Switch Advanced Classes

[TX_Angel]

You make some good points but you also negate some obvious ones to the counter point. As I said earlier, in this thread, we are hard-capped on character slots. AC respec "on the fly" (and we both know that is what it will be) allows for virtually unlimited respecs into and out of FotM "ACs".

 

If the AC system was left as it was, I'd be happy enough with a 30 day cool down on AC changes. That would at least keep the fast swaping down.

 

But then again, you can change your role within an AC 5 times an hour if you want. A PowerTech can be a tank one minute and a dps the next. You can queue for a FP for both roles and respect as needed when the queue pops.

 

How does it hurt anyone isn't the question that should be asked. The question that should be asked is how does it make the game better for everyone?

 

Now that I have way too many toons, I'd rather focus on just a few. I've found that I have the problem some do with companions and alliance, at some point they just become numbers.

 

Rather than have 16+ toons, why not have just a few that you play and love?

 

Lets say I'm working on heroics, which I usually run on my Commando or my Merc for ranged dps and mobility. I'd also like to queue for FP, but I can only queue as dps, so the queue time is long. Imagine if I could queue as a dps, healer, or tank, and spec as needed when the GF popped?

 

Imagine that more people may actually want to be tanks/healers if every class could be every role, because you could be dps for the solo game and switch to tank/healing only for group content. You could also take the time to get really good at one class and thus be more effective in combat when grouped.

 

I do, however, like what we discussed last night about abolishing ACs outright and using a drop down menu for discipline selection.

 

That would be my preferred solution. Just revert to the 8 main classes and ditch the entire AC system. Have a drop down menu with 6 roles... the 4 existing dps roles, 1 tank, and 1 healing role. But frankly even 4 dps roles might be a bit complex for newer players...

 

Of course, if I was lead designer and I had the budget, I'd like to create tutorials for each of the 4 dps roles, along with a video showing how each plays. I would recruit a few expert SWTOR players to provide a "demo" of each class and how to maximize the parse for each, showing what abilities are useful, and put it into a preview window.

 

This way, when players are asking in fleet chat "what is the best role to pick", they can instead read a description of each role, how each works best (DOT/BURST/ETC.) and watch a short video showing that role in action.

 

Same for healing and tanking, an actual quick video to watch, in the game, showing how that role is played in GROUP content, would be helpful to those new to group stuff.

 

Yea, I know, YouTube exists, but I'm firmly of the belief that nothing in the game should require going to YouTube.

 

Speaking of that, I would want to license TeamSpeak and put it right into the game, to make it easy for PUGs to have voice chat without any hassle. You'd have to option to decline it outright, listen only, or listen and talk. The lead tank would be the leader in each group and would have control over TS and the ability to mute players as needed.

 

But then there are a ton of things I'd do to clean up group content to make it friendler... First, I think everyone should win something from the final boss, if you don't get a loot box, then you should get a token that can be turned in for something. One token gets a basic bronze deco perhaps, 3 tokens gets a silver, 5 get a gold. 2 tokens get a mod or enhancement, 3 get an armoring, 6 get a whole piece of armor (legs for example). 10 could get you a main hand hilt/barrel.

 

How about having PUG ops groups vote on loot rules? Why doesn't the game allow a "1 token per person" loot system?

 

Anyway, I could carry on... but I won't, since BW isn't paying me for it.

[Vhaegrant]

Been away from the keyboard for a week, or there abouts, good to see the thread is still active as I'd hate to be accused of necroing it as I have been with the other AC swap thread -> http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=644159

 

I see Ratajack still want's the original intent of the devs upheld. May as well close down the forums then if we're not allowed to debate changes we'd like to be considered. How did that work for those that wanted strongholds, appearance tabs or an off rails pvp space shooter? (Not arguing about the quality of the final product, just that they are all things I seem to recall people saying would never happen... and yet... )

 

Just a little thing about the use of Advanced Class titles in the Class column. Instead of needing two columns, one for the Class and one for the Advanced Class you can make do with one because you know that the only thing a Powertech could be is a Bounty Hunter. This does not magically make it the class of the character, just that you can infer back to the starting class. The same is not true once you have chosen an AC, a Bounty Hunter could be a Powertech or a Mercenary.

However, what would be even more useful would be to list the discipline taken as that as the final decision that directs the character into their role. I've yet to see anyone ask specifically in chat for a Powertech, I've seen plenty asking for tanks. Not to mention how often I've been whispered while on fleet to tank (I'm usually on a powertech- pyro) and have to waste time explaining that I'm Pyrotech discipline not Shieldtech.

 

It's good to see a few mentioning maybe expanding the request of an AC swap function to add in more options in the line of extra Advanced Classes and Disciplines to fill out the role portfolios and weapon choices of other Classes.

I've always felt that SWTOR was a little light on player choice, it gives some good Bioware story and some of the best Star Wars themed story I've encountered, but the player has very little input. To the point that as a Bounty Hunter/ Powertech/ Pyro I can only equip a blast pistol... even though I barely use it (maybe for basic attack). It would be nice to have the option to keep it holstered, after all the attack rotation comes from rockets, flamethrowers, darts and railguns rather than mainhand. Or maybe let the character hold something else.

 

I've often suggested opening up all the roles to all the classes. I felt it was a mistake to tie the role so closely to certain story lines. The Assassin play style makes very little sense for the Inquisitor playthrough, a lot more sense as a sorcerer. And if you want to be a healer you'll never get to experience, in my opinion, one of the best storylines, that of the Sith Warrior. New ACs with the accompanying disciplines could be used to allow all of the classes to fill all of the roles and offer up a few additional varieties of playstyles for that class. Allowing a Bounty Hunter a melee option that uses a tech-staff might be a nice idea, considering the two Mandolorians you encounter as companions both use them.

 

Once you add in these extra ACs you start to open up the freedom to play what role you want on your character. A line of thinking probably more in keeping with modern game design than the old way of doing things.

It's noticeable that many of the original design choices favoured overly punitive methods of extending playtime that suited a subscription style. Gating access to quicker movement rates, long travel times and long cool downs on quick travel are the obvious examples that have been rolled back.

 

That's probably more at the root of the dislike of even thinking about an AC swap. It's not hardcore. It supposedly panders to those that want something for nothing (although many of the major MMOs allow the same character to fulfill any of the roles). Missing the point that the audience for a mainstream MMO based on the Star Wars IP was never going to be old school hardcore. Sure there are some, but a majority that can sustain the game... I don't think so.

This is why we've had essentially a soft reboot of the game with 4.0. A new direction with a focus on incentivising monthly subscriptions without a focus on challenging gameplay (yet). And ever easier ways of accessing gear (Eternal Championship and Crafting will allow gear that's good enough to get all the solo content finished).

 

One of the older arguments against AC swap was that it would inundate the flashpoints and operations with noobs that didn't know how to play their class. An unfortunate argument because it was never about class but about role and the fact that the levelling content was never truly that good at training a player up. It's not an argument against allowing AC swap but more one for having good challenging role specific solo content in the game. This content can not be tied to the normal levelling process as you do not want to gate a players progression through a game that's driving monthly subs through new story content. But, as a stand alone content that can be used to practice role without the frustrations of letting down a group it would fill a much needed gap in bringing players from the solo side of the game to the flashpoints and operations. Eternal Championship may be a glimpse, but I feel the inclusion of a companion and the level of gear it will be dropping it will not be aimed at specific roles (I will withhold full judgement until I've played it).

 

TL;DNR: The games supposed to be fun, lighten up and go with allowing more options. If you want hardcore this is not the game you are looking for.

[GalacticKegger]

I give it 50/50 odds that 5.0 will bring about exactly what I'm suggesting, that every class will be able to pick from all three roles. We shall see.

Why wait until 5.0 when you can has 4.3, where the GSI droids disappear and in their place will be . . . our characters! That's right Star Wars MMO fans, character gear is nut to butt with companion gear. R.I.P. armor and weapon hassles.

 

Pissed that single player casuals can solo story for Ops loot? Not any more. We got your back cuz ... no more gear! Why waste all that time parsing, practicing comparative arithmetic, crafting and making choices when you could invest that time looking cool as hell in themed costumes while steamrolling your way through to Companionville uberdom?

 

Disciplines? Schmisciplines. You can be OP as either a tank, dps or healer with two clicks of a pull down menu right from the comfort of your character sheet. And talk about play style options ... for only 100CC you can even purchase single use unlocks that allow a character to play as all three at the same time! Why feel limited by the trinity when you can actually be the trinity!!!

 

We now return you to your regularly scheduled soap opera.

Edited January 28, 2016 by GalacticKegger

[Fevee]

I forgot that YOU were solely responsible for this game, and that YOU know better than the devs, and only YOUR opinion counts.

 

You are right. My opinion matters not one iota.

 

The ONLY opinion that DOES matter is that of the DEVS. They are the ones who said that AC's were FUNDAMENTALLY DIFFERENT CLASS DESIGNS, and that AC's were treated as FULL CLASSES, not subclasses. Those are not MY words, but the words of the DEVS. I did not define the AC's as FULL CLASSES. The DEVS did that.

 

You keep saying that, but you don't have any proof. And even if you did present that they did say just that, well, I can still judge for myself what they really are. It's obvious that the Subclasses branch off of the main classes. You start off as a Bounty Hunter, for example, and can then go either/or when it comes to Powertech and Mercenary. You don't start off as a Bounty Hunter, and are then offered Assassin/Sorcerer/Juggernaut/Marauder/Sniper/Operative, as that, is where the true fundamental difference is.

 

Maybe our understanding of the word 'fundamental' is different. But when the original devs first sat down to figure out the difference between a full class, they gave him weapons, armor, a story, a voice actor, two subclasses/variants, and three disciplines per subclass.

 

Then, they took their arms, and swept all that work off the table so that not a single drawing, clay model, or empty cup of coffee remained from the design of that class; so that they may begin the design of the next full class.

 

That, is a better example of what it means to be fundamentally different from the other.

 

You want "proof" that AC's are not simply subclasses? Go check your guild roster. How many characters over level 10 have Trooper or Bounty hunter listed as their CLASS? How many characters above level 10 have their CLASS listed as commando, vanguard, mercenary or powertech?

 

There are some people who have made it to 60 without picking a subclass, actually. But that doesn't mean they are entirely different subclasses, that just means that the devs designed the interface so players can simply understand who/what everyone is. After all, it would be way redundant if the chart said

Player | Level | Class | Subclass | Planet (Instance) | Comment

Firstguy | 60 | Knight | Sentinel | Republic Fleet

Someoneelse | 60 | Knight | Sentinel | Republic Fleet

DarthSithSlayer | 60 | Knight | Sentinel | Republic Fleet

Weneedarealnamingsystem | 60 | Knight | Sentinel | Republic Fleet

Master'Obi-Juan | 60 | Knight | Sentinel | Republic Fleet

Whyisn'tObi-JuanaGuardian | 60 | Knight | Sentinel | Republic Fleet

LukenSkywalkersie | 60 | Knight | Sentinel | Republic Fleet

Andwhyisn'tLukenSkywalkersieaGuardianeither | 60 | Knight | Sentinel | Republic Fleet

Asajj'Ventress | 60 | Knight | Guardian | Republic Fleet

Idon'tevenknowanymore | 60 | Consular | Sage | Republic Fleet

 

and so on.

 

Anyone can say anything; even the devs. That doesn't make it the case, though. They can say that they support the midichlorian explanation, they can say money grows on trees, they can say Earth has two moons, they can say that this apple they dipped in orange dye is now an orange, or they can say that the "advanced classes" are entirely different classes.

 

But, anyone will go see for themselves what the truth really is. And I have seen for myself that the Subclasses both branch off the same class. They're like two branches of the same tree. Imagine four two-branch trees in a clearing, now imagine that I claim that the two branches grew from the same tree for each tree, whilst you try to argue that there are eight separate trees, entirely.

[PorsaLindahl]

But, anyone will go see for themselves what the truth really is. And I have seen for myself that the Subclasses both branch off the same class. They're like two branches of the same tree. Imagine four two-branch trees in a clearing, now imagine that I claim that the two branches grew from the same tree for each tree, whilst you try to argue that there are eight separate trees, entirely.

 

There...

Are...

Three...

Lights!

 

Um..sorry.

 

Does each branch have 3 smaller branches? And wouldn't there actually be eight trees - four for each faction?

 

Why do we park in the driveway and drive on the parkway? If a frog had wings, would be bump his *** every time he jumped?

Edited February 1, 2016 by PorsaLindahl

[TX_Angel]

There...

Are...

Three...

Lights!

 

Um..sorry.

 

Does each branch have 3 smaller branches? And wouldn't there actually be eight trees - four for each faction?

 

Why do we park in the driveway and drive on the parkway? If a frog had wings, would be bump his *** every time he jumped?

 

Now THAT was funny... thanks for bringing humor to such a super serious thread.

 

On a side note: The game will be fine with or without all this, in my personal opinion, it falls into the "nice to have but not required" category.

 

But that's just me.

[Kingsbount]

Ok...

Let's do this!!!

 

But only if you will have to wait for month to change your char AC. Aaaaand it will cost about 10000 CC.

I guess it will be fair price

[Wallner]

Sure I'd support it even if you had to wait a month.

 

I'd prefer it without the wait, but I would definitely accept the wait to have the option.

[Mordresh]

I have no objections to this having a long cooldown.

[Erevan_Kindelar]

Well.

 

How would them adding the option to choose another AC hurt the game?

 

I don't see how being able to switch your characters combat technique is a negative thing.

 

With your whole "Choices matter"-logic, a player shouldn't be able to switch specializations either. I mean, if you chose to play Healer, that's it. Choices matter

 

For you as a player, the switching is a negligible thing. Pre-4.0, and even at endgame in post-4.0, it would be a problematic thing from a couple of perspectives.

Taking a Knight/Warrior, if you want to switch from Sentinel/Marauder to Guardian/Juggernaut, you are potentially changing only the look of your character (playing as a DPS Guardian/Juggernaut), or adopting a radically different playstyle and group role (changing from DPS to Tank).

At this time, the leveling experience is so easy that there is no need for a tank class to learn their class mechanics before reaching endgame Ops, because in most cases that is the first time a tank will actually group up with other players. The result is that the tank is probably going to be terrible at their role and because the tank is terrible, the group wipes and everyone has a crappy day (I know, I am generalising a lot, but my experience of tanking with newer players who otherwise play DPS bears this out) .

So that person being able to switch ACs is causing problems for other people... but I grant you that the same can be said for someone who plays the tank class all the way through instead of switching - it is not necessarily the switching that makes the tank bad, but it does not help.

As it stands, the way to "change Advanced Classes" is to roll another character, and this brings us to the biggest single reason why I do not think that Bioware will implement AC switching - having alts. Specifically, experiencing the storyline on several different classes, and then deciding that you want to try another AC within one of your existing classes. So you go to create a new character, and you find that you have hit the Subscriber/Preferred/F2P character limit, so you need to either delete an existing character or buy a Character Slot Unlock (probably from the CM). Meaning that BIoware get a revenue stream from you not being able to switch AC. BY allowing AC switching, Bioware remove 95% of the reason for players to buy Character Slot unlocks, so implementing this feature would hurt their CM sales... maybe not by a huge amount, but asking them to do work that will reduce their ability to sell us stuff? How likely is that?

[Vhaegrant]

For you as a player, the switching is a negligible thing. Pre-4.0, and even at endgame in post-4.0, it would be a problematic thing from a couple of perspectives.

Taking a Knight/Warrior, if you want to switch from Sentinel/Marauder to Guardian/Juggernaut, you are potentially changing only the look of your character (playing as a DPS Guardian/Juggernaut), or adopting a radically different playstyle and group role (changing from DPS to Tank).

At this time, the leveling experience is so easy that there is no need for a tank class to learn their class mechanics before reaching endgame Ops, because in most cases that is the first time a tank will actually group up with other players. The result is that the tank is probably going to be terrible at their role and because the tank is terrible, the group wipes and everyone has a crappy day (I know, I am generalising a lot, but my experience of tanking with newer players who otherwise play DPS bears this out) .

So that person being able to switch ACs is causing problems for other people... but I grant you that the same can be said for someone who plays the tank class all the way through instead of switching - it is not necessarily the switching that makes the tank bad, but it does not help.

I'm sorry but I'm not sure you're aware that you can already swap out from Tank to DPS (and vice versa) using the current Discipline system.

Your argument above has nothing to say about not allowing an AC swap only that there should be more solo role specific content so a player can get to grips with their role before they enter group content.

On the experience of transitioning to tank at endgame. Firstly, levelling as a tank is poissibly the dullest experience you can have (aside from levelling as a healer) I did it on my main, never again. DPS to max level and then switch to role if needed. Secondly, overgeared, overconfident DPS players that have run the FPs so frequently they want to skip everything and take short cuts are as much as a hassle as the new tank.

As it stands, the way to "change Advanced Classes" is to roll another character, and this brings us to the biggest single reason why I do not think that Bioware will implement AC switching - having alts. Specifically, experiencing the storyline on several different classes, and then deciding that you want to try another AC within one of your existing classes. So you go to create a new character, and you find that you have hit the Subscriber/Preferred/F2P character limit, so you need to either delete an existing character or buy a Character Slot Unlock (probably from the CM). Meaning that BIoware get a revenue stream from you not being able to switch AC. BY allowing AC switching, Bioware remove 95% of the reason for players to buy Character Slot unlocks, so implementing this feature would hurt their CM sales... maybe not by a huge amount, but asking them to do work that will reduce their ability to sell us stuff? How likely is that?

This argument may be strong if AC swapping was given away for free. However, most reasonable players asking for this have no issue with there being an associated cost. I think the easiest way to implement and have it most functional is a 1,000-2,000 cartel coin one use token (that can be sold through the gtn). Let a player spend ~£5 each and every time they want to swap AC.

Also, when you purchase a new character slot it provides you with a lot of extras that an AC swap does not. A new character gives you extra inventory space and the ability to run additional dailies, weeklies, OPs lockouts.

There's also the ephemeral aspect that a player that feels invested in a particular character may be more willing to pay for more vanity content.

And, for the 1-50 content there's still 8 strong class stories to experience.

Edited February 4, 2016 by Vhaegrant

[Fevee]

Notice how she didn't say sixteen classes with eight in each faction? Notice how she said each character class can choose from one of two specializations called Advanced Classes.

 

So, no, the subclasses aren't

FUNDAMENTALLY DIFFERENT CLASS DESIGNS, and that AC's were treated as FULL CLASSES, not subclasses.

They are pretty-much cousin classes, they are pretty-much eachother already. So, it's not criminal or game-breaking to ask to switch between the two. (Even if there's a 12-month cooldown) After all, we're not looking to flip-flop between subclasses on a whim, we're looking to swap subclasses because hindsight dictated that it was a poor choice to pick the current subclass, yet one is too invested in their current character to sentence them to oblivion. Edited February 23, 2016 by Fevee

[Ratajack]

Notice how she didn't say sixteen classes with eight in each faction? Notice how she said each character class can choose from one of two specializations called Advanced Classes.

 

So, no, the subclasses aren't They are pretty-much cousin classes, they are pretty-much eachother already. So, it's not criminal or game-breaking to ask to switch between the two. (Even if there's a 12-month cooldown) After all, we're not looking to flip-flop between subclasses on a whim, we're looking to swap subclasses because hindsight dictated that it was a poor choice to pick the current subclass, yet one is too invested in their current character to sentence them to oblivion.

 

All I see is some ORANGE text (not YELLOW as an official post from BW would be) with the word "quote" in front of it. There is no indication of who you are supposedly quoting. I can't help but wonder why you couldn't let us know who "she" is.

 

I can do the same thing with ORANGE text, BTW.

 

See:

 

 

Advance Class is your CLASS. It is NOT simply a spec.

 

 

Notice how "he" says that your advance class is your CLASS and not simply a spec.

 

Now, we all know that was not an official BW statement, just an example of how meaningless your "quote" is.

 

 

I have provided numerous links to official BW statements, along with the names of the BW reps who made those statements in many of the numerous threads regarding this subject. No, I will not do your research for you. If you wish to see those links, the forum search tool should bring up the threads, or even posts.

 

Even Vhaegrant can verify that BW officials DID indeed make the statements I have attributed to them. He may discount them and claim they are no longer valid or relevant, but he cannot truthfully deny those statements were made by BW officials.

 

Those statements are not simply ME claiming that advanced classes were treated as FULL CLASSES WITHIN THEMSELVES and that they are FUNDAMENTALLY DIFFERENT CLASS DESIGNS. This is not a case of me claiming that my opinion is the one and only true law. Those statements were made by BW officials.

 

You can hide your head in the sand or stick your fingers in your ears going "NAH NAH NAH" all you want, but the truth is the truth. You don't have to like it. You don't even have to accept it, but your refusal to accept it does not make it any less the truth.

 

Ultimately, it is the DEVS who decide what is or isn't a class, not you, me or any other player. The devs are ultimately the ones who decide whether or not to allow players to undo a decision they were advised at least 4 separate times by two separate NPC's AND a confirmation pop-up was PERMANENT and COULD NOT BE UNDONE.

 

Thankfully, so far they have held to the decision that they made before the game was released and not implemented this option.

[Ratajack]

This argument may be strong if AC swapping was given away for free. However, most reasonable players asking for this have no issue with there being an associated cost. I think the easiest way to implement and have it most functional is a 1,000-2,000 cartel coin one use token (that can be sold through the gtn). Let a player spend ~£5 each and every time they want to swap AC.

Also, when you purchase a new character slot it provides you with a lot of extras that an AC swap does not. A new character gives you extra inventory space and the ability to run additional dailies, weeklies, OPs lockouts.

There's also the ephemeral aspect that a player that feels invested in a particular character may be more willing to pay for more vanity content.

And, for the 1-50 content there's still 8 strong class stories to experience.

 

IF they allow players to undo a decision they KNEW was PERMANENT when they made that decision, I would hope that the associated cost is not so insignificant as you propose.

 

IF they implement advance class changes, I would like to see them:

 

• 
   
  Create a token available only by direct purchase, using a new currency purchased with RL money other than CC's
   
  Price the token equivalent to the cost of a new 60 character
   
  Make the token bound to legacy upon purchase so that it CANNOT be sold on the GTN
   
  Make the token ONE TIME use
   
  Add a cooldown of at least 30 days.
   
  

 

I think allowing tokens to be purchased with CC's is meaningless as CC's are given as monthly stipends and so that would necessarily create ANY additional revenue for BW. Allowing the tokens to be sold ont he GTN and purchased with credits is meaningless as credits are simply fake, virtual money and they practically rain from the sky.

 

Where is the significant associated cost to undoing a decision you KNEW was permanent if you could do so with either FREE CC's or fake virtual currency that is practically thrown at you?

 

Making the tokens available only for direct purchase using a new currency that can only be purchased with RL money, pricing the tokens equivalent to the cost of a new 60 character, making the tokens BOL and unable to be sold on the GTN, making those tokens ONE TIME use and adding a lengthy cool down DOES add a reasonable associated cost, IMO. This should also insure that each and every time someone chose to UNDO that decision they made KNOWING it was PERMANENT would indeed result in additional revenue for BW.

[Mordresh]

Create a token available only by direct purchase, using a new currency purchased with RL money other than CC's

 

What? Cartel coins are paid for by real money. Subscribers get some each month for paying real money.

[DAMossimo]

"Choices Matter"

 

Get over it and roll an alt.

[Ratajack]

What? Cartel coins are paid for by real money. Subscribers get some each month for paying real money.

 

Notice that I said "no ADDITIONAL revenue".

 

The CC's players receive as a stipend for subscribing or from the referral program do NOT result in any ADDITIONAL revenue for BW.

 

One of the big arguments made by many who want to UNDO a decision the made KNOWING that decision was PERMANENT is that they would pay to do so. They really wouldn't be paying to do so if they are just using FREE CC's they get for doing what they already do in subscribing or from the referral program, would they?

 

So, since so many have claimed to be willing to pay to be able to UNDO that PERMANENT decision, let's let them put their money where their mouths are.

 

Create a new currency that they could pay RL money to purchase. They can use that currency to purchase BOL "decision do-over" tokens with which they can undo that PERMANENT decision.

[Fevee]

All I see is some ORANGE text (not YELLOW as an official post from BW would be) with the word "quote" in front of it. There is no indication of who you are supposedly quoting. I can't help but wonder why you couldn't let us know who "she" is.

 

You apparently never moused over the hyperlink that that quote was, I'm sorry I didn't make it clear enough that a link existed.

 

It was the same color as absolutely every other hyperlink in these forums, after all.

 

I have provided numerous links to official BW statements, along with the names of the BW reps who made those statements in many of the numerous threads regarding this subject. No, I will not do your research for you.

 

You have provided zero links, as far as I can tell. I've used this metaphor before, and I'll use it again. A lawyer doesn't go into court and say "He's guilty, but you have to do your own research ... it's out there somewhere." No, he gathers all the proof into one easy-to-present sitting. You kinda have to do the same if you want any credibility.

Edited February 23, 2016 by Fevee

[Fevee]

This should also insure that each and every time someone chose to UNDO that decision they made KNOWING it was PERMANENT would indeed result in additional revenue for BW.

 

A character's physique and species used to be set in stone, too.

 

Let's say we visit the Grand Canyon, and there's a sign that says "Don't dive into the canyon, it is a permanent and irreversible action." That's because, at the time the sign was planted, there were no safety measures installed. Now, here we are, many years later, and that old rotting sign is still dictating that people shouldn't jump into the canyon. Despite the fact that bungee jumping and safety netting has been invented since then. Now, we've got a crowd of people insisting that canyon administrations install a bungee system so that they can dive into the canyon in a safe and survivable manner.

 

You, however, are camped by that old rotting sign, screaming it's message as though it's scripture. You probably have one or two followers, but the rest of us want to see administration finally install that bungee system (and remove the antiquated sign, while they're at it).

 

Power to the players, a philosophy you vehemently oppose.

Edited February 23, 2016 by Fevee

[TX_Angel]

"Choices Matter"

 

Get over it and roll an alt.

 

I'm a paying customer and this is just a game.

 

Get over it...

[Ratajack]

I'm a paying customer and this is just a game.

 

Get over it...

 

No one is forcing you to pay a dime if you do not like the game or the rules set in place by the devs.

[Ratajack]

You apparently never moused over the hyperlink that that quote was, I'm sorry I didn't make it clear enough that a link existed.

 

It was the same color as absolutely every other hyperlink in these forums, after all.

 

OOOOH. There was a hyperlink, but yet again you refuse to even mention who the "she" is that you are quoting.

 

 

Who is "she"? Is "she" the little girl who lives next door?

 

I may be wrong, bur I find it hard to believe that it was ANY official BW source. I expect that if it were an official BW source, you would have touted that from the mountaintops and not refused to put a name to your anonymous quote.

 

 

You have provided zero links, as far as I can tell. I've used this metaphor before, and I'll use it again. A lawyer doesn't go into court and say "He's guilty, but you have to do your own research ... it's out there somewhere." No, he gathers all the proof into one easy-to-present sitting. You kinda have to do the same if you want any credibility.

 

Again, you choose to stick your finger in your ears going "NAH NAH NAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!I can't hear you."

 

As I said, you can do that all you want, but that does not make the truth any less the truth.

 

But for those who choose to stick their fingers in their ears, I found this link and post within 15 seconds. That does not seem to be an inordinate amount of research, but then again, I am not averse to effort.

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=455383

 

 

 

Greetings,

 

At this time we do not have plans to allow players to switch from one Advanced Class to the other. Here's what Lead Game Designer Daniel Erickson had to say on the subject in one of our Weekly Q&As:

 

 

Aurozia: Will there be a dual specialization system in the future? Will there be a possibility of changing advance classes as well?

 

Daniel Erickson: We have no plans for switching advanced classes - which we see as fundamentally different class designs- but dual spec is in the works and coming soon.

 

 

 

 

 

We hope this sheds some light on the matter. Thank you!

 

 

There are other links and posts that are just as easy to find, should you not be too averse to the minimal effort of searching.

[DAMossimo]

I'm a paying customer and this is just a game.

 

Get over it...

 

We are all paying customers and everyone knows it's just a game.

 

Pointless response. 0/10

[Vhaegrant]

OOOOH. There was a hyperlink, but yet again you refuse to even mention who the "she" is that you are quoting.

 

 

Who is "she"? Is "she" the little girl who lives next door?

 

I may be wrong, bur I find it hard to believe that it was ANY official BW source. I expect that if it were an official BW source, you would have touted that from the mountaintops and not refused to put a name to your anonymous quote.

Did you even bother to follow the link?

 

It's from the official SWTOR You Tube channel and it is a tutorial for new players jumping in at 60.

It doesn't go against what the official site refers to as Class or Advanced Class, and even goes as far to state that Advanced Class is a level of specialisation.

[Fevee]

Who is "she"? Is "she" the little girl who lives next door?

 

I may be wrong, bur I find it hard to believe that it was ANY official BW source. I expect that if it were an official BW source, you would have touted that from the mountaintops and not refused to put a name to your anonymous quote.

 

Y'know, you're just full of it.

 

Is that video not SWTOR's official Youtube channel? I suppose the fact I found it via link through SWTOR's very launcher doesn't give it any credibility. After all, the launcher is always providing links to everyone random Joe and Sue saying whatever they feel like saying.

 

Again, you choose to stick your finger in your ears going "NAH NAH NAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!I can't hear you."

 

That more accurately describes you. You are still camped by that rotting old sign, screaming it's message like scripture. The rest of us are a little more ahead of the times, you're welcome to catch up, if ever you obtain the willpower.