foldyjedi Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 Also i don't see a problem when someone has better gear earlier than i do. Does this affect me in PVE? No i think not. I don't even see the other guys stats unless i look them up. I can only speak for myself....it encourages me when i see players with super cool armors or good stat gear, to go and hunt me some too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IanArgent Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 Ian, I PuG a LOT! I may not get what I need the 1st time, but I know where to go for the gear I need, and eventually I'll get it...and right now, even if my Commando can't use that Bracer, my Sage can. So even crappy luck with tokens STILL has a positive side. How do you choose which Op to pug at SM? Am I missing something in GF that will let me queue for an arbitrary Op, because all i ever see in GF is the day's designated op. So, no, I can't target what op I want to play as a pug. As it is, the GF queue for that designated op doesn't pop; so I can't even be guaranteed to get into a GF SM op even when I queue for it. From my point of view, a duplicate item that I can disintegrate for GXP guaranteed by playing an op is superior to a non-guaranteed chance at a fixed item, because it doesn't matter which op I do, I'm getting something that will result in advancement towards a "final" gear set. And that's not even getting into the metagame knowledge, that isn't documented anywhere in game that I know about, that specific ops bosses drop specific tokens. I did not know that, I was assuming it was random because that's what it appeared to be. And I do read the external guides! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jadescythe Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 How do you choose which Op to pug at SM? Am I missing something in GF that will let me queue for an arbitrary Op, because all i ever see in GF is the day's designated op. So, no, I can't target what op I want to play as a pug. As it is, the GF queue for that designated op doesn't pop; so I can't even be guaranteed to get into a GF SM op even when I queue for it. From my point of view, a duplicate item that I can disintegrate for GXP guaranteed by playing an op is superior to a non-guaranteed chance at a fixed item, because it doesn't matter which op I do, I'm getting something that will result in advancement towards a "final" gear set. And that's not even getting into the metagame knowledge, that isn't documented anywhere in game that I know about, that specific ops bosses drop specific tokens. I did not know that, I was assuming it was random because that's what it appeared to be. And I do read the external guides! Stop Pugging in GF and find a group in fleet chat like everyone else who wants to actually beat the operation... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 Also i don't see a problem when someone has better gear earlier than i do. Does this affect me in PVE?Of course it effects you. People already insist on 220/224 gear for PvE...now you're going to be basing your entire gearing for PvE AND PvP on RNG luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 How do you choose which Op to pug at SM? Am I missing something in GF that will let me queue for an arbitrary Op, because all i ever see in GF is the day's designated op. So, no, I can't target what op I want to play as a pug.How do you choose? You mean...you've never just walked into an Op? I can do every Op in-game in a single night Ian...just grab the mission, start a group and enter... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keimox Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 How do you choose which Op to pug at SM? Am I missing something in GF that will let me queue for an arbitrary Op, because all i ever see in GF is the day's designated op. So, no, I can't target what op I want to play as a pug. As it is, the GF queue for that designated op doesn't pop; so I can't even be guaranteed to get into a GF SM op even when I queue for it. From my point of view, a duplicate item that I can disintegrate for GXP guaranteed by playing an op is superior to a non-guaranteed chance at a fixed item, because it doesn't matter which op I do, I'm getting something that will result in advancement towards a "final" gear set. And that's not even getting into the metagame knowledge, that isn't documented anywhere in game that I know about, that specific ops bosses drop specific tokens. I did not know that, I was assuming it was random because that's what it appeared to be. And I do read the external guides! You know you can just make group and walk in to the operation. And Ops bosses have dropped specific tokens since 2.0. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gntlmanslfe Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 There is a however of course Right now as a guild we know which gear will drop and we can divide it and make sure all are geared up so we can hit the next difficulty mode. In the new set up each individual is dependent on RNG and people might get left behind because of it. Also it looks like it will be harder to gear up alts, so if one of the healers can't make it the group is screwed because others have not been able to gear up their alts properly yet. I do see this as a weakness in this system, though I will say that I do see a lot of positives in it as well, but I would hate for guildies to be left behind because of RNG and the rest of the guild being unable to do anything about it like we can do now with gearing runs. I have a similar fear. I could pull 100 crates and still not get the one piece I've been looking for. And my time is limited. I do the ops I can when I can be online. Doesn't make me any less "hardcore" than the people who can be online all day. I lead a guild and we have an HM raid team. These changes mean I may never get the gear I need to even be competent in the group I plan to lead. I don't mind the idea of boxes, or points even, but make it so I can be selective with what I get, so my gearing time is a couple of months, not "until the next xpac drops". And, in a game where most of your raiders are disappearing into the ether, WHY would you make BOP gear to SLOW DOWN the gearing process anyway? I read earlier on the thread that BW wants people to just quit the game. I don't agree with that statement, but they're definitely showing that they have no idea what the people want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IanArgent Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 Stop Pugging in GF and find a group in fleet chat like everyone else who wants to actually beat the operation... Gee, thanks. I have an extremely limited time frame to play. I can set GF and go play the solo portion of the game for everything but Ops; where I am, for some reason, required to sit on fleet twiddling my thumbs and watching jawa jokes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlixMV Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 A bunch of other people have already said what I think about this decision, as someone who has been doing HM/NiM since 2.0, but I'm commenting anyway to be another username/account adding to the cacophany. But I also just wanted to say this, in case it hasn't been said: What's the point of having a batallion of characters and a Legacy, if you've created a system that actively encourages single toon usage by discouraging running higher difficulty endgame on multiple toons? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IanArgent Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 Yes, I'm aware I could "form a group" and go into whatever Op I want. There's a reason I mentioned GF. If it can't be done via GF, I'm not interested, because GF means I can enter queue and still play the solo game while I'm waiting for a pop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 Yes, I'm aware I could "form a group" and go into whatever Op I want. There's a reason I mentioned GF. If it can't be done via GF, I'm not interested, because GF means I can enter queue and still play the solo game while I'm waiting for a pop. GF doesn't work like that sadly. GF is for bonus comms, not Ops. It SHOULD be...but it isn't, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XhrisShan Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 No we aren't, its purely rng. And yes its like the devs have forgotten what happened with pvp rewards early on in the game. Because they're not the same devs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
otisjerek Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 (edited) Don't see any particular reason to make PVE and PVP gear the same... Edited October 18, 2016 by otisjerek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khevar Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 (edited) Yes, I'm aware I could "form a group" and go into whatever Op I want. There's a reason I mentioned GF. If it can't be done via GF, I'm not interested, because GF means I can enter queue and still play the solo game while I'm waiting for a pop. You're using the fact that a SM group finder pug doesn't let one pick a specific operation as comparison to the new gear RNG coming in 5.0. But one cannot use the GF queue for HM operations. And the people you're arguing with in this thread aren't talking about obtaining SM-rated gear. Edited October 18, 2016 by Khevar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IanArgent Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 GF doesn't work like that sadly. GF is for bonus comms, not Ops. It SHOULD be...but it isn't, It is for every other type of group content in the game. But you know this is one of my hotbuttons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IanArgent Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 You're using the fact that a SM group finder pug doesn't let one pick a specific operation as comparison to the new gear RNG coming in 5.0. But one cannot use the GF queue for HM operations. And the people you're arguing with in this thread aren't talking about obtaining SM-rated gear. Evidently, in 5.0 you can get higher-grade gear via SM ops (eventually). But that's not important right now You're right in that HM+ Ops are not (never?) pugged, and thus the ops group can use "non-traditional" gear distribution to ensure that specific people get the specific drop they specifically need in higher-level content. On the other hand, depending on the rate of GXP gain for doing SM ops, if an ops team can plow through a lower level op, one that the "new guy" can do something in instead of hiding in the corner from the mechanics that will flatten his undergeared self, and get a useful amount of GXP from it, that will be a different kettle of fish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertthebard Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 What's about bolster in warzones? What will stop hardcore pve'ers from ruining pvp? All that much vaunted player skill? I can't begin to remember how many times I've heard that PvPers are the best players in any game, including DDO, which is lolworthy, to say the least, and yet, you're concerned about PvEers messing it up? I would think, based on the generalized PvPer attitude, that they would be welcome additions to the opposing team, since they'll be so easy to beat, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlavivsAetivs Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 So the Devs have been absolutely silent so far today... ~ Eudoxia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsetso Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 So the Devs have been absolutely silent so far today... ~ Eudoxia I believe they are scared of the sh*tstorm they summoned Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolodome Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 (edited) I believe they are scared of the sh*tstorm they summoned I don't know, seems pretty standard from what I've seen. Answer questions on day one, then go silent for a while. They have another livestream on thursday, IIRC, so they will probably make some comments on the *****torm then and that will tell us how they're reacting to it. If they don't comment on the *****torm at all on the livestream, then I'll be worried. But I'm guessing they will at least acknowledge it in passing, even if we don't like what that acknowledgement is. Edited October 18, 2016 by Rolodome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsetso Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 I don't know, seems pretty standard from what I've seen. Answer questions on day one, then go silent for a while. They have another livestream on thursday, IIRC, so they will probably make some comments on the *****torm then and that will tell us how they're reacting to it. If they don't comment on the *****torm at all on the livestream, then I'll be worried. But I'm guessing they will at least acknowledge it in passing, even if we don't like what that acknowledgement is. I'm pretty sure that nothing will change. The only thing they have ever shown us consistently is their arrogance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlasmaJohn Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 You're right in that HM+ Ops are not (never?) pugged, ... HM Ops are PUG'd all the time (at least EV and KP) Just not via Group Finder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SplitBolt Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 I believe they are scared of the sh*tstorm they summoned Well they should be rolling into work by next Monday I mean it is months end so you know.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khevar Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 On the other hand, depending on the rate of GXP gain for doing SM ops, if an ops team can plow through a lower level op, one that the "new guy" can do something in instead of hiding in the corner from the mechanics that will flatten his undergeared self, and get a useful amount of GXP from it, that will be a different kettle of fish. Quite true. You've had a number of suggestions which I think are good ideas (such the command gear stash being filled by Character A, but consumed by Character B). I think things like this could mitigate a number of potential flaws in the implementation. I'm willing to wait and see, but I'm sure you can understand that I'm not particularly hopeful. Your ideas sound better than what I believe we're actually going to get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IanArgent Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 HM Ops are PUG'd all the time (at least EV and KP) Just not via Group Finder. I really need to stop saying "pugged" when I mean "pugged via GF." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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