Psychopyro Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 I play a Hatred Assassin and have zero problems. What's your next rebuttal? So your Assassin can do republic quests now? I wanna see this.... While yes I did get the quest done, is a bit overtuned (the video is from 2 days ago). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShepardSpock Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 And I dont want buffs either I want companions restored back to pre 4.0 That would be better but that's not going to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaximusRex Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Have you done Makeb heroics on Republic side? Viper's Nest? Try them with healing companion. It seems like there are only a few Heroics people are using to justify the nerf being too much. Maybe the nerf is too much, I don't have enough data to tell, but if its only these few heroics that are a problem maybe those heroics need to be nerfed instead. People were complaining about Makeb heroics before the nerf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaximusRex Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 I'm not sure which is sadder, OP having a daughter or OP making up a daughter to make a point on an MMO forum. People making up who is or isn't a majority/minority when there is about zero actual data to support any of it is actually the saddest thing, especially since argumentum ad populum is a logical fallacy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Grand_Nagus Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 People making up who is or isn't a majority/minority when there is about zero actual data to support any of it is actually the saddest thing, especially since argumentum ad populum is a logical fallacy. I get the logical fallacy, but you have to admit there are certain things that common sense tells you the majority of people support. Obviously, the majority of people would rather live than die. That's lot a logical fallacy to say. While not quite as obvious, I think it is also safe to say that based on human nature, most people prefer easy to hard. Hence my point in this post: http://www.swtor.com/community/showpost.php?p=8648004&postcount=77 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ksen Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Choice = More customers. More customers = more money for new content. More people to group with. More people to pvp with. TOR was supposed to be the mythical 'WoW - Killer' - it had so much potential - the amount of money spent on development was the largest for a game at that time. Yet if fell so hard. Different people have differing opinions on why. For me, it was just too hard - the furthest I managed to get my highest was 46 (with half a dozen 30+) before I left - Star Wars The Old Republic simply was NOT Fun for me. When I returned I was not all that surprised to find even TorHead had closed. I rely so heavily on WowHead when I play wow, to me when I noted Torhead had closed it simply told me that it was nowhere near the success it had originally promised to be. Plus with more Server Mergers ahead - the first one p*ssed me off so much, I was pre order and was promised Head Start to 'Reserve Names' ... I lost all but two names in the first server merge - the two I managed to keep are my own first and middle name (an Agent and Smuggler respectlively). Had I lost those I would probably have been too p*ssed off to have returned. The threat of further Server Mergers looms and I am dreading losing my character names again ... then, all of a sudden and totally unexpected the servers needed to Increase their capacity! This was a good time for Tor ... it was finally moving in the direction it should have launched at. MMO's cannot afford to be 'generic' at this point - and Tor had become simply another generic mmo with lightsabers. Until 4.0. 4.0 turned Tor around ... there was a steady growth of characters now instead of a steady decline ... then 4.0.2 ... The number of people leaving says it all. Yep i unsub after 4.0.2 Not only because of comp nerf - all this new bugs and glitches irks me. But 4.0.2 was the last straw.. I think i resub latter but at this moment this game not very comfy or fun to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reno_Tarshil Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 It seems like there are only a few Heroics people are using to justify the nerf being too much. Maybe the nerf is too much, I don't have enough data to tell, but if its only these few heroics that are a problem maybe those heroics need to be nerfed instead. People were complaining about Makeb heroics before the nerf. I've listed 3 Heroics in the front page of the feedback thread that should be address in terms of solo friendly play. Every other planetary Heroic I have ran has been solo friendly. If those 3 (and it doesn't have to be all 3) arn't adjusted in some way, idk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beachdudeca Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Anyone that does not want a Buff Companion should just use Rank 1 Companions , its that friggen simple ,,, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geschmonz Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 (edited) People making up who is or isn't a majority/minority when there is about zero actual data to support any of it is actually the saddest thing, especially since argumentum ad populum is a logical fallacy. You ignore the fact there are polls in this forum showing that 70% are unhappy with the nerf, and that there are statistics of MMORPGs showing minority and majority gameplay. And believe me, challenging gameplay often does not even manage to get higher than 10%. You are suffering from a narrow tunnel vision, and dont even see it. Edited November 21, 2015 by geschmonz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorrdan Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Yes i have and felt they where perfectly fine playing as vanguard Take your lvl 55 character to oricon on a dps class with low lvl influence companion. Solo the heroic without dying multiple times and post the video. Till then i am not gonna take anything you says seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Grand_Nagus Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 You ignore the fact there are polls in this forum showing that 70% are unhappy with the nerf, and that there are statistics of MMORPGs showing minority and majority gameplay. And believe me, challenging gameplay often does not even manage to get higher than 10%. You are suffering from a narrow tunnel vision, and dont even see it. Forum polls are meaningless for 2 reasons: 1) the people who actually use the forums are only a small minority of the total playerbase, and therefore do not accurately reflect the playerbase as a whole. 2) people are more likely to be vocal when they are unhappy, meaning the people who are being vocal on the forums are disproportionately unhappy compared to the people who do not post on the forums. All of that said, I repeat my previous point: society as a whole and human nature show that people in general prefer easy to hard. So I don't need a poll to tell me what is already obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geschmonz Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Forum polls are meaningless for 2 reasons: 1) the people who actually use the forums are only a small minority of the total playerbase, and therefore do not accurately reflect the playerbase as a whole. 2) people are more likely to be vocal when they are unhappy, meaning the people who are being vocal on the forums are disproportionately unhappy compared to the people who do not post on the forums. All of that said, I repeat my previous point: society as a whole and human nature show that people in general prefer easy to hard. So I don't need a poll to tell me what is already obvious. Well, yes, forums are viewed by a small minority. The problem is that forums are mainly used by the most engaged players, means hardcore players.. if you would add all those people who dont view the forums, you probably would get a way higher rate, as the most engaged players already watch the forums. I myself prefer a low and medium challenge and focus completely on story and fun. I am sure there are a lot of players like me in a game like SWTOR.. whichs strenghth actually is the story and the accessibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draqsko Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 THE forums do not count as majority less than 10% of playerbase comes to forum so stop deluding your self They aren't buffing them because of the forums, so stop deluding yourself. They are buffing them because people voted with their wallets, and apparently more people voted with their wallets against the nerf than for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Grand_Nagus Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Well, yes, forums are viewed by a small minority. The problem is that forums are mainly used by the most engaged players, means hardcore players.. if you would add all those people who dont view the forums, you probably would get a way higher rate, as the most engaged players already watch the forums. "A way higher rate" of what, exactly? Your statement is somewhat vague, so I want to make sure I actually understand what you mean before I reply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geschmonz Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 (edited) "A way higher rate" of what, exactly? Your statement is somewhat vague, so I want to make sure I actually understand what you mean before I reply. I meant that the forum is being watched mainly by engaged players. Hardcore players. And they already voted for 70% against the nerf. Now imagine, all normal and low level players would use the forum as well. Do you think the percentage value would get higher or lower? I think it would get a lot higher, as those who look for challenges actually are engaged players mainly who actively use forums, blogs and streams. So the 70% are the lowest bottom percentage, from my point of view. Edited November 21, 2015 by geschmonz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorrdan Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 They aren't buffing them because of the forums, so stop deluding yourself. They are buffing them because people voted with their wallets, and apparently more people voted with their wallets against the nerf than for it. OP is infarct deluding himself. If forum represent such an insignificant minority why the hell would Eric even bother asking feedback here? he could have easily done so on facebook or reddit or twitter. Op just can not accept the reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamAnders Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 OP is infarct deluding himself. If forum represent such an insignificant minority why the hell would Eric even bother asking feedback here? he could have easily done so on facebook or reddit or twitter. Op just can not accept the reality. He's also just a pure troll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draqsko Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Hell, back when I still had a guild our ops healer used to yell: "remove you pants too!" when I was tanking and not taking enough damage to keep him invested, after I had already removed my chest armor My girlfriend just starts throwing rocks past me when I'm not taking enough damage for her to heal me. See pebbles go flying by and I'll be like, I didn't know we had a sage dps on this run... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draqsko Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 I don't blame them, bioware has shown that if you get enough people angry at them over something they will respond to a plan to fix things for you in under a week. Complaining about things you don't like, and trying to motivate others who might agree with you to make the largest stink you can about it seems like a pretty viable plan now. Bioware doesn't listen to hollow threats, but they do listen when it hits their wallets. So that only works if people man up and have the balls to unsub. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draqsko Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 People making up who is or isn't a majority/minority when there is about zero actual data to support any of it is actually the saddest thing, especially since argumentum ad populum is a logical fallacy. And what you just posted is one too... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_fallacy Argument from fallacy is the formal fallacy of analyzing an argument and inferring that, since it contains a fallacy, its conclusion must be false. Fallacious arguments can arrive at true conclusions, so this is an informal fallacy of relevance. And then there is this part Argumentum ad logicam can be used as an ad hominem appeal: by impugning the opponent's credibility or good faith it can be used to sway the audience by undermining the speaker, rather than addressing the speaker's argument. So you are also dipping into that territory too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WulframH Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Take your lvl 55 character to oricon on a dps class with low lvl influence companion. Solo the heroic without dying multiple times and post the video. Till then i am not gonna take anything you says seriously. If you're citing a specific Heroic, then that's a sign that Heroic is too tough, not that the companions are too weak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draqsko Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 (edited) OP is infarct deluding himself. If forum represent such an insignificant minority why the hell would Eric even bother asking feedback here? he could have easily done so on facebook or reddit or twitter. Op just can not accept the reality. They always ask for feedback, but they never do anything with it for several weeks to a month. No, the feedback had nothing to do with this buff. He wrote that post before they even got halfway through that thread given the number of posts in it that popped up overnight. They seen something else that pushed them, that's why it happened in literally days. There's already a preliminary patch for the buff on the servers just not activated yet, so I think they will be adding more to it on Monday, probably bug fixes like the dead bodies issue but also possibly more buffs because tank and dps companions weren't touched yet. Edited November 21, 2015 by Draqsko Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psicotic Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 They aren't buffing them because of the forums, so stop deluding yourself. They are buffing them because people voted with their wallets, and apparently more people voted with their wallets against the nerf than for it. I vote on the forums and with my wallet too and not resub until i see the changes on live server not just numbers on the monday response from Eric. Other 7 ppl i know dont came to forums they just unsub and put on his page account the reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uruare Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 Considering most of the pro nerf crowd use the word challenge to describe tedious trash grinding consisting of no mechanics, is it really a surprise? No surprise at all, nope. I sometimes wonder if those same sorts don't think long loading screens are challenging too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabenschwinge Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 They are Perfectly fine the way they are after 4.0 they where beyond to strong. the people complaining of them not being strong enough no are just not wanting to play with more thought than a 3 year old is capable of putting into the game. After 4.0 I put my 3 year old on the game to keep her out of my hair while I worked on a customers computer. She was able to complete 80% of chapter 1 on her own beyond me just telling her what direction she needed to go I would not say they are perfectly fine. Damage and tank companions are walking CC breakers in favour of the enemy (unless you disable half their skills) and I would prefer if the had stats more similar like a player character in purple standard gear for their role, rather than a giant hit point pool and no defence and damage reduction at all. But I concur in so far as that they are powerful enough as they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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