Cash grabbing, is it a means to an end?

[ebbehhm]

Cash grabbing never got any MMO any success ever, money laundering is the reason or the lack of profit, is why games die. i feel like the 1.0 SWTOR is just a good memory now. This is a rich mans game, or will become. CM is just gambling, last 10 or so packs they've released (opened probably 10+ of each) i have got nothing worth more than 100k.

 

If they are going to play the money game they dont have to make another DA. #EA

 

Seriously, this game is becoming AA + WoW + NW combo that was made by EA.

 

Am i imagining things or is this game on its last legs?

Edited January 27, 2016 by ebbehhm

[Neglience]

This game is made from EA from the start. BW is nothing more than a name with a good old past. EA invests some money initially and after that the money needs to come in. See dragon age.

[BrianDavion]

First of all yes this is an EA game. in case you somehow missed it, EA owns Bioware.

 

secondly, the game's cash shop ahs mostly followed the same format for the apst 3 years. although they've been tweeking it lately to try and see if they can produce something better for everyone.

 

so no the game is not dying, the sky is not falling. it's busniess as useal.

 

P.S.

 

everything in the packs can be found on the GTN, play the market friend.

[ebbehhm]

First of all yes this is an EA game. in case you somehow missed it, EA owns Bioware.

 

secondly, the game's cash shop ahs mostly followed the same format for the apst 3 years. although they've been tweeking it lately to try and see if they can produce something better for everyone.

 

so no the game is not dying, the sky is not falling. it's busniess as useal.

 

P.S.

 

everything in the packs can be found on the GTN, play the market friend.

 

Hard to play the market when you have the attention span of a 2 year old when you're doing anything other than PvP or Ops. I have no profitable income, Ops can be, but not consistent.

 

My main point is, i feel like this game is not doing well atm at all.

[BrianDavion]

luckly all CM items are purely cosmetic, as for playing the market, you said you bought 10 packs,

 

take what you got that you don't want, and sell them for money. you'll get a bit of a return on the investment and maybe be able to afford something you DO want

[ebbehhm]

luckly all CM items are purely cosmetic, as for playing the market, you said you bought 10 packs,

 

take what you got that you don't want, and sell them for money. you'll get a bit of a return on the investment and maybe be able to afford something you DO want

 

I barely get anything of value ever, thats half the problem. The drop rate, the RNG is terrible for me.

[Stoofa]

I barely get anything of value ever, thats half the problem. The drop rate, the RNG is terrible for me.

 

No, it's not "terrible for you" it is simply random.

[ebbehhm]

No, it's not "terrible for you" it is simply random.

 

Randomly terrible for me

[Slappywhite]

These games exist for one reason and ONE reason only. To make money for the companies which produce them.

 

You have two choices. Accept the company's terms and the manner in which they do it, or take your money and leave.

 

It's really that simple.

[Gomla]

My main point is, i feel like this game is not doing well atm at all.

 

Not saying this to "dig" but if you think it's not doing well, you have no idea how business works.

 

Those cartel packs, and the cartel market in general, rake in a fortune. There are a few people that spend thousands of dollars/pounds/yen/whatevercurrency on a regular basis and a lot of others that pump in a few hundred a month.

[Holocron]

 

P.S.

 

everything in the packs can be found on the GTN, play the market friend.

 

So this myth keeps getting perpetuated but the reality is, those items would never exist in the GTN without the initial cartel purchasers. So if Bioware's greed keeps driving away more and more buyers, then there won't be anything listed on the GTN for you to buy. Also the more people that realize they can buy everything on the GTN then they cause a cumulative effect of less people purchasing cartel items over all.

 

On a side note, the biggest mistakes Bioware made with the cartel market was the removal of reputation items/certs. The fact that packs were the only source of rep, and they had vendors offering unique items for that rep/cert constantly drove pack sales. Collectors, completionist, or people wanting a particular item had to open packs to get what they want. So those people drove direct cartel sales, or indirect cartel sales on the secondary market.

Edited January 27, 2016 by Holocron

[ebbehhm]

My point isnt that BW/EA arent profiting, my point is that this game seems to be on its way down for the players. Of late all i seem to see on the forums are "Fix this, bug this, bug that, nerf, buff, CS horrible, when am i getting new things"

 

Its just the very early SWTOR days it just wasnt like this. But then i guess inflation happens and the demand from BW goes up.

[EzioMessi]

My point isnt that BW/EA arent profiting, my point is that this game seems to be on its way down for the players. Of late all i seem to see on the forums are "Fix this, bug this, bug that, nerf, buff, CS horrible, when am i getting new things"

 

Its just the very early SWTOR days it just wasnt like this. But then i guess inflation happens and the demand from BW goes up.

 

In the early days of swtor it wasn't like this? Are you sure you aren't seeing things from rose-tinted goggles?

 

I'm not even gonna argue if the game is good or not (for what it's worth, I love the game). I'm not gonna argue if Bioware/EA is greedy or not. I'm not even gonna argue if CM is a good business plan. But what do you mean "the game is on its way down for players"? During its first six months it lost hundreds of thousands of subscribers, while now it's at worst just losing them to a very slow decline. So based on pure numbers it makes no sense to say the game is on its way down NOW as opposed to during the first few months, because those first few months lost them several times more players than the next 3 years cumulatively did.

[ebbehhm]

In the early days of swtor it wasn't like this? Are you sure you aren't seeing things from rose-tinted goggles?

 

I'm not even gonna argue if the game is good or not (for what it's worth, I love the game). I'm not gonna argue if Bioware/EA is greedy or not. I'm not even gonna argue if CM is a good business plan. But what do you mean "the game is on its way down for players"? During its first six months it lost hundreds of thousands of subscribers, while now it's at worst just losing them to a very slow decline. So based on pure numbers it makes no sense to say the game is on its way down NOW as opposed to during the first few months, because those first few months lost them several times more players than the next 3 years cumulatively did.

 

I mean that ive seen a whole bunch of un happy players of late. I could be seeing things from rose-tinted goggles... but i base my argument on all that the forum has been full of late, and lot more of it than usual. Lots of complaining, i mean i do myself, and im no better than the complainers. But more and more un happy people cant be a good thing.

 

And slow declines are about the end of every game, except SWG, RIP, look at AA for example, a lot of unhappy players started leaving over a longish duration, the game virtually had to revamp. Have you actually played any games that have ever died while playing them? i speak from what i see, not what i imagine.

Edited January 27, 2016 by ebbehhm

[Jedi_riches]

Cash grabbing never got any MMO any success ever, money laundering is the reason or the lack of profit, is why games die. i feel like the 1.0 SWTOR is just a good memory now. This is a rich mans game, or will become. CM is just gambling, last 10 or so packs they've released (opened probably 10+ of each) i have got nothing worth more than 100k.

?

 

luckly all CM items are purely cosmetic

 

This, I mean there is nothing really in the cartel market that screams P2P, it used to be something like Treek (who has been nerfed since the companion change) and level 10 +41 crystals (now Artifice can do the same)

[EzioMessi]

I mean that ive seen a whole bunch of un happy players of late. I could be seeing things from rose-tinted goggles... but i base my argument on all that the forum has been full of late, and lot more of it than usual. Lots of complaining, i mean i do myself, and im no better than the complainers. But more and more un happy people cant be a good thing.

 

And slow declines are about the end of every game, except SWG, RIP, look at AA for example, a lot of unhappy players started leaving over a longish duration, the game virtually had to revamp. Have you actually played any games that have ever died while playing them? i speak from what i see, not what i imagine.

 

I was just saying that no matter how many people you see complaining, the rate of decline shows that there were several more people, with much more severe complaints during the "early days" that you compared them to. I'm not business analyst and I do not have that much experience with dying games, and it does bother me to log in to my old server and see 17 people on fleet and 1 (me) on higher level planets. But I still don't think swtor is gonna die a death, slow or fast, simply due to the hype caused by having 5 Star Wars movies in 5 years. EA would have to literally kill people's pets to get enough people to leave to kill the game for these five years. After that, who knows.

[DWRoelands]

Am i imagining things or is this game on its last legs?

 

You're imagining things.

[ebbehhm]

I was just saying that no matter how many people you see complaining, the rate of decline shows that there were several more people, with much more severe complaints during the "early days" that you compared them to. I'm not business analyst and I do not have that much experience with dying games, and it does bother me to log in to my old server and see 17 people on fleet and 1 (me) on higher level planets. But I still don't think swtor is gonna die a death, slow or fast, simply due to the hype caused by having 5 Star Wars movies in 5 years. EA would have to literally kill people's pets to get enough people to leave to kill the game for these five years. After that, who knows.

 

You do make some good points, i mean the game could be just at the start of the down fall. Or it could be at a start of something bigger. We'll see what Disney does, that'll be the decider imo.

[ebbehhm]

This, I mean there is nothing really in the cartel market that screams P2P, it used to be something like Treek (who has been nerfed since the companion change) and level 10 +41 crystals (now Artifice can do the same)

 

This is a good point. its for sure not a P2W game, its just expensive for people who want that. I mean lots of games cost a half or a third of the price to get such things in equivalent. But then we can blame EA i guess.

[Thoronmir]

I'm not convinced a survey of the "trending" topics on a MMO forum is the best way to judge the "state of the game." In my experience, forums tend to present a very pessimistic perspective of a game. For some reason (I'm no psychiatrist), negative experiences seem to prompt more commentary and discussion than positive. We witness a thread (or multitude of threads) about some bug or whatnot expand to dozens or scores of pages, while threads proclaiming happy-fun-times are (a) rare and (b) short-lived. I've never inferred that the dearth of positive forum posts was proof that fewer players have positive experiences in the game. I've always assumed that, if the game is working for you and you're having fun, you tend to spend time playing rather than posting.

 

As for the insidious, nefarious, malicious, and altogether naughty cash grab, I whole-heartedly support EA/BW raking in as much cash as possible via Cartel Market sales. Whether other games charge less for similar items simply means that those other games either (a) have misjudged the market or (b) don't really offer anything people want. Caveat Emptor, free market, etc., ad nauseam.

 

Having spent the past several years playing LOTRO, I welcome a game that does not effectively gate actual character development behind its store. In LOTRO, you "need" to upgrade weapons through a laborious and mind-numbing grind (though, due to a player revolt, Turbine recently abated that grind ... somewhat). But the "good news" about grinding LOTRO Legendary Weapons was that you could accelerate that grind through store-purchased items. So, to acquire the best weapons in the game, one was forced to either spend months grinding away or spend cash in the LOTRO store. The day SWTOR mirrors LOTRO in that regard is the day I will condemn the Cartel Market. Until then, the Cartel Market exists primarily so we can play "dress-up" (I don't mean to derogate playing dress-up ... as an RPer, my characters outfits are important to me).

 

So, to answer the question posed in this thread's title, yes. Yes, the SWTOR "cash grab" is a means to an end. That "end" being EA making money. So, surprise, surprise! EA's actions to induce players to spend money on SWTOR is a scheme for EA to collect money from players. Who knew? Also, FYI, there is gambling going on in the backroom at Rick's Café Americain.

Edited January 27, 2016 by Thoronmir

[Ghisallo]

This game is made from EA from the start. BW is nothing more than a name with a good old past. EA invests some money initially and after that the money needs to come in. See dragon age.

 

False: BW Austin was founded in March 2006 by BW and its founders specifically for the purposes of making SWTOR. Yes they did not formally announce the game was in production until 2008 but this kind of "busy hush" stuff is standard, especially if a Licensed IP already has a game out that was developed by another company, in this case SOE with SWG.

 

EA did not announce the proposed purchase of BW until a year and a half later in the fall of 2007 and the sale was not done until early 2008. The staff that made this game was hired by BW's founders and the founders remained in overall control until they departed in 2013. At this time EA took more firm control of the office. So you can say 3.0 and 4.0 are EA's fault but 1.0 and 2.0 was BW.

Edited January 27, 2016 by Ghisallo

[ImmortalLowlife]

I mean that ive seen a whole bunch of un happy players of late. I could be seeing things from rose-tinted goggles... but i base my argument on all that the forum has been full of late, and lot more of it than usual. Lots of complaining, i mean i do myself, and im no better than the complainers. But more and more un happy people cant be a good thing...

 

I was reading the book "Specter of the Past", and this statement made by a Camassii speaking about politics can easily be applied to the forum.

 

The one truism in all politics is that loud voices will be raised against any decision that is made

 

I wouldn't use the attitudes you see in post on the forums as an actual representation of player happiness.

[Jerqa]

I barely get anything of value ever, thats half the problem. The drop rate, the RNG is terrible for me.

 

Keep in mind that this "value" that you speak of is purely player made. What one person will pay for a CM item is not what another person would deem the same item to be worth and visa-versa. The prices on the GTN fluctuate on an hourly basis, even less sometimes. I can sell one item for 500k one day and the exact same item for 20k the next day.

 

I see threads in every MMO that I play claiming the "game" is dying, or doing bad or will be closed next week and so on. One of them just had it's 13th anniversary

Edited January 27, 2016 by Jerqa

[Anysao]

What exactly do you consider "cash grabbing?"

[Ghisallo]

Keep in mind that this "value" that you speak of is purely player made. What one person will pay for a CM item is not what another person would deem the same item to be worth and visa-versa. The prices on the GTN fluctuate on an hourly basis, even less sometimes. I can sell one item for 500k one day and the exact same item for 20k the next day.

 

I see threads in every MMO that I play claiming the "game" is dying, or doing bad or will be closed next week and so on. One of them just had it's 13th anniversary

 

Thing is all of them are, technically, dying. Here is the life cycle...

1. MMORPG launches. First couple months they grow as people try an MMO for the first time, were tired of their old game or think the grass is greener on the other side.

2. People leave as they say "this game is not for me", for whatever reason. The population then stabilizes at a certain population.

3. Over time this population declines, some slowly, some faster.

 

Even WoW meets this dynamic. They grew up to WotLK because they continuously expanded into new markets, but if you looked at just the markets they were in on launch day, they really didn't grow past vanilla. The growth was from expansion into other countries.

 

The only difference is how fast does the game die and/or get put on life support/maintenance mode.

Edited January 27, 2016 by Ghisallo