VedaRa Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 From EA's Quarterly Report: "$1 million or 1 percent decrease in subscription net revenue primarily due to Star Wars: The Old Republic." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanNV Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 And now they've screwed the pouch even worse with KOTET by not listening to their remaining players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuiwe Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 Serves them fine when they're "smarter" than anyone else. Won't shed a tear, really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsillah Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 Huh? But I thought they said KotFE was their "most successful expansion to date". Wait, could this be the reason why they're suddenly talking about group content again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QuinlanSaathis Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 Not saying you are wrong Not saying you are right Prove it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toraak Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 Huh? But I thought they said KotFE was their "most successful expansion to date". Wait, could this be the reason why they're suddenly talking about group content again? I'm sure that is part of it, It's probably also part of the reason they're making galactic command crates exclusive to subscribers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthDymond Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 Which document and paragraph did you get that from? I ask because when I looked through their Earnings Release, Prepared Statements, Slide Presentation, and Earnings Call Transcript, I did not see that quote anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRomanRuler Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 (edited) Of course. What else did you expect? Subscription is dead business model. That is why SWTOR went free 2 play and there are no upcoming subscription games. Everything is free 2 play where sub is only if you want to get extra perks, not mandatory to enjoy like in SWTOR. Only thing that makes no sense is why EA insists trying to keep it alive. Of course EA is stupid, so there is that. I hope they rework this game to actually be enjoyable free 2 play, and then you have option to sub if you want more enjoyment. That is overall far better model. I certainly would sub to get complimentary cartel coins, free expansions and increased credit income and some other stuff, but i hate that i HAVE to sub the game just to enjoy it properly. Future is bright for gaming industry. It is dark for subscription models. Sadly, EA still exists and is still making profit, so SWTOR remains sick Design decisions would still be somewhat similar without EA, people would still complain about this being single player MMO, but at least free 2 play experience should improve without EA, making game better place for everyone. Impossible to say if this game can survive as single player MMO though. I would prefer they just make Old Republic single player game, i love every story bit about this game, and then they could make this more MMO-ish - if it could survive without as heavy focus on story. Short term it certainly could not. I hate how EA has license to Star Wars games Everyone wants Old Republic single player game with amazing story from SWTOR that could be heavily improved on single player game. And everyone wants MMO to be MMO and separate from single player game. Sure it would mean devs would actually have to heavily improve this game or it would die, but that is good thing. I hate EA Edited November 13, 2016 by TheRomanRuler Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRomanRuler Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 (edited) Huh? But I thought they said KotFE was their "most successful expansion to date". Wait, could this be the reason why they're suddenly talking about group content again? Maybe. Or maybe they get far more revenue from non-subscription system as they get from subscription. Cartel market has been huge financial success for them. Time to abandon mandatory subscription to enjoy game. Everyone should enjoy the game as free 2 play player and get profits from cartel market and from those who want to sub becouse subbing increases enjoyment. Subbing atm is just subbing to not get penalties which sucks. I would sub if i could get complimentary cartel coins, increased XP and other stuff. Reason they implement galactic command is (among other reasons) so XP actually becomes useful. Now you actually want to get XP as you get rewards from it. Reason they make it sub only is EA. Edited November 13, 2016 by TheRomanRuler Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RudbekAlliance Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 (edited) http://investor.ea.com/results.cfm Quarterly results if anyone actually wants to look. Edit: said I couldn't find it, but yeah, should've did more than skim. Edited November 13, 2016 by RudbekAlliance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsillah Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 Maybe. Or maybe they get far more revenue from non-subscription system as they get from subscription. Cartel market has been huge financial success for them. Well they certainly seem to be wanting to increase sub numbers in 5.0 Also the statement about 4.0 being most successful was made around it's release because it pulled a lot of people back into the game. Those sub numbers that were gained have dropped again to the point that it's now in the minus again. I guess the expansion didn't have the power to keep people subbed. I also think that with sub numbers dropping the CM sales will probably not be quite as good as they were before. Probably still good, but with fewer people playing, especially subs, logically the CM sales will go down with it. Not saying the game is dying, but it's also not growing when it comes to the player base it seems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VedaRa Posted November 13, 2016 Author Share Posted November 13, 2016 Which document and paragraph did you get that from? I ask because when I looked through their Earnings Release, Prepared Statements, Slide Presentation, and Earnings Call Transcript, I did not see that quote anywhere. It's in the form 10-Q. They tried to bury it in with how much they made off Galaxy of Heroes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthDymond Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 It's in the form 10-Q. They tried to bury it in with how much they made off Galaxy of Heroes. Got it - thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keta Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 http://investor.ea.com/results.cfm Quarterly results if anyone actually wants to look. I only skimmed, found no direct reference to the game. Took me awhile but it's in a note on page 38 of their 10Q filing for their 2nd Quarter FY 2017: "For the three months ended September 30, 2016 , digital net revenue was $566 million primarily driven by FIFA Ultimate Team , FIFA Online 3 in Asia, and Star Wars: Galaxy of Heroes . Digital net revenue for the three months ended September 30, 2016 increased $64 million , or 13 percent , as compared to the three months ended September 30, 2015 . This increase is due to (1) a $27 million or 13 percent increase in extra content net revenue primarily driven by revenue associated with our Ultimate Team game mode, (2) a $26 million or 21 percent increase in mobile net revenue primarily driven by Star Wars: Galaxy of Heroes , Need for Speed No Limits, and Madden NFL Mobile, and (3) a $12 million or 15 percent increase in full-game download net revenue primarily driven by Need for Speed 2015, Battlefield 4, and Star Wars Battlefront. These increases are partially offset by a $1 million or 1 percent decrease in subscription net revenue primarily due to Star Wars: The Old Republic." my answer? bfd. refers to a revenue decrease not a net loss for the game. Nothing more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SithKoriandr Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 Of course. What else did you expect? Subscription is dead business model. That is why SWTOR went free 2 play and there are no upcoming subscription games. Everything is free 2 play where sub is only if you want to get extra perks, not mandatory to enjoy like in SWTOR. Only thing that makes no sense is why EA insists trying to keep it alive. Of course EA is stupid, so there is that. I hope they rework this game to actually be enjoyable free 2 play, and then you have option to sub if you want more enjoyment. That is overall far better model. I certainly would sub to get complimentary cartel coins, free expansions and increased credit income and some other stuff, but i hate that i HAVE to sub the game just to enjoy it properly. Yet WoW and FFXIV make the sub model work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllisonLightning Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 Yet WoW and FFXIV make the sub model work. They're rare and of those WoW is the success, FFXIV (which I still consider successful) has a cater to the veteran playerbase which can work long term as long as you don't frell them off. Both are gaming royalty and are entrenched in the gaming world via being the flagship MMO or part of a massively successul 'gaming based' franchise. EvE used to be included in that list... the problem isn't that 4.0 wasn't accessible, I'd say the revamp helped a lot more than the expansion itself which is a problem. KOTFE is pathetic by single player RPG standards. SWTOR has made idiotic move after idiotic move- as we've seen recently, getting dubbed Premium players isn't about giving us extra stuff. The rule with hybrid MMOs has always been, pay to cut down grind, F2P for maximum grind. We've been loaded up with F2P grind despite paying subs and no, it's not because of the F2P side of things- it's because they can't keep subscribers to save their lives- because we aren't offered a subscription worthy service. They weren't honestly providing that after the game launched either which is why the game hemorrhaged- and that was before F2P even happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ekwalizer Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 From EA's Quarterly Report: "$1 million or 1 percent decrease in subscription net revenue primarily due to Star Wars: The Old Republic." The is what happens when you run a 5 month 12XP story event so that you can cook the metrics to show how many people are engaged in "story" as justification to not invest in group content. They wanted their metrics to show X so they tilted the scale to get players to engage in X. I've literally been saying this since KotFE was announced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ekwalizer Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 my answer? bfd. refers to a revenue decrease not a net loss for the game. Nothing more. If it gets called out in the quarterly as a loss, it is a bfd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 Yet WoW and FFXIV make the sub model work. A 1% loss in net revenue is not the same thing as being negative-profit. It just means last quarter you made $100 and this quarter you made $99. That doesn't even qualify as a failure, and makes no mention at all of cartel market profits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ekwalizer Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 Huh? But I thought they said KotFE was their "most successful expansion to date". Wait, could this be the reason why they're suddenly talking about group content again? It may well have been in terms of unique accounts accessing it. But, when Q3 came out last year and they made that claim they weren't looking at 1-and-done subscribers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ekwalizer Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 A 1% loss in net revenue is not the same thing as being negative-profit. It just means last quarter you made $100 and this quarter you made $99. That doesn't even qualify as a failure, and makes no mention at all of cartel market profits. $1M subscription loss over a quarter equates to 22,222 accounts no longer contributing to the game. Do you think we can afford to lose 22K paying customers? Show me a company that does that and says "yep, doing great!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthDymond Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 (edited) $1M subscription loss over a quarter equates to 22,222 accounts no longer contributing to the game. Do you think we can afford to lose 22K paying customers? Show me a company that does that and says "yep, doing great!" The $1 million was the overall decline for that net revenue stream across all of EA's subscription properties, SWTOR's dip was the most significant single contributor but probably not the only one - just like it isn't bringing in $99 million a quarter alone. Edited November 13, 2016 by DarthDymond Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ekwalizer Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 (edited) The $1 million was the overall decline for that net revenue stream across all of EA's subscription properties, SWTOR's dip was the most significant single contributor but probably not the only one - just like it isn't bringing in $99 million a quarter alone. That is true, but they failed to mention any other game in the loss (as in less than last quarter) column. Which means that this game's reduction of revenue was so significant that the board had a fiduciary responsibility to call it out by name to the investors. Edited November 13, 2016 by ekwalizer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 They need a management change here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthDymond Posted November 13, 2016 Share Posted November 13, 2016 (edited) That is true, but they failed to mention any other game in the loss (as in less than last quarter) column. Which means that this game's reduction of revenue was so significant that the board had a fiduciary responsibility to call it out by name to the investors. Not to nit-pick, but the decline was year over year, not by quarter - you can see the language and grid right above the line OP quoted is showing it as the difference between the Quarter ending Sept 30, 2016 and Sept 30, 2015. So this $1 million dip in revenue is relative to the Quarter last year when they had that massive 31% increase in subscriptions from the lead up to KotFE. Edited November 13, 2016 by DarthDymond Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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