The game has been dumbed down TOO far - The thoughts of a returning founder..

[monkeydud]

I have played this game since launch day on and off and have recently resubbed as I wanted to see the new KoTFE content. I figured it would be as close as I was ever going to get to KOTOR 3 and have been back 3 weeks after roughly 18 months away.

 

I realize that there have been a lot of quality of life changes such as being able to hand in missions without having to go to a terminal, multi role companions etc. However having given it some thought the game only appears to be the one I loved and knew on the surface. Sure multi role companions are all fine and dandy. But now I keep thinking to myself that they are all just walking, talking clones of each other. They spit out the same phrases pretty much when healing ("You'll be alright !!!" shouts Kira/Doc/Scourge in a desperate voice when I have the teeniest flesh wound).

 

Thinking back however I managed perfectly fine for nigh on 5 yrs with the companions I was supplied with for each class. Has there been some mass wave of players all dying every 15 seconds that prompted the developers to say `Gosh we must make all the companions multi role before the player base utterly deserts the game`? I truly don`t understand the need to do this. The only answer I have is that they are pandering to the lowest common denominator which is a trend I deplore in gaming.

 

I feel that the *cough* `Tactical` *cough* Flashpoints are a horrendous mistake. Once upon a time these were level gated and gradually introduced different boss patterns, fight mechanics and required better and better teamwork between the trinity (Tank,DPS, Healer). Once you started to hit mid 30's you had been given plenty of practice in your given class and could carry on learning about it as you got to even tougher content and they were good training grounds for what is required in Operations.

 

Now though sub 65 you can pretty much spank and tank from start to finish and if you are required to think its content is `Where is the nearest Kolto Station?` Press button... insta group heal, repeat to fade. Now you too can `rolfstomp` every Flashpoint all the way up to level 65 regardless of class, gear, specs or indeed much thought. Presenting the worst idea in an MMO ever Level 65 Bolster ! The great leveller.. hooray??

 

Now that's all fine and dandy, now everyone regardless of skill can all kill the nasty 'ol monsters together. Yay for not being killjoys and making you well, you know practice or anything. Then we hit Level 65... wups no more Kolto stations, suddenly you have to actually (shh) know how to play your class.

 

Joins first HM 65 False Emperor. Commando is listed as `healer`. Not one heal, nada, zip, not even sure they healed themselves. We get to miniboss... not even a bandaid. Everyone shockingly dies. Healer ragequits for being told to heal, tank follows, then the DPS leaving me all alone. Whee !

 

Chalks it up to the gods of PUGs....

 

Joins second HM FP. I say to the `Tank` after you Mr Tank. He quits. Then the DPS quits. We relist for replacements. Ok another `Tank` and a DPS. I CC the big droid so we can leave him until last. Three Guesses who the Tank goes for..

 

I say four times `please don't wake up anything that is CCd, look I will even put a huge great flame marker on anything I am going to put out of the fight temporarily` Thankfully the Tank listens on the fifth time. SO the DPS runs near it and spams loads of AOE attacks. Whee !

 

Last, but by no means least we get to a mini boss. Pop Quiz for you. When the healer says `don't stand in the red circles or the indicators when hes charging up a blast attack` do they A. Listen B. Hear `blah, blah, wibbet, squeeble,`?

 

Tactical Flashpoints.. training a whole generation of clueless characters. Go Progress !

[xordevoreaux]

So sorry you're burdened with having to train clueless players. Perhaps, since no one's twisting your arm to play, you might venture out and find a game without so many clueless players, perhaps you'll have more fun.

[Tsillah]

Actually you've made quite a few false assumptions, let me address a couple of them.

 

The reason that companions can now select all roles is because people wanted to play with their favourite companions more, not so much because of the difficulty of the game. If you play a marauder and want to level with Jaesa, you'll be dual dps'ing which is not ideal. If you're a sin tank and you think Khem Val is awesome as a companion...well dual tanking is rather boring. As usual BW has a bit of an all or nothing approach so instead of looking at what would make sense per class and companion they just went one size fits all. Considering that some classes got a heal companion first and others not till higher levels has always been an odd thing to me.

 

 

The tactical flashpoints are an interesting topic. They are actually often harder to complete if you don't have a tank and healer in the group. I find this somewhat ironic because being able to go in with 4 dps was the point of having the tacticals in the first place. But because of them being too hard for many when it's a group of dps it actually causes people to quit doing them so it's counterproductive but not because they are dumbed down because especially the higher level ones are actually hard to do as a group of dps (by comparison) and people do die a lot if they don't have a tank, 2 dps and a heal configuration. Funny that.

 

And to be honest, idiot pugs in operations were there in the first year of the game as well. I will say though I did prefer the difficulty of the story bosses originally myself, but clearly a lot of players today just want to play the story and not have much of a challenge. Paying customers you see.

 

Personally I would prefer that BW would do something for level 50+ characters where they have to learn about things like taunting, interrupts, walking out of circles and cleansing before being allowed in operations, but that's just me I guess.

[HuaRya]

I've played since launch as well. Never really leaving for any longer than a month. Last night I decided to level up another Vanguard and was overjoyed with the ability to solo Heroics on the world I was leveling on. I remember a time when I was so poor leveling up that I couldn't even afford a speeder ride to the next transit point.

 

I have toons in conquest guilds where I only PVP with them. Other toons are in guilds that only do HM progression. Currently, what I'm really enjoying is leveling a new toon for the shear entertainment of the story plot. All of these toons are on different servers. Leveling isn't expensive like it used to be. I applaud not having to buy gear for my companions but instead give them gifts to hit that 21 level affection where they become better healers.

 

You can complain but for anyone who likes to do a wide variety of things or is new to the game they are having a great time. There are plenty of other Korean style mmo's where you spend a week making a pot of tea but this one moves me along it's rails at just the kind of pace I'm looking for.

[Andryah]

Actually you've made quite a few false assumptions, let me address a couple of them.

 

The reason that companions can now select all roles is because people wanted to play with their favourite companions more, not so much because of the difficulty of the game. If you play a marauder and want to level with Jaesa, you'll be dual dps'ing which is not ideal. If you're a sin tank and you think Khem Val is awesome as a companion...well dual tanking is rather boring. As usual BW has a bit of an all or nothing approach so instead of looking at what would make sense per class and companion they just went one size fits all. Considering that some classes got a heal companion first and others not till higher levels has always been an odd thing to me.

 

 

The tactical flashpoints are an interesting topic. They are actually often harder to complete if you don't have a tank and healer in the group. I find this somewhat ironic because being able to go in with 4 dps was the point of having the tacticals in the first place. But because of them being too hard for many when it's a group of dps it actually causes people to quit doing them so it's counterproductive but not because they are dumbed down because especially the higher level ones are actually hard to do as a group of dps (by comparison) and people do die a lot if they don't have a tank, 2 dps and a heal configuration. Funny that.

 

And to be honest, idiot pugs in operations were there in the first year of the game as well. I will say though I did prefer the difficulty of the story bosses originally myself, but clearly a lot of players today just want to play the story and not have much of a challenge. Paying customers you see.

 

Personally I would prefer that BW would do something for level 50+ characters where they have to learn about things like taunting, interrupts, walking out of circles and cleansing before being allowed in operations, but that's just me I guess.

 

^^ Extremely well expressed, and spot on IMO, Tsillah.

[ShadessaWayland]

yep 4 dps in a TFP i asking for trouble

 

or you have a good party and no1 listen is trouble again -.-

 

i think the DEV must think of a way to make it understand beter how FP works

but not make it easy but show them some info or so for the first time

 

like manaan it can be for new players very very hard to do like the second boss

he can kill the party in no time and you stile dont no what to do

 

even if i say don't stand in the water on the ground when he summon the lighting storm move far away

but sadly no1 listen QQ

 

so how can we make TFP more beter for new players and if so how can they undertand it ??

[Rabenschwinge]

IMHO... tactical flashpoints without a level 65 to carry everyone through are actually harder than hard mode flashpoints, assuming that everyone is actually level 65.

 

I painfully remember an attempt on the tactical Maelstrom prison with a group of level 22 - 47 player characters. Three damage dealers and one healer (the level 22 one). We struggled all our way through the prison to Kilran, skipped the bonus boss (no healing terminal, takes him three seconds to kill any one of us). The reason why this stuck in my memory is because the group was really good. When we wiped we discussed the problem, changed our tactics and everyone followed through with the plan. You could see by the way they moved that everyone knew and understood their character. We worked out aggro rotations due the lack of a tank and things like that, it was a good team.

 

But fighting Kilran... once we managed to beat him down to the last stage... but it was just not possible. We gave up when it turned out that summoning a repair droid, even outside of the room where he stands causes aggro after certainly ten wipes. Trying to vary our behaviour slightly, on every turn. For two of us a single one snipe was instant death, even at full health. Penetrating blasts (which cannot be interrupted by cutting the line of sight once it starts) took two thirds of my health.

 

Part of the problem is how bolster works. a) It emphasizes being undergeared and with the normal leveling stuff it's not uncommened for a player to be severly undergeared, because in the normal story gear hardly matters. b) You become weaker if you gain a level during a flashpoint, because the factor by which your gear is boosted decreases.

On top of that healing terminals are often positioned in a place where you WILL be pushed off a ledge when you click them (Blood Island, the central platform), or you are slowed and there is just no way to reach them in time in certain phases of the fight. The absence of balanced groups in a game that was specifically designed as a triad game is not exactly helpful either.

 

On the other hand, if you have a level 65 in a tactical they can carry the group through easily. I absolutely love it when I have a 65 and someone rage-quits. Then I just pull my companion, which, despite its lack of tactics, performs a whole lot better than a low level player possibly could, no matter how good they think they are. I just need to set them briefly to passive to position them every now and then.

 

In hard mode flashpoints... well, there is the problem that some people think they can do it without being actually level 65 and good gear. But it usually is pretty straightforward, the majority of people queuing for HM flashpoint know what they're doing. And unless it's Kaon Under Siege or Lost Island it's not a big deal.

 

I am not quite sure what they were thinking making Esseles a Hard Mode. It reminds me of one of Kaliyo's lines: "It's not anarchy if nothing matters. It's just a sugar rush."

 

Anyway, tactical flashpoints, particularly without a 65 and a combat role missing, are usually harder than hard mode flashpoints by now.

Edited April 24, 2016 by Rabenschwinge

[jimmorrisson]

Counterpoint: The game is too much of a time sink.

 

Illum and Makeb need to be slimmed down.

Initial Alliances and /Star Fortresses are extremely lengthy and repetitive.

Some of Fall Empire's chapters length are torture to complete.

[xordevoreaux]

Counterpoint: The game is too much of a time sink.

 

Illum and Makeb need to be slimmed down.

Initial Alliances and /Star Fortresses are extremely lengthy and repetitive.

Some of Fall Empire's chapters length are torture to complete.

 

I find it a bit laughable to ask for a form of leisurely activity to be reduced in the amount of time it takes. I would rather have this game, which is a form of entertainment, be my time sink rather than mowing the yard or cleaning off the roof, truth be told. Like tennis or bowling or playing chess, all distractions are time sinks.

[Rabenschwinge]

The tactical flashpoints are an interesting topic. They are actually often harder to complete if you don't have a tank and healer in the group. I find this somewhat ironic because being able to go in with 4 dps was the point of having the tacticals in the first place. But because of them being too hard for many when it's a group of dps it actually causes people to quit doing them so it's counterproductive but not because they are dumbed down because especially the higher level ones are actually hard to do as a group of dps (by comparison) and people do die a lot if they don't have a tank, 2 dps and a heal configuration. Funny that.

 

A curious situation is when you play a level 65 damage dealer in decent gear (mostly 208 and a bit 216 is what you have if you play the story and all the alerts and nothing else) and there is a level 34 tank in a mix of level 32/28 gear. Even if the tank knows what he's doing and taunting the hell out of the mobs, there is no way they can keep up with you. With the healing terminals healing a percentage of health (I am not entirely sure there, but I think they do), more than makes up for a lower damage reduction; the more max hit points you have the more you heal.

 

I usually let the tank decide whether or not they're up to this, I can take over for the tank so long as I am playing a character that at least has taunts. It won't be pretty, an overpowered damage dealer is still not a tank. But there are always the terminal, means to drop aggro for four seconds and then take over again. It won't be pretty, but it will work, whereas an mid-level tank stands about the chance of a snowball in hell at times, even if they are really damn good.

Edited April 25, 2016 by Rabenschwinge

[xkcurtisx]

my prime example yet again how easy the game is... and not teaching anything about how it works. HERE

[jauvtus]

snip

All I understand is that you let Kilran snipe you. Seriously, you approached him in his clear line of sight?

[Rabenschwinge]

All I understand is that you let Kilran snipe you. Seriously, you approached him in his clear line of sight?

 

You are slowed at this point and he still snipes you when you are already in melee. Of course we did everything we can to avoid a line of sight, but if you avoid a line of sight altogether you can't attack either. You can avoid lots of snipes but not all of them.

 

I've done the Maelstrom Prison often enough in Hard Mode, and that's a walk in the park compared to an unbalanced group of mid thirty characters in tactical, even if their players are really good.

Edited April 25, 2016 by Rabenschwinge

[DarthEnrique]

Well seeing as you just got back in 18 months, I'm guessing you don't know about the uproar that arose when they nerfed companions after 4.0 making it where they pretty much were not healing you. So please don't give Bioware any ideas to nerf again, God we don't need that.

 

As for your fp statements, I find flashpoints in this game to be highly annoying, mostly for reason you have mentioned, especially in hard mode, it seems that people never want to do the bonus, despite it being more 4x the amount when completing it, and this both in tatical and hard mode, and with GTN prices as they are this makes it particularly difficult to get a decent amount of money from these flashpoints, especially when damage repairs being almost always 10k or more if you die and depending on the flashpoint (sometimes it's been 7k but mostly higher). Yes it does seem that some people do not want to listen, there is this one particular instance where I literally left the group because the healer kept pulling agro, and they were a low lvl I think 20 something and we were doing one of the CZ flashpoints and we had two lvl 65s, one dps and one tank, and a lvl 50 tank both tanks were a sith assassin tank. I kept telling the healer over and over and over to let the tanks do their job because for whatever reason when she pulled agro, they would start focusing me over her even though she was the healer, my guess is cause I'm a lvl 65 sorcerer dps so I'm a bigger threat then the one keeping us alive, though she did an awful job at it too, she really wasn't healing us. The reason this sticks out in my mind the most is cause it's the first time I've ever left a group for players not listening or not doing their job in flashpoint.

 

The second time I quit a flashpoint was when I left my favorite one, The Foundry, as I dawn Revan's original outfit and enjoy battling against Revan in it but I also enjoy doing the bonuses, not just for the money but cause it's fun, they completely wanted to skip the bonuses to the point they had the stupid sluggy things towards the end following us and not stopping I literally was the only one attacking them and trying to stop them cause they weren't evading and I died so I left cause they were sucking the fun out of my favorite flashpoint for me.

 

The one thing I've learned on my server is not a lot of people have patience for Tatical or hard mode flashpoints nor do they want to help others learn, it's like nearly impossible to get a group of four for hard mode flashpoints on my server, I've literally time it once and in 2 hours there was no pop for it, and there have been times where it's popped but people have denied it or just let the timer run out cause they are picky and then back to the long wait for queuing. I have only two pieces of 220 gear, that's it because of this because it is nearly impossible to queue and get the daily reward or finish the weekly.

 

As far as I'm concerned tatical and hard mode flashpoints are only worth it if you are grouped up and queued with a healer who really knows what they are doing and are properly equipped for it but then even when I've done this, a tank doesn't pull agro, a healer's ****ed almost automatically cause they go after them, especially if they are lvl 65.

Edited April 25, 2016 by DarthEnrique

[Tsillah]

A curious situation is when you play a level 65 damage dealer in decent gear (mostly 208 and a bit 216 is what you have if you play the story and all the alerts and nothing else) and there is a level 34 tank in a mix of level 32/28 gear. Even if the tank knows what he's doing and taunting the hell out of the mobs, there is no way they can keep up with you. With the healing terminals healing a percentage of health (I am not entirely sure there, but I think they do), more than makes up for a lower damage reduction; the more max hit points you have the more you heal.

 

I usually let the tank decide whether or not they're up to this, I can take over for the tank so long as I am playing a character that at least has taunts. It won't be pretty, an overpowered damage dealer is still not a tank. But there are always the terminal, means to drop aggro for four seconds and then take over again. It won't be pretty, but it will work, whereas an mid-level tank stands about the chance of a snowball in hell at times, even if they are really damn good.

 

Yeh the huge level range causes some weird situations as well. On top of that the boss fights generally are easier than certain groups of trash mobs because the bosses have the healing nodes. If you have a group of 4 without a healer then the trash mobs can be the biggest challenge and you'll have to focus fire and kill one or two of them before dying so that you can wipe them out after wiping a couple of times. Wiping on trash is part of the tactics then... very odd.

 

It's a bit peculiar in that respect that some tactical fp's are actually harder to do than some SM operations...that just makes zero sense to me.

[Jedi_riches]

Actually you've made quite a few false assumptions, let me address a couple of them.

 

The reason that companions can now select all roles is because people wanted to play with their favourite companions more, not so much because of the difficulty of the game. If you play a marauder and want to level with Jaesa, you'll be dual dps'ing which is not ideal. If you're a sin tank and you think Khem Val is awesome as a companion...well dual tanking is rather boring. As usual BW has a bit of an all or nothing approach so instead of looking at what would make sense per class and companion they just went one size fits all. Considering that some classes got a heal companion first and others not till higher levels has always been an odd thing to me.

 

 

The tactical flashpoints are an interesting topic. They are actually often harder to complete if you don't have a tank and healer in the group. I find this somewhat ironic because being able to go in with 4 dps was the point of having the tacticals in the first place. But because of them being too hard for many when it's a group of dps it actually causes people to quit doing them so it's counterproductive but not because they are dumbed down because especially the higher level ones are actually hard to do as a group of dps (by comparison) and people do die a lot if they don't have a tank, 2 dps and a heal configuration. Funny that.

 

And to be honest, idiot pugs in operations were there in the first year of the game as well. I will say though I did prefer the difficulty of the story bosses originally myself, but clearly a lot of players today just want to play the story and not have much of a challenge. Paying customers you see.

 

Personally I would prefer that BW would do something for level 50+ characters where they have to learn about things like taunting, interrupts, walking out of circles and cleansing before being allowed in operations, but that's just me I guess.

 

All very good points, though with tactical flashpoints I think you missed one, pre 4.0 getting a flashpoint to pop was like pulling teeth due to the simple fact people don't want to tank or heal meaning you had to wait around if there were none in the queue. Bioware attempted to fix this by allowing any 4 players into a flashpoint regardless of role, this has had the problem in the matter of having level 15's being able to queue for something like blood hunt which is well above the capabilities of those players, maybe bioware should have restricted some flashpoints as you level to counter this, but that's for another thread.

[Tsillah]

All very good points, though with tactical flashpoints I think you missed one, pre 4.0 getting a flashpoint to pop was like pulling teeth due to the simple fact people don't want to tank or heal meaning you had to wait around if there were none in the queue. Bioware attempted to fix this by allowing any 4 players into a flashpoint regardless of role, this has had the problem in the matter of having level 15's being able to queue for something like blood hunt which is well above the capabilities of those players, maybe bioware should have restricted some flashpoints as you level to counter this, but that's for another thread.

 

Oh I understand the point of tacticals and the problem is indeed the implementation. I think for that topic that they should restrict the choice of fp's by the lowest level in the group. So if you have a level range in a group between 15 and 65 it should take a fp that is no higher than 10 levels about the lowest level for example. But bottom line remains that tacticals are often not actually easy but rather quite the contrary so it doesn't fulfil the need as you describe because what's the point of implemention a role neutral option if the reality is that it's near impossible to do for a group of 4 dps...it defeats its own purpose that way.

[Jedi_riches]

Oh I understand the point of tacticals and the problem is indeed the implementation. I think for that topic that they should restrict the choice of fp's by the lowest level in the group. So if you have a level range in a group between 15 and 65 it should take a fp that is no higher than 10 levels about the lowest level for example. But bottom line remains that tacticals are often not actually easy but rather quite the contrary so it doesn't fulfil the need as you describe because what's the point of implemention a role neutral option if the reality is that it's near impossible to do for a group of 4 dps...it defeats its own purpose that way.

 

Yeah it was badly implemented, I think I would have done it bands based on your story progression (I will explain why in a moment) so for instance chapter 1 of your class story allows players to pug for something up to Aithis for example then so on, meaning you must have done chapter 3 to get the Ilum ones or Forged alliances.

 

Now for why I say this way rather than level, if you are a new player you could often get a 'story' flashpoint well before you were supposed to rather than running a flashpoint in the order and 'context' it was supposed to be.

 

But I guess level based would 'please' more of the majority as more people ready for the higher flashpoints since you can hit 65 by Alderran.

[JeKoCZ]

I was that close to stop reading at "I'm a founder", gave up readingb at "played at launch".

 

Games evolve, for the better or for the worst. End of story.

Edited April 25, 2016 by JeKoCZ

[DieAlteHexe]

I was that close to stop reading at "I'm a founder", gave up readingb at "played at launch".

 

Games evolve, for the better or for the worst. End of story.

 

Not all of us who are founders and were here at the start are grouchy about the current state. I'm pretty much happy with the game overall. There are things I don't like or would like to see done differently, sure. Your comment touches on exactly why I enjoy MMOs. They DO evolve, change, grow and I find that interesting. I guess, though, it upsets some when the change/evolution doesn't go the way they want it to. Been there, done that, quit those MMOs. No whinging, just moved on.

[Storm-Cutter]

I agree that a lot of the game is stupid easy now. - Quick leveling, crutch companions, no gear grind unless you're doing ops, so much solo-able.....

 

Fundamentally you can do ~90% of things by spamming basic attack and setting 1st companion on heals. - then watch a few cutscenes as the story progresses, and then one a month for the continuing arc.

 

But if that's what people want, so be it. BW obviously have evidence to suggest that's what best pays their bills and bonuses.

 

Rest in the knowledge that you leveled characters the long slow way, that you ran Hm/ NiM ops undergeared and on level, that you got all those achieves before achievements were even a thing.

 

There are still challenges if you look carefully for them, (albeit no longer new ones) but if you're neither being challenged or entertained, then no-one will blame you for moving on after all these years.

[Stradlin]

^^ Extremely well expressed, and spot on IMO, Tsillah.

 

Things "not being ideal" was among the charms behind playing with your favourite companion in past, really. It is true KOTFE has been flayed from " pretty easy" to " your one handed grandmother could now play this game" - easy. However, it never was some Wildstar level of difficulty anyway. When playing as my Jug tank, I'd keep Jaessa out cause she was one of the few companions in the game I actually liked, story-wise. Was it " optimal" to roll with two melee DPS? Heck no! Did it lead to any kind of real trouble at all? Not really.

 

It gave each companion it's own, unique flavour. Now they are all one and same thing. Since almost no companion seems to be getting any notable measures of new storyline at all, I can't really see anything besides looks that'd set them apart anymore. Boring.

[Jedi_riches]

When playing as my Jug tank, I'd keep Jaessa out cause she was one of the few companions in the game I actually liked, story-wise. Was it " optimal" to roll with two melee DPS? Heck no! Did it lead to any kind of real trouble at all? Not really.

 

See now this was where my problem was I am not so good at the game so two melee DPS's made the game rather difficult for me without keeping every piece of gear up to date and over levelling as much as I possibly could. For me 4.0 was a very welcome change for me, I tend to need to run with a healer for 'best' performance yet there are very few healers in the game that I actually like (mako, Dr lokin and Elara) I actively dislike most of them.

[Tsillah]

Things "not being ideal" was among the charms behind playing with your favourite companion in past, really. It is true KOTFE has been flayed from " pretty easy" to " your one handed grandmother could now play this game" - easy. However, it never was some Wildstar level of difficulty anyway. When playing as my Jug tank, I'd keep Jaessa out cause she was one of the few companions in the game I actually liked, story-wise. Was it " optimal" to roll with two melee DPS? Heck no! Did it lead to any kind of real trouble at all? Not really.

 

It gave each companion it's own, unique flavour. Now they are all one and same thing. Since almost no companion seems to be getting any notable measures of new storyline at all, I can't really see anything besides looks that'd set them apart anymore. Boring.

 

Yeh and I was able to do so as well, but you know that most people would really struggle. You've got to stop seeing yourself as the lowest common denominator, because as soon as you say "I can do it, so what's the problem" you are basically saying you're the crappiest player out there so if you can do it everyone can...and forgive me if I don't think you are the worst player out there.

 

As for companions I am also not happy with how they did it. I was merely explaining that the overall difficulty was not the main driver in this. I would've preferred that they would've given companions two options instead of three, so there would be no Khem Val or Jaesa healers or Doc tanking for example, but BW tends to go all or nothing these days and I wish they would exercise a bit of temperance in that.

Edited April 25, 2016 by Tsillah

[DieAlteHexe]

... " your one handed grandmother could now play this game" - easy.

 

Isn't boring for a one-handed grandmother. Okay, okay, I have 1.5 hands.

 

I get your point and, for someone who wants a real challenge, this is not the game. There are a lot of those games but not so many that are so story heavy. That's what draws me. BW and their storytelling. I didn't mind the original overmuch and I don't mind what it currently is. It's fun and that's why I'm here. Stops being fun? Gone.