If SWTOR is losing players, how can Bioware turn things around?

[notanjelika]

I would be fine with giving them a section where they can post, they're still ex-customers, but I understand Bioware not allowing them to post everywhere...they're EX-customers...it's just too much drama allowing them to post freely on the forums. Bioware runs a business and allowing EX-customers to post would be bad for business.

 

There is a lot of drama anyway, i remember when i registered and subbed two years ago, some British guy caused a big fuss on the forums, i think it was something about Ashara Zavros, but i might be wrong, it was a long time ago and i wasnt paying much attn to forum anyway.

Then it was another scandal about someone getting reported for guessing the identity of a certain bad guy. Then the merc scandal and drama. Then.. ok , i know, enough examples, you got the big picture.

[olagatonjedi]

There is a lot of drama anyway, i remember when i registered and subbed two years ago, some British guy caused a big fuss on the forums, i think it was something about Ashara Zavros, but i might be wrong, it was a long time ago and i wasnt paying much attn to forum anyway.

Then it was another scandal about someone getting reported for guessing the identity of a certain bad guy. Then the merc scandal and drama. Then.. ok , i know, enough examples, you got the big picture.

Stay on topic plz

[LordArtemis]

I don't think any more can be done Artemis. You've been on these forums ever since I can remember offering some great suggestions but, it's too little too late for SWTOR. A combination of a botched launch, F2P in less than a year, lack of endgame content since launch, staff getting let go and quitting, slug-paced responses to server transfers and merges, the game making pendulum swings in one direction when it came to content updates (from PvP to PvE to singleplayer), and incompetent dev decisions in general (Galactic Command, no west coast servers, credit exploits, etc) have left this game dying a slow and painful death.

 

I appreciate the comments. I will keep trying at any rate.

 

There is a huge swath of likely reasons why players left....I can cite 5 distinct reasons why I left at certain times. I was personally enticed back to play by the Amazon 90/2400 deal, as I found that to be a pretty good value compared with what the game offers me.

 

I do think that offering some candy here and there could convince some players to return.

[DuchessKristania]

I appreciate the comments. I will keep trying at any rate.

 

There is a huge swath of likely reasons why players left....I can cite 5 distinct reasons why I left at certain times. I was personally enticed back to play by the Amazon 90/2400 deal, as I found that to be a pretty good value compared with what the game offers me.

 

I do think that offering some candy here and there could convince some players to return.

 

Yeah, people like candy. The rewards need to be consistent and if not frequent, at least a regular and attainable through long term loyalty rather than splash subs that are dropped as soon as the prize is won. The occasional special promotion is fine, but the long term loyalty of subscribers should be recognized and encouraged. Incentivize maintaining subscriptions and customer loyalty.

 

As far as content goes, I think they need to do more to strike a better balance with what's released. The swinging pendulum doesn't work. They focus on story and they lose the people who do group/pvp/etc content. So they panic and focus the other way, losing the story/solo/pve players. Both demographics are important to the overall health of the game, swinging back and forth just creates a seesaw effect rather than the stable and balanced base that they need. In fairness, I think they're kind of trying to do it, but they're still not hitting the mark and it seems like a lot of people from various play styles are dissatisfied.

Edited January 18, 2018 by DuchessKristania

[LordArtemis]

Yeah, people like candy. The rewards need to be consistent and if not frequent, at least a regular and attainable through long term loyalty rather than splash subs that are dropped as soon as the prize is won. The occasional special promotion is fine, but the long term loyalty of subscribers should be recognized and encouraged. Incentivize maintaining subscriptions and customer loyalty.

 

As far as content goes, I think they need to do more to strike a better balance with what's released. The swinging pendulum doesn't work. They focus on story and they lose the people who do group/pvp/etc content. So they panic and focus the other way, losing the story/solo/pve players. Both demographics are important to the overall health of the game, swinging back and forth just creates a seesaw effect rather than the stable and balanced base that they need. In fairness, I think they're kind of trying to do it, but they're still not hitting the mark and it seems like a lot of people from various play styles are dissatisfied.

 

You pretty much covered the salient points of loyalty IMO.

 

I agree that small bits of expansion for all parts of the game, in a more balanced manner is far better at this point. That is not to say that other expansions could not work, as they had secondary reasons they did not meet expectations IMO....but at this stage your approach makes the most sense.

 

As far as rewards, I posted my view of a proper reward program HERE. I think that total sub time is the proper scale to use, and that scale should be VERY long...the more desirable rewards at the end of the scale.

Edited January 18, 2018 by LordArtemis

[DuchessKristania]

You pretty much covered the salient points of loyalty IMO.

 

I agree that small bits of expansion for all parts of the game, in a more balanced manner is far better at this point. That is not to say that other expansions could not work, as they had secondary reasons they did not meet expectations IMO....but at this stage your approach makes the most sense.

 

As far as rewards, I posted my view of a proper reward program HERE. I think that total sub time is the proper scale to use, and that scale should be VERY long...the more desirable rewards at the end of the scale.

 

I like the way you have it laid out. I mean the details like what the specific rewards are is something that would be difficult to pin down, and ultimately not up to any of us anyway, but if the devs do look at this thread, I would suggest a wider range of sub rewards since different players have different tastes and goals. The general idea id spot on though.

 

I'm glad you made this thread, I think we need to see more threads like this. It promotes constructive thought and discussion rather than the usual arguments and side taking. This is the kind of thing that has the potential to attract the attention of developers and open the lines of communication.

[LordArtemis]

I like the way you have it laid out. I mean the details like what the specific rewards are is something that would be difficult to pin down, and ultimately not up to any of us anyway, but if the devs do look at this thread, I would suggest a wider range of sub rewards since different players have different tastes and goals. The general idea id spot on though.

 

I'm glad you made this thread, I think we need to see more threads like this. It promotes constructive thought and discussion rather than the usual arguments and side taking. This is the kind of thing that has the potential to attract the attention of developers and open the lines of communication.

 

I appreciate your participation, and naturally all those folks that have taken time to leave comments.

 

As to the specific items suggested in the timeline, they are really just placeholders to provide a general idea. They have metrics that would define rewards far better than I could speculate.

[LordArtemis]

Offering cartel coins and sub and stuff wouldn't personally bring me back. Those are just short term gimmicks.

 

What interests me and brings me back to games is challenging content - challenging progression, challenging pve, certainly challenging end game content and of course pvp.

 

the majority market though is casuals, autists, kids and bads and they need to be catered to for max profits and they prefer screaming for everything to be nerfed into the ground, so adding any challenge back is unfortunately counter intuitive to big corporations and companies.

 

As for pvp, it's just a chore - here's a post i just made on it:

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=9518735#post9518735

 

So goodluck bringing anyone, any proper gamers, anyone than more than just the random casuals and bads that won't stick around for long after playing through the story, back.

 

I wont argue against your views, as you are entitled to them...I will only say that I will continue to make an effort regardless of whether or not it seems like it would be fruitless. I have never let that stand in my way.

[LordArtemis]

There is a lot of drama anyway, i remember when i registered and subbed two years ago, some British guy caused a big fuss on the forums, i think it was something about Ashara Zavros, but i might be wrong, it was a long time ago and i wasnt paying much attn to forum anyway.

Then it was another scandal about someone getting reported for guessing the identity of a certain bad guy. Then the merc scandal and drama. Then.. ok , i know, enough examples, you got the big picture.

 

Do you think that allowing F2P and preferred players a place in the forum to post would be enticing to prior players? It may be a good option for current players, but I am not sure it would be something that would bring players back.

[PennyAnn]

Do you think that allowing F2P and preferred players a place in the forum to post would be enticing to prior players? It may be a good option for current players, but I am not sure it would be something that would bring players back.

 

No one I know that has quit playing the game cares about the forums. The only thing that the 8 or 10 people that I used to play this game with that I still talk to outside of SWTOR ask me is: "Is there an expansion yet?" or " Have they finished that raid yet?"

 

Until I can answer yes to either of those questions, I think it's likely that most of the people who left here bored without regular intervals of new content will come back, play through what has been added in less than a week, and find none of it is worth repeating on alts.

 

Content, lots of content, good content, replayable content. This will potentially bring people back. But they will have to keep up with that to not see those same people leave again unless there is something interesting enough to repeat in the game, and Galactic Command grind is not enough.

[fushnchips]

We are paying $15 per month for Cartel Market updates and very few quality content patches that should be coming in with a sub based mmo.

 

5.7 patch notes

 

* hey earn the companions back you already had

* delayed ops boss from last year

* super good cartel market goodies

 

this is not a content patch it's a poor excuse for them to try and push a patch and for a game with one of the worlds top ip's it's beyond shocking and I do feel sorry for certain employees that are trying to pay the bills but as a subscriber of over 6 years it's just not right with how they are doing this to loyal and new players that subscribe.

 

But all I can say is shame on you Bioware/EA.

[Eshvara]

We are paying $15 per month for Cartel Market updates and very few quality content patches that should be coming in with a sub based mmo.

 

5.7 patch notes

 

* hey earn the companions back you already had

* delayed ops boss from last year

* super good cartel market goodies

 

this is not a content patch it's a poor excuse for them to try and push a patch and for a game with one of the worlds top ip's it's beyond shocking and I do feel sorry for certain employees that are trying to pay the bills but as a subscriber of over 6 years it's just not right with how they are doing this to loyal and new players that subscribe.

 

But all I can say is shame on you Bioware/EA.

 

Well it is up to you whether you continue paying or not. Not that I'm saying that you should stop. But who is being a lot more foolish, the man who continues to stay with his wife that's cheating while he's fully aware she is, or the woman that cheats?🤔

Edited January 23, 2018 by Eshvara

[Soteirian]

I agree with those who said the key to retaining/gaining subscribers is content. You can only do the same thing over and over so many times, and then it's just not going to work.

 

Personally, I would have liked for Bioware to allow the option to turn-off level-sync so that I can solo some of the lower level group contents, including Operations, when my character becomes high-level enough. I have not been able to complete a single operation despite PUG multiple times. Without going into details, let's just say that level-sync makes it very difficult for PUGS to succeed their objectives, and people abandon the group often.

 

If I can go back and take my time soloing the Operations, I think it will keep me quite busy for months, if not a couple of years (or more). Back when I was playing WOW, going back to solo the lower-level raids kept me interested and subbed for years. Making this possible would be a pretty cheap way to add a LOT of new contents for many players.

Edited January 23, 2018 by Soteirian

[olagatonjedi]

No one I know that has quit playing the game cares about the forums. The only thing that the 8 or 10 people that I used to play this game with that I still talk to outside of SWTOR ask me is: "Is there an expansion yet?" or " Have they finished that raid yet?"

 

Until I can answer yes to either of those questions, I think it's likely that most of the people who left here bored without regular intervals of new content will come back, play through what has been added in less than a week, and find none of it is worth repeating on alts.

 

Content, lots of content, good content, replayable content. This will potentially bring people back. But they will have to keep up with that to not see those same people leave again unless there is something interesting enough to repeat in the game, and Galactic Command grind is not enough.

Nothing in any MMO is really "replayable" content. For swtor, you could maybe argue Kuat Drive Yards was replayable for the fact there are multiple versions of it, but other than that, every piece of content becomes old once you run it once. MMOs thrive on doing (not necessarily grinding) the same content over and over, so Im curious what kind of things would be "replayable" in your mind.

[olagatonjedi]

We are paying $15 per month for Cartel Market updates and very few quality content patches that should be coming in with a sub based mmo.

 

5.7 patch notes

 

* hey earn the companions back you already had

* delayed ops boss from last year

* super good cartel market goodies

 

this is not a content patch it's a poor excuse for them to try and push a patch and for a game with one of the worlds top ip's it's beyond shocking and I do feel sorry for certain employees that are trying to pay the bills but as a subscriber of over 6 years it's just not right with how they are doing this to loyal and new players that subscribe.

 

But all I can say is shame on you Bioware/EA.

Wrong, you are paying $15 to log into the existing world. Paying the monthly access fee grants you access to new content, but does not guarantee there will be new content. You may have misunderstood what you were paying for.

[vingmotor]

by stop beeing so obviously greedy. and make star wars, star wars again.

damn sound like trump, but you know what i mean.

[TUXs]

No one I know that has quit playing the game cares about the forums. The only thing that the 8 or 10 people that I used to play this game with that I still talk to outside of SWTOR ask me is: "Is there an expansion yet?" or " Have they finished that raid yet?"

 

Until I can answer yes to either of those questions, I think it's likely that most of the people who left here bored without regular intervals of new content will come back, play through what has been added in less than a week, and find none of it is worth repeating on alts.

 

Content, lots of content, good content, replayable content. This will potentially bring people back. But they will have to keep up with that to not see those same people leave again unless there is something interesting enough to repeat in the game, and Galactic Command grind is not enough.

Absolutely true PennyAnn, my experiences mirror yours exactly. The forums don't mean anything, the game does.

[LordArtemis]

Thanks for your replies, I will compile a list later and add it to the OP, and respond to a few posts. Thanks again.

[DasVio]

Well first update that stoneage Engine... in two years i Need Dosbox to simulate stoange9.0c

Its simple. Bring real new Content, Workout new stuff, like PVE GSF... whole planets with 3pillar Storys. Toon, Planet/fraction, main Story usw...

Openspace, Spacecrafts with diffrent purpes. Harvesting, Transport, Exploring and ofc War... there is so much stuff, what we and others still missing.

Oh and than most important bla bla bla..^^ ofc the most important! Recolor gear for 5200CM would do just fine. Everybody must have the same pants in four diffrent prints. Thats for sure:rolleyes:

Edited January 23, 2018 by DasVio

[olagatonjedi]

Really?

 

Class Stories in SWTOR and eminently replayable.

At the time Hytbold in LOTRO was not only replayable but gave a direct way to end-game gear.

 

You try so hard at being wrong all the time you really should work for Bioware, if you don't already that is.

 

All The Best

If the stories are replayable, what is the problem? You guys are not making sense.

 

If there wasnt enough replayable content, the game would be dead, which is not the case. The people who are still subbed and playing are fine enough with the current grind and system and content to be paying money for it. BW will never please the people who left on a whim, so their efforts to reach them should be limited, and mostly focus on keeping up with their plan to date.

Edited January 23, 2018 by olagatonjedi

[vingmotor]

i think the first step is to acknowledge that they are still caring about the game.

[PennyAnn]

Really?

 

Class Stories in SWTOR and eminently replayable.

At the time Hytbold in LOTRO was not only replayable but gave a direct way to end-game gear.

 

You try so hard at being wrong all the time you really should work for Bioware, if you don't already that is.

 

All The Best

 

I refuse to even respond to him anymore. I don't even read his replies because they are always so mind boggling. He obviously doesn't raid - because that is the essence of repeatable content. A good challenging raid is repeatable content for months, working through the various difficulties.

 

The story lines from vanilla are repeatable also. Very enjoyable especially after not doing them for awhile.

 

But what this guy won't pull his head out of the sand and realize is that after you've repeated something ten million times, it wears out. New content that you can then work through several times is what is needed. Bioware doesn't get it either, so yes.. he would be repeat employee of the month there. He has missed his calling as a bone head in chief.

[PennyAnn]

Thanks for your replies, I will compile a list later and add it to the OP, and respond to a few posts. Thanks again.

 

Thanks for attempting to gather constructive criticism in several threads. I hope it makes a difference somewhere... anywhere.

[olagatonjedi]

I refuse to even respond to him anymore. I don't even read his replies because they are always so mind boggling. He obviously doesn't raid - because that is the essence of repeatable content. A good challenging raid is repeatable content for months, working through the various difficulties.

 

The story lines from vanilla are repeatable also. Very enjoyable especially after not doing them for awhile.

 

But what this guy won't pull his head out of the sand and realize is that after you've repeated something ten million times, it wears out. New content that you can then work through several times is what is needed. Bioware doesn't get it either, so yes.. he would be repeat employee of the month there. He has missed his calling as a bone head in chief.

So kotet and kotfe fill that void, as they are repeatable and enjoyable. You're contradicting yourself.

[LordArtemis]

Thanks for attempting to gather constructive criticism in several threads. I hope it makes a difference somewhere... anywhere.

 

Thanks. Ill offer some responses to posts later, I already updated the OP.