Is this lack of communication normal?

[DarthWoad]

the fact that you think your statements contain fact is also an opinion....to which we will disagree.

 

Well I disagree with you Nova.

 

I completely agree with you, Capt. I'll QFT your post because people need to see it and learn the facts from it:

 

Except, it itsn't.

 

No matter where you stand on what BW is doing, per a good proper running business you are required to have open communication. This isn't the government where they can be silent.

If they want their money to stay running, they have to be open in communication. They have to talk.

 

As for their "metrics" as they have mentioned. They fix their metrics to read how they want to read it. Which is a horribly sad thing to base a game that centers around content for all sorts of people. Because as it is now, they have alienated 3 or more different playing groups. They have even alienated the people who wanted story because the "story" they produced was not at all like previous story telling nor even flowed properly.

 

So yes, say what you want per the "doom & gloom" crowd, BW is killing themselves in the game with their non-existent communication & ignoring of problems.

[DarthSpuds]

I have my doubts about this incident. Also, anyone who ever worked in customer support will have a story or two to tell about upset customers behaving in unacceptable manners. What happens there is that, if the offense is bad enough, that customer is excluded from service. What never happens is that because of one such incident, communication stops.

 

 

^ This.

 

As a general rule a customer would need to be so abusive, or make threats that constitute a criminal offence; at which point said customer's details are handed to the relevant authorities and said customer is denied further service.

 

But communication with the rest of the customer base MUST continue, and continue to be effective.

 

All The Best

[gabigool]

I don't doubt that its possible to track one of these devs down in real life. If they were really scared would they do these cantina tour events. Obviously its the Internet and most people are a lot tougher here then in real life. Its an easy place to make wild comments. I think if you work in this industry you probably have to have some thick skin. That doesn't justify someone making threats about your family especially your wife an kids. I know not many of us would take that too kindly.

That being said. An mmo is going to attract a large number of people. That's the point. On average you're going to come across some unstable people. I don't think its fair to punish the whole community based on the actions of one person

 

I actually think it was a few morons, not just one.

 

The only thing I do not understand is why BW chose to share the incident in the first place.

 

It seems like the sort of thing that you would simply turn over to the police, offer counseling to the employee/family and possibly employee training on PII.

 

It does not seem like something I would broadcast to the community.

 

But let's be honest. Communication was meh before that. To tiptoe around the landmine, the outcry that incident was a part of was not surprising. The insanity of a couple nutjobs was certainly sick/demented/disgusting etc. But the outcry itself was not.

 

And the follow-up was this - no more of this or we won't communicate with you. I dunno, maybe it's happened again and this time they kept it in house. It might explain why we have this inexplicable scenario where we have to infer the future of raid content in an MMO because it's a secret.

 

All I do know is this is the type of business where effective communication can help both sides, and as such more timely, meaningful communication from the studio might help.

[nepochop]

I still don't understand why other MMO's are capable of open communication and SWTOR is not. SWTOR cannot be the only MMO that has crazy people willing to do these sorts of things over a disagreement. What are other MMO community managers(or whatever they're called) doing that allows them to speak so openly...?

 

Yup all this secrecy, lack of communication, lack of balancing, bug fixing, it only increases the chances of such real life issues!

[DarthSpuds]

I actually think it was a few morons, not just one.

 

The only thing I do not understand is why BW chose to share the incident in the first place.

 

It seems like the sort of thing that you would simply turn over to the police, offer counseling to the employee/family and possibly employee training on PII.

 

It does not seem like something I would broadcast to the community.

 

However, you would broadcast it to the community if you were looking for a ready made excuse to cover your decision to not communicate with that community.

 

All The Best

[nepochop]

When he says "bad groups" do you think he means pug groups? Think he's in some gang called the 989 bad group? Sounds scary bro

 

"What are you in for?"

"Computer fraud"

 

Blah, there is no point being serious here with all these kids around.

[AlrikFassbauer]

Blah, there is no point being serious here with all these kids around.

 

Interesting that it is often kidsw who say this. Or are you already listed in the "how old are you" thread ?

[AlrikFassbauer]

I loved playing pinball. I mean, real, with tables. But then, I was a kid and not often had the possibility to do that.

And I do know that song, yes. But I was a kid even then, too.

Edited September 16, 2016 by AlrikFassbauer

[Transcendent]

BUT readin you were taken by your dad to the arcade in 1980 could mean you are now in your 40s?? Kinda old to play such games, hmm?

 

I wonder if you will have that same opinion when you also reach your 40s. I think you're in for a small surprise my young neighbour. I'd like to point out that attitudes like the one you want to portray in this thread are a prime example of why the developers will step back from communication, if you take a step back yourself for a second and read what you've posted and think about it, you would possibly understand why.

 

As a developer, I certainly wouldn't be rushing to communicate with anyone who doesn't communicate in a calm and reasoned manner. Certainly we can all be feisty towards each other, it doesn't really accomplish much by doing so, which you learn with experience and hopefully a little wisdom.

[DarthWoad]

Check the dev tracker. Another 2 days of silence.

[ikinai]

Check the dev tracker. Another 2 days of silence.

 

Words like violence

Break the silence

Come crashing in

Into my little world

Painful to me

Pierce right through me

Can't you understand?

Oh my SWtoR devs

All I ever wanted

All I ever needed

Is responses here in your forums

[FlavivsAetivs]

I would still like a response to my question if they read the GSF forums.

 

~ Eudoxia

[Ybini]

I've been posting for 3 years about my cyborg glitch bug so no surprise here.

[Transcendent]

Words like violence

Break the silence

Come crashing in

Into my little world

Painful to me

Pierce right through me

Can't you understand?

Oh my SWtoR devs

All I ever wanted

All I ever needed

Is responses here in your forums

 

Vows are spoken

To be broken

Feelings are intense

Words are trivial

Pleasures remain

So does the pain

Words are meaningless

And forgettable

All I ever wanted

All I ever needed

Is new ops in your game

[sumquy]

29 pages in 2 days. it is pretty rare to see a forum post blow up like this. probably it has something to do with the fact that the devs chose to comment in this thread, but it seems very clear that a lot of players are unhappy with the lack of content in the communications we have received. personally, i didn't give a crap about kofte and don't give a crap about kotet. if they want to try and keep that info super secret until whenever, again, i don't care. but, using that as an excuse to refuse to talk about anything else is just cowardice.

 

if you look through this thread, people ask about gsf, they ask about pvp, they ask about operations. when a dev bothers to finally make an appearance in the forums, that thread is flooded with people desperate for some kind of feedback to questions that get ignored everywhere else. our community manager, when he even deigns to respond, seems to think that talking at people is the same thing as talking with them, and combines that with the rest of the dev teams absolute refusal to consider anything players have to say.

 

i play a lot of games and have for a very long time (to the poster who thought 40 was kind of old for video games i repeat Transcendent's reply: see how you feel about it when you're 40). the thing that strikes me most, is the sheer disparity between this games forums and any other AAA title. if you go into the forums for other games you see weekly developer blogs , you see community managers answering questions, you see discussions between team members working on specific parts and players trying to help them. most importantly, you see a dev team that wants to engage with their players, instead of treating them like a nuisance. where do you see any of that in swtor.com?

Edited September 16, 2016 by sumquy

[Andryah]

29 pages in 2 days. it is pretty rare to see a forum post blow up like this. probably it has something to do with the fact that the devs chose to comment in this thread, but it seems very clear that a lot of players are unhappy with the lack of content in the communications we have received.

 

Same sort of thing happened last year as well. People know an expac is coming, but not any details, coupled with having burned out on prior expac content = much expressed discontent in the forum... some of it constructive, most of it dosed with hyperbole, demands, and even hollow threats.

 

This will continue, in various forms and topics until the expac actually releases. And what they reveal on 10/7 is only going to make it worse as the arm chair quarterbacks settle in to school them on the errors of their approach.

 

If they continue the chapter based monthly content releases, which some people love and some people hate.... I do expect the demographics of the game to shift over time to where the studio is taking us. Some will leave, others will come and stay, rinse and repeat. Some players will adapt, others will just leave. This is the nature of MMOs these days to be honest.

Edited September 16, 2016 by Andryah

[sumquy]

Same sort of thing happened last year as well. People know an expac is coming, but not any details, coupled with having burned out on prior expac content = much expressed discontent in the forum... some of it constructive, most of it dosed with hyperbole, demands, and even hollow threats.

 

This will continue, in various forms and topics until the expac actually releases. And what they reveal on 10/7 is only going to make it worse as the arm chair quarterbacks settle in to school them on the errors of their approach.

 

If they continue the chapter based monthly content releases, which some people love and some people hate.... I do expect the demographics of the game to shift over time to where the studio is taking us. Some will leave, others will come and stay, rinse and repeat.

 

you're missing my point completely, so let me repeat the pertinent bit: i don't care about kotet or the expansion before it, or the one that comes after it. i don't care if they choose to try and keep it secret. my complaint is the way they use that as an excuse to refuse to talk about anything else. not that they need an excuse, they have shown irrefutably, that they can just ignore the forums as long as they like.

Edited September 16, 2016 by sumquy

[CaptRogue]

Words like violence

Break the silence

Come crashing in

Into my little world

Painful to me

Pierce right through me

Can't you understand?

Oh my SWtoR devs

All I ever wanted

All I ever needed

Is responses here in your forums

 

Vows are spoken

To be broken

Feelings are intense

Words are trivial

Pleasures remain

So does the pain

Words are meaningless

And forgettable

All I ever wanted

All I ever needed

Is new ops in your game

 

Ikinai, Transcendent, you two win the internet today!!

[DarthWoad]

Same sort of thing happened last year as well. People know an expac is coming, but not any details, coupled with having burned out on prior expac content = much expressed discontent in the forum... some of it constructive, most of it dosed with hyperbole, demands, and even hollow threats.

 

This will continue, in various forms and topics until the expac actually releases. And what they reveal on 10/7 is only going to make it worse as the arm chair quarterbacks settle in to school them on the errors of their approach.

 

If they continue the chapter based monthly content releases, which some people love and some people hate.... I do expect the demographics of the game to shift over time to where the studio is taking us. Some will leave, others will come and stay, rinse and repeat. Some players will adapt, others will just leave.

 

Ah the usual stuff from you - it's always the players fault, and the devs can't make everyone happy, that there are more "whiners and angry" people on the forum than constructive arguments....etc etc...yes Andryah you've said it countless times before, we get it, you don't like internet forums.

 

This is the nature of MMOs these days to be honest.

 

Maybe that's because the devs don't listen to what the players want, maybe it's because the content is boring and stale and doesn't appeal to the masses. Considered that maybe?

 

From my deep experience, spending well over 30 years in business management and communications for extremely large businesses (i'm an expert in a lot of things), I've learned a lot and applied my particular set of skills to many aspects of my life. I'm fairly certain, using my wealth of knowledge on this subject, that communication is key to success.

 

Also you forgot to add IMO at the end of your posts.

Edited September 16, 2016 by DarthWoad

[PlasmaJohn]

If you keep stringing them along however with platitudes and vague meaningless spin, they may stay long enough for the expac to drop and then, even if they are annoyed by the changes, they have paid for the expac (so you got some money out of them) and they may stay anyway simply because there is something new to do, even if they are annoyed by the changes. The tricky part is to make sure the "spin" you put out is crafted in such a way as to mollify a majority of players enough so that it is an effective string.

"Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me"

 

Frankly I'm surprised that any serious raiders are left. This will be the third "fool me". I think we're getting into Fifty Shades territory.

[Andryah]

you're missing my point completely, so let me repeat the pertinent bit: i don't give a crap about kotet or the expansion before it, or the one that comes after it. i don't give a crap if they choose to try and keep it secret. my complaint is the way they use that as an excuse to refuse to talk about anything else. not that they need an excuse, they have shown irrefutably, that they can just ignore the forums as long as they like.

 

I understand what you wrote. You are frustrated with their style and manner of communications (or lack there of). Welcome to the club. Pretty sure we all are. It's just that different people handle it in different ways.

 

Now, take the time to understand what I wrote please. The forum gets extremely pissy this time of year, for the reasons I stated, (since they typically announce an expac in summer/fall and release it in fall or winter. Which has nothing to do with ongoing complaints about communications... it just become the horse to beat in order to vent all frustrations about communications.

 

Your complaint appears to be about communications in general.. which has been about what it is for years now. I don't see it changing to be honest. It would be nice if it did, but I doubt it and I certainly would not hold my breath.

Edited September 16, 2016 by Andryah

[PlasmaJohn]

This will continue, in various forms and topics until the expac actually releases. And what they reveal on 10/7 is only going to make it worse as the arm chair quarterbacks settle in to school them on the errors of their approach.

Their designs do tend to feature some rather fundamental and sometimes obvious faults. Had they been more open with their plans prior to release a lot game breaking issues could have been avoided. Assuming they pay attention to the feedback.

 

But of course "dialog" is a dirty word to them.

[sumquy]

Your complaint appears to be about communications in general.. which has been about what it is for years now. I don't see it changing to be honest. It would be nice if it did, but I doubt it and I certainly would not hold my breath.

 

reference the title of this thread. as for the rest, if nobody complains, then nothing changes. maybe nothing will change anyway, but the only way to guarantee that, is to say nothing.

[sumquy]

Their designs do tend to feature some rather fundamental and sometimes obvious faults. Had they been more open with their plans prior to release a lot game breaking issues could have been avoided. Assuming they pay attention to the feedback.

 

But of course "dialog" is a dirty word to them.

 

it's worse than just not sharing their plans, they don't even fix the problems people tell them about. every time a piece of content has gone up on the pts, players have given feedback on bugs and things that weren't working correctly. in every single case, that feedback was ignored and the bugs went to live.

Edited September 16, 2016 by sumquy

[Firolas]

you're missing my point completely, so let me repeat the pertinent bit: i don't give a crap about kotet or the expansion before it, or the one that comes after it. i don't give a crap if they choose to try and keep it secret. my complaint is the way they use that as an excuse to refuse to talk about anything else. not that they need an excuse, they have shown irrefutably, that they can just ignore the forums as long as they like.

 

Sumguy don't waste your time with Andryah.

 

The Devs could take a massive dump on his keyboard and he'd thank them for the pieces of sweetcorn in it.

 

Swtor devs don't communicate here, never really have, never will.

Nothing to do with being close to an expansion release either.

After the expansion is released the communication will not be any better.

White Knights will tell everyone complaining its because its after an expansion or before or its halloween or thanksgiving or xmas or raining out side...there will always be an excuse for Bioware's failures.

 

wait for it......wait.....wait...... IMO

there I wrote it