Well, I guess Kotaku gave us their own Producer's Note. SWTOR could Shut Down

[Kurj]

 

snip

 

2. Servers down to 5 from 17.

Investment and cost cutting at the same time.

 

snip

 

 

I don't see how we have evidence of investment in the game's future. Firing Ben and having Keith assume his duties in addition to existing responsibilities isn't investment, it's cost-cutting. The same is true of the new servers. Even if they really did buy new hardware (not sure I believe that), they eliminated a data center and went from 17 servers to 5. Again, that's cost cutting, not investment.

[cagthehack]

Luckily it's still not decided. Hopefully after Anthem is released we can get some resources back in this game if it's still up and running. That may be why we see the good Cartel Market sales on high demand items so the devs can show a positive cash flow even in times of content drought.

 

If Anthem is a huge hit (and I have doubts - serious doubts) then BW will survive. If Anthem is another dud then BW is toast.

 

But really, even if Anthem is a hit what makes you think BW will move resources to this game? And I'm more worried about Dragon Age. EA/BW has already destroyed my favorite game series, Mass Effect. And with the collapse of BF2.. I don't know.

 

Why is it that EA trashed so many good titles. It's a long list. It's almost like they don't want to make hits.

[damonskye]

I find it absolutely FASCINATING how many people in this thread and the other threads about the Kotaku story are calling foul, saying that Kotaku has a bad rep and that it can't be true.

 

The ONE THING we've heard about this game in the past two months, and people grasp at straws to avoid what is obviously a true story about the future, or lack thereof, of this game.

 

If you really doubt that the statement in the Kotaku story that they're mulling over shutting down development of this game, then you haven't been paying attention. At all.

 

Remember when Keith said he'd be timely with his comments and he'd interact more with the community? Well guess what. Eric Musco is the only employee to have posted in the past MONTH AND A HALF. Keith's last post? Early December.

 

Think about that for a moment.

 

We've had one virtually EMPTY content drop... most players won't experience the Scyva boss, and it's already months late anyway. Meanwhile, the one thing the remainder of the player base were actually looking forward to, more companions returning, is (a) only for specific classes and (b) bugged. Bugged.

 

I love this game, but the writing is on the wall. The developers have disappeared. The one community manager that does post on this forum only replies to complaints about game-breaking bugs, and that's it. He won't engage with us otherwise.

 

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice....

Edited January 25, 2018 by damonskye

[Galahard]

I don't see how we have evidence of investment in the game's future. Firing Ben and having Keith assume his duties in addition to existing responsibilities isn't investment, it's cost-cutting. The same is true of the new servers. Even if they really did buy new hardware (not sure I believe that), they eliminated a data center and went from 17 servers to 5. Again, that's cost cutting, not investment.

It's both, you sometimes have to invest (capital expense, capex) to be able to cut ongoing costs (operating expense, opex).

Companies are happy to spend capex, if they will see their opex drop and the business case is positive.

[Mournblood]

It really just confirms what many of us have suspected for some time now, but didn't want to openly admit. But if it's any consolation, any decision to pull development and put the game into maintenance mode won't be made until close to October, which is when the new fiscal year starts. As many of us know, EA being the big corporate goblin that they are makes its decisions based on money, and those quarterly earnings reports are on the fiscal schedule. If they do go into maintenance mode, I'm guessing we'll see one last server merger and the game will remain available for at least another year after that before attrition dries up the CM revenue stream enough for EA to finally pull the plug. But who knows, maybe Disney will let Blizzard have a crack at the license?

 

That said, what I also found disappointing about that article was the assertion that players are demonizing EA and putting Bioware developer jobs in harms way.

 

"And then there’s the toxicity problem, as video game pundits seize any opportunity to stoke anger at big publishers. Two people who have worked on Anthem both expressed anxiety to me about the ways some big YouTubers have spread misinformation and inflammatory rhetoric about EA, saying that it has a demoralizing effect on those people on the ground level. To people who work for EA, the publisher isn’t just a cold corporate master—it is a complicated machine that, yes, is concerned first and foremost with generating revenue for investors, but also supports thousands of people in many tangible and intangible ways. People close to BioWare, along with many other developers I’ve talked to in recent months, worry that commentary from some of YouTube’s loudest voices has eliminated nuance and made companies like EA seem like Disney villains."

 

Inflammatory rhetoric? Um, no. EA has earned every bit of its bad reputation. Big publishers like EA and NCSoft aren't in the gaming industry to make better games for players, they are in the gaming industry to make money. Gobs and gobs of it. Gamers didn't create the bad reputation that EA has so feverishly accumulated over the years. EA did that. Nearly every major title they have touched has ended badly. They use a Studio to make their stockholders rich, and when the game fails, they break them up and absorb whatever is left worth keeping. EA is like the Borg of the gaming industry.

 

As for the Bioware developers worried that gamers are putting their jobs at risk by perpetuating EA's bad rep, it wasn't gamers who decided to sell the company to EA. It was BW execs who sold the soul of their company to the devil. So really, the people who put BW developer jobs at risk was actually other BW employees. Not some YouTubers angry about monster publishers chewing up the gaming industry and spitting out what's left. But you can bet that when SWTOR dies an ignoble death, there will be a few more angry YouTubers talking about EA.

Edited January 25, 2018 by Mournblood

[Eshvara]

It's sad when EA makes all the crappy decisions and everybody else has to suffer with it. Why are they even in the gaming business, they clearly don't like games or know what to do with them other than running them into the dirt.

[Rheshalea]

That said, what I also found disappointing about that article was the assertion that players are demonizing EA and putting Bioware developer jobs in harms way.

 

"And then there’s the toxicity problem, as video game pundits seize any opportunity to stoke anger at big publishers. Two people who have worked on Anthem both expressed anxiety to me about the ways some big YouTubers have spread misinformation and inflammatory rhetoric about EA, saying that it has a demoralizing effect on those people on the ground level. To people who work for EA, the publisher isn’t just a cold corporate master—it is a complicated machine that, yes, is concerned first and foremost with generating revenue for investors, but also supports thousands of people in many tangible and intangible ways. People close to BioWare, along with many other developers I’ve talked to in recent months, worry that commentary from some of YouTube’s loudest voices has eliminated nuance and made companies like EA seem like Disney villains."

 

Inflammatory rhetoric? Um, no. EA has earned every bit of its bad reputation. Big publishers like EA and NCSoft aren't in the gaming industry to make better games for players, they are in the gaming industry to make money. Gobs and gobs of it. Gamers didn't create the bad reputation that EA has so feverishly accumulated over the years. EA did that. Nearly every major title they have touched has ended badly. They use a Studio to make their stockholders rich, and when the game fails, they break them up and absorb whatever is left worth keeping. EA is like the Borg of the gaming industry.

 

This is what I was thinking when I read the article, too.

Blaming Youtubers for EA making craptastic games? Really?

Sure, we all understand that the companies making our games need to make a profit of some kind to be able to make us more games. But they don't seem to realize that the key to keep them rolling in dough is to make good games. Different games, so they reach all kinds of players. Unique games, so players don't even think twice about picking up a new one.

 

Take survival games, ARK and Conan for example. Same idea, very same feel to the game play, but still manages to be different from each other. In one you die a lot, tame dinosaurs and build bases. You can PvP, you can PvE, you can play with friends or alone. In the other one you die a lot, "tame" slaves and build bases. You can PvP, you can PvE, you can play with friends or alone.

Or you can play one of the many, many Zombie survival games out there. You'll die a lot, fight zombies and build bases.

And somehow, the devs of these games apparently make enough money on Buy-to-Play games to be able to keep up official servers. And make new content. They create and sell optional expansions and DLC.

 

...and EA tries to get away with adding P2W RNG cash shops, because "making games is expensive, QQ".

...sure, EA. It's expensive if the game sucks.

What they don't seem to get is that people won't buy craptastic games anymore. Checking out a Youtube video or a livestream before forking over 60 moneys, 90 with season pass in case there's future content, has become second nature for a lot of us. We're not buying based on a flashy trailer and dev's promises anymore (thanks, No Man's Sky).

 

Meh. End rant.

TL;DR: Stupid devs are stupid and don't understand gamers

[Tsillah]

Stop Development <> Shut Down.

This is factually correct. At the same time, you can wonder how many people will stay on once it's clear they're not going to develop more content for the game and more importantly how many people are going to be willing to put money into this game. I mean would you spend 100s of bucks on cartel packs on items you only rent basically and will disappear when the game shuts down after development stops? Chances are the game might not last very much longer. So people invest less into it. It becomes a vicious cycle that will lead ever more quickly in a shut down.

So it seems they are trying to cost cut themselves into a place where they can be profitable with lower revenues.

This is clearly true as well. However, they needed this already before they did this, they were just hoping to turn the tide on players leaving.

This only makes sense if they are preparing for a content draught that is happening right now.

And this is not a correct statement. It already made sense before to do this. Most of the servers were sort of ghost towns and revenues must've been down already. I think people still underestimate how much damage 5.0 did to the game. But the need for server merges and cutting costs to be able to make a revenue is generally not a preventative measure but a last resort measure. It does allow for a sort of restart but even if the plan is to go on with creating new content this would have been a necessary step. The content drought has been going on for years already. The last two expansions were too small to carry the game forward.

They have content in development or ready to release, as far as we know from VO recordings.

True but that's no guarantee it will be released. Ask the guys from Visceral. Now my expectation is that they will announce one more expansion but it will not be that big as far as new content is concerned and they will use it to tie up some loose story ends and do what's needed to have the game in maintenance mode. Then it will depend on the players whether this game shuts down sooner or later.

Content is being produced with copy paste, cost cutting solution.

Yeah we've seen a lot of that, particularly with 5.0. Uprisings are an example of that. Edited January 25, 2018 by Tsillah

[StupidWiz]

If this is true my interest in Anthem will drop significantly, customization of my character is a biggie for me personally.

Yep. Same. I'm not interested in always looking at some mechas. I wanna see how my guy looks in 3rd person view.

[Mournblood]

One of the YouTube videos that article is referring to is here.

 

I couldn't have possibly said it better myself, so I'll quote (paraphrased the profanity for posting purposes here) a couple of the responses to that video and the assertion that YouTubers are unfairly characterizing EA as a villain of the gaming industry.

 

'Do you really think that this kind of analysis is inherently unfair? EA has been [crappy]. And anyone who’s coming at the topic from anything like a consumer-oriented perspective should be well aware of that, and willing to prioritize it in said analysis. If the entire point here is that I don’t work for EA, therefore I can’t know the nuances and complexities of how they operate as a corporate entity, that’s completely obvious. Still, I don’t see why that’s my problem. Their consumer-facing actions are what do, and should, concern me. If devs get down on themselves working for a company that projects this kind of corporate attitude to the public, that’s not my problem. Maybe they shouldn’t feel great to work for this company, because a lot of what EA seems to be about, particularly with their tunnelvision trained on GaaS [bS], is treating customers fundamentally like crap. Which means that the devs’ labor is being leveraged toward that end. I wouldn’t feel great if the work I did every day was being used to manipulate and exploit people who are supposed to be having fun with the products I make. That wouldn’t, and shouldn’t, make me feel good.'

 

And this one...

 

'I’m going to politely suggest this: know your history. EA’s “Disney villain” image didn’t form in a vacuum, and is justified by the decisions they’ve made going back nearly twenty years. Maybe you don’t know about any of that; maybe you don’t care. Either way, it’s not “amazing” the perception exists - it’s the most natural response to what they’ve done.'

Edited January 25, 2018 by Mournblood

[Eshvara]

It's sad how high the feeling of impending doom is around these forums after this news.:( Edited January 25, 2018 by Eshvara

[Paulsutherland]

It's sad how high the feeling of impending doom is around these forums after this news.:(

 

Now we'll never know the joys of having a Vaylin companion ... DOOM!!!!

[Eshvara]

Now we'll never know the joys of having a Vaylin companion ... DOOM!!!!

 

D; !!!

At least I'll get my Arcann romance before the timer runs out! G'darnit.:mad:

 

Doooooooooooooom!!

Edited January 25, 2018 by Eshvara

[Paulsutherland]

D; !!!

At least I'll get my Arcann romance before the timer runs out! G'darnit.:mad:

 

Doooooooooooooom!!

 

I can see it now ... the servers will shut down as you click the option to start the romance with Arcann.

[Tsillah]

I can see it now ... the servers will shut down as you click the option to start the romance with Arcann.

 

Hahaha...oh dear, poor Eshvara. You're gonna give her an anxiety attack.

[MikeCobalt]

This is the only game I play and when/if this runs out, my gaming will too. I'm not at all interested in any of the FPS's with zero substance just 90% bright flash's and loud explosions to me that's incredibly backwards like all the way back to "Space Invaders" on Atari level. It seems EA doesn't care about making games that are actually evolved, or go beyond "Run, Shoot, Win level, just quick money and trendy FPS's. The Thought of losing this game I like and that other at the Expense of this is similar to the idea of Stepping all over a friends grave to dance with their killer; sickening. But that's E.A. I guess. They've left a swath of wreckage in every aspect of gaming they've touched; I wont feed that animal after this.

[Lunafox]

It did not state "a couple of months" it said "a few weeks":

 

 

That was just over two weeks ago.

 

The last roadmap was titled "Fall Road Map". A "Winter Road Map" in May would be a joke, and do nothing to quell the speculation going on around here.

 

I'm sorry, but some type of break in the silence needs to happen. Now. Keith? Talk to us, man. We're in your corner, but not in the loop.

 

I was going off of memory, having just read it once, but I guess it comes down to how many = a few? I'm going by experience, they never do anything quickly and a 'few weeks' can turn into months.

 

Honestly, what do you think would happen, if they came out and laid the cards on the table and said 'oh hey we might be shutting down.' People would leave in droves, so i can see the need for secrecy to try and keep the semblance of things being okay. Admitting anything negative would hasten this game's death.

[Tsillah]

Honestly, what do you think would happen, if they came out and laid the cards on the table and said 'oh hey we might be shutting down.' People would leave in droves, so i can see the need for secrecy to try and keep the semblance of things being okay. Admitting anything negative would hasten this game's death.

People have been leaving in droves already over the years. The problem is that their secrecy is ultimately driving more people away than it keeps.

 

I think that it will depend greatly on how they do this. First of all saying out loud will dash the final hopes of some players and they will leave. That much is certain, but not having to put in anymore development and have a loyal fanbase left that is not as demanding can help keep the game alive rather will in spite of that exodus.

 

Also they could look at F2P and Pref status. Alllowing them full content and alleviating a few restrictions might also bring a lot of players back that would play a game in maintenance mode.

 

Now if the core loyal fanbase cannot sustain this game by themselves in maintenance mode then the game is already dead and it just doesn't know it yet. I don't see it as a positive that they basically lie (albeit by omission) just to keep things afloat.

 

Also finally being able to be honest will also create some goodwill and it will be a lot of pressure off of their shoulders as well. It could be very freeing and might give this game a few years yet on a more honest basis.

[TrixxieTriss]

https://kotaku.com/bioware-doubles-down-on-anthem-as-pressure-mounts-1822380989

So the writings on the wall. I think lots of us have realised this for the last 16 months. 5.0 was the real nail in the coffin and they’ve been trying to keep the game on life support since.

I blame Ben Irving a lot and his in ability to listen to the players and what we actually wanted and not what he wanted to force down our throats.

There has been so much wasted potential with this game because management were too arogent and lied to players too often. Things could have been 100x better if they had just listened to player feed back and not just their silly influences friends.

Players have been treated like mushrooms for years and fed ****. It’s no wonder this great game is failing. If you treat paying customers like that, they will abandon you, no matter how good your product should be.

 

This info in the article is a two edged sword and a self fulfilling prophecy. Now that this is out there, people will be less likely to spend money on the CM or even subs. That means less revenue for the game and ultimately causes EA to shut it down. I think this article will now make the decision for them because people who read it or read the forums will start to abondon the game and new players will obviously stay away.

[TrixxieTriss]

This is the only game I play and when/if this runs out, my gaming will too. I'm not at all interested in any of the FPS's with zero substance just 90% bright flash's and loud explosions to me that's incredibly backwards like all the way back to "Space Invaders" on Atari level. It seems EA doesn't care about making games that are actually evolved, or go beyond "Run, Shoot, Win level, just quick money and trendy FPS's. The Thought of losing this game I like and that other at the Expense of this is similar to the idea of Stepping all over a friends grave to dance with their killer; sickening. But that's E.A. I guess. They've left a swath of wreckage in every aspect of gaming they've touched; I wont feed that animal after this.

 

There are other options like Guild Wars 2 or World of Warcraft.

[notanjelika]

There are other options like Guild Wars 2 or World of Warcraft.

 

I'd rather go back to PWI, Shaiya and LIneage II than to play that garbage Anthem.

[Costello]

What is really disappointing is how no one from the SWTOR development team has taken the time to get some information out about this. Hell we are still waiting on the Winter Roadmap and to see how 2018 is going to be exciting.

 

Looking at 2017 this hardly comes as a shock, but the way it has been handled can't help but disappoint. All through 2017 people were hoping for some good news as far as the game went and for the most part all concerns were utterly ignored. Now we come to 2018 and even the most die hard haters of Ben and fanatical supports of Keith felt that the 2018 roadmap would be the telling point. He had been in charge for almost an entire year, little had been produced in 2017 much of it using assets developed under Ben.

 

And what does it bring, well silence as far as the roadmap goes, plenty of twitter posts about what to purchase on the CM and an article saying the future of the game is in the air and development may cease. Looking at the state of the game and the lack of any information about the future whose going to think it has any future at all. Hell if there had been a roadmap that would be something but anyone think its a coincidence despite promises of more transparent communication that there doesn't appear to be one and there is talk of the game going into maintenance mode (which for a theme park game is pretty much the end).

 

Sadly this will also leave the Story ending on Theron's big adventure, basically regardless of how it turns out with him, the last year of story will have been him betraying you and you pointlessly running around after him. Should he be a double agent then the final SWTOR is him saving the day and if he should prove to be a traitor then the final story is him delivering a super weapon to your enemies. Either way its all about Theron and the player was just there to shout at the end of each flash point 'I'll get you next time Danger Mouse.. I mean Theron.'

 

On a side note I remember people saying an expansion had been announced, this seems as far from an expansion as possible, was that lies or wishful thinking on misunderstanding something said.

[Eli_Porter]

Also they could look at F2P and Pref status. Alllowing them full content and alleviating a few restrictions might also bring a lot of players back that would play a game in maintenance mode.

 

Giving F2P full content is a bad idea IMO. The only way this game can make a profit in maintenance mode is through new players buying access to expansion story content. Preferred should get full access though, with subs getting more XP/CXP/CC.

 

That said, I'd really like more sandbox content developed before the game's put in maintenance mode.

[TrixxieTriss]

Giving F2P full content is a bad idea IMO. The only way this game can make a profit in maintenance mode is through new players buying access to expansion story content. Preferred should get full access though, with subs getting more XP/CXP/CC.

 

That said, I'd really like more sandbox content developed before the game's put in maintenance mode.

 

The cats out of the bag now. I highly doubt they’ll get an new players from now on.

[Rheshalea]

There are other options like Guild Wars 2 or World of Warcraft.

 

Yup, even before this article I had started leaning towards another break from SWTOR (depending on what the Roadmap says). If I don't find reason to continue my sub, I'm going back to GW2. Then I'll try Vanilla WoW (provided I don't have to buy the whole game a second time) when that comes out, but I doubt I'll be playing that for very long.