iacon Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 (edited) "People are leaving the game". Uh, yeah, and the sun is bright and hot. The ocean is wet. Rocks are hard. People come, people go. You will never have a player base that does not change. The companion nerf is just one among many reasons for leaving. It is also likely is a reason people stay. And it is definitely not the most drastic change that has been done (change from skill tree to disciplines). So please, enough with the doom and gloom already. Edited November 20, 2015 by iacon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pirate_Scuba Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Yep but this is closer You Sir, Have won the internet today - Congratulations!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxHellsmokexx Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Did you even read what I linked you? That tells you all you need to know about why EA is not even remotely close to worst company ever. No I didn't look at what you linked. I saw enough of their damage control back then when it happened and their pathetic response to it. I am not some sheep you can lead to propaganda I do my research and I am very good at it. I have been for many years now as such topics interest me. The company is crap and ruining gaming as we know it. This is why they were awarded with this honor. They are dirty and will rip you off and not even make the slightest effort to give you a solid product or keep that product up once you have paid. They are in love with the microtransaction model and it ruins games. They will pull all kinds of low stunts to force you to go in on it as well. I remember times when beating a game would give you an epic reward. Now..epic rewards are only found on the cartel market and that is EA games. The whole early access stunt, the sudden nerf of companions back to or worse than they were, it was planned. There is no way they miscalculated a difference of 70% or so..you can feed that crap to someone else. That was someone trying to be slick and it blew up in their face. Now it is time to fix it or pay hard for being so bold and thinking people are that stupid. You can defend them all you want I really don't care. I believe his was the last game I got that involved EA games and it will stay that way too. The only reason they continue to get money from me here is because I already spent my money on the collectors edition way back then and I love starwars. The things they are doing now are taking all the fun out of the game and I know I wont last much longer. I notice myself getting annoyed after being logged in a while and it gets worse with every patch. The spell is breaking and once it does I will make sure it doesn't get another chance to get a hold of me. There are much better games coming out and I have better things to do than get annoyed at what is supposed to be fun and the fanboys defending it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fallensouls Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 (edited) Wow you guys are so smart how ever did we live without your wisdom? Companion too easy mode for you? Then turn off the OP skill like I did. No I would rather complain for 3 weeks on the forums" Im bored my companion too OP", when all you had to do was turn off one or two skills which was easier. you have no argument for that. you just wanted to ruin other peoples fun, that's cool. But your selfishness has a cost it always does. Many players are upset on already low number servers. Id rather be a little bored than not have people to play with or against in PVP. You know what your really not smart at all, you didn't look at the big picture you wanted to be lazy and selfish. FYI I bet I am one of the very few who turned the skills off because I am smart. Edited November 20, 2015 by Fallensouls Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxHellsmokexx Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Wow you guys are so smart how ever did we live without your wisdom? Companion too easy mode for you? Then turn off the OP skill like I did. No I would rather complain for 3 weeks on the forums" Im bored my companion too OP", when all you had to do was turn off one or two skills which was easier. you have no argument for that. you just wanted to ruin other peoples fun, that's cool. But your selfishness has a cost it always does. Many players are upset on already low number servers. Id rather be a little bored than not have people to play with or against in PVP. You know what your really not smart at all, you didn't look at the big picture you wanted to be lazy and selfish. FYI I bet I am one of the very few who turned the skills off because I am smart. It was never about the challenge for them, that was simply their excuse. It's about them not wanting others to get ahead and about others not calling for help anymore. If everyone can play the game solo all the "big shots" can't show off their toys anymore and how "leet" they are. Regular content was never a challenge and still isn't, it just got more annoying and takes longer. Oh boy is this fun!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
x_Boots_x Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 I also play mostly just PvP, but with 4.0 I actually enjoyed doing PvE stuff for the first time, and it felt good to get some credits... now I consider dropping my sub, and that even though I play since launch. This is me as well, after leveling many toons early on, I have since, mostly PVPed, however the changes in companions made leveling less of a grind fest and I focused on max leveling the majority of my characters(29 across 2 accounts), now it's back to being a tedious and unplayable once again, too bad cause bioware actually made a correct decision for once and of course ruined it inside of 2 weeks. Leveling should never have been intended to be the "challenge" that a small but obnoxious minority claim that is was for them, that's what end game content should be for, but instead a chance to learn your character and do story stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Severitus Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 I assure you,if your beloved EA felt a noticable enough drop in subscribers in such a short time there would be a PR operation to prevent it and so far it is silence. You would've thought the same thing after Blizzard made their infamous "No-flying" announcement a few months ago. A big player backlash occurred, flaming on the forums for both sides of the discussion, so all-in-all very similar to what's happening here. There was silence for a while from Blizzard, seems it just took them a long time to actually find their thinking caps and use them (there were probably some behind the scenes "talks" between devs, PR folks, and people that actually know business models). I suspect something similar is happening right now at Bioware. What it all really boils down to is that, when it comes to corporations, money talks. The devs can shout to the high heavens about their "vision" for the game, but in the end, it comes down to players speaking with their wallets. If this change is too much for you, unsub...end of story. You can type on the forums until you get arthritis, but the only thing that they will truly listen to is the power of your wallet. If you feel strongly against this change, unsub, period. Don't wait around for a few weeks "hoping" things will change. Unsub, that's the only way your opinion is truly voiced. (If you do unsub, make sure you specifically state why in the comment block they give you) Conversely, if you like the state of the game right now, then either sub or continue your sub. If number of subs goes way down, the business people win the argument and tell the devs to shove their "vision" and the change gets reverted or tweeked back closer to what it was. If subs don't go down, the devs win the argument and the change will stay in place. It really is just that simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
x_Boots_x Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 "People are leaving the game". Uh, yeah, and the sun is bright and hot. The ocean is wet. Rocks are hard. People come, people go. You will never have a player base that does not change. The companion nerf is just one among many reasons for leaving. It is also likely is a reason people stay. And it is definitely not the most drastic change that has been done (change from skill tree to disciplines). So please, enough with the doom and gloom already. Complete nonsense, adding extra grind will never be a reason for people to stay, it can only be a negative, use common sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psychopyro Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 (edited) Everytime someone brings up worst company award. http://1.media.dorkly.cvcdn.com/37/94/c5817d6dc2d8866146dac2ccc7cab713-eas-reponse-to-being-named-the-worst-company-in-america.jpg The problem is he comes off as snide, arrogant, uncaring, and oblivious to reality... No one doubts those other companies are worse. However, failing customer service should not be something a CEO takes lightly, no matter how stupid the voters seem... He does nothing but make it worse. Edited November 20, 2015 by Psychopyro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghisallo Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 I just have to say to the OP... Read this OP http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=855014 No one who did the content before Tuesday would say those medium and hard goals at the bottom of the list were met. Heck before this came out the main complaint about the planetary failed were no longer a steam roll making them a grind. So by the goals of BW the companions were OP, at least at end game. This is a simple fact. There is a difference between something being OP and a Player enjoying said OP state. I have no problem with the people who say they did not want a grind and the OP companions eliminitaed it or at least minimized it. But again the fact that the companions were OP can not be debated now that BW has actually given us the goals they had for perceived difficulty. If you disagree with those goals fine, but that being the case blaming whiners and falsely accusing people of lying is far from appropriate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reno_Tarshil Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 The problem is he comes off as snide, arrogant, uncaring, and oblivious to reality... No one doubts those other companies are worse. However, failing customer service should not be something a CEO takes lightly, no matter how stupid the voters seem... He does nothing but make it worse. I'm not saying he's a saint or anything but he brings up a very good point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knockerz Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 (edited) I also play mostly just PvP, but with 4.0 I actually enjoyed doing PvE stuff for the first time, and it felt good to get some credits... now I consider dropping my sub, and that even though I play since launch. I have cancelled my subscription. I waited until after 4.0.2 to make judgement. I frankly don't care what the people who want a challenge say. BW has to decide if they want to keep those players who want a challenge with weaker companions or players who want their op companions. If they can find a middle ground fine, but if not they have to choose who they want to keep. Edited November 20, 2015 by Knockerz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghisallo Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Everytime someone brings up worst company award. http://1.media.dorkly.cvcdn.com/37/94/c5817d6dc2d8866146dac2ccc7cab713-eas-reponse-to-being-named-the-worst-company-in-america.jpg I know. Any opt in internet poll is useless. Anyone that understands polling gets this. I always think about the AOL poll about Clinton and should he resign... A majority of Americans (52%) said yes. Well Gallup, the gold standard in polling, said it was more like 21%. The reason? People who were against Clinton were far more motivated to hunt down the poll or share it with their friends. Same as how yesterday I saw someone start a thread telling people to go to metacritic. Something actually depresses me though. With how obvious it is such polls are flawed, people will keep pointing to them if they concur with their opinion. Do people really need outside validation that badly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psychopyro Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 I'm not saying he's a saint or anything but he brings up a very good point. Not saying he doesn't... But there are better things he could have done. To publicly say essentially we don't care about customer service because other companies have done far worse then us and you people are still stupid enough to buy our products and make us money hand over fist.... I really would have been better to just say FU and be done with it... At least it would have been honest... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed-Ykic Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 It's Bioware, not EAware. Just call them what they resemble.....SOE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghisallo Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Not saying he doesn't... But there are better things he could have done. To publicly say essentially we don't care about customer service because other companies have done far worse then us and you people are still stupid enough to buy our products and make us money hand over fist.... I really would have been better to just say FU and be done with it... At least it would have been honest... That isn't what he was saying. What he was doing was satire. He was saying, and its true, is that "opt in internet polls are largely useless because they are first, two heavily effect by response and non-response biases as well (though probably minimal) the ability for a single person to " vote early vote often. " Now was it perhaps as much snark as satire? Yepper but there is a difference between pointing out an obvious dynamic of the internet and internet polling and not caring about customer service. They could also do a better job BTW, I just think "doesn't care" period is a stretch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marseluswallace Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 (edited) ^This right here. BW SOP, give us stuffs then take away stuffs or make stuff suck, sometimes they'll cite the 'community' as the reason why they took away stuffs or made stuffs suck. I agree. Was it the SWG community that made the game suck after its two critical updates? Nope. That was on SOE and its developers. Infact, they owned up to it in interviews. They didn't want an innovative and challenging game anymore. They wanted to cater to the WoW masses, and have a generic MMO experience for everyone, without the Communities thoughts and feelings in mind. They messed up ROYALLY. And now that game is all but gone, save for Bloodfin. As for the OP. I did agree with most of what you said, till last night. I played through the last half of Rise of the Hutts, and the prelude for Shadows of Revan. Didn't die once. Didn't even come close in the SOLO FPs. The game is still really easy. So you lose some health from time to time. Be quicker on the buffs and CCs, or merely step out of the AoEs. Edited November 20, 2015 by marseluswallace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draqsko Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 "Obvious" "Common sense"...So i take it you have no idea. Well,i did today 3 operations on 3 different characters,not with a guild. 2 of them via gf and 1 via announcement on fleet. Did not feel for 1 bit that population is lower then pre-KOTFE. So how large is exactly the number of people who are leaving - dozens,hundreds,thousands,millions- is the factor we both do not know. Completely "obvious and common sensual" one extrapolation (meaning - completely random) from "i am done" posts on forum it is no more then few thousands,while it is only those who say they will quit,but there is a good chance they will not. I assure you,if your beloved EA felt a noticable enough drop in subscribers in such a short time there would be a PR operation to prevent it and so far it is silence. http://www.torstatus.net/the-harbinger/week/60d#!/the-harbinger/trends/7d Seems to have had an impact. Harbi was 70% standard, 30% light last Thursday, and today is 50% standard, 50% light. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draqsko Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 You would've thought the same thing after Blizzard made their infamous "No-flying" announcement a few months ago. A big player backlash occurred, flaming on the forums for both sides of the discussion, so all-in-all very similar to what's happening here. There was silence for a while from Blizzard, seems it just took them a long time to actually find their thinking caps and use them (there were probably some behind the scenes "talks" between devs, PR folks, and people that actually know business models). I suspect something similar is happening right now at Bioware. What it all really boils down to is that, when it comes to corporations, money talks. The devs can shout to the high heavens about their "vision" for the game, but in the end, it comes down to players speaking with their wallets. If this change is too much for you, unsub...end of story. You can type on the forums until you get arthritis, but the only thing that they will truly listen to is the power of your wallet. If you feel strongly against this change, unsub, period. Don't wait around for a few weeks "hoping" things will change. Unsub, that's the only way your opinion is truly voiced. (If you do unsub, make sure you specifically state why in the comment block they give you) Conversely, if you like the state of the game right now, then either sub or continue your sub. If number of subs goes way down, the business people win the argument and tell the devs to shove their "vision" and the change gets reverted or tweeked back closer to what it was. If subs don't go down, the devs win the argument and the change will stay in place. It really is just that simple. QFT, If you are unhappy, unsub because that is the only way they will get the message. All the forum posts in the world didn't do a damn thing about the slot machine, it won't change this either. Unsub until it's fixed to your liking and then you can resub and play just fine. If you find something else you like better in the mean time, that is their loss, not yours and maybe next time they'll think a little harder first. But the only way they'll learn this is if we put it to them where it hurts, their wallet. I learned my lesson after the CSM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShepardSpock Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 The expac's name is Knight of the Failed Empire now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psychopyro Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Well regardless, something is up... Bioware hardly ever asks for feedback this detailed regarding a change. Something happened between Tuesday and Today. I have no idea for sure what it was, but with the level of detail they are asking for, I can't see it being a good thing. Could be the blow up on the forums over the weekend thru yesterday, could be a lot of people really did hit the cancel button. No way to know for sure. I just hope that people give objective and real feedback, and that Bioware actually listens to that feedback whatever it may be. Right now I am in the middle of a lot of videos and testing to give them that info, I hope other people are taking it just as seriously... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmwfte Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 The problem is he comes off as snide, arrogant, uncaring, and oblivious to reality... No one doubts those other companies are worse. However, failing customer service should not be something a CEO takes lightly, no matter how stupid the voters seem... He does nothing but make it worse. You guys are aware that this is a fake letter created by Dorkly, right? The real response is here: http://www.ea.com/news/we-can-do-better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fallensouls Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Well regardless, something is up... Bioware hardly ever asks for feedback this detailed regarding a change. Something happened between Tuesday and Today. I have no idea for sure what it was, but with the level of detail they are asking for, I can't see it being a good thing. Could be the blow up on the forums over the weekend thru yesterday, could be a lot of people really did hit the cancel button. No way to know for sure. I just hope that people give objective and real feedback, and that Bioware actually listens to that feedback whatever it may be. Right now I am in the middle of a lot of videos and testing to give them that info, I hope other people are taking it just as seriously... The only real numbers bioware needs to worry about is how many subs till it gets thru to them or thier bosses, how much money are they willing to lose, and players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psicotic Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Wow you guys are so smart how ever did we live without your wisdom? Companion too easy mode for you? Then turn off the OP skill like I did. No I would rather complain for 3 weeks on the forums" Im bored my companion too OP", when all you had to do was turn off one or two skills which was easier. you have no argument for that. you just wanted to ruin other peoples fun, that's cool. But your selfishness has a cost it always does. Many players are upset on already low number servers. Id rather be a little bored than not have people to play with or against in PVP. You know what your really not smart at all, you didn't look at the big picture you wanted to be lazy and selfish. FYI I bet I am one of the very few who turned the skills off because I am smart. Sir *Bow* to you you deserve my respec **im not been sarcastic** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaximusRex Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 This is exactly the kind of thread to post if you want to destroy any hope of having the nerf partially reverted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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