Subscriber Rewards? Musco.... Really? How About Us Founders??

[DarthDymond]

I never hard to buy rise of hutt cartel. I suppose I got it for free with the expansion.

Nope - I was just being a dumb-dumb, Party Jawa was a subscriber reward from early on, I was thinking of the Hutt Holo-statue trainer.

Edited December 3, 2015 by DarthDymond

[CrazyCT]

Except for the fact that the developers said during the end of open beta and after launch (all the way up until F2P) that they would continue to add more CE rewards to the game such as adding more items to the CE vendor (which never happened). Hell i don't think even the VIP vendor has been updated since launch

 

They HAVE added more. OK, the stuff isn't "OMG You have to look at this", but there's a couple more pets, decorations etc. Maybe you just didn't notice

 

EDIT: They've also updated the Security Key vendor with a mount and some furniture

Edited December 3, 2015 by CrazyCT

[Xhelis]

Just a quick question - how long do you have to have been subbed to get "the Loyal" title?

 

I know it's early in the day for some, but at least put some effort into reading and comprehension.

[CrazyCT]

I know it's early in the day for some, but at least put some effort into reading and comprehension.

 

I just wanted to know. How do you define "loyal"? Can't the new subs be "loyal"? Maybe they ARE loyal, and didn't have the money till now, but they will stay subbed for the rest of the life of the game. How long will they have to stay subbed before you include them in your definition?

[TriggerBlade]

I don't get the accusation of "whining". As a paying customer you do have a right to complain about a product you are unhappy with; this is a fact. There is nothing "entitled" about being upset over broken promises and whether it was a slip of the tongue or not, Bioware has made promises in the past that they have broken.

 

I'll note, because this is a garbage defense that is repeatedly spouted, one does not have to say "I promise" to make a promise. Simply saying you will do something is making a promise. You don't defend a politician who failed to follow up with his staements by saying "Well he never said 'I promise'".

 

In the end constantly accusing people of being "entitled" only hurts yourself as well. Because one day you'll have something to complain about and then you'll be accused of being "entitled" because you're unhappy.

 

To those who are unhappy with an aspect of the game and don't voice their unhappiness, you're only being the fool for accepting your displeasure and continuing to pay money for a product you're not fully enjoying.

 

Edit: In case someone decides to think they're all smart and accuse me of something from my ending statement, I do enjoy this game. I play it solely for the story elements and that's what I am getting. Though I have the ability to sympathize with those who enjoy the other aspects.

Edited December 3, 2015 by TriggerBlade

[Beltane]

I don't get the accusation of "whining". As a paying customer you do have a right to complain about a product you are unhappy with; this is a fact. There is nothing "entitled" about being upset over broken promises and whether it was a slip of the tongue or not, Bioware has made promises in the past that they have broken.

 

Yes, exactly.

 

I'm not going anywhere, I'm not entitled, but when they kept hyping "subscriber rewards" I got excited because I thought about all the other games I've played with in-depth and interesting veteran/subscriber tier rewards. Only to find out the promotion is basically limited time offers ONLY.

 

If they had called it "subscriber incentives" or "limited time offers for subscribing" I wouldn't have one ounce of resentment. But subscriber rewards IMO means a reward for subscribing long term, that anyone can potentially get (i.e. if there's a reward for subscribing for 6 months, anyone who subs for that long can get it, which is a lot different from "subscribe by x date for y reward).

 

I don't get why we aren't allowed to be disappointed.

[FAAmecanic]

My feedback is that I am incredibly disappointed that BW is spending substantial resources to create a fluff alternate POV chapter rather than use those resources on what players want ie new operations, FPS or warzones. Heck even more main story content would be better than a HK-55 chapter.

 

^^This^^ so much this.

 

Also the dumbing down of just about everything in SWTOR has me considering the unsub button. And mandatory PvP requirements are just wrong (I like PvP in other games, just not this one). Day 1 player, close beta tester as well.

 

Too many new games out there, too many new MMOs (my Elderscrolls account is crying for attention anyway).

 

Anyway...flame away to show the power of your epeen.

[Fazaani]

Hi, I'm a founder, and I got the title I paid for. Should I get more? No

 

I also bought the Collectors Edition and got the Malgus statue I paid for. Should I get more now? **** no, I already got what I paid for. I bought a car 2 years ago, can I get a free tank of fuel for it cause I kept it? Sure. Really? No!

 

^^ this

[Xhelis]

I just wanted to know. How do you define "loyal"? Can't the new subs be "loyal"? Maybe they ARE loyal, and didn't have the money till now, but they will stay subbed for the rest of the life of the game. How long will they have to stay subbed before you include them in your definition?

 

The distinction I was making is that Bioware really isn't referring to current, older subs specifically with the newprogram. They are referring to newer subs. This likely why some of the older, longer subs feel slighted by the new program. Personally, I've been a sub since day 1. Bioware is wanting to attract new subs, which they should, but not slight older subs at the same time.

Edited December 3, 2015 by Xhelis

[Icebergy]

Hi, I'm a founder, and I got the title I paid for. Should I get more? No

 

I also bought the Collectors Edition and got the Malgus statue I paid for. Should I get more now? **** no, I already got what I paid for. I bought a car 2 years ago, can I get a free tank of fuel for it cause I kept it? Sure. Really? No!

 

This is probably the worst analogy I've ever seen on these forums, and that is saying something.

 

To keep with your gas idea, its more like if you bought your gas from the same place for two years and they decided to give you a free tank to say thanks. Is it required? No, but it sure is nice of them and will probably make you want to keep buying gas from them.

 

Keeping with that same idea, say Bioware is that gas station. They make a huge announcement, put out commercials, newspaper ads, etc that they are going to reward people like you for buying their gas loyally. Then that "reward" turns out to be a punch card where you buy 12 more tanks of gas and get a free hotdog at the end.

[Trobon]

The distinction I was making is that Bioware really isn't referring to current, older subs specifically with the newprogram. They are referring to newer subs. This likely why some of the older, longer subs feel slighted by the new program. Personally, I've been a sub since day 1. Bioware is wanting to attract new subs, which they should, but no slight older subs at the same time.

 

I don't see it as a slight towards me in the least. I have the same opportunity to get this as anyone else and don't feel like I should or shouldn't get more than that. The truth is I paid my sub so I could play the game. If they want to give me something else then that's fine. If they don't that's fine too. I'm a little disappointed with the time-gating on these rewards recently (I ended up not getting Nico because I couldn't sub during the right times), but not to the extent that I am going to quit over it.

 

What I don't understand is why someone would feel slighted over this. If there had never been a rewards program then you and I would get nothing either way. This rewards program just gives everyone the opportunity to get something while also creating an opportunity for Bioware to get more money. Personally, I'd like them to keep making money because I am enjoying the game and would like to be able to continue to do so.

[Trobon]

This is probably the worst analogy I've ever seen on these forums, and that is saying something.

 

To keep with your gas idea, its more like if you bought your gas from the same place for two years and they decided to give you a free tank to say thanks. Is it required? No, but it sure is nice of them and will probably make you want to keep buying gas from them.

 

Keeping with that same idea, say Bioware is that gas station. They make a huge announcement, put out commercials, newspaper ads, etc that they are going to reward people like you for buying their gas loyally. Then that "reward" turns out to be a punch card where you buy 12 more tanks of gas and get a free hotdog at the end.

 

So like when Starbucks started a loyalty program and didn't retroactively give it to everyone who had bought their coffees over the years?

 

The truth is this is how most loyalty programs work in the real world. They start the program and then loyal customers can begin earning rewards, but typically they don't retroactively give it to everyone.

[Icebergy]

So like when Starbucks started a loyalty program and didn't retroactively give it to everyone who had bought their coffees over the years?

 

The truth is this is how most loyalty programs work in the real world. They start the program and then loyal customers can begin earning rewards, but typically they don't retroactively give it to everyone.

 

Did Starbucks endlessly hype it up as a way to reward long term loyal customers?

[Xhelis]

This rewards program just gives everyone the opportunity to get something while also creating an opportunity for Bioware to get more money. Personally, I'd like them to keep making money because I am enjoying the game and would like to be able to continue to do so.

 

I do agree with this 100%, if Bioware has said "We're instituting a new rewards program for peoplewho sub and stayed a sub" all would have been fine. That isn't what they said. It was their intention, but not what they said. They referred to it as a loyalty, rewards program which is the crux of the issue. I'm all for rewards moving forward to reward everyone, including new subs, regardless of what the rewards are, but to the longer subs it appears that Bioware is only rewarding new subs with the program, regardless of sub length. Another game does offer vetern rewards. The longer you are a sub, the better the rewards are over time. This would have been a much better solution.

[Trobon]

Did Starbucks endlessly hype it up as a way to reward long term loyal customers?

 

Well I can't tell you for sure, but seeing how this is corporate America I'm going to say... Probably?

 

The truth is they were hyped. I've worked for a gaming company and the marketing people are people who get hyped about something that you or I may not always be. I know a lot of people were disappointed, but this was an unprecedented announcement, especially from their point of view.

 

They had never before offered anywhere near a bonus chapter of story as a loyalty reward. It was a large announcement for them, just not the one some people were hoping for.

 

That being said, endlessly is a bit of hyperbole for something that was announced on twitter about a week before the actual stream, with a few employees also tweeting a couple times. The forumites hyped this far more than they did.

[Transcendent]

No one forced you to be a sub for four years, the fact that you did subscribe for that amount of time must mean that you took some enjoyment out of it.

 

Just this part holds true enough, if you've played the game for this long and have been a subscriber for this long, then the developers have rewarded you enough with engaging content to while away those moments in time.

 

No-one needs a title to acknowledge this (although if you've completed any achievements you probably have already been rewarded with a title for doing so.).

 

I take no issue with the subscriber rewards (incentives?), if you were intending to subscribe anyway, then they're just an added bonus. As a draw for potential new subscribers, only time will tell if that will work.

[Callaron]

yeah, I was kinda facepalming at the whole "loyal long term subscribers... meaning only since KOTFE.

 

sigh. oh well. not like its unexpected, giving cherry picked quotes in the stream among other things.

 

I've pretty much resigned myself to fact that this game will never do real veteran rewards.

[Trobon]

I do agree with this 100%, if Bioware has said "We're instituting a new rewards program for peoplewho sub and stayed a sub" all would have been fine. That isn't what they said. It was their intention, but not what they said. They referred to it as a loyalty, rewards program which is the crux of the issue. I'm all for rewards moving forward to reward everyone, including new subs, regardless of what the rewards are, but to the longer subs it appears that Bioware is only rewarding new subs with the program, regardless of sub length. Another game does offer vetern rewards. The longer you are a sub, the better the rewards are over time. This would have been a much better solution.

 

I'm biased. I hate vet rewards. I think they are an awful thing that only ends up dividing the community. A lot of times I end up feeling worse for having something that others would probably have more fun with than I do.

 

However, the issue for you seems to be with their usage of "loyalty". Now I agree, that it is not a necessary term for this program, but I don't think it is not an improper term either. They are rewarding loyalty, just not previous loyalty. They are rewarding those who stick with them through the coming chapters, and who don't unsub just so they can pick it all up once 16 comes out. Again, I liken this to something like Starbucks and their loyalty program. It doesn't matter how many coffees I bought before the program started, because it wasn't part of that loyalty program.

 

I can understand why you don't like them using the term loyalty, but I personally disagree that they should have used a different term.

[Reno_Tarshil]

Just this part holds true enough, if you've played the game for this long and have been a subscriber for this long, then the developers have rewarded you enough with engaging content to while away those moments in time.

 

No-one needs a title to acknowledge this (although if you've completed any achievements you probably have already been rewarded with a title for doing so.).

 

I take no issue with the subscriber rewards (incentives?), if you were intending to subscribe anyway, then they're just an added bonus. As a draw for potential new subscribers, only time will tell if that will work.

 

This. Bonus Rewards are just bonus rewards for people who were already going to sub.

[Alssaran]

There is no reasonable explanation to tie this subscriber reward promotion to the months covering January the 11th up until August the 1st.

 

Nobody else in this industry has ever found a good reason to tie subscriber rewards, awarded for staying with the game, to a specific timeframe within the anticipated content release cycle. This isn't a subscriber reward promotion for loyal customers, it's a desperate attempt to push something shiny in front of the glaringly obvious hole that is KotFE replayability up until the ending of season 1 in August. They were so keen on announcing this new business model, they forgot to ask important questions. A few weeks ago Eric and his team were standing around the water cooler, when the intern suddenly realized: "Guys. What's keeping people from just spending 12,99€ in August instead of giving us continued revenue?". A stroke later Eric and his team were sitting at their machines, hastily coming up with a subscriber reward promotion.

 

A subscriber reward promotion would be tied to the total amounts of months in a subscriber plan. A subscriber retention meassure would be tied to being subscribed in a certain timeframe with less content than anticipated.

 

Go ahead. Explain to me why a reward promotion, advertised as an announcement for "loyal" subscribers, has to be tied to a certain timeframe, not to overall months in a subscriber payment plan. I'll wait. I'm probably going to see Half-Life 3 before someone can make a good argument, but I'll wait.

Edited December 3, 2015 by Alssaran

[Trobon]

There is no reasonable explanation to tie this subscriber reward promotion to the months covering January the 11th up until August the 1st.

 

Nobody else in this industry has ever found a good reason to tie subscriber rewards, awarded for staying with the game, to a specific timeframe within the anticipated content release cycle. This isn't a subscriber reward promotion for loyal customers, it's a desperate attempt to push something shiny in front of the glaringly obvious hole that is KotFE replayability up until the ending of season 1 in August.

 

A subscriber reward promotion would be tied to the total amounts of months in a subscriber plan. A subscriber retention meassure would be tied to being subscribed in a certain timeframe with less content than anticipated.

 

Go ahead. Explain to me why a reward promotion, advertised as an announcement for "loyal" subscribers has to be tied to a certain timeframe, not to overall months in a subscriber payment plan. I'll wait. I'm probably going to see Half-Life 3 before someone can make a good argument, but I'll wait.

 

Its about loyal players for the exact reason that you've already said. Look, let's be honest here. It would be very easy for everyone who wants to play KotFE to just unsub until chapter 16 and then resub for a month. However, if everyone did that then we wouldn't see the game live that long.

 

What they need are people who are going to stay subbed through it. That is loyalty, just not the loyalty that you want to see rewarded.

[Alssaran]

Its about loyal players for the exact reason that you've already said. Look, let's be honest here. It would be very easy for everyone who wants to play KotFE to just unsub until chapter 16 and then resub for a month. However, if everyone did that then we wouldn't see the game live that long.

 

And that's the pressing issue here. The glaringly obvious hole that they forgot to take into account when pressing forward with KotFE. I edited a little scenario into my post.

 

What they need are people who are going to stay subbed through it. That is loyalty, just not the loyalty that you want to see rewarded.

 

Yes, let's be honest here.

 

Trying to shove a subscriber retention meassure into my face as a "subscriber reward program" is lazy game design. Period. This should be a no brainer here. If they haven't planned enough content for an expansion covering at least three or four months, something that I'm supposed to pay a 140€ MMO subscriber fee for? That is lazy design at its best.

 

That is trying to ignore the obvious elephant in the room, while at the same time finding a sleazy way out of designing less and less content for the same amount of money going forward. Rewards are nice, but don't try to make them a fancy substitution for releasing and developing enough content. Not much content, but just enough of it. Trying to make people stay subbed through KotFE with a subscriber retention meassure is having a lazy designer team at its best. Don't come up with fancy distractions. Go into their room, turn of their Netflix tv and tell them to work.

Edited December 3, 2015 by Alssaran

[JulesKor]

Every service you subscribe to, every utility you pay for, every financial institution you bank with will always have a "reward" to attract new business. All the "honeymoon" deals that are offered in advertising are always for new customers only regardless of how long "you" have been with said company.

When was the last time your financial institution said to you, "We've got this great new home loan at a ridiculous low rate for the first 12 months. You've had your home loan with us for 15 years now, so we're doing the same for you, enjoy"?

Gone are the days when loyalty to a single company is recognised - you used to get a gold watch and an envelope full of cash for staying in the same company for a long, long time... now, people just ask, "What's wrong with you?! Why are you still here?"

It's sad, but it's the truth

[AlienEyeTX]

yeah, I was kinda facepalming at the whole "loyal long term subscribers... meaning only since KOTFE.

 

sigh. oh well. not like its unexpected, giving cherry picked quotes in the stream among other things.

 

Long-term can mean past or future. It's actually kind of nice to tell people ahead of time what they will get for sticking around.

[Effec]

I AM A FOUNDER!!!

 

Now with that said big deal, I just want better rewards and mostly content to keep my playing. Just because I started in Bata does not mean I should get BIGGER/BETTER things then the last person who has only subscribed for a year.

Edited December 4, 2015 by Effec