Khoranth Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Agreed - and "not game-breaking for me" right now hasn't yet included high level pvp or raids, where this issue would be even more critical. I think it just feels SOOOOO close; so the hyperbole doesn't mean the game will be or is a failure - it's just, as you said, might not live up to the POTENTIAL there. This one fix makes it have a chance to be amazing. YEah it doesnt bother me much questing and doing easy group content, but ive already given up on PVP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allocater Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 (edited) Hey guys, I just tested a little with the smuggler, and my conclusion is: it is not an engine issue. SWTOR is perfectly able to deliver a better responsiveness. Here is what I did: -Charged Burst-Tab to different target while casting-Spam Flurry of Bolts expected&delivered result:-Both shots go off at the same time to both target Now the other test:-Charged Burst-Tab to different target while casting-Thermal Grenade expected:-shots at target 1, grenade at target 2 at the same time delivered:-shots at target 1, afterwards grenade at target 2 Soooo, it seems that Flurry of Bolts is a hight-priority-action that ignores running animation and shots anyway. But thermal grenade is a low-priority-action that waits for the running animation to finish before executing. So BW just needs to change all actions to this high-priority-action like Flurry of Bolts. (or Flurry of Bolts works because its animation is the same as the running animation, in either case: ignore running animation, execute immediately is the solution) Edited December 30, 2011 by allocater Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnyBigBoss Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Played my mercenary to 34, spent about 60hours on him, now I've got the 1 hour queue everytime I try logging on, so I rolled a marauder, and man does this bring me back to the WAR days. Choppy melee and getting stuck in animations, this is hardly any better than what WAR was like. Only positive is the fact that they "aknowledge" the problem and are working on it. Though I doubt there'll be a fix considering WAR's been the same since launch. Yup. This game is going to limp along like WAR, with a few more subs because of its IP. I'm 100% sure of it. Why? I've seen several highly-anticipated MMOs come and go over the years that got combat wrong and were never able to make it even SLIGHTLY better. BioWare is in trouble because the FOUNDATION of this game is flawed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ckps Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 This is how i feel exactly ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samdbtto Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Hey guys, I just tested a little with the smuggler, and my conclusion is: it is not an engine issue. SWTOR is perfectly able to deliver a better responsiveness. Here is what I did: -Charged Burst -Tab to different target while casting -Spam Flurry of Bolts expected&delivered result: -Both shots go off at the same time to both target Now the other test: -Charged Burst -Tab to different target while casting -Thermal Grenade expected: -shots at target 1, grenade at target 2 at the same time delivered: -shots at target 1, afterwards grenade at target 2 Soooo, it seems that Flurry of Bolts is a hight-priority-action that ignores running animation and shots anyway. But thermal grenade is a low-priority-action that waits for the running animation to finish before executing. So BW just needs to change all actions to this high-priority-action like Flurry of Bolts. (or Flurry of Bolts works because its animation is the same as the running animation, in either case: ignore running animation, execute immediately is the solution) There is truth in this I've tested and recorded this this shows the animation issues can be corrected but there is still a ton more that needs fixing outside animations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weaponxr Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 This needs to be on high priority on fix. Or else they will start losing customers . btw I love this game but this is just killing me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kishiko Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Yes there is an ability delay. I have experienced it many times. I am glad to hear they are working on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red-Patriot Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 (edited) Posting in this thread because I completely agree with the OP. I thought I was okay with it in beta but after playing the game a while longer at launch I've decided this is unacceptable, in warzones especially. Animations should NEVER override control of the character or the person playing it, period full stop. Edited December 31, 2011 by Red-Patriot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xcore Posted December 31, 2011 Author Share Posted December 31, 2011 There is truth in this I've tested and recorded this this shows the animation issues can be corrected but there is still a ton more that needs fixing outside animations. I have no doubt it can work, I've plenty of times done combos and chains of abilities as well as held a decent rotation... Its still not as fluid and responsive but very close to WoW, but then... you have these times where 2x Instant Abilities that don't trigger GCD + another instant following those two takes upwards of 4 seconds instead of 2 ish "max". Georg is gonna have to dig deep with the Team on this one, hope they don't: A) Give up B) Pretend its fine C) CU or NGE <--- huehuehue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnyBigBoss Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Yes there is an ability delay. I have experienced it many times. I am glad to hear they are working on it. They never said they're working on it. All we heard is one of their designers say they've noted that people have reported it. I foresee nothing happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magic_pants Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 I just want to add that I love this game to death but this is starting to really ruin my day. If it's not fixed within a month from now I'm going to have to take a break until they fix it (or don't, in which case I won't return) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allocater Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 One funny way to prove that the "Take Cover" delay is in addition to lag, you have to press&hold the walk-forward (W) key at the same time as the Take Cover (2) key. Now since Take Cover stops the char you can see how far you can walk, before Take Cover is actually activated. That is the delay. So your move-forward is executed way before Take Cover every single time, even though lag is supposed to be equal for both. *best do it without a coverspot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fallenvirtues Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 I have no doubt it can work, I've plenty of times done combos and chains of abilities as well as held a decent rotation... Its still not as fluid and responsive but very close to WoW, but then... you have these times where 2x Instant Abilities that don't trigger GCD + another instant following those two takes upwards of 4 seconds instead of 2 ish "max". Georg is gonna have to dig deep with the Team on this one, hope they don't: A) Give up B) Pretend its fine C) CU or NGE <--- huehuehue I dont know homie...I think this thread getting to the size that it has and seeing how important it is to the people being effect (whither teeny, slightly, or severely) and etc, I really cant see them not taking this issue seriously...I think they realize that a decent amount of people are having a big problem here and thats the last thing they want for a game they worked so hard on and has so much damn potential. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndreBisigCH Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 And still supporting OP. Why is BW showing no interest at al, what so ever, to this issue? Maybe it's some sort of core coding problem, holy crap I would't like messing with the event management core coding... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fallenvirtues Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 And still supporting OP. Why is BW showing no interest at al, what so ever, to this issue? Maybe it's some sort of core coding problem, holy crap I would't like messing with the event management core coding... Ummm they did...Wasnt necessarily the response we all hoped for, but they let us know that they know and they are taking a peeksy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fallenvirtues Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 (edited) My suggestion, though I know you guys are extremely annoyed with your situation, at least give them some time to investigate and iron it out.. You waited a ultra long time for this game to come out, why give up after the first 30 days...I guarantee you they are gonna TRY and fix every problem there is...Not saying they will be successful with everything, but they will try fo sho! EDIT: And keep in mind...Even if you tested the crap out of something doesnt mean once it hits the masses that problems wont happen regardless...I sell cars for a living and believe me when that "Brand new model" comes out, their is always recalls and problems...Even though they been working on the car for a long time, road tested the hell out of it, and most of the components are probably from previous models, THEY STILL @#$% UP!!! Edited December 31, 2011 by fallenvirtues Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isende Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 fallen? LOVE your siggie!!! just had to say! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xcore Posted December 31, 2011 Author Share Posted December 31, 2011 I dont know homie...I think this thread getting to the size that it has and seeing how important it is to the people being effect (whither teeny, slightly, or severely) and etc, I really cant see them not taking this issue seriously...I think they realize that a decent amount of people are having a big problem here and thats the last thing they want for a game they worked so hard on and has so much damn potential. Yea that makes sense of course and I would wager that its true but we have had no official word on their "thoughts" really. A Ghostcrawler would actually share opinion/views etc. without much of a problem. We just got a very vague acknowledgment, mind you its still an acknowledgment and thats great but I for one am not quite sure where "they " stand on this issue so based on that how should I know where "I" stand on this. I'm one foot out the door basically, its real easy to have me come fully inside... just say something. I really see Bioware Developers and "Higher Ups" as a "Corporate Firm" kind of thing. I don't feel much of a human connection. With Blizzard there is much more of a Developer to Player connection I find, you have Blizzcon, "Many" different Blogs (addressing REAL issues and "understanding" the real issue at the Top level as well as casual level) by Developers, Blizzard Devs post on hard topic threads on the forums on a regular basis (especially GC) with in depth views and opinions (even negative things) etc. I don't mean to divert from the Responsiveness subject at hand but it ties into why I feel insecure about it currently. In the end I see Blizzard as Hardcore "Gamers" making high quality games not giving a f*** about how long it takes and what it costs. I know thats not exact reality but that is the perception. I see Bioware as EA's little project for big cash, I don't feel the passion. If there was passion and care, there would be posts here on this forum... not on reddit for heaven's sake. - Perhaps this is because Blizzard Devs come from a Hardcore Playing background in EQ and well I think Bioware Devs come from... something incredibly casual seemingly?. Again, these are "my perceptions" formed by the actions I see Bioware taking. Of course these could be 100% wrong, or right... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fallenvirtues Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 fallen? LOVE your siggie!!! just had to say! hahah ty!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samdbtto Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 I have no doubt it can work, I've plenty of times done combos and chains of abilities as well as held a decent rotation... Its still not as fluid and responsive but very close to WoW, but then... you have these times where 2x Instant Abilities that don't trigger GCD + another instant following those two takes upwards of 4 seconds instead of 2 ish "max". Georg is gonna have to dig deep with the Team on this one, hope they don't: A) Give up B) Pretend its fine C) CU or NGE <--- huehuehue Agreed. My mindset now is to casually level to 50 and if there isn't something developing or changes already have been made by the time I cap I'm leaving. I can't go back to WoW so this is really sad for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xcore Posted December 31, 2011 Author Share Posted December 31, 2011 I should say overall I am much more of a fan of Blizzard and CCP Development Team and Company in general. They handle communication to customer base much better. This is the scale I see: From my experience with their Games/Devs/CSRs Blizzard CCP ? ? ? ? Bioware ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? SOE <--- /rageface Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fallenvirtues Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Yea that makes sense of course and I would wager that its true but we have had no official word on their "thoughts" really. A Ghostcrawler would actually share opinion/views etc. without much of a problem. We just got a very vague acknowledgment, mind you its still an acknowledgment and thats great but I for one am not quite sure where "they " stand on this issue so based on that how should I know where "I" stand on this. I'm one foot out the door basically, its real easy to have me come fully inside... just say something. I really see Bioware Developers and "Higher Ups" as a "Corporate Firm" kind of thing. I don't feel much of a human connection. With Blizzard there is much more of a Developer to Player connection I find, you have Blizzcon, "Many" different Blogs (addressing REAL issues and "understanding" the real issue at the Top level as well as casual level) by Developers, Blizzard Devs post on hard topic threads on the forums on a regular basis (especially GC) with in depth views and opinions (even negative things) etc. I don't mean to divert from the Responsiveness subject at hand but it ties into why I feel insecure about it currently. In the end I see Blizzard as Hardcore "Gamers" making high quality games not giving a f*** about how long it takes and what it costs. I know thats not exact reality but that is the perception. I see Bioware as EA's little project for big cash, I don't feel the passion. If there was passion and care, there would be posts here on this forum... not on reddit for heaven's sake. - Perhaps this is because Blizzard Devs come from a Hardcore Playing background in EQ and well I think Bioware Devs come from... something incredibly casual seemingly?. Again, these are "my perceptions" formed by the actions I see Bioware taking. Of course these could be 100% wrong, or right... Very true and I understand...I do believe though the fact that you guys backed it up with videos helped a lot...They arent just taking your word for it you know I think whats gonna make it hard is the fact that SOME of us might only have half and not the whole problem thats going on..I hope that doesnt prolong the "investigation"..Makes it a lot easier when its the same scenario for everyone you know P.S: Please no "You have it, you just dont notice it" comment...At home on my desktop PC, I am able to fire off abilities as my GCD's end with no problem..A delay might happen to a small degree here and there, but its not really noticeable....In PvP, I do have a problem with abilities not firing off when I hit the button and I do notice a delay sometimes there, but that only seems to happen when massive @#$# is going on and FPS drop..Or like a stuttering if you will My laptop now is a different story...I been trying to produce this problem since I got into this thread and my laptop experiences it a lot and I'm pretty sure part of it is hardware, but the other part is definitely the UI/Responsiveness Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triskil Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 If you care about this game and this issue please don't let this thread (and continuations of this thread) drop off the first page until its fixed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rukhh Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Just posting to support the thread. As a melee char, I'm a bit of a button spammer, so I feel this a lot. The more recognition we give to this thread, hopefully the higher up the priority list it goes for BW development. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Itukaaj Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 (edited) So far my experience is stuns are what wins in PVP this delay is getting me killed and causing me to blow cool downs too late. This is a quality of life issue in a major way. I enjoy the PVE but I came to PVP. I have to be able to react to stealthers etc very quickly. My overload is wasted if by the time the ability hits my target already passed the fire I was gonna blow him into in huttball. I have had things queue only to see them not happen till the target is out of "effective" range. Then go off causing me to now be on a cd timer. Still having fun but this could be a serious issue and I will have a lot less patience with my money at 50 then I do now. I hate Ghostcrawler and so I don't want to go back to wow but I will save my money for Titan. And Bioware Titan is what you are really up against if you can't bury wow you just wasted5 years. Edited December 31, 2011 by Itukaaj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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