Literally no reason to play anything but Deception Assassin

[Aetideus]

Yep, ok, keep doubling down on how much more too Nerf Sins. Would you like a buff to your class while they are at it so that you don’t have to worry about learning to play or any other class that’s not your own being a threat to you? And you had the audacity to derided my earlier post and accuse me of looking foolish :rolleyes:

 

Just read the peoples' comments and stop deluding yourself. Deception is the FOTM. Nothing new for Swtor.

[Jinre_the_Jedi]

How are you stopping them from stealthing out and healing to full? A lucky force storm? That's obviously not reliable.

 

 

 

You act like a sin can't do damage after the opener. Let's say I don't break or phase, so I'm at 40% and the sin is at 100%. Then the sin pops shroud so I can't even damage the sin and it keeps attacking me. I'm dead, or now I have to phase. O wow, the sin force speeds to my phasewalk spot and starts *********** me up again. If the sins feels like it, it can even stealth out and open on me all over again, and still have a stealth out left in the tank. I can grenade, I can run away, I can self heal a bit, but it will chase me down. Meanwhile, I haven't even done any damage yet in the round. Or, alternatively, someone else on their team, or multiple people on their team, start attacking me, either killing me or again, forcing me to use phasewalk or barrier. I could go on and on with scenarios like this. Of course if the sin isn't very good, and doesn't relentlessly pursue me, then I can heal up and have all kinds of flexibility, but that's irrelevant.

 

No offense, Trixxie, but I'm not sure you fully appreciate the kind of pressure that good sins can apply in ranked. Even if you've played ranked in the past, 6.0 is much different. Everything is doing more burst, but sins are doing way more than any other class. It is nothing like what happens in regs.

 

 

 

This is laughably wrong. Nothing can stand against sins in a 1v1 except ops (assuming everyone has all their dcds. If a sin has no more stealth outs and the sorc still has everything it can win, but otherwise it stands no chance against an equally skilled sin). And honestly, I'm not so sure ops will win those all the time anymore.

 

Idk friend, I've been in a lot of matches vs Lightning sorcs and they are pretty resilient. Even when I triple maul spam, their DR seems super high, with each maul dealing roughly 30-40k damage. I'm not sure what causes this discrepancy in damage since I'm not familiar enough with 6.0 lightning passives, but they are definitely harder to deal raw damage too than some other classes.

 

Additionally, I kinda feel like your argument painted a very specific picture where you deal no damage to the enemy sin while they deal a ton of damage to you, as well as their team damaging you, but in a good majority of games I've played, this simply doesn't play out like this scenario very often. Most of the time, there is always a better initial target to kill than a Lightning Sorc. Another Sin, a Merc, a Juggernaut, a Powertech, a Sniper, these are all better initial targets than a Lightning sorc for a variety of reasons. Second, even when focus does finally shift to the Lightning sorc (whether that be because other targets are already dead, or they do happen to be the kill target), I very rarely, if ever see the scenario that you've described. More often than not, I see them getting pulled by teammate Sorcs, skank guarded by Sin team mates, cross healed by operatives and mercs, not to mention the map advantages of being able to knock down enemy melee players and the huge AoE that they have which will pull players out of stealth if they are like 5-8m away from the initial target. I guess my point is, in theory, what you say does sound correct, because a Sins toolkit is probably superior to a Sorcs in a 1v1, but in a group environment, it's not that common that what you've described occurs the way that you've stated.

 

Now if you were talking about Madness Sorc, I would 100% agree, those feel very easy to kill by comparison, but Lightning Sorc, I just cannot agree with what you've described. That being said, I'm not saying this to make sins sound weak or to make sorcs sound strong, I'm merely stating that it's my opinion that Sorcs are definitely one of the better performing classes in ranked atm. I've seen some sorcs like Etude do ridiculous stuff like cleansing my whirlwinds or electrocutes on team mates, pulling them to the 2nd level of a multi-level map, away from melee dps on the bottom level, offheal while still doing very good damage, etc.

 

I would say that on a scale of 1-10, 10 being the best, 1 being the worst, Sins are like a 9/10 and sorcs are like a 7.5/10. I think the best classes atm are like a 9/10 power level, while the median class is a 7/10, and the worst class (jugg) is like a 4/10, so I would definitely agree with buffing up the worst classes and nerfing the best classes to the median's level. But overall I can't help but feel you've really downplayed Sorc's effectiveness atm. Playing against them, including some of the best ones on EU and NA, they feel the most powerful that they've ever been in all expansions, not to say that they are *too* powerful, but they definitely feel like they are in their best iteration, currently.

[Jinre_the_Jedi]

Also, it's worth mentioning that I see a lot of people rating classes purely based on their ability to perform solo vs other classes when I think that's just a flat out incorrect way to evaluate a class in the context of ranked. Solo Ranked is a format of 4 players working together vs 4 other players working together. Classes that would ordinarily overperform (Sin, for example) can easily perform extremely poorly depending on the composition of the enemy team, which is always random. Great example of this is a match I had yesterday vs a Jugg and 3 Mercs. I got shut down extremely easily because despite Shroud and Deflection, I was their initial kill target and got netted 3 times. Additionally, going against comps like double Sniper or double Mara will also limit the effectiveness of my class from being a 9/10 to a 7/10 or even 6/10. Now the fact that your team is random will always be worth considering, and this can also work in the inverse, where you get a full stealth comp vs a comp that's weaker to full stealth teams, but the point is that overall, some classes carry by being really good support classes, while other classes carry matches with raw damage output. It's easy to compared Sin to Sorc and say that Sin is strictly better, but you have to consider that Sorc is a better support class than Sin, and that will 100% come into play a lot of the time, in subtle ways that dictate the outcome of a match without people thinking about it. How often do you see Sorcs pull team mates who are the initial kill target, cleanse whirlwinds and force based stuns? Probably not nearly as often as you see them offhealing team mates. Those plays aren't flashy, but they contribute to matches in ways that can't be measured on the scoreboard, and I feel that things like that are vastly understated by players of those respective classes. It's easy to rate a class poorly when a lot of people aren't even taking into consideration the support abilities and plays made by those classes because a large portion of players aren't using their full suite of abilities.

[JediMasterAlex]

Additionally, I kinda feel like your argument painted a very specific picture where you deal no damage to the enemy sin while they deal a ton of damage to you, as well as their team damaging you, but in a good majority of games I've played, this simply doesn't play out like this scenario very often. Most of the time, there is always a better initial target to kill than a Lightning Sorc. Another Sin, a Merc, a Juggernaut, a Powertech, a Sniper, these are all better initial targets than a Lightning sorc for a variety of reasons. Second, even when focus does finally shift to the Lightning sorc (whether that be because other targets are already dead, or they do happen to be the kill target), I very rarely, if ever see the scenario that you've described. More often than not, I see them getting pulled by teammate Sorcs, skank guarded by Sin team mates, cross healed by operatives and mercs, not to mention the map advantages of being able to knock down enemy melee players and the huge AoE that they have which will pull players out of stealth if they are like 5-8m away from the initial target. I guess my point is, in theory, what you say does sound correct, because a Sins toolkit is probably superior to a Sorcs in a 1v1, but in a group environment, it's not that common that what you've described occurs the way that you've stated.

 

You're totally right that the scenario I laid out is rare, no question. But there are definitely games where sorcs are focused first. On teams with just ops, or ops and sins for example, sorcs will often get focused first. I'm also basing my scenario on playing very good sins, not just average or bad ones.

 

There's a better objection you can make, that Zurules often does, which is that it's a team game so teammates should be peeling for the sorc. But the fact is, nothing in this game requires peeling more than sins opening on you with triple maul spam. The best counter I've noticed so far is waiting around the person they're going to open on and throw a grenade as soon as they do. But anyway, maul spam is just overtuned, that's all. I've never advocated for huge nerfs. Fixing tactical swapping goes without saying.

 

I'm merely stating that it's my opinion that Sorcs are definitely one of the better performing classes in ranked atm. I've seen some sorcs like Etude do ridiculous stuff like cleansing my whirlwinds or electrocutes on team mates, pulling them to the 2nd level of a multi-level map, away from melee dps on the bottom level, offheal while still doing very good damage, etc.

 

I would say that on a scale of 1-10, 10 being the best, 1 being the worst, Sins are like a 9/10 and sorcs are like a 7.5/10. I think the best classes atm are like a 9/10 power level, while the median class is a 7/10, and the worst class (jugg) is like a 4/10, so I would definitely agree with buffing up the worst classes and nerfing the best classes to the median's level. But overall I can't help but feel you've really downplayed Sorc's effectiveness atm. Playing against them, including some of the best ones on EU and NA, they feel the most powerful that they've ever been in all expansions, not to say that they are *too* powerful, but they definitely feel like they are in their best iteration, currently.

 

I completely agree with all of that. I didn't mean to give an impression otherwise. I was only comparing sorcs to sins specifically. After sins and ops, I think lightning sorc is the best class, followed very closely by snipers, maras and mercs. There has to be a pecking order of some sort. The main issue is that the gap between sins and ops and the rest of the field is too wide right now.

Edited January 6, 2020 by JediMasterAlex

[Xertasian]

45k mauls are weak omg...skilled sins in ranked do 60-75 k mauls, 3 times in a row

that 45k maul..came cause i hit through the bubble..of course ate the mezz..but well worth it..i chewed that sorc up..before he or she knew what hit them..

[JediMasterAlex]

It's easy to compared Sin to Sorc and say that Sin is strictly better, but you have to consider that Sorc is a better support class than Sin, and that will 100% come into play a lot of the time, in subtle ways that dictate the outcome of a match without people thinking about it. How often do you see Sorcs pull team mates who are the initial kill target, cleanse whirlwinds and force based stuns? Probably not nearly as often as you see them offhealing team mates. Those plays aren't flashy, but they contribute to matches in ways that can't be measured on the scoreboard, and I feel that things like that are vastly understated by players of those respective classes. It's easy to rate a class poorly when a lot of people aren't even taking into consideration the support abilities and plays made by those classes because a large portion of players aren't using their full suite of abilities.

 

This is woefully incorrect. Guard is a more powerful support tool than all of sorcs' tools combined. It's not even close.

Edited January 6, 2020 by JediMasterAlex

[TrixxieTriss]

This is woefully incorrect. Guard is a more powerful support tool than all of sorcs' tools combined. It's not even close.

 

Depends on the class.

[Eastiano]

I would argue contrary to guard being better support, it’s purely redirecting dmg not nullifying it which sorc has in the case of a heal and bubble.

Sure you can pop a dcd but you’re still gonna take 50% of that dmg and you’re limited to be in guard range for it to even be effective.

[supertimtaf]

I would argue contrary to guard being better support, it’s purely redirecting dmg not nullifying it which sorc has in the case of a heal and bubble.

Sure you can pop a dcd but you’re still gonna take 50% of that dmg and you’re limited to be in guard range for it to even be effective.

 

This. Since the healing nerfs, guard has lost a lot of power now. It's still a good tool, afaik it's the best tool apart from mass cc that sins tank got tbh. But now off-healing, sorc bubble or a grapple/cleanse is just as strong as an off-guard, if not more depending on the scenario.

 

I saw somebody mentionning nerfing force regen on deception, but that would just kill the class in PvE, where Force Regen is really more important on long fights, don't forget that.

[JediMasterAlex]

This. Since the healing nerfs, guard has lost a lot of power now. It's still a good tool, afaik it's the best tool apart from mass cc that sins tank got tbh. But now off-healing, sorc bubble or a grapple/cleanse is just as strong as an off-guard, if not more depending on the scenario.

 

I saw somebody mentionning nerfing force regen on deception, but that would just kill the class in PvE, where Force Regen is really more important on long fights, don't forget that.

 

This reasoning is totally backwards. As you said, healing has been effectively nerfed. With the amount of burst damage, puny offheals are less effective than ever, whereas 50% damage reduction is still invaluable, especially when combined with 2 cloaks, multiple heal to fulls, and tactical swapping (and the shroud tactical specifically).

 

To be clear, I am not saying cleanses, pulls and offheals aren't important tools. They definitely are, and they can make the difference between wins and losses when used properly. But they still pale in comparison to offguarding by sins. This is not a debatable point. If you think it is, I really question how much solo ranked you've played lately.

Edited January 6, 2020 by JediMasterAlex

[Jinre_the_Jedi]

This reasoning is totally backwards. As you said, healing has been effectively nerfed. With the amount of burst damage, puny offheals are less effective than ever, whereas 50% damage reduction is still invaluable, especially when combined with 2 cloaks, multiple heal to fulls, and tactical swapping (and the shroud tactical specifically).

 

To be clear, I am not saying cleanses, pulls and offheals aren't important tools. They definitely are, and they can make the difference between wins and losses when used properly. But they still pale in comparison to offguarding by sins. This is not a debatable point. If you think it is, I really question how much solo ranked you've played lately.

 

I'm looking at it from the perspective that a well timed pull is essentially effective damage mitigation. Guard is more obvious in how it mitigates damage since it even has a scoreboard number to display it, but it's harder to put a numerical value on something like Extricate, or cleanse. For example, let's say you pull someone in Mandalorian Battle Ring from the ground floor to the top, pulling them away from 2 DPS, to safety. That's probably equivalent to saving them from taking 50k-100k damage (let me know if that number seems unreasonable). It also means they get to save some DCDs that would have been popped to stay alive vs 2 dps. So while protection can easily be measured (130k protection is the same as "healing" 130k hp to an ally, there is obvious nuance to this since it reduces damage taken but let's focus on the numerical value for quantitative purposes), it's harder to put a numerical value to some of the support tools sorc has. So I disagree that it's as cut and dry as you make it seem. Sins are still like S-tier and Sorcs are still a tier below, but guard is not single handedly the best support tool hands down because while it has a scoreboard number attached to it, there are other support tools that have visual numerical value but I guarantee if they did, they would be just as potent as guard, for different reasons.

Edited January 6, 2020 by Jinre_the_Jedi

[JediMasterAlex]

I'm looking at it from the perspective that a well timed pull is essentially effective damage mitigation. Guard is more obvious in how it mitigates damage since it even has a scoreboard number to display it, but it's harder to put a numerical value on something like Extricate, or cleanse. For example, let's say you pull someone in Mandalorian Battle Ring from the ground floor to the top, pulling them away from 2 DPS, to safety. That's probably equivalent to saving them from taking 50k-100k damage (let me know if that number seems unreasonable). It also means they get to save some DCDs that would have been popped to stay alive vs 2 dps. So while protection can easily be measured (130k protection is the same as "healing" 130k hp to an ally, there is obvious nuance to this since it reduces damage taken but let's focus on the numerical value for quantitative purposes), it's harder to put a numerical value to some of the support tools sorc has. So I disagree that it's as cut and dry as you make it seem. Sins are still like S-tier and Sorcs are still a tier below, but guard is not single handedly the best support tool hands down because while it has a scoreboard number attached to it, there are other support tools that have visual numerical value but I guarantee if they did, they would be just as potent as guard, for different reasons.

 

I've never based my arguments about guard on scoreboard numbers, so I'm not sure why you're even bringing that up. I mean, I agree that sorc utility stuff is harder to gauge unless you're really paying attention. The amount of times that people have *****ed at me for not offhealing/cleansing when I was in fact doing both is proof of that. You're also correct that in certain niche situations, like the one you described of pulling someone to the top on mandalorian battle ring, pull can have a bigger impact than guard.

 

But those situations are rare. Normally a pull is just 25% damage reduction for 6 seconds, assuming they take that utility. In my experience, in the thousands of games I've played in the last year+ (frequently at a relatively high rating) offguarding has a much, much more profound impact when it's used properly, and there's no doubt that it's used much, much more frequently.

 

You're also underestimating how guard changes the dymanics of a match in a way that sorc utilities do not. If a sorc pulls, bubbles and offheals someone, that doesn't change how the enemy team behaves (they'll likely be ccing the sorc regardless), it just delays the kill on the focus target slightly. Sometimes that slight delay is enough to make a difference; often it's not and that time would have been better spent doing damage. There are a lot of bad sorcs that think their role is "support" and don't understand the correct times to be using those support abilities and when it's best to put out as much damage as possible on the correct targets.

 

Guard, on the other hand, totally changes how the other team has to approach the match. If you know that sins will be offguarding, you often have to focus them first, and if they're good, they'll be delaying engagement after each stealth and playing cautiously on purpose, forcing the other team to split damage while they simply tunnel someone on the team without any offguards. And if you choose to ignore/cc the sins, then you'll end up having to swap to the sin when they guard, again splitting damage, or tunnel through guard and its 50% damage reduction.

 

Sorc utility stuff doesn't cause any of those concerns or create any of those problems. Honestly, it's completely ludicrous to compare sin offguarding to any other kind of dps support in the game.

Edited January 6, 2020 by JediMasterAlex

[Jinre_the_Jedi]

Guard, on the other hand, totally changes how the other team has to approach the match. If you know that sins will be offguarding, you often have to focus them first, and if they're good, they'll be delaying engagement after each stealth and playing cautiously on purpose, forcing the other team to split damage while they simply tunnel someone on the team without any offguards. And if you choose to ignore/cc the sins, then you'll end up having to swap to the sin when they guard, again splitting damage, or tunnel through guard and its 50% damage reduction.

 

I have to wonder though, does this apply to Powertechs and Juggernauts too? Because they also have guard. If not and it's a Sin specific thing, based on the premise you've described, it sounds like the real culprit here is Stealth as a mechanic and the benefits that it provides, with Guard + Stealth combo being added insult to injury.

 

Sorc utility stuff doesn't cause any of those concerns or create any of those problems. Honestly, it's completely ludicrous to compare sin offguarding to any other kind of dps support in the game.

 

I disagree that it's ludicrous to compare it because making these comparisons is good for finding a baseline and then adjusting things above that baseline to bring them down to a reasonable level. Saying something like "Sin Guard is the best support tool, period" isn't really helpful for the devs. Having engaging dialogue like we are is better because even if we don't agree, our different perspectives might be at least considered by the Devs if they happen upon this thread.

Edited January 6, 2020 by Jinre_the_Jedi

[omaan]

Remove double vanish and give double force shroud instead (with restriction that if next force shroud is used after 1 second after first one was used it lasts on 1.5 seconds less)

NERF death knell set bonus a bit

 

Nerf operative veilded strike tactical item so that only backstab critically hits

 

Nerf pt tank meteor brawler (tanks aren't supposed to hit so much)

 

Nerf sniper ambush so it hits 60-65k but not 70+k

 

NERF marauder camouflage reset so that next camouflage used after reset lasts 1.5 seconds less.

 

With these changes balance will become better

Edited January 6, 2020 by omaan

[Lundorff]

I have to wonder though, does this apply to Powertechs and Juggernauts too? Because they also have guard. If not and it's a Sin specific thing, based on the premise you've described, it sounds like the real culprit here is Stealth as a mechanic and the benefits that it provides, with Guard + Stealth combo being added insult to injury.

 

I have only managed it once with reasonable effect on my jugg this season. And that was only because they couldn't really decide whether to focus me or our PT.

 

So far the signs strongly points to no for both PTs and Juggs, as we are simply focused first and hard. With multiple juggs / pts / sins on the same side, then maybe some cross guard can take place, but not nearly to same effect and frequency as previous seasons.

 

I suspect off-guarding will mostly be a sin-thing this meta.

[JediMasterAlex]

I have to wonder though, does this apply to Powertechs and Juggernauts too? Because they also have guard. If not and it's a Sin specific thing, based on the premise you've described, it sounds like the real culprit here is Stealth as a mechanic and the benefits that it provides, with Guard + Stealth combo being added insult to injury.

 

Correct. Also, juggs and pts are better focus targets than anything else anyway, so they rarely have the chance to offguard. When juggs get the ED cooldown reduction tactical, that might become a different story, we'll see.

 

I disagree that it's ludicrous to compare it because making these comparisons is good for finding a baseline and then adjusting things above that baseline to bring them down to a reasonable level. Saying something like "Sin Guard is the best support tool, period" isn't really helpful for the devs. Having engaging dialogue like we are is better because even if we don't agree, our different perspectives might be at least considered by the Devs if they happen upon this thread.

 

Fair enough.

Edited January 6, 2020 by JediMasterAlex

[supertimtaf]

Sorc utility stuff doesn't cause any of those concerns or create any of those problems. Honestly, it's completely ludicrous to compare sin offguarding to any other kind of dps support in the game.

 

I'm one to disagree, as I think that there is other tools to help your allies or mitigate damage taken that are definitely worth noting. Juggs Intercede (Don't remember the english name, I might be wrong) can be defined as a powerfull defensive utility. Sorc bubble can be too, operative's group stealth, every kind of mass cc/fear... Those are definitely good party mitigation tools, but tools that most players struggle to use correctly.

 

I'd disagree that sins off-garding peoples is that much superior, especially when you consider how easily you can lower your own health by doing so. I've never been as carefull about using guard than now tbh, because I know that if the enemy team just has one aoe or dot class I'm gonna get wrecked really quickly. It's funny that when you're guarding someone with a sin, lightning sorc suddenly becomes the most threatening thing there is, and you have to be carefull about stealthing out after taking too much damage from guard, seeing how easy it is to get pulled of stealth, or at least be kept in combat, which prevents the resets of your abilities. Sure you could wait this out to regen, but leaving your team alone for 15+ sec is probably more dangerous than re-engaging combat without being fully healed.

 

Guard as a dps is a risk&reward thing imo, it is powerfull when played correctly, and hard to pull off, but if you don't play properly with it you'll just die quicker, you should try playing with it, I'm sure you'll quickly understand my point.

 

our different perspectives might be at least considered by the Devs if they happen upon this thread.

 

This is without any question the nonsensical part of your argumentation, I hope you know about that.

Or I just got jebaited really hard by a well-made troll.

Edited January 6, 2020 by supertimtaf

[bladech]

mercs defenses are useless against 65k mauls, 65k backstabs which are instant abilities with low cd. I often see teams with sins/opers spliting dps between merc/jugg or merc/pt, merc/sin so merc could not really dps much and have to use energy shield and madpacks against 1-2 sins or oper fast so that when time zerging full on merc comes, he had less dcds. This makes pressure on both merc and other zerged team mate because even 1 sin or oper can make huge pressure on someone while classes like jugg, sorc, marauder can't really do that big pressure

[Jinre_the_Jedi]

This is without any question the nonsensical part of your argumentation, I hope you know about that.

Or I just got jebaited really hard by a well-made troll.

 

All of the recent changes to ranked (Win threshold for top 3, 15 minute lockout and harsher rating penalty for leaving/declining a pop, etc) were all community based suggestions. I fail to see why making the assumption that the devs continue to care about our feedback is troll worthy, but to each their own.

Edited January 6, 2020 by Jinre_the_Jedi

[MandoMetal]

A tune down in the amount of damage transferred by DPS spec guard to say 20-30% sounds reasonable... preserves the unique utility of the ability while not making it as overpowered

[sdom]

All of the recent changes to ranked (Win threshold for top 3, 15 minute lockout and harsher rating penalty for leaving/declining a pop, etc) were all community based suggestions. I fail to see why making the assumption that the devs continue to care about our feedback is troll worthy, but to each their own.

 

So what you mean is, we can blame you.

What community? I wasn't consulted.

Can you verify how many members of the community actually play ranked?

 

Penalties for missing pops were all ready harsh with Bioware's current RNG.

Now I get a 15 min lockout which laughably sometimes just holds the queue for 15 mins since not that many people play ranked (And im on SF one of the better servers for solos).

 

The game tiers were reasonable but what we really need was the valor entry requirement to be raised so idiots can't queue as easy, perhaps to 80 since pvp played toons will be about valor 60 when completed.

You failed us.

[sdom]

Also everyone blame Jinre for giving all the noobs the deception rotation.

Great troll bro

[TrixxieTriss]

So what you mean is, we can blame you.

What community? I wasn't consulted.

Can you verify how many members of the community actually play ranked?

 

Penalties for missing pops were all ready harsh with Bioware's current RNG.

Now I get a 15 min lockout which laughably sometimes just holds the queue for 15 mins since not that many people play ranked (And im on SF one of the better servers for solos).

 

The game tiers were reasonable but what we really need was the valor entry requirement to be raised so idiots can't queue as easy, perhaps to 80 since pvp played toons will be about valor 60 when completed.

You failed us.

 

There was a thread asking for feed back. We discussed it there and if you were here, you could have added your point of view.

Everything that’s been implemented was needed to help mitigate wintrading and people dropping games for friends or paid services.

Edited January 7, 2020 by TrixxieTriss

[TrixxieTriss]

Also everyone blame Jinre for giving all the noobs the deception rotation.

Great troll bro

 

Instead of criticising someone who was trying to offer advice on how to play a class, why don’t you help and make some guides on how to play other classes. You know, maybe how to mitigate Sin attacks instead of QQing how bad they are

[Jinre_the_Jedi]

So what you mean is, we can blame you.

What community? I wasn't consulted.

Can you verify how many members of the community actually play ranked?

 

Penalties for missing pops were all ready harsh with Bioware's current RNG.

Now I get a 15 min lockout which laughably sometimes just holds the queue for 15 mins since not that many people play ranked (And im on SF one of the better servers for solos).

 

The game tiers were reasonable but what we really need was the valor entry requirement to be raised so idiots can't queue as easy, perhaps to 80 since pvp played toons will be about valor 60 when completed.

You failed us.

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=961680

 

That community. It's not my fault if you didn't take part in that thread, but it's 150 posts of ideas on Ranked improvements made by various different users.