Iivana_Julma Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 Now, it takes a lot to make me go and rant in the forums about anything, and i can't even recall if i have ever done that. But now i will after going through the agony that is this games customer service, excluding in game CS, which, although slow, at least works to some degree. My phone reset itself back to the factory setting, and there goes my security key app as well. For some weird *ss reason, all of the non- in game cs is done by phone, and actually calling to the customer service. No e-mail, no live chat, nothing. Which, i have to say, is incredibly fun if you have, for example, a speech problem like i do. Tried contacting EA's support by mail as well as BW's support by mail, both of them told me to go and call to the CS. And after being left with no other option even after i told them i can't speak english properly, that's what i did(fk those guys whomever read my emails). And then, what would take around 5 minutes by live chat, turned into phone conversation that lasted longer than what is considered as an average lifespan of a human being. After immortalizing my name in the guinness book of world records for the longest phone call in human history, i'm left to wonder: *** is wrong with having normal customer support that operates via email or some other form of live chat. You know, something that pretty much every single company does, and has done for very long time? Well, i managed to reset the security key, was left with the most horrendous customer service experience i have ever gone through, and made up my mind to not give a single penny to EA in a VERY good while (well i already boycotted EA for murdering battlefront, but excluded Swtor for having played it for years.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silenthc Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 I agree with your point entirely, it is unacceptable to me that in this digital age there is no direct customer support other than a phone-call option. Language barrier is not an issue for me, but I do have social anxiety which tends to come out especially severe while having to make phone calls. I'm dreading the day when I'm at the point where I'd need to call customer service. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seireeni Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 (edited) I agree with your point entirely, it is unacceptable to me that in this digital age there is no direct customer support other than a phone-call option. Language barrier is not an issue for me, but I do have social anxiety which tends to come out especially severe while having to make phone calls. I'm dreading the day when I'm at the point where I'd need to call customer service. This. This. So much this. Last time I had to call CS, I was in a place where speaking to a bus driver to go to my damn therapy was challenging -- not to mention calling someone. A trusted family member offered to make the call from work (where he had free international calls), but the person on the phone said it was an easy fix but they could only do it if I called. He lied and said I didn't speak English, at which point he was told that it was acceptable for him to explain the issue as long as I answered to my security questions first. So next time we called together, and I was moments from panic attack -- when the second CS agent just fixed the issue after hearing it, no security questions needed. That guy didn't make my day, he made my damn month. I'm now in a better place mental health wise, but still suffer from these sorts of issues. The two things most difficult to me are a. speaking in a language that is not my first (and, spoiler alert, it's not English) and b. making phone calls. If I had a problem with my account, I'd would be very likely to just leave rather than make the call. Kinder to the CS too, not having to deal with someone near panic attack trying to explain the problem in heavily accented broken English. Edited April 30, 2018 by Seireeni Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silenthc Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 (edited) Pardon me for chuckling to myself a little while reading your post, Seireeni, only because so much of your story sounds recognizable (minus the English part). Just know you're not alone! And we need some non-speaking options dammit! Edited April 30, 2018 by silenthc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NHBabe Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 Now, it takes a lot to make me go and rant in the forums about anything, and i can't even recall if i have ever done that. But now i will after going through the agony that is this games customer service, excluding in game CS, which, although slow, at least works to some degree. My phone reset itself back to the factory setting, and there goes my security key app as well. For some weird *ss reason, all of the non- in game cs is done by phone, and actually calling to the customer service. No e-mail, no live chat, nothing. Which, i have to say, is incredibly fun if you have, for example, a speech problem like i do. Tried contacting EA's support by mail as well as BW's support by mail, both of them told me to go and call to the CS. And after being left with no other option even after i told them i can't speak english properly, that's what i did(fk those guys whomever read my emails). And then, what would take around 5 minutes by live chat, turned into phone conversation that lasted longer than what is considered as an average lifespan of a human being. After immortalizing my name in the guinness book of world records for the longest phone call in human history, i'm left to wonder: *** is wrong with having normal customer support that operates via email or some other form of live chat. You know, something that pretty much every single company does, and has done for very long time? Well, i managed to reset the security key, was left with the most horrendous customer service experience i have ever gone through, and made up my mind to not give a single penny to EA in a VERY good while (well i already boycotted EA for murdering battlefront, but excluded Swtor for having played it for years.) https://help.ea.com/en-us/help/star-wars/star-wars-the-old-republic/swtor-security-key-faqs/ I'm not making light of your situation or what you went through, but that link would've helped you in avoiding having to deal with CS at all. Maybe bookmark it as you will have the issue again - whether your phone breaks, get a new phone, or it gets reset again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seireeni Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 (edited) Pardon me for chuckling to myself a little while reading your post, Seireeni, only because so much of your story sounds recognizable (minus the English part). Just know you're not alone! And we need some non-speaking options dammit! Chuckle all you want, more laughter is always good. Fear of phone calls seems to be more common than one would think! I know this one guy, really sociable in person, not the type who seems he'd have social anxiety. One time he came to talk to me after having to make some important calls and even after several minutes, his hands were visibly shaking. And I completely understood why. Edited April 30, 2018 by Seireeni Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 (edited) https://help.ea.com/en-us/help/star-wars/star-wars-the-old-republic/swtor-security-key-faqs/ I'm not making light of your situation or what you went through, but that link would've helped you in avoiding having to deal with CS at all. Maybe bookmark it as you will have the issue again - whether your phone breaks, get a new phone, or it gets reset again. ^^ exactly this. As for needing to talk to live support by phone for something security related to your account... most studios actually require this these days. There are things they can and do fix from in game requests, or emails.. but SECURITY matters are generally NOT one them in todays modern MMO world. Now.. why would they want to talk to you live? Because a live phone call, where they can ask you questions and you provide answers sufficient to prove to them you are who you say you are is a much better security approach than on-line chat and infinitely better than email ... where they cannot hear your voice and recognize that you may not be who you claim to be... such as John Smith from Minneapolis... talking to them in a thick foreign accent. Accounts do not much get hacked or hijacked with SWTOR.. and so far I know of no instance where it happened via an attempt to persuade CS to give you access to an account. So, personally, I applaud that they take account security seriously... and not via some cavalier internet text app. As for why not email... PLEASE!! .. email accounts getting hacked (usually via phishing coupled with a careless email account holder) is the number one way that people do actually get their game accounts hacked. In fact.. it is the number one way a wide range of accounts get hacked these days... because people are sometimes careless and it does work... even if only 1% of the time. As for alleged language problems.... um.. most CS have the ability to connect you to someone who can speak your language. Not to mention.. if you can write proper English.. as is the case in the first post of this thread.. how is it you cannot actually speak English well enough to have a conversation?????? I'm sympathetic to the frustrations expressed here... but I also understand there are very valid reasons why a security issue with your account can only be resolved via A) a formal online process.. such as what is linked above or B) an actual live conversation where they can ask you a number of questions and if you do not provide immediate and coherent responses that make sense.. they can keep drilling until they are 100% convinced you are who you say you are. Edited April 30, 2018 by Andryah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lhancelot Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 Pardon me for chuckling to myself a little while reading your post, Seireeni, only because so much of your story sounds recognizable (minus the English part). Just know you're not alone! And we need some non-speaking options dammit! I am just curious, but does your social anxiety go away as far as when you interact in a game, like swtor? If someone sends you a tell, do you get anxious, or does the interaction in a MMO not have the same anxiety affect? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 (edited) Pardon me for chuckling to myself a little while reading your post, Seireeni, only because so much of your story sounds recognizable (minus the English part). Just know you're not alone! And we need some non-speaking options dammit! I'm pretty sure one of the things CS keys in on during a live phone chat is your voice, timeliness of your responses, and do you appear calm and honest.. or anxious and suspicious in some way, are you being forthright in your responses or are you appearing to try to game them somehow. I know this sucks for someone who is easily anxious in live conversation... but they really are trying to protect your account from a hijacking on their watch. But again.. all of this could have been resolved without a live phone call if the OP had simply reviewed and followed the instructions on the security key FAQ. And that same approach would have worked for you as well and avoided the anxiety of a live phone call with someone you do not know. Edited April 30, 2018 by Andryah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seireeni Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 (edited) As for alleged language problems.... um.. most CS have the ability to connect you to someone who can speak your language. Not to mention.. if you can write proper English.. as is the case in the first post of this thread.. how is it you cannot actually speak English well enough to have a conversation?????? Do tell me how I get CS support for SWTOR in Finnish. I'd be really thankful. As for writing vs. speaking, it's very different. One thing is the accent. If you have a nearly incoherent accent (and loads of mispronouncing on top of it), it's hard to communicate what you're trying to say. Another thing is the ability to spellcheck, grammar check etc. I quite often google how words should be written before making a post, and have to change sentences because I realized I'm not sure how it's properly written. All of these are things I can't do while speaking. In addition, there are people with speech issues, hearing issues and social anxiety. OP mentioned having the first one. Edited April 30, 2018 by Seireeni Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 (edited) Do tell me how I get CS support for SWTOR in Finnish. I'd be really thankful. As for writing vs. speaking, it's very different. One thing is the accent. If you have a nearly incoherent accent (and loads of mispronouncing on top of it), it's hard to communicate what you're trying to say. Another thing is the ability to spellcheck, grammar check etc. I quote often google how words should be written before making a post, and have to change sentences because I realized I'm not sure how it's properly written. All of these are things I can't do while speaking. In addition, there are people with speech issues, hearing issues and social anxiety. OP mentioned having the first one. Well..that is a bit surprising to me. I have some Finnish friends (my grandmother was Finnish, and that is how I came to know other people from Finland) .... and interestingly they speak English better than many Americans. I asked them how this came about in a country like Finland where the two official languages are Finnish and Swedish..... and they noted that Fin's learn English as part of their normal schooling. But first they politely lectured me on how Finland has the top educational system in Europe (no idea how much of that is fact, or how other EU nations would respond to the claim) They pointed out that many in Finland learn multiple languages in school and as such Finland has the highest foreign literacy in Europe, with English being accountable for about 60% of students. They did point out that they do struggle with certain pronunciation, but honestly I noticed no real challenge when speaking to them.. other then the every popular challenges with American idioms. My Finnish on the other hand... sucks.. and Grandma always got so frustrated with me. But this is all academic... if you had looked up and followed the FAQ for handling security key issues.. no live phone call would have been required in this sort of case. Problem solved for that particular issue and challenge. Would work equally well for the OP too. Edited April 30, 2018 by Andryah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silenthc Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 (edited) I am just curious, but does your social anxiety go away as far as when you interact in a game, like swtor? If someone sends you a tell, do you get anxious, or does the interaction in a MMO not have the same anxiety affect? Online interaction (I'd put in-game interaction on the same 'level' as chatting to someone on Steam or IM, or making a post on forums like these) is definitely easier for me personally, as it takes away the factor of the other person being able to see and hear me which apparently plays a big role in my anxiety (and funnily enough, maybe the biggest reason I get anxious over phone calls is not being able to see the other and thus I can't 'read' them as well), as well as being able to take a bit more time in calmly formulating your words. Does it go away? Not at all. I'm still very wary of how others perceive me with a thousand thoughts running through my head every second (and sadly it goes beyond just social anxiety for me), more than anything when it comes to one-on-one dialogue. I spend a lot of time worrying the other person will think I'm <insert a random negative title>. Another example would be me being inexperienced at the game so I dread doing group content because of thinking I suck and not wanting to bother anyone else (and have actively avoided group content because of it so far). I tend to trip over my own words and train of thought when speaking a lot, or at least I THINK I do (rationally I know most of it is just happening inside of me), because there's just too much going on my head. Online chat allows me to very deliberately choose my words, as tiring as that can get (unless I happen to be in a foul mood). But no, it never really stops for me. Online it's just a bit more comfortable. I'm pretty sure one of the things CS keys in on during a live phone chat is your voice, timeliness of your responses, and do you appear calm and honest.. or anxious and suspicious in some way, are you being forthright in your responses or are you appearing to try to game them somehow. I know this sucks for someone who is easily anxious in live conversation... but they really are trying to protect your account from a hijacking on their watch. But again.. all of this could have been resolved without a live phone call if the OP had simply reviewed and followed the instructions on the security key FAQ. And that same approach would have worked for you as well and avoided the anxiety of a live phone call with someone you do not know. I do actually agree with your sentiments on this topic entirely, Andryah. For me it's not a matter of a speech impediment, nor paranoia in the sense of not trusting them to handle my details or anything. I understand why they're doing it the way they're doing it. In my case it is literally just being anxious of coming across "wrong" (whatever that may be), even where there might be no reason whatsoever for that to hold any sort of truth. No way getting around it in some cases like having to call up authorities, or in this matter, customer service. And at the end of the day will just have to suck it up and do it. But it's just very frustrating to someone like me when that's the only option given to you. Even when I do come off thinking "that wasn't so bad" nine out of ten times. Edited April 30, 2018 by silenthc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seireeni Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 (edited) Well.. I have some Finnish friends (my grandmother was Finnish, and that is how I came to know other people from Finland) .... and interestingly they speak English better than many Americans. I asked them how this came about in a country like Finland where the two official languages are Finnish and Swedish..... and they noted that Fin's learn English as part of their normal schooling. But first they politely lectured me on how Finland has the top educational system in Europe (no idea how much of that is fact, or how other EU nations would respond to the claim) They pointed out that many in Finland learn multiple languages in school and as such Finland has the highest foreign literacy in Europe, with English being accountable for about 60% of students. They did point out that they do struggle with certain pronunciation, but honestly I noticed no real challenge when speaking to them.. other then the every popular challenges with American idioms. But this is all academic... if you had looked up and followed the FAQ for handling security key issues.. no live phone call would have been required. Problem solved for your particular issue and challenge. The reason I had to call CS had nothing to do with security key. I had a bug which caused me to be unsubscribed in game but subscribed in the website, and it didn't let me change my subscription or unsubscribe. And just because some Finnish people are fluent in English doesn't mean everyone is. Many Finnish people have a really bad Finnish accent, and they mispronounce words (and this includes me). When I was on vacation in London, I first attempted to speak English in stores and restaurants, but people kept not understanding me, so pretty soon I just let others do the speaking. As for the Finnish education system, claims of it's superiority are usually because Finland used to rank really high in PISA test. We have been dropping down for years though, but if it's been a while since you spoke about this to your friends, we might have still been in top 3 with countries like South-Korea and China. Edited April 30, 2018 by Seireeni Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaerethDL Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 I am just curious, but does your social anxiety go away as far as when you interact in a game, like swtor? If someone sends you a tell, do you get anxious, or does the interaction in a MMO not have the same anxiety affect? I believe the reason why he plays mmo's is because its more a comfortable way to interact with other people and be social without having to talk to someone face to face, or over the phone. There is a sense of comfort when you are anyone you want to be behind a keyboard or via text. He probably doesn't use voice comms much either. I have social anxiety too but I deal with it, first dates with females are always a challenge, i got by on my looks more than my conversation skills until I get comfortable with someone. People with bad social anxiety usually like to be recluses too and don't go out much unless necessary, its a constant struggle. Unfortunately you miss out on a lot of good times. I challenged myself as I got older, the military helped/forced me to get more comfortable speaking to people or being around a big crowd. Now that I've been out though, I've kind of fell back into my old ways. Prescribed anxiety medicine like xanax helps, but you can get addicted to that stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silenthc Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 (edited) I believe the reason why he plays mmo's is because its more a comfortable way to interact with other people and be social without having to talk to someone face to face, or over the phone. There is a sense of comfort when you are anyone you want to be behind a keyboard or via text. He probably doesn't use voice comms much either. I have social anxiety too but I deal with it, first dates with females are always a challenge, i got by on my looks more than my conversation skills until I get comfortable with someone. People with bad social anxiety usually like to be recluses too and don't go out much unless necessary, its a constant struggle. Unfortunately you miss out on a lot of good times. I challenged myself as I got older, the military helped/forced me to get more comfortable speaking to people or being around a big crowd. Now that I've been out though, I've kind of fell back into my old ways. Prescribed anxiety medicine like xanax helps, but you can get addicted to that stuff. Pretty much on everything you said, yes (especially first dates and getting by on looks initially, ugh), definitely the going-back-to-old-ways rut I'm finding myself into lately lol, it really comes in periods for me. But like I said it's not just social anxiety for me. You mind me asking your age as you state "as I got older"? Don't use medication in the traditional sense fortunately, though I do smoke cannabis. Edited April 30, 2018 by silenthc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaerethDL Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 Pretty much on everything you said, yes (especially first dates and getting by on looks initially, ugh), definitely the going-back-to-old-ways rut I'm finding myself into lately lol, it really comes in periods for me. But like I said it's not just social anxiety for me. You mind me asking your age as you state "as I got older"? Don't use medication in the traditional sense fortunately, though I do smoke cannabis. i'm 30. I'd probably smoke cannabis too but its not legal here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silenthc Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 i'm 30. I'd probably smoke cannabis too but its not legal here. Close enough with me at 27. And yeah, it's one of the last saving graces we have here in the Netherlands with its supposed liberalism being a complete myth at this point , although I'd prefer not to be using anything at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iivana_Julma Posted May 1, 2018 Author Share Posted May 1, 2018 https://help.ea.com/en-us/help/star-wars/star-wars-the-old-republic/swtor-security-key-faqs/ I'm not making light of your situation or what you went through, but that link would've helped you in avoiding having to deal with CS at all. Maybe bookmark it as you will have the issue again - whether your phone breaks, get a new phone, or it gets reset again. That page is apparently outdated, and so are the "advices." that does not work anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebamcfan Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 And just because some Finnish people are fluent in English doesn't mean everyone is. Many Finnish people have a really bad Finnish accent, and they mispronounce words (and this includes me). When I was on vacation in London, I first attempted to speak English in stores and restaurants, but people kept not understanding me, so pretty soon I just let others do the speaking. As for the Finnish education system, claims of it's superiority are usually because Finland used to rank really high in PISA test. We have been dropping down for years though, but if it's been a while since you spoke about this to your friends, we might have still been in top 3 with countries like South-Korea and China. This, so much this as fellow Finn. I write English well and read books in it but gods, my pronunciation is awful at times. And I agree, while our education is still good, it has come down considerably in past few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamaicanCastle Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 So... not to derail this fascinating discussion of Finnish education (and I mean that mostly sincerely) - developers don't have anything to do with CS. CS is provided by the publisher (in this case EA) and managed by its own team of administrators, who have little or nothing to do with the development team. Even when there is no separate publisher - take the case of WoW, for instance, another game I play where people rag on the CS all the time even though it's usually quite good - the groups that develop the game, the groups that maintain a frontend community, and the groups that handle customer support don't generally interact very much. Normally when you go through the CS process they'll give you instructions on how to contact the powers that be if something goes truly wrong. (I will say that in all three of my interactions with TOR CS - once by phone, once by ingame ticket, and once via email - I've always been satisfied with how it turned out.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NHBabe Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 That page is apparently outdated, and so are the "advices." that does not work anymore. I used it myself a little over a month ago when I got a new phone, so if it's not applicable any longer, than it was very recent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthSpuds Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 ^^ exactly this. As for needing to talk to live support by phone for something security related to your account... most studios actually require this these days. There are things they can and do fix from in game requests, or emails.. but SECURITY matters are generally NOT one them in todays modern MMO world. . Well, the only time I have needed to reset a secondary security key on a game it took two e-mails, and 20 mins. The first e-mail to explain the problem, the second to provide the proof of account ownership the company asked for - 1) the original activation code for the game, 2) the card number my subscription was paid with. Simples. Time to stop making excuses for poor customer service from Bioware. All The Best Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 (edited) Time to stop making excuses for poor customer service from Bioware. Time to be a little bit more objective and stop universally denigrating both the game and the studio over every single thing that is posted in the forum. Good post, bad post.. you will come in and slather negativity all over it and then make ad hominem attacks toward people who say anything even remotely non-negative....like you did in this case. and then put a "all the best" cherry on top as though that makes it OK. By all means discuss the game if you like.. but stop doing it on the backs of other peoples opinions you disagree with. As for it taking you two emails and 20 minutes to resolve... that actually is reasonable for something like a security key remedy. You can disagree of course.. but most reasonable consumers would not, particularly when what triggered the problem to begin with was on the user side (cell phone issue) and not the studio. We just had a discussion here a few days ago on a CS experience, and low and behold.. through discussion the thread originator came to realize that said issue was neither a bug, nor a glitch.. but actually the way the encounter works and that CS did nothing wrong by not solving the problem for them. And in that thread.. most posters gave positive feedback about their experiences with CS.... even with the thread actually being a "my experience sucks, how is yours" theme to it. Edited May 1, 2018 by Andryah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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