what was stopping people from just, getting slicing?

[acheros]

The reason why people aren't getting slicing is because they feel the need to be self-sufficient in their own professions. You could "just make an alt" but that would be a PITA just for that one thing.

 

So instead they demanded it nerfed to force their views on others?

 

Hey! next we can stop gay marriage and pass anti-abortion laws!

[FSEric]

To be an effective crafter, you need the craft skill/gathering skill/mission skill.

 

Without mission skill you're just making greens.

 

 

I didn't have a problem with slicing, seeings how worthless money is, Everyone makes tons of money (even without slicing) yet mats on the market are usually on sale for less than the price to vender them (seriously, check).

 

If anything slicing was helping the economy, since people who had that would have to buy mats from people who had mission skills (since that is likely the one they dropped), without slicing being viable everyone gets their mission skill and no crafting supplies get sold on market.

[DJIzzy]

So instead they demanded it nerfed to force their views on others?

 

Hey! next we can stop gay marriage and pass anti-abortion laws!

 

But hey, it's fine if we force people to drop their crafting-related gathering profs for a credit-gathering prof just so that they *CAN* be self-sufficient, right?

 

To even suggest that slicing funds the game's economy is to implicitly state that slicing was the only crew skill that made any kind of decent money. If this is the case, not only was slicing way overpowered, but then everything else was far too weak.

 

You can't have it both ways; either slicing was a no-brainer and therefore unbalanced, or they gave us 3 crew skills to be used as follows: craft, gather, slicing.

[acheros]

But hey, it's fine if we force people to drop their crafting-related gathering profs for a credit-gathering prof just so that they *CAN* be self-sufficient, right?

 

To even suggest that slicing funds the game's economy is to implicitly state that slicing was the only crew skill that made any kind of decent money. If this is the case, not only was slicing way overpowered, but then everything else was far too weak.

 

You can't have it both ways; either slicing was a no-brainer and therefore unbalanced, or they gave us 3 crew skills to be used as follows: craft, gather, slicing.

 

No one -forced- them to drop it to be self sufficient, but nothing stopped them from picking it up if they so chose. You could easily just pick up a crafting, a mission, and a gathering skill and do everything yourself. IF YOU WANTED. Or you could pick up crafting and buy from other people.

 

I'm not "even suggesting" that slicing funded the games economy, not wholly. that would be absolutely ludicrous and i'd have to be either insane, an idiot, have no idea how economics works on even a basic level, or some combination there of.

 

HOWEVER, it was more money to put into the economy, thus helping it thrive. This is how it works now. Slicing is useless for making money, which gives people less money, which means less to spend on the GTN, which means less money everyone else makes.

[Msbungle]

I'm thinking it really hard to believe that people actually thought that gaining (a lot of) money while afking on their ship by pressing a button and pressing another one after a couple of minutes was totally good design and didn't warrant a nerf.

 

You make the assumption that everyone was playing this way.

 

So you have an issue with people making money while they are not actively playing? Then they should also close down the DTN.

[RamzaBehoulve]

Seriously? Stop arguing. Slicing was BROKEN for lvl 1-25 characters past 300 skill. The amount of money you were getting was far above what you should normally get. You were making as much and some lucky ones even more money than the best crafters and market manipulators for just clicking on a mission once every 30-50 min. Edited December 28, 2011 by RamzaBehoulve

[Styngray]

No one -forced- them to drop it to be self sufficient, but nothing stopped them from picking it up if they so chose. You could easily just pick up a crafting, a mission, and a gathering skill and do everything yourself. IF YOU WANTED. Or you could pick up crafting and buy from other people.

 

I'm not "even suggesting" that slicing funded the games economy, not wholly. that would be absolutely ludicrous and i'd have to be either insane, an idiot, have no idea how economics works on even a basic level, or some combination there of.

 

HOWEVER, it was more money to put into the economy, thus helping it thrive. This is how it works now. Slicing is useless for making money, which gives people less money, which means less to spend on the GTN, which means less money everyone else makes.

 

Flooding the market with more money does not make it a good thing. If thats the case why dont we just print more money? because it makes it useless. How much would McDonalds charge for a happy meal if everyone in the world was millionares?

[Balinoar]

Then you're extremely unlucky. Boxes on the field of Nar Shadda still frequently drop over 1000 credits, and it's nowhere near 400 skill level.

 

Nope, I have 400 slicing and hung around Nar Shadda for about an hour last night gather lockboxes and never did I once get a box worth over 500 credits.

 

Maybe this was the way of things in the past but not post nerf.

[islander]

To be an effective crafter, you need the craft skill/gathering skill/mission skill.

 

Without mission skill you're just making greens.

 

 

Yeah, something I really don't like about the system. Ultimately, your 'choice' of skills is limited. You either craft - and get pigeon holed into two other professions you may not want - or you don't craft, and just pick whatever gathering/mission you want.

 

I understand taking a gathering skill that helps you craft, but forcing a mission skill too is pretty lame to me.

Edited December 28, 2011 by islander

[Balinoar]

Flooding the market with more money does not make it a good thing. If thats the case why dont we just print more money? because it makes it useless. How much would McDonalds charge for a happy meal if everyone in the world was millionares?

 

No this is a game and the economy in its present state doesn't make sense, slicing is not the problem.

 

ladies and gentlemen of this supposed forum, I have one final thing I want you to consider. Ladies and gentlemen, this is Chewbacca. Chewbacca is a Wookiee from the planet Kashyyyk. But Chewbacca lives on the planet Endor. Now think about it; that does not make sense!

 

Why would a Wookiee, an 8-foot-tall Wookiee, want to live on Endor, with a bunch of 2-foot-tall Ewoks? That does not make sense! But more important, you have to ask yourself: What does this have to do with this nerf? Nothing. Ladies and gentlemen, it has nothing to do with this nerf! It does not make sense! Look at me. I'm a player defending a major crafting nerf, and I'm talkin' about Chewbacca! Does that make sense? Ladies and gentlemen, I am not making any sense! None of this makes sense! And so you have to remember, when you're in this forum deliberatin' and conjugatin' the Emancipation Proclamation, does it make sense? No! Ladies and gentlemen of this supposed forum, it does not make sense! If Chewbacca lives on Endor, you must un-nerf! The defense rests.

Edited December 28, 2011 by Balinoar

[Cameirus]

Seriously? Stop arguing. Slicing was BROKEN for lvl 1-25 characters past 300 skill. The amount of money you were getting was far above what you should normally get. You were making as much and some lucky ones even more money than the best crafters and market manipulators for just clicking on a mission once every 30-50 min.

 

So?

 

 

Its too early to make that kind of judgement on the economy.

 

 

AS the economy picks up, the slicers start buying the crafter goods and mats, raising the prices of the crafters and gatherers.....

 

 

And what stops you making a slicing alt.

 

 

BW had a knee jerk reaction to qq on teh forums. All that tells me is:

 

1. They give in to qq, so thats a great way to run an mmo, as there is never much of that...

 

and

 

2. They have not got a *********** clue what they are doing, or where they are going. It was like this in beta, so if it was wrong why did it make it into live only to get nerfed this soon?

[Niyenna]

Flooding the market with more money does not make it a good thing. If thats the case why dont we just print more money? because it makes it useless. How much would McDonalds charge for a happy meal if everyone in the world was millionares?

 

This.

[Belkiratwo]

Simple question i really don't understand the answer too.

 

You're given three skills. Only one -could- be a crafting, but it didn't need to be. there were crafting skills, gathering to get mats for crafting, and mission skills.

 

I never really got the point of most mission skills, but thats beside the point.

 

What was stopping anyone from just dropping a profession, getting slicing, and using the "**** its sooo op" money to fund their crafting?

 

 

 

This is exactly what i did.

 

Right now I have 276k credits, so many crafting mats for cybertech to keep me in epic mods all the way to 50 and basically no need for slicing anymore.

 

Slicing nerf? oh well i'll just drop and go back to a gathering professions I don't need since I've already bought all the mats I do.

[Cryowolf]

Why didn't they just nerf the mid range of mission lockboxes (which were certailnly OP) and then put a level cap on all crew skills, such as:

 

Character level 1-20 allows a crew skill to be leveled to 100.

21-30 allows up to 200.

31-40 allows up to 300.

41-50 allows up to 400 in any chosen crew skill.

 

I was baffled when I found out I could just keep leveling slicing all the way up to 400, which I achieved at character level 23. I'm sure others had this at a lower level or even leveled alts until getting their ship just so they could send two companions on slicing missions.

 

Or if that idea is somehow flawed and crappy... Then this could be implemented.

 

At **max level** (400) the lockbox missions should either:

 

a. Break even (roughly) on white boxes with the chance to get more with green/blue boxes and schematics/crafting missions and with no chance to fail (you are a master of this crew skill!).

 

Or

 

b. Lockbox missions are not even available for the 49-50 bracket and just missions that return schematics/crafting missions and augments.

[Toggles]

Because they rather go mindlessly farm mobs to get credits and waste their time instead of doing something useful/fun/productive while their unused companions go do the mindless for them.

 

-.-;

 

 

Like I said in many posts yesterday, only the mindless lazy man wins with this nerf. Which makes sense if you think about it. Instead of playing the game and enjoying it, they were sitting on the forums complaining. Heck, I'm only being so active right now because I want to contribute to the undoing of the damage these dolts created.

Edited December 28, 2011 by Toggles

[Belkiratwo]

The reason people believe that slicing is broken is that the amount of money it generated at this point in time far exceeded the amount that could be generated with other professions.

 

 

At the start of the game the only way for money to enter the economy is through questing, vendoring items and slicing. The GTN will be virtually empty and there just doesn't exist a ton of available cash stimulate an economy similar to that of WoW which is well established.

 

 

Over time, as more money is introduced into the economy you start to see inflation of the price of goods. This means that those crafting items you're currently selling for 350-500 credits will start to sell for more and more. This has already started to happen as the epic crafting materials on my server were selling for 250-400cr the first week and are now over 1500-2500 each and have been consistently for the last several days.

 

 

Basically if you had just left crafting alone it would have killed itself anyways. Now what happens is you have a ton of people that chose to slice that are going to have a massive headstart in terms of credits and materials.

[Machazareel]

Then you're extremely unlucky. Boxes on the field of Nar Shadda still frequently drop over 1000 credits, and it's nowhere near 400 skill level.

 

Why do people try to lie about stuff that's so easily refuted? It's like telling everyone the sky is orange when all they have to do is look out the window to see it's blue.

Edited December 28, 2011 by Machazareel

[Styngray]

No this is a game and the economy in its present state doesn't make sense, slicing is not the problem.

 

Ill only quote this the rest was just a lame attempt to hide the facts of the very basic fundamentals of economics behind the fact this is a game.

 

Any market real or fiction must adhere to basic economics. True player based economies are generally the best even the chinese figured this out and look at how they are doing. Flooding the market only means credits will be worth less, its called inflation. Opec restricts oil production why? The more oil they produce the less value they get for it. If everyone in the game had 20 million extra credits your credits would be worth 1 million.

 

Is slicing the biggest problem with the skill system or crafting in general? NO its not, but it is part of the problem.

 

For crafting to be viable they need to do away with loot items (at least the loot/vendor items that beats what can be crafted) and go with loot mods. Make each item have a slow decay so you will need to replace equipment every now and then (nothing drastic), make the mods savagable but have a slower decay (even makes Raiding more needed).

Edited December 28, 2011 by Styngray

[Belkiratwo]

Basically if slicing was left alone it would have fixed itself.

 

Why spend 2k to send a companion out 30 min for 4k profit when thanks to inflation that level 200 underground metal now sells for 8k.

 

Inflations, higher returns on vendor trash at higher levels, more rewards from questing at later levels, these all would balance out the early advantage of slicing.

 

Is 400 slicing ridiculously overpowered at level 20 for generating money? yep.

 

Is it at level 40? 50? not so much.

[Repefe]

Is it at level 40? 50? not so much.

Make character level affect the available missions ... would be good way to go around this.

[ImperiumAlpha]

Then you're extremely unlucky. Boxes on the field of Nar Shadda still frequently drop over 1000 credits, and it's nowhere near 400 skill level.

 

Thats fake. I've test nar shadda and most drop are between 200 and 500 Credit average. More is only pure luck. (I'm level 400 by the way).

[freepy]

I still manage to make 50k+ an hour with slicing. I just have to do the work manually instead of sending my companions on missions. It doesn't allow for questing/leveling while making money like pre-nerf but it can still make you money. I just collect slicing boxes that drop 1100-2000 per box. It's time consuming but building a little bank roll now is nice.

[Amadox]

I'm thinking it really hard to believe that people actually thought that gaining (a lot of) money while afking on their ship by pressing a button and pressing another one after a couple of minutes was totally good design and didn't warrant a nerf.

 

i find it hard to believe that you think whatever gathering skill you have is something completely different. while those others might not generate instant cash like slicing did, they are by no means less profitable than slicing was, and they definitly do not make you a loss like slicing does now. considering the prices of the higher Mats on the Market (that i NEED to buy to advance in cybertech, thus giving you the money to advance in whatever you do), slicing wasn't very profitable at all. its benefit was that you got that money instantly and didn't have to put up with the market at first. low to no benefit if you ask me, as i on the other hand need that same market to get my mats for crafting, those mats that you can easily farm yourself.

 

the problem with slicing was: it created fast and easy money for the EARLY game, which we all were in, so it seemed op. for the higher levels, du to drastically rising costs but only slightly rising slicing income, that wasn't true anymore at all. additionally, questing and pvp earns you far more credits on high level than slicing did.

 

i do agree in one point: some low level missions yielded to much simply due to the fact that they take far less time than the higher ones. those guys bragging they made millions where those abusing this fact, mostly with several alts at once leaving them no time to do anything else i guess. that needed to be addressed, fixing that would have been perfectly okay. but that they now nerfed ALL slicing missions so hard, that 9 out of 10 tries its a loss is insane.

 

only thing keeping me at slicing for now is the hope that they might nerf the nerf, and that augments might be more valuable later on - for now, the early days of the game, they are more than useless.

[Idaho-D]

Because Slicing is the least productive skill. I've done Slicing missions to 170 and just gotten a few Enhancements I could have bought for 300 credits.

 

My wish is that Devs would fix Slicing to make it of value even if it returns no credits at all. Make it return valuable items.

[acheros]

Because Slicing is the least productive skill. I've done Slicing missions to 170 and just gotten a few Enhancements I could have bought for 300 credits.

 

My wish is that Devs would fix Slicing to make it of value even if it returns no credits at all. Make it return valuable items.

 

you must of gotten it post nerf, let me explain.

 

pre nerf, everyone was complaining about it being over powered.

 

If it was over powered like everyone said..I don't believe it was., why not just take it up?