The DISGUSTING state of general chat

[Andryah]

People don't even know what free speech means, they took the term and ran with it. Then think it applies everywhere.

 

It is one of the most misused terms in use these days on the internet. People seem to forget that it is actually a constitutional right which does not mean it applies everywhere. What it means is that the government cannot legally squelch public expression of views via free speech. Period.

 

Inside a forum (or game) owned by a private individual or company.... is not guaranteed free speech (as constitutionally defined) unless the terms and conditions of said forum specifically say so. I know of no such forum or game either.. they all have restrictive terms and conditions.

 

That said.. some of the hyper-sensitive demands for policing of chat in games is also unwarranted and without precedent. Why? Because nobody is forced to read anything in general chat, much less take it seriously or personally.... given it is anonymous squeaking between anonymous parties in a virtual game chat channel that is accessed by consent of the reader.

Edited November 6, 2016 by Andryah

[Asmodesu]

Everyone yelling about "free speech" and "grow a thicker skin" must be forgetting that this game is teen rated. The rating is important, hence the rules whether they seem enforced or not (and yes some of those kids have a filthier vocabulary then I do, believe me, I know). It's called human decency: Keep the more disgusting, horrible chat to your guild's own chat and your friends, it's not needed to be seen by everyone, and why bother trying to trick the profanity filter anyway? there's an uncheck filter option in settings and you can swear your lovely mouth off in text form as much as you like without jumping through text/letter hoops. Anyone with filter unchecked will see it, anyone with it checked are choosing not to see that language, respect that choice made by other players. It's really not that hard.

Basic human decency. Learn it.

[Ralei]

It is frustrating that some of the public space of the game is taken over by a very strange group of people. They express the most cringe worthy - intentionally ignorant viewpoints , each trying to outdo the other, until chat is filled with a very specific combination of words and mood.

 

If anyone tries to reclaim this space from them, they begin to swarm, buzzing with sounds like "triggered, sjw, cuck, pc" through channels of tells and replies. Its a hive mind, with the obedient little worker bees spreading the pollen of belligerence, fueled by the irony of wanting everyone to read what is on their small garbage minds while complaining about being censored.

 

The easiest way to get them to swarm is to randomly type the word "ignored" into general chat.

[Belpheghor]

All MMOs are like this. I've played MMOs every day for years and years. ALL MMOs are like this. This will never ever change. If Bioware went after all the trolling they'd loose a TON of ppl who play the game, fact.

[dr_mike]

edit: Not worth the trouble. Some folks just think they have a god given right to sprouting hate. Edited November 6, 2016 by dr_mike

[curulz]

Speech may be free, but the consequences could be costly.

[DarthEnrique]

I personally just ignore most of the gen chat, I just pretend it's not there a lot of the times because of a lot of what people say. For awhile I was like "You are aware that there are minors in this game and you probably shouldn't talk like that." because profanity filter or not something aren't hard to figure out what someone is saying. But it comes down to people just don't care anymore they say what they want they don't care how stupid or ignorant it makes them look, they just don't have any self-respect so I choose not to engage in conversation with these people and just ignore the chat all together. I only use the chat when I want to form an OPS or to see if others are forming one other then that I stay out of the chat and just play the game.

[MidnightTrooper]

play the game, ignore the chat. This is not made for people who just want to talk. The game if fun to play & if you play it, you might not care what others are chatting about. Any time I have tried to read it, it was usually someone chatting with a second individual & a conversation between the two & usually not an interesting conversation anyway.

 

If you just want to chat, go to a social media site & if you want to chat with someone while you play, there is private conversation as well, but mostly if you are offended at the chat, don't read it play the game.

[Tsillah]

It's unfortunate that some folks have replied here without reading more than the title of the post. Yes, there is an ignore function, yes you can turn general chat off, but I specifically stated why these are limited or don't work.

 

And being thin skinned? Just because I prefer not to have to read chat that is that disgusting? Perhaps you should re-evaluate the type of person you are and what you find acceptable in life. Like I said, it is bad and I cant begin to repeat it here or I wold get banned from the forums.

 

But seriously, from a business sense, allowing this doesn't make any sense. I am sure far more people are going to leave or not subscribe than people are going to say, "wow this chat is great, I'm going to sub right now!"

 

Feel free to reread this post of yours. If you cannot see that you are being arrogant, condescending and patronising here, then it's clear that you are part of the problem. If you can take yourself off the self-righteousness for a minute and realise that you are your own worst enemy here, then perhaps there is hope for you yet.

 

Could you please do us a favour and understand that just because you think you are right doesn't mean you have any more rights than others. As much as I agree that chat can be disgusting at times, it would appear most of us have learned to adapt, as much as we do in real life as well. Your energy would be far better spent in finding solutions there, because anything that pushes us closer to censorship and thought police is a worse situation than a handful of idiots that are easy enough to ignore. You say the means in the game are not enough. I tell you they are sufficient. So who's right?

 

Are you more right than I am? No, we are different people. That is the essence of it and you can't really police that in a live environment, nor should you want to. The price that is paid for what you want simply is not worth it. Let's just agree that your truth is fine for you, but does not apply to the rest of us. You are letting your anger guide you here but it's not going anywhere productive as you've just proven. You've lost your credibility here completely. If you want to be on the moral high ground, such condescension is counter-productive at best.

 

Wisdom would be to not keep digging that hole deeper for yourself, but wisdom is the first victim when people get angry. I understand that.

 

Your choice to decide what you do next, it's a free world where we live after all.

Edited November 6, 2016 by Tsillah

[americanaussie]

Everyone yelling about "free speech" and "grow a thicker skin" must be forgetting that this game is teen rated. The rating is important, hence the rules whether they seem enforced or not (and yes some of those kids have a filthier vocabulary then I do, believe me, I know). It's called human decency: Keep the more disgusting, horrible chat to your guild's own chat and your friends, it's not needed to be seen by everyone, and why bother trying to trick the profanity filter anyway? there's an uncheck filter option in settings and you can swear your lovely mouth off in text form as much as you like without jumping through text/letter hoops. Anyone with filter unchecked will see it, anyone with it checked are choosing not to see that language, respect that choice made by other players. It's really not that hard.

Basic human decency. Learn it.

 

And what? You think it's the 40 yr Olds that have the potty mouths? seriously? It's probably the teenage 14-21 crowd responsible for it.

[WayOfTheWarriorx]

Everyone yelling about "free speech" and "grow a thicker skin" must be forgetting that this game is teen rated. The rating is important, hence the rules whether they seem enforced or not (and yes some of those kids have a filthier vocabulary then I do, believe me, I know). It's called human decency: Keep the more disgusting, horrible chat to your guild's own chat and your friends, it's not needed to be seen by everyone, and why bother trying to trick the profanity filter anyway? there's an uncheck filter option in settings and you can swear your lovely mouth off in text form as much as you like without jumping through text/letter hoops. Anyone with filter unchecked will see it, anyone with it checked are choosing not to see that language, respect that choice made by other players. It's really not that hard.

Basic human decency. Learn it.

 

So ummm....on which plane of existance exactly is it so that teen's haven't been exposed to cussing and are less guilty of using such words on a regular basis than any other age group?

 

It's okay to play a game wherein it's dipicted of killing people without any provocation other than wanting more darkside points, having a city bombared from orbit, crushing people's windpipes via sheer will and the force, impaling people with a lightsaber because ya just didn't like one of their answers, having multiple sex partners and having two wives at the same time, that's all fine. But saying the F word or the C word in text on a video game, that's just going beyong the pale of decency.

 

It's also respectful to not attempt to force the speech of others to be only in line with your way of thinking. Can such language be disrespectful? Of course it can. But it's not disrespectful when someone has just called you some nasty four letter words and you return them in like.

 

Using four letter words is not inherently immoral. When people stub their toe and yell aloud "Owww you mutha f'er". The context of thier use is the determining factor of what might be appropriate and what isn't. Now if someone calls me some nasty words, I'm not interested in "being the bigger person", I'm interested in hitting back. Sometimes other people might be forced to overhear [over-read?] such instances. There is really little excuse, as far as I can see to raise a stink over this when one has the option of using language filters. If you are using language filters and therefore not seeing much of this language, what the hell difference does it make what anyone else ever says if you can't even see it when they use such language? If you are choosing not to use language filters, it's not for others to have to change their manner so as not to offend total strangers whom they are not even addressing, and even if they are, use your language filter.

 

Decency can be somewhat subjective. In india if you eat a steak you are the worst sort of person and you are doomed to hell for all eternity.

 

People can be very unkind to each other and words are the least of it. If that's the worst of it, count your blessing. And with regard to what other people are saying to each other [meaning not directed at you], you shouldn't get a say in that. If that's the sort of society you wish to be a part of, might I suggest building a time machine and moving to Nazi Germany. After all, they raised such fine and upstanding youth. I envy the people that got to kill them.

You'll only get 12 years out of that tho.

 

You are most certainly entitled to your beliefs. You're not entitled to anyone elses.

 

Make mine Freedom.

[Asmodesu]

And what? You think it's the 40 yr Olds that have the potty mouths? seriously? It's probably the teenage 14-21 crowd responsible for it.

(and yes some of those kids have a filthier vocabulary then I do, believe me, I know).

I obviously am not discounting that.

 

-snip-

 

you have a lot of anger for no reason. I said:

 

you can swear your lovely mouth off in text form as much as you like without jumping through text/letter hoops. Anyone with filter unchecked will see it, anyone with it checked are choosing not to see that language, respect that choice made by other players.

 

As you can see I never said don't use the language, that would have been hypocritical since I swear a lot. I'm just decent enough not to try and get past the profanity filter for obvious reasons. The first part of my post was simply keep the edgier stuff to more private areas. There is a reason I used the words disgusting and horrible, and not by trying to exaggerate. I'd get a ban on the forums if I tried to explain what those topics are so use your imagination. I also never said teens aren't exposed to it, most teens I know swear and carry on more then I do, this was an objective comment on the terms of the ESRB which is much stricter then society usually.

None of the rest deserves a reply. Have a great day.

Edited November 7, 2016 by Asmodesu

[Rolodome]

It's unfortunate that some folks have replied here without reading more than the title of the post. Yes, there is an ignore function, yes you can turn general chat off, but I specifically stated why these are limited or don't work.

 

And being thin skinned? Just because I prefer not to have to read chat that is that disgusting? Perhaps you should re-evaluate the type of person you are and what you find acceptable in life. Like I said, it is bad and I cant begin to repeat it here or I wold get banned from the forums.

 

But seriously, from a business sense, allowing this doesn't make any sense. I am sure far more people are going to leave or not subscribe than people are going to say, "wow this chat is great, I'm going to sub right now!"

I re-read your OP.

 

If you want to find groups for Ops or Heroics without dealing with general chat, join a guild. You can argue you shouldn't "need to" turn chat off or go a different route for grouping, but it's not like there aren't options.

 

I will defend your right to complain about it, but I would be holding a double standard if I did not equally defend the right of those people in chat to talk as they see fit, as long as they aren't going out of their way to be jerks to people (which does, unfortunately, happen).

 

If BW wants the hold the same standards as their forums in-game, that's their prerogative and there's nothing wrong with you asking them to do it. But as long as they aren't choosing to enforce such rules, it's iffy getting on peoples' case about what they say in chat. Without a black and white rulebook to follow, a lot of it comes down to "have they passed into threats or harassment?" In which case, report them. If not, what can you do. You could poll 100 people and may get a different response from each one about whether certain subjects and ways of talking should be uncensored in general chat, in-game.

 

And even BW, if they did hire people to enforce the same rules in chat as in the forums, you still might not agree with them on everything they choose to censor.

[AllisonLightning]

And what? You think it's the 40 yr Olds that have the potty mouths? seriously? It's probably the teenage 14-21 crowd responsible for it.

 

Teenagers are bad but 40 year Olds are more than capable of being vitriolic. They're as bad as each other and being offensive online isn't reserved for kids or the older generation. The playerbase in this game is far older than people think- and that pertains to all things across the board.

[Tsillah]

Everyone yelling about "free speech" and "grow a thicker skin" must be forgetting that this game is teen rated.

 

This is a non-argument. The teen rating is a minimum age, not a maximum age and refers to the content of the game. Now, you may argue that there are a lot of younger players but to me that's all about American hypocrisy. It's not unique to America, I will say that right away, but they do seem to be the champions of it. I lived there for almost 6 years and the thing that amazed me is how parents were all worried about kids not being exposed to swearing on tv or in the house etc, but when kids are at school they swear up a storm day in, day out.

 

My point is not that this is all fine and ok, but I do want people to be a bit more realistic about their options and instead of just trying to control what other people say (which just doesn't work), there is a larger issue in this hypocrisy which is called double standards. I think the world would be a better place with less swearing, because people just don't learn proper vocabularies. There are moments where it makes sense but I believe that it's because people try to police it, that kids (and some kids are over 18) find it particularly interesting to have a "potty mouth" as you say it. But let's be honest, even "potty mouth" sounds like it's something cute or funny.

 

Go out in the world and people use "bad" language constantly, it's part of our society. And though I have no moral issues with swearing by itself, I do find its continuous use thereof unfortunate.

 

It's not just swearing though. There are also the topics themselves. You see if I were to correct a spelling mistake, someone will call me a grammar nazi. Aside from it being spelling and not grammar, we find it generally normal to use a term like nazi. It shows a lack of historical context and that's a reality.

 

You say that people should learn basic human decency. Well, first of all, they won't. So that's kind of a pointless statement. Secondly, where would they go to learn this? At school? That's where they learn the bad language. Look at the "music" videos today and what they are about and have been about for many years. To be honest, I don't see BWA as the entity that can or should resolve those issues.

 

What can they do? Sure they could add a LFG channel, but people may start their tripe in there just the same, because they are looking for an audience. So that's why I say, it's best to use the tools that exist consistently. I personally found that ignoring just 2-3 people on a given occasion is quite effective. I also play my part to ridicule people into silence from time to time, which has worked on various occasions. Just getting angry and complaining about it though is exactly what they want. It's still a form of trolling in the end; they want a reaction.

 

But the more you try to force or convince people, the more people will try to break through it. Sure there are moments that I feel people are really going too far. So I deal with it my way. That's all anybody can really do.

Edited November 7, 2016 by Tsillah

[Krazhez]

Black desert has a system, that you can type in any word you don't want to see and it will completely block it out. Also, if you block someone,` it completely deletes what they said from your chat window.

 

It doesn't bother me for the most part if something is super disgusting I switch back to my guild tab.

 

But i see his complaint, if he's looking for groups, because we don't have a looking for group channel he will see stuff he doesn't want to. I don't see the issue with the chat filter being better and adding an LFG tab while they're at it.

[nhsknudsen]

Why do military personnel always need to mention it? 'Serving' not enough of an ego boost so you need validation from internet strangers?

 

Better yet, why do they think they protect their countrymens rights to express themselves by invading Iraq?

[curulz]

Better yet, why do they think they protect their countrymens rights to express themselves by invading Iraq?

 

you realize that the US service men/women don't make decisions on who/when/why to "invade" right?

[robertthebard]

I personally just ignore most of the gen chat, I just pretend it's not there a lot of the times because of a lot of what people say. For awhile I was like "You are aware that there are minors in this game and you probably shouldn't talk like that." because profanity filter or not something aren't hard to figure out what someone is saying. But it comes down to people just don't care anymore they say what they want they don't care how stupid or ignorant it makes them look, they just don't have any self-respect so I choose not to engage in conversation with these people and just ignore the chat all together. I only use the chat when I want to form an OPS or to see if others are forming one other then that I stay out of the chat and just play the game.

 

They don't have to care. Mommy and daddy aren't monitoring chat, so they're free to abuse the language as they see fit. Ironically, some of them do wind up on enough ignore lists that they can't get into FP/Ops queues fast enough to suit them, and then wind up here, complaining about how we need server merges, or xserver queues. It's hilarious to watch. The other side effect is that people tend to avoid the areas where it's most prevalent, such as Fleet, and then want to say "Nobody's on Fleet, the game is dead".

 

Out here in the world, I'm an old biker that can, and has used language that makes sailor's blush. I don't have any kids living at home, any more, and my cat doesn't much care what I say when I talk on the phone or to her. In game, I tone it down, because you never know when someone's kid might be either in chat, or in the same room with someone that doesn't have headphones for chat. I have banned people from TS and Vent for not having that common courtesy, and have even had one such person report me to a game's admin about it. That was hilarious, he wasn't expecting to be told that it's a private server, and the admins of that server can do that for any reason, or no reason, if they so choose.

 

In general, Fleet chat serves one good purpose, weeding out the "undesirables", who will, of course, be offended at that. "Grow a thicker skin" only applies to everyone else, after all.

[Tsillah]

They don't have to care. Mommy and daddy aren't monitoring chat, so they're free to abuse the language as they see fit. Ironically, some of them do wind up on enough ignore lists that they can't get into FP/Ops queues fast enough to suit them, and then wind up here, complaining about how we need server merges, or xserver queues. It's hilarious to watch. The other side effect is that people tend to avoid the areas where it's most prevalent, such as Fleet, and then want to say "Nobody's on Fleet, the game is dead".

 

You know, you're making some really good points here. Hadn't quite thought of it this way but I think you're on to something here.

[isorfidia]

This is really getting far beyond acceptable. I understand there is always going to be some chat which is considered unacceptable by someone, but the current state of general chat is absolutely ridiculous. In fact it's so bad I cannot repeat any of it here, because I would get banned.

 

So why the double standard? Why is it not acceptable in the forums, but completely unmonitored in the game chat?

 

Yeah, yeah I know there is a profanity filter; I know I can turn general chat off, but I shouldn't have to. They bypass the filters with ALT letters or other means and since BioWare failed to put in a LFG channel, Gen chat is the best way to link up with other people for ops and heroics.

 

Where is the legacy ignore feature Eric talked about months ago? Why isn't there a TOS within the game chat like there is in order to use the forums (and a way to report people who violate that TOS)?

 

If there is a single biggest complaint I see or hear about SWTOR, this is it!

 

Just turn General chat off. You have only yourself to blame for keeping it turned on.

[Deaconik]

Just turn General chat off. You have only yourself to blame for keeping it turned on.

 

Sure, because you can use the group finder for HM Operations. Or Heroics. Oh, damn...