This game has the worst PVP I've ever seen in my life.

[Alexandrosama]

The title pretty much says it all.

 

I had 10 games tonight, 4 wins and 6 losses, and in ALL of them one team completely dominated the other. In one game I got pulled inside the enemy team and got killed in 2 seconds. Am I supposed to enjoy a game where this is allowed?

Devs, do you really think I am going to spend money on a game where I get smashed 8vs1? Do you really think that?

 

PvP is a complete failure in this game, and I think it will die soon. Countless topics on the internet about players who left the game because of it.

 

I mean, take a class like operative of jugg. It doesn't matter what you do, you will die if they are decent and you are playing a class like sorc. Is knowing to not stand a chance against other players considered to be fun?

 

I have played this game for some time, and I think that the story and atmosphere are great. But PVP ruins everything, especially endgame where PVP is the main activity to have some "fun". I think it's a waste, with all the potential this game has... truly a waste.

 

Well that's all I guess, another player quits PVP and ends the subscription.

[DragonSire]

The title pretty much says it all.

 

I had 10 games tonight, 4 wins and 6 losses, and in ALL of them one team completely dominated the other. In one game I got pulled inside the enemy team and got killed in 2 seconds. Am I supposed to enjoy a game where this is allowed?

Devs, do you really think I am going to spend money on a game where I get smashed 8vs1? Do you really think that?

 

PvP is a complete failure in this game, and I think it will die soon. Countless topics on the internet about players who left the game because of it.

 

I mean, take a class like operative of jugg. It doesn't matter what you do, you will die if they are decent and you are playing a class like sorc. Is knowing to not stand a chance against other players considered to be fun?

 

I have played this game for some time, and I think that the story and atmosphere are great. But PVP ruins everything, especially endgame where PVP is the main activity to have some "fun". I think it's a waste, with all the potential this game has... truly a waste.

 

Well that's all I guess, another player quits PVP and ends the subscription.

 

I disagree PVP is the main activity at end game in a story based MMO....but regardless, I'm sure it is yours and others main source of fun. It is not very balanced because Chris thinks everyone from level 1-74 should be grouped together. Plus unless u have equal power, it will never be balanced.

[ALaggyGrunt]

The main purpose of PvP is for you to get a bunch of sadistic friends and use this gear you and your sadistic friends have farmed in order to melt pug faces.

 

For this purpose, PvP works wonders.

[Sappharan]

The title pretty much says it all.

 

I had 10 games tonight, 4 wins and 6 losses, and in ALL of them one team completely dominated the other.

 

Thank goodness for the deserter debuff! Imagine how terrible the games would be without it? (dripping sarcasm)

 

The deserter debuff is the first thing that needs to go, imo. Class balance needs to be addressed (operatives in particular are far too powerful in PvP, Vanguards, Mercenary survivability, sniper mobility), matchmaking, numbers farmers, and then, of course, there is the engine which will earn players deserter debuffs just cuz...

 

There are so many issues with PvP in general in this game...it is fun...but it's every bit as frustrating as it is fun, and that should not be.

[TrixxieTriss]

Thank goodness for the deserter debuff! Imagine how terrible the games would be without it? (dripping sarcasm)

 

The deserter debuff is the first thing that needs to go, imo. Class balance needs to be addressed (operatives in particular are far too powerful in PvP, Vanguards, Mercenary survivability, sniper mobility), matchmaking, numbers farmers, and then, of course, there is the engine which will earn players deserter debuffs just cuz...

 

There are so many issues with PvP in general in this game...it is fun...but it's every bit as frustrating as it is fun, and that should not be.

 

They can keep the debuff if they fix everything else that makes the debuff arduous.

[HiddenPalm]

Warzones for level 75 is endgame content. Like operations or chapters. Depending on the players, the warzone can be story mode easy, veteran mode routine or master mode challenging. It's all up to the level of AI if you will in your team and your enemy team.

 

You mentioned your sorc died in two seconds. And blamed the enemy for playing their best. But you're also exaggerating. You weren't fighting 8 players by yourself. Unless the other 7 players in your team were just left alone to score the huttball or cap all the nodes, which in that case you were skillfully kiting the enemy team away from the objectives so your team can win. But that my friend is unlikely based on whay you wrote.

 

This isn't vetmode flashpoints or heroics. You're playing other players. The players who know their abilities ,escapes, interrupts, stuns, buffs, dots, hots, cleanses, taunts, raid buffs, ability procs, understand their set bonuses and tacticals and combat proficiencies are the players with the advantage.

 

A sorc doesn't have good defenses, but it has great abilities to prevent damage. You need to know your escapes, and the objectives of the map. Recently Mark Biggs did an excellent video on how sages and sorcs can survive in ranked warzones. Look it up on YouTube. He does excellent videos for pvp'rs.

 

SWTOR's warzones are not broken. But there are plenty of broken players. Being a winner in warzones is an art much like chess. Know your stuff, and use your stuff. Know your enemy and take advantage of their weaknesses. Don't come on here accpecting us to be npcees. We are tricky, nasty, mean, brutal and devious. And I challenge you to improve your know how and tame us. Welcome to the endgame.

 

If you need a Guild to help you improve and understand warzones look up <The Underground Jedi Movement> or the <The Sith Freedom Movement> on the Satele Shan server. I'll walk you through the maps and show you some pointers. I've helped many pve'rs find the fun and magic in warzones.

[Raansu]

The title pretty much says it all.

 

I had 10 games tonight, 4 wins and 6 losses, and in ALL of them one team completely dominated the other. In one game I got pulled inside the enemy team and got killed in 2 seconds. Am I supposed to enjoy a game where this is allowed?

Devs, do you really think I am going to spend money on a game where I get smashed 8vs1? Do you really think that?

 

PvP is a complete failure in this game, and I think it will die soon. Countless topics on the internet about players who left the game because of it.

 

I mean, take a class like operative of jugg. It doesn't matter what you do, you will die if they are decent and you are playing a class like sorc. Is knowing to not stand a chance against other players considered to be fun?

 

I have played this game for some time, and I think that the story and atmosphere are great. But PVP ruins everything, especially endgame where PVP is the main activity to have some "fun". I think it's a waste, with all the potential this game has... truly a waste.

 

Well that's all I guess, another player quits PVP and ends the subscription.

 

This game is over a decade old. Did you really think you could just hop into pvp and head bang the keyboard and do well? It takes time to learn the game. Don't just queue expecting wins and kills to be handed to you.

[Craydingus]

They can keep the debuff if they fix everything else that makes the debuff arduous.

 

Agreed, the debuff is fine. The tendency for certain maps to be spammed, the losses-don't-count mission progression, and the matchmaking algorithm that was developed by an inbred orangutan can all go.

[Raansu]

Agreed, the debuff is fine. The tendency for certain maps to be spammed, the losses-don't-count mission progression, and the matchmaking algorithm that was developed by an inbred orangutan can all go.

 

The daily is fine.

[Craydingus]

The daily is fine.

 

I'm not against there being some incentive to win, but Zero points for losing is draconian. "L2P Scrub," and various other arguments that aim to treat casual mode PvP in an MMO as more like a "how tough are ya" contest than, well, casual mode PvP in an MMO, are not justifications thereof. There are too many factors outside of an individual player's control to skunk people for a loss, like having a lot of new players, or players who are begrudgingly PvPing for other goals (thanks, Galactic seasons) on your team, being pitted against a team that is superior in ways that simply can't be overcome, or facing an enemy team whose composition is far more advantageous for a specific map, EG, going against a team of Jugg Tanks and Conc ops in huttball.

 

Maybe a 2:1 win-to-loss-point-ratio isn't good enough motivation. Maybe 5:1 like the old ranked missions would be the right balance of incentive to win without telling people with bad RNG to go F**k themselves.

[-Bob-]

People like this are an example of why participation medals were complained about and removed from WZs.

 

No I would recommend that ALL players that do not like PvP join ALL pvp matches just to piss off the PVPers. I will gladly mess up all the PvP I can since BW insists on making me PvP.

 

Call it my revenge for PvPers screwing up PvE play in the game. If you don't like it complain to BW.... I don't care.

[Sappharan]

They can keep the debuff if they fix everything else that makes the debuff arduous.

 

If I were in charge, and of course, I am not, I would get rid of the deserter debuff first. Then I would address everything else (and there is a lot), THEN I would reinstate it on a trial basis...beginning with matchmaking. A longer wait with higher quality games would be preferable to lots of extremely lopsided games. I wouldn't just institute some garbage one-size-fits-all hamfisted solution to a problem that was not all that bad to start.

 

Make no mistake, deserters are annoying, but desertion was not nearly as common in my experience as some claim. Further, and even MORE annoying is loading into a backfill, more often than not it is a lost cause. That is worse because now players are trapped in a suck fest for the duration.

 

What I am getting at is, even though I seem to be completely against the deserter debuff (kinda), your position on the whole thing I would find a LOT better than what we have now. I hate what we have now...so much so I have stopped playing regs errr regularly.

 

I keep posting because it is better than pulling out my hair in frustration.

Edited May 26, 2021 by Sappharan

[TrixxieTriss]

If I were in charge, and of course, I am not, I would get rid of the deserter debuff first. Then I would address everything else (and there is a lot), THEN I would reinstate it on a trial basis...beginning with matchmaking. A longer wait with higher quality games would be preferable to lots of extremely lopsided games. I wouldn't just institute some garbage one-size-fits-all hamfisted solution to a problem that was not all that bad to start.

 

Make no mistake, deserters are annoying, but desertion was not nearly as common in my experience as some claim. Further, and even MORE annoying is loading into a backfill, more often than not it is a lost cause. That is worse because now players are trapped in a suck fest for the duration.

 

What I am getting at is, even though I seem to be completely against the deserter debuff (kinda), your position on the whole thing I would find a LOT better than what we have now. I hate what we have now...so much so I have stopped playing regs errr regularly.

 

I keep posting because it is better than pulling out my hair in frustration.

 

Logic ^^ in a non-logical developed game. You and I and plenty of other players can see the logic behind an approach like yours.

What amazes me is coders and programmers have to understand logic to make this stuff work. But they fail at the most basic logic when making changes or implementing new things. It’s akin to not doing basic maths to come to an answer. 1+1=2 not 1+1= pink elephant.

[-Bob-]

Logic ^^ in a non-logical developed game. You and I and plenty of other players can see the logic behind an approach like yours.

What amazes me is coders and programmers have to understand logic to make this stuff work. But they fail at the most basic logic when making changes or implementing new things. It’s akin to not doing basic maths to come to an answer. 1+1=2 not 1+1= pink elephant.

I could be wrong but i'm pretty sure the people who write the code/program the content in the game, are just doing what they're told to do, other people who are more detached from what is going on are making the calls, the money managers.

[TmoneyTime]

Lets really clear up some things,

 

This is completely a L2P argument.

 

There is no so called skill at all in this game, everything revolves around a gcd and tab targeting. There is no aim that needs to be done its all completely knowledge based. Heaven forbid that in system designed to be used in a specific way (class rotations, dcds, etc) That most people refuse to use the system, want to just do whatever and player their way.

 

Its like playing checkers then saying well I dont like the games rules, so please change them I cant stand being bad. Sorry to all care bears but it dosn't work that way. Go learn your rotation, learn how to key bind, learn what dcds to use, learn what others classes do and how to counter them, and if you dont want to don't complain about the system in place. That is solely a you problem. Space Barbie might be more your speed.

[ALTHEORUS]

PVP is fun, matchmaking is bad and i can only guess is intentional bad because people doing and managing this games are far from stupid, we are the lab rats and the forum is just a place to vent and keep playing. I am on deserter buff now spending quality time here

[Sappharan]

Lets really clear up some things,

 

This is completely a L2P argument.

 

There is no so called skill at all in this game, everything revolves around a gcd and tab targeting. There is no aim that needs to be done its all completely knowledge based. Heaven forbid that in system designed to be used in a specific way (class rotations, dcds, etc) That most people refuse to use the system, want to just do whatever and player their way.

 

Its like playing checkers then saying well I dont like the games rules, so please change them I cant stand being bad. Sorry to all care bears but it dosn't work that way. Go learn your rotation, learn how to key bind, learn what dcds to use, learn what others classes do and how to counter them, and if you dont want to don't complain about the system in place. That is solely a you problem. Space Barbie might be more your speed.

 

That is your perspective.

 

Comparisons to checkers or chess are false equivalencies as there are multiple classes, each with its own set of abilities. In either checkers or chess the rules have extremely low variance. AFAIK, the only difference between the two sides are who goes first, and the position of the queen and king respective to the color played. The queen always goes on her colored square. That's it. The pieces and how they interact with one another are all governed by the same rules for both players, and each player is able to be fully aware of the board state at all times. Not so in ToR PvP. Between stealth, the different classes and their abilities, and information overload it is impossible to be fully aware of the state of the warzone at any given time. The classes each have rules that govern how they are played, but with 8 different classes, the rules (abilities) between each are quite varied. Furthermore, anticipation of what will come next, knowing what to use in a given situation, situational awareness, learning what information is important and what is not, and reacting to combat situations quickly and efficiently are all skills that are acquired over time.

 

For example being stunned and electing whether to break when resolve is not full can depend on a lot of factors. What is your health? Is anyone attacking you? What is target's health? How many are around you? Can you get away? If not, can you immediately apply cc immunity? If you don't break, what could happen? If you do, what could happen? Do you have a healer? Do you have dcds active while stunned? Does the stun negate a dcd (looking at you, Saber Ward)?

 

Sometimes you don't want to break even when resolve IS full because there might be an electro net that has not been used. Knowing these things and NOT panicking is yet another facet to the skill required for PvP.

 

Most jobs require some level of skill, and some require a high degree of skill (scientists, computer scientists, engineers, medical personnel, and so on). Skill is the ability to do something well.

 

L2P? Maybe, but don't pretend that it doesn't take skill. In point of fact, you were defining skill just after denying it's necessity for the game. Just...wow.

Edited May 28, 2021 by Sappharan

[TrixxieTriss]

I could be wrong but i'm pretty sure the people who write the code/program the content in the game, are just doing what they're told to do, other people who are more detached from what is going on are making the calls, the money managers.

 

Oh, I agree the designers and monetisation manager often don’t code, but people like ChrisS does and he should know better.

[-Bob-]

Oh, I agree the designers and monetisation manager often don’t code, but people like ChrisS does and he should know better.

 

Based off of everything that i've read about him on this forum, I get the impression that he is completely absorbed into being one of the cool kids because everyone is chatting him up on discord. He is too important for these forums, his real fanbase is over there so he doesn't have time to really do his job, just keep the sycophants happy.

[Ibokagain]

They can keep the debuff if they fix everything else that makes the debuff arduous.

 

You're still alive that's great! How's Aussie life?

[TrixxieTriss]

You're still alive that's great! How's Aussie life?

 

Cold at the moment, it’s winter

[Nickodemous]

Based off of everything that i've read about him on this forum, I get the impression that he is completely absorbed into being one of the cool kids because everyone is chatting him up on discord. He is too important for these forums, his real fanbase is over there so he doesn't have time to really do his job, just keep the sycophants happy.

 

Bob, this could be one of the most epic posts, of epics posts, you have dropped on these forums. Made me laugh!

 

Because it so true.

 

I will say I do agree with the lock out. It has changed regs.

Edited June 1, 2021 by Nickodemous

[JediMasterAlex]

Really? You are back attacking the forums after all the rubbish posted on discord lately 😉

 

Yeah, to be honest, whatever lows the forums may reach, it's not even close to the lows of theorycrafters, where you have solow, brant, lethtoxic, etc on alts spamming nonsense, then nikana posting on multiple accounts pretending not to be nikana. Granted, these periods are relatively rare thankfully, but when they happen it's ridiculous lol.

[TrixxieTriss]

Yeah, to be honest, whatever lows the forums may reach, it's not even close to the lows of theorycrafters, alts spamming nonsense, then N posting on multiple accounts pretending not to be N. Granted, these periods are relatively rare thankfully, but when they happen it's ridiculous lol.

 

Yeah, you’re right. Enough to put off legitimate users of that discord reading it. I’ve noticed a steep decline of “real use” lately. What happened to the project the guys were doing to upload ranked stats? Did RL slow it down or they lost interest. Haven’t heard anything for a few weeks.

Edited June 1, 2021 by TrixxieTriss

[-Bob-]

Bob, this could be one of the most epic posts, of epics posts, you have dropped on these forums. Made me laugh!

 

Because it so true.

 

I will say I do agree with the lock out. It has changed regs.

 

I'm glad i could help someone smile

If you see me in game, say hey!