Choices do matter

[RameiArashi]

I'm tired of people going on and on that choices don't matter when in fact chapter 16 has two different outcomes depending on how you made Koth feel. They put in a choice that matters and some people still complain. And how Senya reacts the next time we meet is surely going to depend on how you reacted to her leaving.

[Lightbanee]

I'm tired of people going on and on that choices don't matter when in fact chapter 16 has two different outcomes depending on how you made Koth feel. They put in a choice that matters and some people still complain. And how Senya reacts the next time we meet is surely going to depend on how you reacted to her leaving.

 

Intelligence matters too, these whiners are not able to comprehend the full picture of the story and the obvious development limitations.

[SFDebris]

"Choice matters" implies:

You do A, one thing happens

You do B, something else happens

 

What we had was:

You do A, status quo is maintained

You do B, status quo is maintained, except we'll also punish you for choosing wrong

 

Choice matters would have been:

You do A, Arcann is stronger, but your Alliance is intact

You do B, Arcann is weakened, but your Alliance is fractured

 

Since your choices have no effect on the war whatsoever, the game is no longer Star Wars, it's a peer group simulator - upset the wrong person and they'll, like, totally blow this party, what-ever! That Outlander is, like, so not our leader any more.

[Mowermanx]

When talking about the general population in regards to depth in stories, Marin Scorsese got it right when he said, "The average movie goer just won't get it!"

Technically, your character is the biggest threat to the galaxy, harbouring the planet munching monster and the whole galaxy should be united in putting you down, but eh, what are you to do?

[Theradonh]

I'm tired of people going on and on that choices don't matter when in fact chapter 16 has two different outcomes depending on how you made Koth feel. They put in a choice that matters and some people still complain. And how Senya reacts the next time we meet is surely going to depend on how you reacted to her leaving.

 

The choices you made just don't have this huge impact on the story as they said before.

 

In Mass Effect you could literally loose the whole galaxy (ofc you can't do something like that in a MP) in SWTOR Senya maybe say a diffrent sentence and koth can leave the party . But we will see. Maybe the choices you made in S1 will have an impact in S2 but for now your choices are completely irrelevant.

Edited August 14, 2016 by Theradonh

[Bobs_YourUncle]

"Choice matters" implies:

You do A, one thing happens

You do B, something else happens

 

What we had was:

You do A, status quo is maintained

You do B, status quo is maintained, except we'll also punish you for choosing wrong

 

Choice matters would have been:

You do A, Arcann is stronger, but your Alliance is intact

You do B, Arcann is weakened, but your Alliance is fractured

 

Since your choices have no effect on the war whatsoever, the game is no longer Star Wars, it's a peer group simulator - upset the wrong person and they'll, like, totally blow this party, what-ever! That Outlander is, like, so not our leader any more.

 

So you agree they mattered some what? I agree though, it would have been nice if they mattered more.

[Shwarzchild]

I think people were expecting the choices matter statement about KOTFE to mean that more than one choice will matter in the finale of season 1. It seems that the only choice to have an effect was with Koth.

[SFDebris]

So you agree they mattered some what?

In much the same way that red, green, or blue light at the end of Mass Effect 3 meant your choice mattered: they are technically different but not in any substantive sense at all. And if the best example that anyone can come up with about choice mattering in a game about a galaxy-scale war is that you can disappoint someone, well, that's not much of a rallying cry. "Play Knights of the Fallen Empire, our thrilling Disappointment SimulatorTM! See if you can remember who gets the skinny latte, because the fate of the galaxy is in your hands!"

[ZanyaCross]

....

 

Wow, you couldn't even come up with an original name?

[SFDebris]

Wow, you couldn't even come up with an original name?

 

?????

 

Edit:

Are you accusing me of not being me? If so, that really just puts the finishing touch on an already terrible week.

Edited August 14, 2016 by SFDebris

[Theradonh]

In much the same way that red, green, or blue light at the end of Mass Effect 3 meant your choice mattered: they are technically different but not in any substantive sense at all.

 

Well in ME you can have a really bad blue endling or a really good blue ending. It depends on your military power and the military power depends on the choices you made. For example: If you killed wrex you cant lie to the krogan. if you didnt save the admiral you cant get geth & quarianer etc etc.

[Rolodome]

I don't think anyone is denying

 

the Koth betrayal being somewhat of a meaningful choice. But that's ONE choice that is a side plot and has nothing to do with the main story, nor has any kind of noticeable impact on the main story.

 

When people talk about wanting choices, I'm pretty sure they mean that they want their choices to have some kind of impact on the MAIN STORY in a noticeable way.

 

And more than that, they just want quantity. They want more than one little choice that gives a couple of slightly different, budget-saving cutscenes.

 

There are many moments for me in the class stories where there's a choice that doesn't exactly change the plot itself, but it does pay off in a noticeable way and it feels like it matters somehow. It would seem that with KOTFE, they more or less got too ambitious (and/or overthought the whole process) with trying to make choices matter and forgot that the primary success of a meaningful choice is whether it feels like it matters. Mechanics have got nothing on emotion in storytelling.

 

I think part of where they are tripping themselves up is not wanting to leave things open-ended. In the class stories, many of the moments that I felt mattered somehow were a sort of "left unfinished" kind of story thread. For instance:

 

Sparing Praven in the JK storyline. You can get the mail from him, indicating that he's changed his mind about things and changed his ways. And IIRC, he even shows up later, near the end of the story, to help you out. It's implied (doesn't need to be explicitly shown) that he's basically become a Jedi.

 

Versus just killing him. I've not completed a full DS JK playthrough, but I imagine you don't see him again... cause he's dead lol.

 

That's a meaningful choice to me. And it's also really really simple and didn't require a lot of assets to do.

 

 

 

 

[merovejec]

I'm tired of people going on and on that choices don't matter when in fact chapter 16 has two different outcomes depending on how you made Koth feel. They put in a choice that matters and some people still complain. And how Senya reacts the next time we meet is surely going to depend on how you reacted to her leaving.

 

It wont matter, just like those zakuul knights at the start of KOTFE, you could let Lana kill one or not, however when you met them again still, one of them died either by Lanas hand or they killed him for failing. Nothing changed, just gibberish.

[Haruen]

I'm tired of people going on and on that choices don't matter when in fact chapter 16 has two different outcomes depending on how you made Koth feel. They put in a choice that matters and some people still complain. And how Senya reacts the next time we meet is surely going to depend on how you reacted to her leaving.

 

Sure.

 

But Koth wasn't the main storyline. Koth and I had no problems all along, so it never felt like a choice had been made. Twice I chose to kill Arcann. Both times he gets away. Pretty clearly, a choice that seemed fully within my character's ability to effect, didn't matter.

[tattoohero]

Intelligence matters too, these whiners are not able to comprehend the full picture of the story and the obvious development limitations.

 

Saying over and over and over and over again choices matter. Choices didn't matter and what we do going forward won't either.

 

Let me explain why. Koth took the Groystone if you allowed Kaliyo do her thing in Chapter X, do you honestly think he won't be there when the big battle happens and the Greystone is needed? If Koth does show up to aid the Alliance, does it really matter that he took it? The ship is still part of the fight? Which will prove again, choice doesn't matter.

 

One choice out of 15 chapters doesn't remotely satisfy the choices matter hype they have been promoting for about a year now and they'll continue to promote for the next year.

 

No matter how cooperative you were to SCORPIO, she betrays you. No matter what you wanted to happen to Arcann, Mommy saved him and took off. No matter what you do, Senya betrays you.

 

Koth taking the Greystone happens at the END of the chapter, which doesn't affect anything in the chapter. So no choice made had any consequences in chapter 16, NONE.

 

To say as so is the one being ignorant and lacking intelligence.

Edited August 14, 2016 by tattoohero

[DarthSpuds]

I'm tired of people going on and on that choices don't matter when in fact chapter 16 has two different outcomes depending on how you made Koth feel. They put in a choice that matters and some people still complain. And how Senya reacts the next time we meet is surely going to depend on how you reacted to her leaving.

 

So out of ALL the dialogue and acton choices we had throughout the entirety of KotFE because 2 choices made a different to the end-point then choices actually matter?

 

There's 16 chapters, let's say that on average we make 6 choices per chapter - or 96 choices. 2 of them matter.

 

That would mean that throughout KotFE 2.08% of our choices mattered.

Or to put it another way 97.92% of our choices DIDN'T matter.

 

Not the most convincing or arguments you have there, is it?

 

All The Best

[icemoneyboi]

Spoiler Alert:

 

There was one or two big choices like when you got to execute Kaliyo.

 

But the disappointing thing is all along we have been told, "Your decision will be remembered" like it really mattered. However as far as the main plot nothing you have done so far has had the slightest influence with the one exception that everyone keeps pointing to of Koth who would probably just scrape into the top 10 most important characters in this story.

 

How has any choice that you have made so far affected Valkorion, Arcann, Vaylin, SCORPIO, Lana, Theran or Heskal in any way at all?

 

And please don't say it is coming in episond 147, in 6 years time there will be a big reveal and something you did in episode 2 will be critical. After a full season, 16 episodes there was nothing.

 

Don't get me wrong, I like the story, it is interesting, I just wish it was more like a RPG and less like watching a movie where it is all laid out for you and you are just along for the ride.

[DarkSaberMaster]

So out of ALL the dialogue and acton choices we had throughout the entirety of KotFE because 2 choices made a different to the end-point then choices actually matter?

 

There's 16 chapters, let's say that on average we make 6 choices per chapter - or 96 choices. 2 of them matter.

 

That would mean that throughout KotFE 2.08% of our choices mattered.

Or to put it another way 97.92% of our choices DIDN'T matter.

 

Not the most convincing or arguments you have there, is it?

 

All The Best

 

QFE. The fact that some people don't get this shows me who the truly ignorant are.

[Elracor]

I'm tired of people going on and on that choices don't matter when in fact chapter 16 has two different outcomes depending on how you made Koth feel. They put in a choice that matters and some people still complain. And how Senya reacts the next time we meet is surely going to depend on how you reacted to her leaving.

 

There's absolutely zero proof that this choice will matter. KOTET can render the choice irrelevant by something like:

A) Someone(Theron?) steals back the ship for those who lost the ship

B) Those who kept Koth and the ship lose it through some other event

C) The ship becomes entirely irrelevant for KOTET

 

Any of these could easily happen, and has happened before with other choices we made through KOTFE.

Edited August 14, 2016 by MFollin

[BorisKarloffe]

Intelligence matters too, these whiners are not able to comprehend the full picture of the story and the obvious development limitations.

 

And apparently you can't comprehend the huge bait and switch Bioware just fed you.

 

After 9 chapters: ppl complain choices don't matter, Bioware and their defenders: "Don't worry, later in the season stuff will change"

After all 16 chapters: ppl complain choices still haven't mattered at all, Bioware and their defenders: " But guys, next season you'll see bla bla bla".

 

What will your excuse be for them after next season?

[ludoviccb]

There's absolutely zero proof that this choice will matter. KOTET can render the choice irrelevant by something like:

A) Someone(Theron?) steals back the ship for those who lost the ship

B) Those who kept Koth and the ship lose it through some other event

C) The ship becomes entirely irrelevant for KOTET

 

Any of these could easily happen, and has happened before with other choices we made through KOTFE.

 

I would have instead HK-51 and HK-55 hidden in the ship as a security mesure. When they activate, since you didn't send an all clear message, they clean up the ship of anything alive that isn't on your to survive list with cleaning product as they did before then bring the ship back. That could be HK chapter, The Great Cleaning.

[Bobs_YourUncle]

And apparently you can't comprehend the huge bait and switch Bioware just fed you.

 

After 9 chapters: ppl complain choices don't matter, Bioware and their defenders: "Don't worry, later in the season stuff will change"

After all 16 chapters: ppl complain choices still haven't mattered at all, Bioware and their defenders: " But guys, next season you'll see bla bla bla".

 

What will your excuse be for them after next season?

 

They made changes to the experience. Plain and simple. To say they did not matter at all is just incorrect.

[Audoucet]

I think that the BIGGEST mockery of a choice was, to kneel, or not to kneel.

 

I was so happy, when I thought that I actually COULD, kneel in front of the bad guy, with my Wrath. Well... He didn't even seem to remember it. He even went to the point of accusing me of "resisting him". Even though I literally NEVER said no to him. I mean, even on Ziost, I told him that I still wanted to serve him even if he killed everybody.

[Audoucet]

They made changes to the experience. Plain and simple. To say they did not matter at all is just incorrect.

 

The fact is, we don't really care about what you think is incorrect, do we ?

 

The hard cold fact is, we think they didn't matter, and we are not happy.and we will not once again subscribe for an entire year. We will wait for September 2017, and do all KOTEE in one month.

 

And you know who will be the loser ? The game. Because it needs subs. If you think that hard fans will save the game, look at the fabulous destiny of Pathfinder Online.

 

You are happy with the game, that's great for you, and you are not WRONG. It's not about being right wrong. It's about enjoying the experience.

 

Chapters 14 & 15 were ok. But in the end, a vast part of us, are disappointed by the experience, because of the lack of meaningful choices and consequences.

[BorisKarloffe]

They made changes to the experience. Plain and simple. To say they did not matter at all is just incorrect.

 

You're claiming they made changes to the experience of 10-16 or that you're counting on things being different next season?