6.0 Play your way is a pipe dream

[Collec]

First shout out to Keith for talking about Galacitc Command and Ossus gear. I didn't expect that. Galacitc Command is ok now in my opinion, doesn't take long to level and I just ignore Ossus top gear 258.

 

Right off the bat you got the problem with saying "play your way" , but you'll have to do ranked pvp or master mode operations to get some super rare tactical items. So someone like me, who stopped playing ranked pvp years ago, because it was a joke (and probably still is)...though I do like your arenas (all of them).....so if I just play unranked I won't get XYZ tactical item for my class and discipline. What is then stopping ranked player playing unranked wz and having total advantage over others,who can't get that . And you know it's gonna happen.

 

Appreciate the stream,it's what I wanted...but just from hearing about it,sounds like a mess. I don't even like, how current traits/points are now, where out of 32 traits/points only 12 or so are viable per class/ role.

[Hercology]

Because Elitist players DESERVE stuff that casuals don't. You put more effort into doing things, you deserve a greater reward.

[OlBuzzard]

Nah... depends on the pipe you're smokin'

 

:eek::eek:

[robertthebard]

Yeah, I am thinking that, if I'm not going to be playing top tier content, I won't need the top tier stuff, so I'll be able to play my way, and be fine. Now, if they require BIS gear to run any story content associated with or after the update, I'll sharpen up my pitchfork.

[TrixxieTriss]

What is then stopping ranked player playing unranked wz and having total advantage over others,who can't get that . And you know it's gonna happen

 

This is a very valid point because those ranked players also play reg pvp. That means that they will have an unfair advantage over reg players on top of already being better players than most.

 

This causes even more imbalance in regs and makes people not want to play.

 

It’s my opinion that ranked should never have any form of farming gear or mats. The rewards for playing ranked should always be the rewards given at the end of the seasons for making a certain lvl.

That is what people essentially compete for in ranked.

 

Having the haves and have nots in reg pvp is one of the reasons pvp continues to slip and population continues to fall.

5.0 was a terrible gearing system that created a massive gear gap for many in regs. Bolster didn’t close that gap enough until 5.10 and that’s 2 years that made people leave.

 

I’ve said this before till I’m blue in the face. My “pvp” only guild, who was mostly ranked players, but also played lots of regs, all up and left the game during 5.x gear rubbish.

This proposed gear gating behind “harder” content will end up having a similar effect on the pvp player base as 5.0 did if the advantage is too much.

 

Good players don’t like one shotting or globalling under geared players and casual players don’t like being on the receiving end. It’s not fun for anyone and just debases pvp even more than it already is.

Edited May 31, 2019 by TrixxieTriss

[OlBuzzard]

 

This is a very valid point because those ranked players also play reg pvp. That means that they will have an unfair advantage over reg players on top of already being better players than most.

 

This causes even more imbalance in regs and makes people not want to play.

 

It’s my opinion that ranked should never have any form of farming gear or mats. The rewards for playing ranked should always be the rewards given at the end of the seasons for making a certain lvl.

That is what people essentially compete for in ranked.

 

Having the haves and have nots in reg pvp is one of the reasons pvp continues to slip and population continues to fall.

5.0 was a terrible gearing system that created a massive gear gap for many in regs. Bolster didn’t close that gap enough until 5.10 and that’s 2 years that made people leave.

 

I’ve said this before till I’m blue in the face. My “pvp” only guild, who was mostly ranked players, but also played lots of regs, all up and left the game during 5.x gear rubbish.

This proposed gear gating behind “harder” content will end up having a similar effect of the pvp player base as 5.0 did if the advantage is too much.

 

Good players don’t like one shotting or globalling under geared players and casual players don’t like being on the receiving end. It’s not fun for anyone and just debases pvp even more than it already is.

 

Actually this is what I was suggesting when I made the statement about accessibility. That must in turn be equal to everyone. Somehow a certain amout of randomness might have an adverse affect in the PvP arena !

 

Balance in PvP is unquestionably one of the most delicate part(s) of any game... BUT when done correctly will gain a LOT of happy players.

(just my $.02 worth for the evening )

[EricMusco]

First shout out to Keith for talking about Galacitc Command and Ossus gear. I didn't expect that. Galacitc Command is ok now in my opinion, doesn't take long to level and I just ignore Ossus top gear 258.

 

Right off the bat you got the problem with saying "play your way" , but you'll have to do ranked pvp or master mode operations to get some super rare tactical items. So someone like me, who stopped playing ranked pvp years ago, because it was a joke (and probably still is)...though I do like your arenas (all of them).....so if I just play unranked I won't get XYZ tactical item for my class and discipline. What is then stopping ranked player playing unranked wz and having total advantage over others,who can't get that . And you know it's gonna happen.

 

Appreciate the stream,it's what I wanted...but just from hearing about it,sounds like a mess. I don't even like, how current traits/points are now, where out of 32 traits/points only 12 or so are viable per class/ role.

 

I am glad that you brought this up! There has been some misconception about how gearing works when we indicate play your way. Let me make some direct statements and then I will add clarification:

• You do not need to play any content to get specific items.
  
• You can play almost any content in the game to get any item.

 

Since you brought up specifically that you never want to play ranked and only want to play unranked let me use that as an example. It is still possible that specific items come from specific content. Let's say that there was a specific tactical that only came from ranked. Yes, that does mean that specific item will not come from playing unranked warzones. However, you can get that item from Renown Crates, Conquest rewards, and by spending Charles Points/ChuxBux (on both the in-direct and direct vendors).

 

The play the content you want portion of the loop may not give you availability to every item in the game, that is true. But every other part of the loop does. So again to put it directly...

 

If you only want to play unranked warzones, you can, and you will still have access to every set and tactical item in the game. (this statement is true of almost every content type in the game at max level).

 

I hope that provides some clarity and allows you to be excited about what we are doing with spoils of war!

 

-eric

[Collec]

It does provide clarity thank you, but I wouldn't say just yet I am excited for 6.0....not my first rodeo with BW

 

Guess this thread can be closed or whatever.

 

I would add,that getting these tactical items shouldn't be some crazy grind to get. Get one decently fast and let people have fun at start with 1st tactical item. That will make them happy, will stay and try out other classes, items,etc.

[Delani]

People who work harder deserve more than those who do not, if you do not like that ideology then life is going to be a pain for you!!!!!!

[Delani]

Because Elitist players DESERVE stuff that casuals don't. You put more effort into doing things, you deserve a greater reward.

 

EXACTLY

The way I read his post, "people who work 40 hours a week and are more sufficient at their job deserve the same amount of money that people who work 20 hours hours of week make" Its ludacris

[Collec]

Get off your high horse. Just because you play ranked doesn't mean ****. I said I played it years ago,but then stopped,because it's a joke. People q-syncing just so that they land on same team and throwing game, throwing hissy fits. Then I think ranked was dead for a while and those mat farmers brought it back to life. So yeah real skill hearing, how you go up against people who stand in place and let you kill them. Do you really think that is competitive? Either you on team that does nothing, because mat farming or you vs them and it's easy win.

 

And arena match is usually 2 rounds. Sometimes 3. Even with 3 it's shorter than unranked wz of Voidstar,Hutball (s), Civil War, Yavin Ruins, Ancient Hypergate, Novare Coast or Odessen Proving Ground. Where you go up against more people and have to also play objectives and not just run FOTM class that is best for arena.

 

So get of your fking high horse thinking you are some elite piece of pvp turd.

[Delani]

Get off your high horse. Just because you play ranked doesn't mean ****. I said I played it years ago,but then stopped,because it's a joke. People q-syncing just so that they land on same team and throwing game, throwing hissy fits. Then I think ranked was dead for a while and those mat farmers brought it back to life. So yeah real skill hearing, how you go up against people who stand in place and let you kill them. Do you really think that is competitive? Either you on team that does nothing, because mat farming or you vs them and it's easy win.

 

And arena match is usually 2 rounds. Sometimes 3. Even with 3 it's shorter than unranked wz of Voidstar,Hutball (s), Civil War, Yavin Ruins, Ancient Hypergate, Novare Coast or Odessen Proving Ground. Where you go up against more people and have to also play objectives and not just run FOTM class that is best for arena.

 

So get of your fking high horse thinking you are some elite piece of pvp turd.

 

Do PVE then if thats better for you, either way, rewarding players with better tacticals for completing harder content is the best way to do it. It creates incentive to actually do harder content. Also, he didnt mention WIN just participate in the content. Im personally going to partake in ranked because as you mentioned in your statement it is shorter. I dont mind if I lose or get a bad team because my main goal is to acqure the best gear for the playstyle I am chasing and more fun builds for my toons. Also, I heard they are changing the way ranked works so who knows.

[TrixxieTriss]

I am glad that you brought this up! There has been some misconception about how gearing works when we indicate play your way. Let me make some direct statements and then I will add clarification:

• You do not need to play any content to get specific items.
  
• You can play almost any content in the game to get any item.

 

Since you brought up specifically that you never want to play ranked and only want to play unranked let me use that as an example. It is still possible that specific items come from specific content. Let's say that there was a specific tactical that only came from ranked. Yes, that does mean that specific item will not come from playing unranked warzones. However, you can get that item from Renown Crates, Conquest rewards, and by spending Charles Points/ChuxBux (on both the in-direct and direct vendors).

 

The play the content you want portion of the loop may not give you availability to every item in the game, that is true. But every other part of the loop does. So again to put it directly...

 

If you only want to play unranked warzones, you can, and you will still have access to every set and tactical item in the game. (this statement is true of almost every content type in the game at max level).

 

I hope that provides some clarity and allows you to be excited about what we are doing with spoils of war!

 

-eric

 

Thank you for clarifying that. This deal is getting better and better each day

[DzastinBiberi]

But whats the point of getting super rare items/gear if you only do pvp? Bolster is gonna be maxed out so whats the point of getting top gear if you only play pvp?

[Nee-Elder]

People who work harder deserve more than those who do not, if you do not like that ideology then life is going to be a pain for you!!!!!!

 

EXACTLY

The way I read his post, "people who work 40 hours a week and are more sufficient at their job deserve the same amount of money that people who work 20 hours hours of week make" Its ludacris

 

umm, first off: Did you just quote YOURSELF to QFE your own point...to yourself? lol wut the eff dude

 

Secondly: last i checked, SWTOR is a video game. Not a "job" and certainly not "life" .

 

p.s. I play & enjoy all content, including 'Ranked' .

Edited June 1, 2019 by Nee-Elder

[DarthCasus]

People who work harder deserve more than those who do not, if you do not like that ideology then life is going to be a pain for you!!!!!!

 

Where have you been for the last 3 years? 'Working harder' (ugh) hasn't amounted to jack other than having a better hand at RNG and chasing pointless treadmills to the point of mind numbing tedium. The lack of challenging ASND engaging content ran out the lot of people of who were actually serious. Ranked PvP is a sh**show and does NOT make anyone more hardcore than anyone else, you can literally grind away and suck but eventually receive your rewards. Hard Mode and NIM content guilds are fractured, dead, gone and the few that remain have been likely running the same content for over half a decade but with different numbers because gear. All they can do now is make it so that if we choose to pursue any sort of content, it remains engaging and allows us to branch off into something else without a completely gear-shock.

 

If I want to GSF all day for the first few months and then decide "Hmm, let me try my hand at some Hard Modes flashpoints or Ops, I got these tactical items and some gear worth a damn", that sounds fine to me. Now if it were people wanting the top gear in game for completing story crap and dailies for 6+ months *cough* Ossus *cough*, then I'd be turned off completely but let it roll out and let people voice their concerns. I don't need or want BiS, but I would like to play the game and not feel pigeon holed into certain content only.

[TrixxieTriss]

But whats the point of getting super rare items/gear if you only do pvp? Bolster is gonna be maxed out so whats the point of getting top gear if you only play pvp?

 

You can try for different tactical’s and Amps for pvp.

 

Plus, if Bolster works the way it usually does and Bioware don’t boost the Bolster way above max lvl, people with the highest gear will be able to min max better and still have a small gear advantage.

 

All this Bolster will do it make pvp closer to skill vs skill and not gear vs gear. I think a lot of the pvp community is excited and welcomes this change. I know I do and others have voiced similar sentiments.

[OlBuzzard]

You can try for different tactical’s and Amps for pvp.

 

Plus, if Bolster works the way it usually does and Bioware don’t boost the Bolster way above max lvl, people with the highest gear will be able to min max better and still have a small gear advantage.

 

All this Bolster will do it make pvp closer to skill vs skill and not gear vs gear. I think a lot of the pvp community is excited and welcomes this change. I know I do and others have voiced similar sentiments.

 

I agree.. The last post that Eric has provided did clarify a lot. PvP and PvE stuff looks promising. Now then if we can just get s few more items like companions (but let's save that for another thread) ... hammered out we should be in good shape.

[TrixxieTriss]

I agree.. The last post that Eric has provided did clarify a lot. PvP and PvE stuff looks promising. Now then if we can just get s few more items like companions (but let's save that for another thread) ... hammered out we should be in good shape.

 

More Companions I don’t even know what ones I have now, lol. I certainly don’t need them unless they are integral to the story.

Edited June 1, 2019 by TrixxieTriss

[OlBuzzard]

More Companions I don’t even know what ones I have now, lol. I certainly don’t need them unless they are integral to the story.

 

nah ... just one more ... maybe (should I post the link ) ?

 

Besides ... we can save that for later if that's best.

 

Also: I think you are definately on the right track on your other suggesting in the other thread too BTW..

 

(Edited for clarification)

Edited June 1, 2019 by OlBuzzard

[ZionHalcyon]

People play video games to have fun.

 

Anyone who treats the game like a full time job and demands only people who do the same deserve the best equipment need their head examined.

[Seterade]

just going to point out an obvious (to me) point here.

 

 

MMORPGs by nature are time investment based. The more time and effort you put in, the more you get.

 

Action Games by nature give you every tool you will need then hinder your progress with puzzels, mazes and riddles.

 

ActionRPGs tend to take traits from both, RPG stats design (leveling, gear and buffs) while incorperating proper (puzzle) positioning in combat (LOS) puzzles in PvE and use non turn based combat.

 

That being said when it comes to instant gratifacation vs time investment, actionrpgs tend to lean to time Investment.

 

SWTOR is an ActionRPG

 

Finaly, my personal opinion? I do not think anything should be gated behind hard content. You do hard content to personaly challenge and push yourself. You dont do hard content for a gear edge.

 

personal opinion only.

[ZionHalcyon]

just going to point out an obvious (to me) point here.

 

 

MMORPGs by nature are time investment based. The more time and effort you put in, the more you get.

 

Action Games by nature give you every tool you will need then hinder your progress with puzzels, mazes and riddles.

 

ActionRPGs tend to take traits from both, RPG stats design (leveling, gear and buffs) while incorperating proper (puzzle) positioning in combat (LOS) puzzles in PvE and use non turn based combat.

 

That being said when it comes to instant gratifacation vs time investment, actionrpgs tend to lean to time Investment.

 

SWTOR is an ActionRPG

 

Finaly, my personal opinion? I do not think anything should be gated behind hard content. You do hard content to personaly challenge and push yourself. You dont do hard content for a gear edge.

 

personal opinion only.

 

Agreed 100%

[Rion_Starkiller]

rabble rabble I have a jerb rabble rabble

 

As an FYI, I too have a 40+ hour work week, yet I find time to grind max gear on my favorite toons in 5.10. Whether that's because I'm dating a fellow gamer (that plays Overwatch, no SWTOR), or because I don't have children -- I don't know. But don't put YOUR problems on the SWTOR community, man.

 

All that said, the devs have clearly stated in the stream that gearing should be easier HORIZONTALLY versus the current vertical Ossus gear path. Please listen to the stream.

 

Listen. to. the. stream.

 

When people complain about non-issues, it waters down the real issues that players report to the devs. So please keep in mind: keep your mouth shut until you have something to say that's actually relevant and current to the discussion.

Edited June 1, 2019 by Rion_Starkiller

[MandFlurry]

I am glad that you brought this up! There has been some misconception about how gearing works when we indicate play your way. Let me make some direct statements and then I will add clarification:

• You do not need to play any content to get specific items.
  
• You can play almost any content in the game to get any item.

 

Since you brought up specifically that you never want to play ranked and only want to play unranked let me use that as an example. It is still possible that specific items come from specific content. Let's say that there was a specific tactical that only came from ranked. Yes, that does mean that specific item will not come from playing unranked warzones. However, you can get that item from Renown Crates, Conquest rewards, and by spending Charles Points/ChuxBux (on both the in-direct and direct vendors).

 

The play the content you want portion of the loop may not give you availability to every item in the game, that is true. But every other part of the loop does. So again to put it directly...

 

If you only want to play unranked warzones, you can, and you will still have access to every set and tactical item in the game. (this statement is true of almost every content type in the game at max level).

 

I hope that provides some clarity and allows you to be excited about what we are doing with spoils of war!

 

-eric

 

@Eric, Hello, first of all sorry about my bs about not liking certain Huttballs game, i really love you guya and love Keith a lot to as a No Nonsense kind of guy that seems to be honest. He's a breath of fresh air to the community.

 

To the point. I think people people want to know what the RNG conversion rate of these command boxes might be. As we have it now, we can easily through 500 or more crates without getting anything useful.

Edited June 1, 2019 by MandFlurry