Companion Changes in 4.0.2

[freeoftime]

I'm not picking a fight, I'm posting what Eric asked for. He asked for feedback. I personally did not find the analog on or off option for companions to be a real solution. I also said that I found an option that worked for me in going with a group. At no point did I say that you had to play the way I did.

 

I am sorry for your perceived loss in the game. Please be tolerant that not everybody sees the change as negative. Have a blessed day.

 

Eh, that stuff about people demanding to group wasn't addressed at you and more at the people who always yell "it's an mmo so group!!!111!" but you're right, I was being unneccesarily aggressive and I apologize. Though I stand by the point that increasing difficulty for the people unhappy with the comps was an option, but decreasing it for those who are unhappy now unfortunately isn't.

 

(Part of me wishes they'd introduce some sort of difficulty system, but I admit I'm not sure how to implement that in an mmo. I don't think it would really have an appreciably big effect on the economy -- you could scale credit rewards with difficulty like it's done with level rn and in my experience playing the GTN and crafting still makes ton more credits than running the Heroics anyway.)

[Jadescythe]

Pic related

http://imgur.com/16HEVZk

Bubbles drops in one hit, running away for 2 minutes around the room? Yeeeeah, so funny game! Love that! (No)

Yeah I killed him when i speced in Lightning (Madness spec cant win in fair combat at all, funny), I killed Exarch thanks to all 4 bonuses like sentry, medpac, grenade and holocron. I ll never believe that madness sorc without rank 10 alliance specialists can win this. And people will never be able to do "One For All" anymore.

Companions are bad. Super bad.

 

I'll have to test your theory tonight on my Sage. But honestly, why are you playing a squishy, ranged class if you don't want to be squishy and/or stay at range?

[Alssaran]

Eric. Please. For the love of god. We both know that you are supposed to be at work right now. Go to QA. Go to the combat designers and ask what went wrong and make them actually punch numbers and come up with a suitable buff to the companions. The overwhelming majority is in favour of not reverting to point zero, but finding a middle ground where everyone can agree that it is both soloable but slightly difficult.

 

Take some Niman advice for once: Everything in moderation. And keep that in mind for the future. Instead of one big nerf...make two or three small ones to see where the sweet middle is.

[CombatLord]

I understand the desire to play solo as I do most of my non-raid content solo. But when I have done Heroics in groups, I've done them much faster and actually acquired more credits in the process. The options to speed up and ease the "grind" exist, players are simply choosing not to play that way. And I have no issue with that and am happy that players are able to play the way they want. But I wouldn't expect content designed for two people that can be completed by 1 player to be as fast and/or easy for that individual.

 

I am glad you have had a ok time at it. Cause pre 4.0 I always had to spend up to a hour doing nothing but begging in chat for a grp and when I finally got lucky enough to get a grp, some idiot would go afk cause they suddenly remembered that they needed a drink or their puke ball of a dog was barking, and now it looks like I will have to go back to that.

[Master-Nala]

Of course it seems fine to YOU. Do tell us, do you have all legacy unlocks? Legendary status? Newsflash, many of us dont. The nerf might not have hit established players that hard, but anyone without all legacy buffs is screwed big time.

 

I'll be honest, yes I do have all legacy unlocks. I have 30 high level characters. So perhaps you're right and it's easier for me. I can't deny that, but, isn't that the advantage of having all those buffs?

 

Doing H2s as you lvl past Belsavis is almost out of the question, Your evidence that you can clear it on a geared 65 means nothing for players at 45-47 trying to do those quests.

 

Which ones specifically are giving you problems?

[Jadescythe]

I could not agree more.

 

The damage this stupidity has caused is just moronic. Who the hell were they listening to?

 

This needs an emergency patch ASAP...before the weekend warriors show up and cancel in droves.

 

I've never seen a more damaging move by a company (minus NGE)...but this is along the same lines as that. Casual play in SWTOR is dead. If you're not hardcore, get out.

 

Don't you think you're going a little overboard here? Companions DEFINITELY aren't worse than they were in 3.X, so at worst the game is back to how it was before KotFE. Heroics are still incredibly easy and, with preparation, a majority of casual players will be able to solo a SF with decen gear, a higher influence companion, and a buff or two. One for All achievement will take some time to get for unskilled or new players, but I don't see the issue with what is supposed to be the hardest solo achievement being hard to achieve.

[Master_Morak]

Eric. Please. For the love of god. We both know that you are supposed to be at work right now. Go to QA. Go to the combat designers and ask what went wrong and make them actually punch numbers and come up with a suitable buff to the companions. The overwhelming majority is in favour of not reverting to point zero, but finding a middle ground where everyone can agree that it is both soloable but slightly difficult.

 

Take some Niman advice for once: Everything in moderation. And keep that in mind for the future. Instead of one big nerf...make two or three small ones to see where the sweet middle is.

 

Do you really think they have enough brain in their head to unterstand?

 

Before Patch 4.0.0 it was a good game, with patch 4.0.0 it was a great agme and now ist a bull.**** game. My healer has now an healing Output from 10-15% to that before the patch. Did you believe that anyone there was clear in mind when they decided to dó that. I'm pissed, I'm very pissed.

Edited November 18, 2015 by Master_Morak

[lord_wilczur]

Not sure if trolling or trolling. You cant say "hahaha i did it as tank you stupid noobs learn to play haha". Because tanks you know have million DEFENSIVE COOLDOWNS, great DAMAGE REDUCTION and DEFENSE.

I am so mad at people who says "i did it as tank/healer/best DPS class in game = nerf is okay, blah blah i dont care about other classes".

 

NERF IS NOT OKAY. And most of dps sorcerers, operatives and snipers will agree.

 

But you only need to do it once for an achievement. The other times you have buffs and crates with you. Not a problem at all.

[Blurch]

For your enjoyment of the run around EA/Bioware do. EA called #650-628-1500 selection #1 then 0. Spoke with live person who handles EA complaints informed them of EA contact page for SWTOR isn't working and in game issues. She said correct that the SWTOR costumer service department not ours I'll let people know that your being sent to a page that doesn't exist. Was given the SWTOR telephone #855-345-2186 wanted to let them know of multiple issues in game and patch and companion issues since in game support is a joke. There saying its not there job. Wait for manager they said they will file complaint....... Per CS they've consolidated all my complaints in came and on phone into one giant ticket. Any bets that I'm going to get the generic robot response that I haven't given them enough information......

[TUXs]

Don't you think you're going a little overboard here? Companions DEFINITELY aren't worse than they were in 3.X, so at worst the game is back to how it was before KotFE. Heroics are still incredibly easy and, with preparation, a majority of casual players will be able to solo a SF with decen gear, a higher influence companion, and a buff or two. One for All achievement will take some time to get for unskilled or new players, but I don't see the issue with what is supposed to be the hardest solo achievement being hard to achieve.

Not at all...I tested this last night and without a doubt, this is going to 100% HARM the game.

 

Prior to 4.0 we didn't have level sync...forced level syncing is absolutely the reason companions needed to be beefed up.

 

The #1 factor in a game is that it MUST BE FUN! This nerf destroys the fun. Forced descaling makes sure that average players will never have "fun".

[The_Wulff]

Eh, that stuff about people demanding to group wasn't addressed at you and more at the people who always yell "it's an mmo so group!!!111!" but you're right, I was being unneccesarily aggressive and I apologize. Though I stand by the point that increasing difficulty for the people unhappy with the comps was an option, but decreasing it for those who are unhappy now unfortunately isn't.

 

(Part of me wishes they'd introduce some sort of difficulty system, but I admit I'm not sure how to implement that in an mmo. I don't think it would really have an appreciably big effect on the economy -- you could scale credit rewards with difficulty like it's done with level rn and in my experience playing the GTN and crafting still makes ton more credits than running the Heroics anyway.)

Oh, I agree. If I ran the zoo I would have left the companion mechanics alone and given a set of gear that could be used with any companion that would stay at the top level of what they could use. It would be the same as having the 4.0 mechanic where you wouldn't have to gear and those of us who wanted more challenge would still be able to gear our companions however we wanted to dial in the toughness to what we want.

Edited November 18, 2015 by The_Wulff

[TinaLovesHan]

I'd like to request that we be allowed to gear our companions again to make them better than nearly useless.

 

4x could barely heal my trooper for planetary heroics. My companions were better before 4.0 than they are now.

[ScarletBlaze]

Just tested this on my dps Shadow in the heroic on the black hole.

 

My companion died once. I did not. I have a mixture of gear 192/208/216 and never once used my heroic moment. Yes it may be a little more challenging and you have to play smart but with the no repair costs (which I just noticed) it is not that big of a deal to me.

[StarkHelsing]

Don't you think you're going a little overboard here? Companions DEFINITELY aren't worse than they were in 3.X, so at worst the game is back to how it was before KotFE. Heroics are still incredibly easy and, with preparation, a majority of casual players will be able to solo a SF with decen gear, a higher influence companion, and a buff or two. One for All achievement will take some time to get for unskilled or new players, but I don't see the issue with what is supposed to be the hardest solo achievement being hard to achieve.

 

Somewhere in this thread a few folks have posted their experiences of going in with SF Heroic, with 216+ gear, with a full 50 influence companion with buffs, and still the companion couldn't take the heat.

 

When a companion at that stage can't even heal a dint in tanks health or keep a dps topped up to be somewhat reasonable, there's an issue.

 

I heard tell that the tanks were improved; I have yet to see this. My 37 Akk hound tank, which used to be able to keep everything off of me. Can't even meat shield for my DoT sorc, even with me popping the agro reduction move. When you have overly powerful elites/strongs and champions and your companions would cause more damage if you threw them at them - literally just picked them up and tossed them... there's a problem.

 

I'm going past KOLTO tanks, silently weeping that I can't use them like in the Manaan flashpoints, etc. I would gladly roll around in dirty Kolto if it meant being b*tch slapped by a Zakuul Juggernaught who hits harder than a sun going nuclear, didn't take a 1/4 or more of my HP in one hit.

[Alssaran]

4x could barely heal my trooper for planetary heroics. My companions were better before 4.0 than they are now.

 

QFT.

 

The only one who has barely any chance at surviving a strong encounter is my tank Juggernaut in 216 gear. My Sentinel in augmented 208 gear and my sage in 208 gear with everything but relics augmented barely stand a chance with a healing companion. Theron (tech healer) feels weaker than some of my tech healers (Quinn/Talos) pre 4.0. He's influence 45 and barely feels any different than my influence 10 T7.

[Lyaise]

Eric. Please. For the love of god. We both know that you are supposed to be at work right now. Go to QA. Go to the combat designers and ask what went wrong and make them actually punch numbers and come up with a suitable buff to the companions. The overwhelming majority is in favour of not reverting to point zero, but finding a middle ground where everyone can agree that it is both soloable but slightly difficult.

 

Take some Niman advice for once: Everything in moderation. And keep that in mind for the future. Instead of one big nerf...make two or three small ones to see where the sweet middle is.

 

No, the overwhelming majority isn't in favour of not reverting to point zero. On the only evidence available - the online poll prior to this patch - 70% where in favour of leaving the companions alone. That is the overwhelming majority.

 

That is what has upset a lot of people - that their feedback was completely ignored.

Edited November 18, 2015 by Lyaise

[Rodon]

Hey folks,

 

All that we ask is that you log in tomorrow, and check the changes yourself. Play around with the Companions in each role and let us know your feedback. Thanks everyone.

 

-eric

WTH, you dont have a test server for this? You throw a major change whitout testing?

Edited November 18, 2015 by Rodon

[scardera]

you want my feedback Eric? Unsubbed...clown Edited November 18, 2015 by scardera

[Lyaise]

WTH, you dont have a test server for this? You throw a major change whitout testing?

 

Well he's definitely getting feedback

Edited November 18, 2015 by Lyaise

[TinaLovesHan]

QFT.

 

He's influence 45 and barely feels any different than my influence 10 T7.

 

This is also true. Influence rank feels like it makes no difference now.

[Blurch]

you want my feedback Eric? Unsubbed...clown

 

I did the same. Wondering why they haven't responded back since its tomorrow and with the few feed backs (jk) they've got why hasn't Eric/Tait responed? Answer they know Dev department didn't drop the ball but blew it up and they don't want to accept there cluster.

[Jadescythe]

Somewhere in this thread a few folks have posted their experiences of going in with SF Heroic, with 216+ gear, with a full 50 influence companion with buffs, and still the companion couldn't take the heat.

 

When a companion at that stage can't even heal a dint in tanks health or keep a dps topped up to be somewhat reasonable, there's an issue.

 

I heard tell that the tanks were improved; I have yet to see this. My 37 Akk hound tank, which used to be able to keep everything off of me. Can't even meat shield for my DoT sorc, even with me popping the agro reduction move. When you have overly powerful elites/strongs and champions and your companions would cause more damage if you threw them at them - literally just picked them up and tossed them... there's a problem.

 

I'm going past KOLTO tanks, silently weeping that I can't use them like in the Manaan flashpoints, etc. I would gladly roll around in dirty Kolto if it meant being b*tch slapped by a Zakuul Juggernaught who hits harder than a sun going nuclear, didn't take a 1/4 or more of my HP in one hit.

 

I can say I did the Alderaan SF last night, no buffs, influence 20 companion healing for the achievement. Took 20-30 minutes, no deaths. I'm in a 216/220 mix which is obviously higher than most, but anyone can get close even through solo play with crystals. But it was easy for me in this scenario. I wouldn't expect anyone to have trouble in 216s (or even lower in 208s or 204s) with a full influence companion using the buffs as you mention.

 

I mean, if you are a solo only player, this is your end game. Why should they make your hardest solo content as easy as leveling on your starter planet? I have no issue with giving companions some power back, especially if it's harming low level new players, but people claiming SF are no longer soloable are delusional.

[Pookan]

I'll have to test your theory tonight on my Sage. But honestly, why are you playing a squishy, ranged class if you don't want to be squishy and/or stay at range?

I cant stay at range obviously. And I dont want to group up with someone because its MY STAR WARS STORY. Its me and Lana destroyed Star Fortress over Tatooine, Its me and Talos defeated Exarch without any help from alliance. I dont need Darth BobiWanBenobi, Bobiwan Legacy in my team.

Why I am playing sorc doesnt matter.And I know bioware will never buff them, that sorcs will never compete with annihilation maras or AP PT, but I still love Sorcs.

 

BW postition was like "Hey, here is epic story, here is cool companions so you could do that story without grouping with random half-naked ugly twileks( who is ruining my RP server)" And I liked their position. Now its gone. FeelsBadMan

[Galentor]

Ok folks, let's be rational about this here and calm down. You don't have to be gone or unsub due to being overly emotional, because I have been testing it now doing my usual stuff. Yes it's more challenging now and no they aren't op anymore but it's not NEARLY as bad as some are making it out to be! Some people just have to stop and settle down. Total overreaction because they want to justify to themselves it is what they thought it was going to be. A catastrophic utter madness of a nuclear nerf that will kill the game for them.

 

I have been doing my missions on Nar Shadda, Tatooine, Balmorra, like I have always had, except Aric isn't healing me for an absurd amount. But it's enough to keep me in fights to full or health bar just below 3 quarters, sometimes going into half even. It's not THAT drastic that some here are making it out to be. A total overreaction by some that is absolutely not needed. Yes, they do heal lower numbers and yes I do agree it was very fun having them be overpowered so you felt like superman and yes it takes longer to do things. But let's be honest here after 4.0 they WERE too strong, but the nerf is not completely crap like some are saying. BUT they didn't have to nerf it AS MUCH as they did. I'll agree with that.

 

We all knew the nerf was needed, and the amount can be debated until the end of time! But it does NOT "kill the game" or make it any less fun whatsoever! It's not AS bad as some are making it out to be so..what's the deal here?! I think you guys are overreacting just a little bit :eek:

 

I do not think that they are overreacting or being emotional. It's a genuine rage and frustration because now they must actually PLAY their class.

 

I had a long talk on TS with a person in the guild about this. He is about to cancel his subscription for the sole reason that now he is forced to use interrupts and move his hero out of bad stuff on the ground !! When i asked him to elaborate he made it crystal clear that as a subber he demands the option to play the game by doing just the absolute minimum. "If i wanted to use crowd control, interrupts and watch where my character steps on i would play a different game".. where his words. And this comes from a former WoW raider in one of the top EU guilds.

 

As for the nerf, i did some of the Belsavis HC's with both healer and tank companions. Yes, they are a bit harder now however the nerf is nowhere near as bad as many on these boards claim to be.

[freeoftime]

Don't you think you're going a little overboard here? Companions DEFINITELY aren't worse than they were in 3.X, so at worst the game is back to how it was before KotFE. Heroics are still incredibly easy and, with preparation, a majority of casual players will be able to solo a SF with decen gear, a higher influence companion, and a buff or two. One for All achievement will take some time to get for unskilled or new players, but I don't see the issue with what is supposed to be the hardest solo achievement being hard to achieve.

 

Except they are worse than before? I used to run with the heal companion because they were my LI or I liked them best on a bunch of my toons and they could actually keep up with the damage done, even when I went to solo a Heroic (2 *and* 4) or having both of us in really outdated gear. Now heal companions do so little healing as to be useless -- I'd say one is probably better off grabbing a bunch of green or blue medpacks and run with tank or DPS because heals have become pointless.

 

I haven't tried Star Fortresses yet, but while everything until the Ephemeris chamber and maybe the Paladins was super easy with a heal comp, I had trouble with the Exarch even in mostly 208 - 216 gear (only one relic below that) with 6 augments and rank 39 Lana. Yes, I'm not a good player, but I suspect I'm not the only one who isn't (I have at least one fried who expressed her displeasure with the current difficulty and haven't heard from the other cause I simply haven't talked to them yet today) and I also suspect that it's even worse for new players that just came with KotFE.