out as rewards to participating members during conquests Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike_carton Posted June 6, 2021 Share Posted June 6, 2021 (edited) A Guild Master who is planning to let their subscription lapse can promote one of the officers beforehand, can't they? Edited June 6, 2021 by mike_carton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spikanor Posted June 6, 2021 Share Posted June 6, 2021 the auto guild transfer system should be stopped as keeping up a sub in times like this can be an issue also guilds should never be tied to a sub system as this system gives ownership to inactive or even low ranking members these members are that way because the GM doesn't trust them with leadership of any type usually for good reason now if a GM is gone for like 6 months i recommend a vote be sent to the officers in the guild so they can take over but for small guilds this current system is a detriment to there survival as it can lead to the random transfer to strip the guilds bank and items and then just disband it and block the GM or officers witch if the bank is striped can lead to real-world money loss as many guilds put outfit or weapons or mounts from the cartel market in the banks to give out as rewards to participating members during conquests its a problem that has been suggest all for some time to chance it. so far what most guild masters are doing if there sub is runing out and not going to buy a new sub there going to kick all there members what are not from him out off the guild to make sure after the sub has end he keeps the controle off the guild still then lose it to somebody else that has sub. the same there are doing it when there going to take a break off the game there kick all there members out off the guild since if he is not online after 28+ day's he is losing the guild also to somebody else. so that the guild system needs to be chance good is something that has been ask all what time's since you only get more and more that guild master is going to kick all there members from the guild since there not wane lose there guild master position to make sure there still own it after there sub has running out or coming back from a break. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSYCHOBLITZ Posted June 6, 2021 Author Share Posted June 6, 2021 A Guild Master who is planning to let their subscription lapse can promote one of the officers beforehand, can't they? that would work but if u run a small guild with no officers due to size its an issue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EHKodiak Posted June 6, 2021 Share Posted June 6, 2021 No way. If you want to run a guild, be subscribed and active. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSYCHOBLITZ Posted June 6, 2021 Author Share Posted June 6, 2021 its a problem that has been suggest all for some time to chance it. so far what most guild masters are doing if there sub is runing out and not going to buy a new sub there going to kick all there members what are not from him out off the guild to make sure after the sub has end he keeps the controle off the guild still then lose it to somebody else that has sub. the same there are doing it when there going to take a break off the game there kick all there members out off the guild since if he is not online after 28+ day's he is losing the guild also to somebody else. so that the guild system needs to be chance good is something that has been ask all what time's since you only get more and more that guild master is going to kick all there members from the guild since there not wane lose there guild master position to make sure there still own it after there sub has running out or coming back from a break. exactly the system is detrimental to guilds as it forces u to use extreme measures to keep urself as the leader i have no issues with a membership needed to make a guild but it should never be a requirement to hold onto it add in the fact that it gives it to an active player of any rank rather than just keeping u and that it actually hurts small or newer guilds and it start to loose viability especially if a leader is building everything up alone then a low ranked member gets it one day and cleans them out plus if u have real money items in the bank the company and the thief are liable for any legal recourse that may arise its just not smart to take that chance for any company or publisher especially since there's a no refund order on these items and I've heard stories of guilds being cleaned out and being told by EA BW or the support team we cant help u witch is actually a lie especially if real money was involved in anyway so the smart thing to do is to retract the sub requirement and push the inactive to 3 to 6 months with a vote from the officers o who takes over or just give it to an office even if its an alt to the leader they can then reverse this without issue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSYCHOBLITZ Posted June 6, 2021 Author Share Posted June 6, 2021 No way. If you want to run a guild, be subscribed and active. some ppl don't have money to throw at a game all the time hell im lucky to have any money at all some months Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceryxp Posted June 6, 2021 Share Posted June 6, 2021 (edited) i have no issues with a membership needed to make a guild but it should never be a requirement to hold onto it Being a subscriber is not required to form a guild. There are two types of guilds in the game: subscriber and F2P. Only subscribers can lead a subscriber guild. That means that if you are guild leader of a subscriber guild and your subscription ends then you can not lead that guild and leadership will be passed to the next highest ranking sub in the guild. It is possible to convert a sub guild into a F2P guild, which can be lead by a non-sub, but doing so requires that there be no subscribers in the guild when the GL's sub ends. It may be possible to convert by promoting a non-sub to GL, but I am not certain. F2P guilds have some restrictions, which you can read about on this page. Scroll down to the guilds section near the bottom. https://help.ea.com/en-gb/help/star-wars/star-wars-the-old-republic/swtor-free-to-play-faqs/ You could test this yourself by creating a second account. Create a character on this new account, which will be F2P, and have them added to your guild. This is easier to do if you are able to log into both accounts at the same time, such as with having two computers. Now transfer leadership to this F2P character. Either you will be blocked from transferring or the guild will be downgraded to a F2P guild. If the guild is downgraded then once the sub ends on your main account you can safely transfer leadership back to your original GL character. add in the fact that it gives it to an active player of any rank rather than just keeping u That is incorrect. When guild leadership is automatically transferred it goes to the next highest ranked character (subbed character if a sub guild) in the guild. For example, the GL of a sub guild either goes inactive or drops their sub then leadership will be passed to the next highest rank. If the ranks are President, Vice President, and General then leadership would be passed to whomever is the VP, so long as they are a sub. If they are not then leadership will be passed to a sub in the General rank. If there is more than one sub then one will be chosen at random. And yes, it is random, so leadership will not necessarily be passed to the first General who logs in. Edited June 6, 2021 by ceryxp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike_carton Posted June 6, 2021 Share Posted June 6, 2021 (edited) that would work but if u run a small guild with no officers due to size its an issue You mentioned officers multiple times in your posts. Besides, the GM is free to elevate anybody at all - even non-officers - before unsubscribing. Edited June 6, 2021 by mike_carton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSYCHOBLITZ Posted June 6, 2021 Author Share Posted June 6, 2021 You mentioned officers multiple times in your posts. Besides, the GM is free to elevate anybody at all - even non-officers - before unsubscribing. yes i have a guild with no officers as the only person that was interested failed his officer test buy attempting to abuse his power and no one else wants the role Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSYCHOBLITZ Posted June 6, 2021 Author Share Posted June 6, 2021 Being a subscriber is not required to form a guild. There are two types of guilds in the game: subscriber and F2P. Only subscribers can lead a subscriber guild. That means that if you are guild leader of a subscriber guild and your subscription ends then you can not lead that guild and leadership will be passed to the next highest ranking sub in the guild. It is possible to convert a sub guild into a F2P guild, which can be lead by a non-sub, but doing so requires that there be no subscribers in the guild when the GL's sub ends. It may be possible to convert by promoting a non-sub to GL, but I am not certain. F2P guilds have some restrictions, which you can read about on this page. Scroll down to the guilds section near the bottom. https://help.ea.com/en-gb/help/star-wars/star-wars-the-old-republic/swtor-free-to-play-faqs/ You could test this yourself by creating a second account. Create a character on this new account, which will be F2P, and have them added to your guild. This is easier to do if you are able to log into both accounts at the same time, such as with having two computers. Now transfer leadership to this F2P character. Either you will be blocked from transferring or the guild will be downgraded to a F2P guild. If the guild is downgraded then once the sub ends on your main account you can safely transfer leadership back to your original GL character. That is incorrect. When guild leadership is automatically transferred it goes to the next highest ranked character (subbed character if a sub guild) in the guild. For example, the GL of a sub guild either goes inactive or drops their sub then leadership will be passed to the next highest rank. If the ranks are President, Vice President, and General then leadership would be passed to whomever is the VP, so long as they are a sub. If they are not then leadership will be passed to a sub in the General rank. If there is more than one sub then one will be chosen at random. And yes, it is random, so leadership will not necessarily be passed to the first General who logs in. odd as i could not make a guild until i had a sub Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceryxp Posted June 6, 2021 Share Posted June 6, 2021 odd as i could not make a guild until i had a sub Was your character level 10? The party leader, who will become the guild leader, has to be level 10 to form a guild. If that restriction applies to existing guilds and if you did try to convert your guild to a F2P guild as I suggested above then you will need to level up that character a bit. https://help.ea.com/en-us/help/star-wars/star-wars-the-old-republic/swtor-guild-management/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSYCHOBLITZ Posted June 6, 2021 Author Share Posted June 6, 2021 (edited) Was your character level 10? The party leader, who will become the guild leader, has to be level 10 to form a guild. If that restriction applies to existing guilds and if you did try to convert your guild to a F2P guild as I suggested above then you will need to level up that character a bit. https://help.ea.com/en-us/help/star-wars/star-wars-the-old-republic/swtor-guild-management/ i was lvl75 got a pop up saying i needed to sub to form a guild but that's besides the point my point is its a bad system that isnt needed just remove the auto transfer on sub loss as again it is an unnecessary system with no benefits Edited June 6, 2021 by PSYCHOBLITZ more info Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spikanor Posted June 6, 2021 Share Posted June 6, 2021 i was lvl75 got a pop up saying i needed to sub to form a guild but that's besides the point my point is its a bad system that isnt needed just remove the auto transfer on sub loss as again it is an unnecessary system with no benefits i know what the problem is. when you are pref or free to play status and wane creat a guild you need to find 3 other players that are also pref or free to play status. if you have 1 sub player that is helping you creat a guild then its not working since its a sub status guild then since that one guy all is sub and you are not so then you cant creat a guild. and with the status off the game now your are doomd more when you wane creat a guild if you are pref or free to play status since finding 3 other players that not are sup and not have a guild is hard then when you are sub and finding 3 other players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spikanor Posted June 6, 2021 Share Posted June 6, 2021 exactly the system is detrimental to guilds as it forces u to use extreme measures to keep urself as the leader i have no issues with a membership needed to make a guild but it should never be a requirement to hold onto it add in the fact that it gives it to an active player of any rank rather than just keeping u and that it actually hurts small or newer guilds and it start to loose viability especially if a leader is building everything up alone then a low ranked member gets it one day and cleans them out plus if u have real money items in the bank the company and the thief are liable for any legal recourse that may arise its just not smart to take that chance for any company or publisher especially since there's a no refund order on these items and I've heard stories of guilds being cleaned out and being told by EA BW or the support team we cant help u witch is actually a lie especially if real money was involved in anyway so the smart thing to do is to retract the sub requirement and push the inactive to 3 to 6 months with a vote from the officers o who takes over or just give it to an office even if its an alt to the leader they can then reverse this without issue and sadly this is also why you see some threads are been make on the forum from people that tell there got kickt from the guild with no reason and 9,9 from the 10 time's the reason is there got kickt that the guild master is becoming pref status or there going to take a break from the game for some time and not wane have any off the other members have the guild when he is taking a break or become pref status. and to take it more in general with the guild system its so old and broken more that it needs a good upgrade to become better but sadly that is something we not going to see in this game that a system like the guild system gets a good upgrade what it needs hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSYCHOBLITZ Posted June 6, 2021 Author Share Posted June 6, 2021 i know what the problem is. when you are pref or free to play status and wane creat a guild you need to find 3 other players that are also pref or free to play status. if you have 1 sub player that is helping you creat a guild then its not working since its a sub status guild then since that one guy all is sub and you are not so then you cant creat a guild. and with the status off the game now your are doomd more when you wane creat a guild if you are pref or free to play status since finding 3 other players that not are sup and not have a guild is hard then when you are sub and finding 3 other players. hmm i didnt think about that if your right thats a good catch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSYCHOBLITZ Posted June 6, 2021 Author Share Posted June 6, 2021 and sadly this is also why you see some threads are been make on the forum from people that tell there got kickt from the guild with no reason and 9,9 from the 10 time's the reason is there got kickt that the guild master is becoming pref status or there going to take a break from the game for some time and not wane have any off the other members have the guild when he is taking a break or become pref status. and to take it more in general with the guild system its so old and broken more that it needs a good upgrade to become better but sadly that is something we not going to see in this game that a system like the guild system gets a good upgrade what it needs hard. right i get that but its also a needed upgrade in the game something that would help players mostly GMs but the point of a guild is stability and making new friends or hitting high end things like late game but u need clear command chains for that stuff especially if something happens and u have to resolve it so it doesn't get out of hand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spikanor Posted June 6, 2021 Share Posted June 6, 2021 hmm i didnt think about that if your right thats a good catch if you read on this help EA https://help.ea.com/en/help/star-wars/star-wars-the-old-republic/swtor-guild-management/ you see on this part from it: Premium (Subscriber) guilds can only be led by Premium players (with a current subscription). If the Guild Leader becomes a preferred player, the highest-ranking Premium player in the guild will be promoted to Leader in their place. so thats why i think it will work the same when you create a new guild and you are preferred status player then you need to find free to play players or other preferred status player to create a guild with and that sub status players is not going to work since its then a sub status guild. what works fine if a preferred or free to play player is helping a sub status player with create a guild then you get no problems. so yea its not smart there not have added also on help EA since its missing a lot off info. right i get that but its also a needed upgrade in the game something that would help players mostly GMs but the point of a guild is stability and making new friends or hitting high end things like late game but u need clear command chains for that stuff especially if something happens and u have to resolve it so it doesn't get out of hand i have been thinking today good about it. and i think that there never will come any upgrade for the guild system will it needs it hard on a lot off points. since the game is runing on a Alpha version off the hero game engine and since thats all a problem with a lot off things and i think thats also a problem why the guild system maybe never can have any new upgrade's on a lot off points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSYCHOBLITZ Posted June 6, 2021 Author Share Posted June 6, 2021 if you read on this help EA https://help.ea.com/en/help/star-wars/star-wars-the-old-republic/swtor-guild-management/ you see on this part from it: Premium (Subscriber) guilds can only be led by Premium players (with a current subscription). If the Guild Leader becomes a preferred player, the highest-ranking Premium player in the guild will be promoted to Leader in their place. so thats why i think it will work the same when you create a new guild and you are preferred status player then you need to find free to play players or other preferred status player to create a guild with and that sub status players is not going to work since its then a sub status guild. what works fine if a preferred or free to play player is helping a sub status player with create a guild then you get no problems. so yea its not smart there not have added also on help EA since its missing a lot off info. hmm interesting thanks for that info i have been thinking today good about it. and i think that there never will come any upgrade for the guild system will it needs it hard on a lot off points. since the game is runing on a Alpha version off the hero game engine and since thats all a problem with a lot off things and i think thats also a problem why the guild system maybe never can have any new upgrade's on a lot off points. and yes that's is true but the hero game engine is pretty easy to work with or around in for any trip A dev team im sure they could easily modify it if they took the time o even find a work around with some testing (tho i would i would look into a upgrade to unreal engine 1 2 or 3 in the future after a full assessment of of cost and viability tho unreal is just a simple option for that as most are free use nowadays tho im sure dev teams know of more optimal engines they could use to cut on costs or even bring up quality of life improvements to the game)<== but this is a pipe dream like a bioware kotor remaster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ibokagain Posted June 6, 2021 Share Posted June 6, 2021 (edited) yes i have a guild with no officers as the only person that was interested failed his officer test buy attempting to abuse his power and no one else wants the role If you don't trust anyone else in your small guild to run it and pass back gm when you're back, maybe boot them and just have your toons in the guild, then problem solved. Edited June 9, 2021 by Ibokagain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spikanor Posted June 7, 2021 Share Posted June 7, 2021 and yes that's is true but the hero game engine is pretty easy to work with or around in for any trip A dev team im sure they could easily modify it if they took the time o even find a work around with some testing (tho i would i would look into a upgrade to unreal engine 1 2 or 3 in the future after a full assessment of of cost and viability tho unreal is just a simple option for that as most are free use nowadays tho im sure dev teams know of more optimal engines they could use to cut on costs or even bring up quality of life improvements to the game)<== but this is a pipe dream like a bioware kotor remaster read this thread about the game engine then you will see that there cant upgrade the alpha version off the hero engine https://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=990235&highlight=engine and that there gone use a new game engine for the game is not going to happen. and the only game engine that will work for this game is a custom game engine there need to make from scrap since company's game engine's are not good to use for MMORPG game's that need here and there some upgrade's with some systems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSYCHOBLITZ Posted June 7, 2021 Author Share Posted June 7, 2021 If you don't trust anyone else in your small guild to run it and pass back gm when your back, maybe boot them and just have your toons in the guild, then problem solved. its not a trust issue so much as a no one else wants the role issue an i vet my ppl unlike some other guilds i learn from my past leaders mistakes but this isn't the issue at hand we simply need them to remove that aspect of the auto transfer and look into extending the inactive system to 3 or 6 months then have it transfer to the officer of the guild and only the officers one by one or add an inactive vote system to the guild for the ppl or officers to install a new GM after said amount of time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkTergon Posted June 7, 2021 Share Posted June 7, 2021 (edited) its not a trust issue so much as a no one else wants the role issue an i vet my ppl unlike some other guilds i learn from my past leaders mistakes but this isn't the issue at hand we simply need them to remove that aspect of the auto transfer and look into extending the inactive system to 3 or 6 months then have it transfer to the officer of the guild and only the officers one by one or add an inactive vote system to the guild for the ppl or officers to install a new GM after said amount of time No, there are too many deadbeat GL's out there, if a GL doesn't want to log in once in 28 days, then they've no right to be GL. There's no point in extending that, a deadbeat GL is a deadbeat GL, extending the time just makes it worse for the other active people in the guild who would do better if they got it. As for officers, it's up to you to set the order that the guild will go to (assuming they are subs) If you want to hold on to your guild, you could remove everyone, unsub/let your sub lapse, then when it goes to preff guild, reinvite them all, it should (at least it did for me) stay as preff guild, with you still in charge. You might want to test that with someone you trust. But personally, if you want to be a GL you should have to stay subbed, and be active. Or just remove everyone and have it as a vanity guild. My sub is up soon, (still sitting on the fence about continuing) but the active guilds already have a system in place for someone to take over, the not so active ones, I've already removed the people I don't know, and the ones left are all free/pref players. If I'm gone before you, I'll let you know if inviting a sub in to a preff guild automatically gives them the lead. Edited June 7, 2021 by DarkTergon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceryxp Posted June 7, 2021 Share Posted June 7, 2021 (edited) we simply need them to remove that aspect of the auto transfer and look into extending the inactive system to 3 or 6 months then have it transfer to the officer of the guild and only the officers one by one or add an inactive vote system to the guild for the ppl or officers to install a new GM after said amount of time I agree that the auto-transfer on sub status change is not a necessity. If the GL drops their sub then the guild could be moved into F2P status until either the GL subs or a sub is made GL. On the subject of inactive GL's and extending auto-transfer of leadership, that is a hard no for me. As DarkTergon points out, there are far too many deadbeat GL's out there. 28-days is long enough. I have personally been in a guild with a deadbeat GL who had no interest in running the guild, they just logged in every ~25 days to retain leadership, but never responded to messages or in-game mail. I could get behind a system wherein the transfer was not automatic but one where the next highest active member, from highest to lowest rank, had to choose to usurp leadership, but the inactive time frame should remain 28-days. If I'm gone before you, I'll let you know if inviting a sub in to a preff guild automatically gives them the lead. That should not happen. The FAQ on F2P guilds says that subs can be members of F2P guilds. https://help.ea.com/en-gb/help/star-wars/star-wars-the-old-republic/swtor-free-to-play-faqs/ If one of our guild members becomes a Subscriber, will our guild become a Subscriber guild? If the guild leader becomes a Subscriber, then yes, the guild will be automatically become a Subscriber Guild. However, this does not apply if other guild officers or members become a Subscriber. Edited June 7, 2021 by ceryxp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xordevoreaux Posted June 7, 2021 Share Posted June 7, 2021 (edited) there are far too many deadbeat GL's out there This. Every time this subject comes up, its either a former guild leader who logs in and finds he's been kicked out of a guild he failed to log into for 28 days, knows he'll lose his position when he doesn't log in for 28 days, is about to drop his sub, or logs in and sees someone else is now GL who won't turn the guild over again. I logged onto the test server in Everquest 2 a few weeks ago, where back into 2010 or so, my guild on one of the live servers created a guild there. No one had logged on in seven years. I hadn't had a sub in that game since 2014. I was still GL. In that game, more than one person can have the top-most rank of guild leader, and at that rank, any one guild leader can deguild not only all the members, but the other guild leaders as well. I culled the guild's roster of all but my own toons. Seven years gone by, I don't think anyone, including the other guild leader, will feel the loss. Doesn't get more deadbeat than that. I'm still a guild leader on the live server, along with two other guild leaders. I was sole GL in that guild from 2007 - 2014. At any moment, either of the other two GLs could gut the guild for their own purposes. They have not, in all that time. It's a lonely game over there these days. Few log on. But the "main" GL, a retired veterinarian, logs on every day just because she still likes playing the game. Still pays the guild's "rent." Still invites members. She's a great GL. Of the two methodologies, EQ2's treatment of guild leaders versus SWTOR's, I prefer SWTOR's. If I'm a GL, and absent for whatever reason from an active guild, that guild deserves an active guild leader with a subscription, in other words, with skin in the game. As a GL, the most important thing to know about a guild is that it's not about you. It's about your members. It's about what THEY want, what THEY deserve, not your selfish desire to cling to power. If you want to hang on to your guild, and doing so won't burn anyone like it didn't with the people on the EQ2 test server I mentioned, do I what I did. Gut it, be happy with your choice, and be done with it. If a guild leader cares at all about the other people in their guild, the last final act of a good GL is to know when it's time to step aside, not selfishly cling to power. Kudos to SWTOR for culling deadbeat GLs. Edited June 7, 2021 by xordevoreaux Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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