Healers shouldn't be a raid boss.

[Azareya]

Healers aren't the problem, well mostly..

Sorcs and Guard are

 

Oh and there aren't enough healing debuffs in this game

 

You leave out the part were most of us say "the average healer is a free kill."

 

It's funny how people who ***** about healers only remember the ones they could not kill.

 

You make no sense, the game isn't/shouldn't be balanced around average players, if it was (it is) the balancing would be horrible (which it is).

Edited November 3, 2015 by Azareya

[alexsamma]

Healers aren't the problem, well mostly..

Sorcs and Guard are

 

Oh and there aren't enough healing debuffs in this game

 

 

 

You make no sense, the game isn't/shouldn't be balanced around average players, if it was (it is) the balancing would be horrible (which it is).

 

Good dps don't ***** about healers.

[jedcjedcjedc]

Stop whining about this already. The only role in the game to come into a WZ gimped and people still cry. The Sin hits for 20k while the healer heals for 10k and the Sin cries. The PT hits for 25k while the healer heals for 13k and the PT cries. The Sniper hits for 28k while the healer heals for 15k and the Sniper cries. We could have a man-made ocean by now...

[tcgtqu]

Stop whining about this already. The only role in the game to come into a WZ gimped and people still cry. The Sin hits for 20k while the healer heals for 10k and the Sin cries. The PT hits for 25k while the healer heals for 13k and the PT cries. The Sniper hits for 28k while the healer heals for 15k and the Sniper cries. We could have a man-made ocean by now...

 

All the crying are from dps that think they should be able to burst anyone down in one rotation, and if they couldn't burst that healer down then it was the class that's op and not because the healer was actually good (or their dps was just bad). Oh and don't forget they do not understand the concept of tank taunting and guarding in pvp. Lol.

[RodneyMcNeely]

Sorry. Sorcs are out of control, and - if you think otherwise - you're not viewing the same reality as the rest of the world.

[Ballroompirate]

Sorry. Sorcs are out of control, and - if you think otherwise - you're not viewing the same reality as the rest of the world.

 

Guarantee you people who are qqing about "it's a L2p issue", "healers are fine" or "real dps don't have a problem with healers" are little scrubs who play healers or don't want their healers to be nerfed in ranked so they can't get carried.

[LudhaninRolgge]

I've been reading this thread and what most of you seem to be complaining about is stacking of healers in matches. Unless you want incredibly longer queue time, I'm afraid it's an unsolvable problem.

I sometimes pvp as a sage healer, it's not my main anymore and I'm not a great PvPer. As was stated in a previous post, most people the biggest problem there is is that people don't seem to be interested in shutting down a healer. Most the games I can free cast as long as I want. Getting annoyed from time to time by 1 DPS, maybe 2, rarely more. I'm almost never CC'd or interrupted. The only times I found myself in danger was when smarter players focused fire on me, CC's and interrupted me. Those games were the more painfull and I couldn't even do anything.

Now, I'll admit sages/sorcs have a bit too much survivability and kitting tools (Phasewalk was totally unneeded), but this doesn't change anything when people seem to only want to do big number and don't think how to win a game properly.

[Ballroompirate]

I've been reading this thread and what most of you seem to be complaining about is stacking of healers in matches. Unless you want incredibly longer queue time, I'm afraid it's an unsolvable problem.

I sometimes pvp as a sage healer, it's not my main anymore and I'm not a great PvPer. As was stated in a previous post, most people the biggest problem there is is that people don't seem to be interested in shutting down a healer. Most the games I can free cast as long as I want. Getting annoyed from time to time by 1 DPS, maybe 2, rarely more. I'm almost never CC'd or interrupted. The only times I found myself in danger was when smarter players focused fire on me, CC's and interrupted me. Those games were the more painfull and I couldn't even do anything.

Now, I'll admit sages/sorcs have a bit too much survivability and kitting tools (Phasewalk was totally unneeded), but this doesn't change anything when people seem to only want to do big number and don't think how to win a game properly.

 

It's almost pointless to interupt a healer, not saying you shouldn't cause you still should. Interupts in this game only interupt the current ability being used, healers still have 3-4 other heals to use which makes using interupt futile

 

Healing debuffs are what 20%?, that's nothing and borderline garbage. Outside of stuns (well time stuns) it's almost impossible to shut down a healer unless you have 3 or 4 dps focus firing a healer (good luck with that one), which all of that can be ignored if that healer has another healer or even a tank that guards/taunts.

[JouerTue]

It's almost pointless to interupt a healer, not saying you shouldn't cause you still should. Interupts in this game only interupt the current ability being used, healers still have 3-4 other heals to use which makes using interupt futile

 

Healing debuffs are what 20%?, that's nothing and borderline garbage. Outside of stuns (well time stuns) it's almost impossible to shut down a healer unless you have 3 or 4 dps focus firing a healer (good luck with that one), which all of that can be ignored if that healer has another healer or even a tank that guards/taunts.

 

if you don't interrupt healing trance/innervate or kolto waves or progressive scan/successive treatment it's useless whining about healers. the 3-4 dps focusing shouldn't all open with their hard stun and shouldn't put out laughable dps, or shouldn't break the awe on the second healer and maybe stun him or knockback the tank.

as already said, doing 2k dps is harder than 2k hps, it's average dps being bad fault.

[Spellbreaker]

I was one of the first lvl 50 to pvp in this game at launch and i can say that what healers are doing today, they used to do while guarded back then. During the first weeks of the game, a DPS could outplay and sometimes kill a healer, or at least make him resource starved with enough pressure. What i see today is 2-3 dps focusing a healer who can still run around and tank just fine, creatin a lot of space for his team

 

Why that happens? its very simple: healers scaled much more with gear/lvl than dps did, allowing them to faceroll and top their HP with 2-3 skills. The same happened to WoW in Cataclysm when blizard cut heal effectiveness.

 

Nowadays warzones are defined buy the number of healers in each team, wich is a sad joke. No matter what people say, healing should be looked into and nerfed.

[jedcjedcjedc]

Nowadays warzones are defined buy the number of healers in each team, wich is a sad joke. No matter what people say, healing should be looked into and nerfed.

 

Let's cut your dps in half and see how much damage you do. People will complain and complain about anything that gets in their way of a free kill, but will never bother with putting any effort in.

[Spellbreaker]

Let's cut your dps in half and see how much damage you do. People will complain and complain about anything that gets in their way of a free kill, but will never bother with putting any effort in.

 

yeah bro everyone here are stupid noobs with fresh 65 in green gears f**k em. 2-3 DPS to kill a healer is fair. Lets staack more healers and faceroll to victory.

[Vodrin]

Healers aren't the problem, well mostly..

Sorcs and Guard are

 

Oh and there aren't enough healing debuffs in this game

 

 

This is so very true.

 

Although if sorc/sage healing was balanced down to the effectiveness of ops and mercs, I do not think we would need more healing debuffs (although a healing debuff that increased in effectiveness on guarded targets would be interesting).

Edited November 4, 2015 by Vodrin

[Tharenisis]

Just make a successful interrupt put all abilities on a 2-3 second GCD. The issue is interrupts are currently rather pointless considering they can just cast a different heal/whatnot. (This would work the same on DPS as well aka peeling.)

[Asaxor]

Healing needs to be nerfed until every keyboard turning, backpeddling clicker can kill them 1v1 ezmode, only then will healing be balanced.

 

Back after 2.0 when operative heals were really strong the forum was flooded with threads complaining about immortal op heals that can't be taken down by 4-5 DPS. Watching Roudy's stream though you could see even the best op heals getting rekt 1v1. How come? I call hax lolololo.

 

Since then they only ever nerfed the hots and increased the burst of DPS specs. And the QQing continues.

[masstershake]

I solo kill sorc healers all the time. 1st thing; dont waste inturrupt on innervate. Knock them back or stun them instead. Then innturupt the casted heals that dont go on cooldown after use... If u are on a merc use electro net around 30% so they cant omgbubble. Edited November 5, 2015 by masstershake

[kissingaiur]

I solo kill sorc healers all the time. 1st thing; dont waste inturrupt on innervate. Knock them back or stun them instead. Then innturupt the casted heals that dont go on cooldown after use... If u are on a merc use electro net around 30% so they cant omgbubble.

 

Why wouldn't you interrupt innervate? It is the ability that gives them procs to use their instant heals. I will agree that stunning a sorc is better tho.

[aristrokratie]

Healing needs to be nerfed until every keyboard turning, backpeddling clicker can kill them 1v1 ezmode, only then will healing be balanced.

 

Back after 2.0 when operative heals were really strong the forum was flooded with threads complaining about immortal op heals that can't be taken down by 4-5 DPS. Watching Roudy's stream though you could see even the best op heals getting rekt 1v1. How come? I call hax lolololo.

 

Since then they only ever nerfed the hots and increased the burst of DPS specs. And the QQing continues.

 

Then nobody would ever play healer. Neither in regs, nor in arenas. It would be balanced though because if noone is playing heler nothing can be op

[masstershake]

Why wouldn't you interrupt innervate? It is the ability that gives them procs to use their instant heals. I will agree that stunning a sorc is better tho.

 

Because the innervate goes on cooldown so knocking them back/stunning works better. Then you can save inturrupt for heals that dont go on cooldown. If i have no knockback or stun up then i inturrupt.

[Lhancelot]

All of this being said about how OP'd healers are should really be aimed and directed at one healer, the sorc... and even then I am not so sure that's proper. Compared to the other two healers I can see how it appears to be overperforming though.

 

In regs, sorcs can manage most of the burst on a target pretty well, keeping them alive. Sorcs also can stay alive and manage the focus fire of multiple enemies on themselves. basically sorcs can perform well under any circumstance.

 

Sadly the other two healers cannot.

 

Mercs can put up burst heals decently and keep a target who is heavily damaged alive for awhile. Mercs cannot manage the focus fire of multiple enemies on themselves and continue to perform well, healing others when focus fired.

 

Scoundrels cannot put up very good burst healing on a single target. They can manage to stay alive with lots of escape mechanisms. They also benefit from the fact their heals are mostly heal-over-times meaning the healing continues even when the scoundrel does get focused and has to run for their lives.

 

I find scoundrels underperforming for what I like to do on a healer, which is have a noticeable affect on the targets I heal. The HoTs seem weaker in 4.0, and I really hate having no decent emergency heal to save people with. Not the instant heal pack i get after I pop pugnacity, it's "nice" but I rather have some sort of nice BIG heal to save someone with!

 

I find mercs more fun than scoundrels in regs, tbh. I put up about the same numbers on my merc as I do with the scoundrel, and it seems to require much less "work".

 

Scoundrel healing is like whack-a-mole, constantly filling the names taking damage with my HoTs, trying to keep them all running as much as possible.... after a few matches I find myself thinking, "hmmm... this is boring."

 

Sage is faster paced, has bigger heals, stays alive easier, and has god-bubble. Everything about sage healing is more fun, and yes, easier. In the current meta of big-burst 4.0, sage deals with it best IMO.

[gblXsw]

Why wouldn't you interrupt innervate? It is the ability that gives them procs to use their instant heals. I will agree that stunning a sorc is better tho.

 

The only heal that innervate procs to make instant is the aoe.

[UglyStik]

The only heal that innervate procs to make instant is the aoe.

 

Which then procs other insta casts, no?

 

 

Anyways, it depends on your class. I interrupt innervate on my guardian whereas I knock back on my shadow. If I don't want to white bar them(it really varies from fight to fight) I usually interrupt innervate. If they're low and my interrupt is free I use it on cool down pretty much(same with hardstuns).

Edited November 5, 2015 by UglyStik

[gblXsw]

Which then procs other insta casts, no?

 

True, but you don't need it, there are other ways to proc the other instant, besides, you've just used your interrupt, so I can just cast Dark Infusion.

[aristrokratie]

Scoundrels cannot put up very good burst healing on a single target. They can manage to stay alive with lots of escape mechanisms. They also benefit from the fact their heals are mostly heal-over-times meaning the healing continues even when the scoundrel does get focused and has to run for their lives.

 

I find scoundrels underperforming for what I like to do on a healer, which is have a noticeable affect on the targets I heal. The HoTs seem weaker in 4.0, and I really hate having no decent emergency heal to save people with. Not the instant heal pack i get after I pop pugnacity, it's "nice" but I rather have some sort of nice BIG heal to save someone with!

 

Well, the hots are not that much weaker than they were in 3.0 per total health.

What irritates me the most ist that our ''big'' (laughing) burstheal heals for about 7k non crit which is even less than a dark infusion (which is a FILLER heal and procs an insta 6k dark heal).

 

The biggest problems with scoundrels atm are:

 

1st (only affecting ranked):

The scoundrel is waaaay too easy to shut down. Two interrupts rotated on a scoundrel can leave him totally unable to keep his tank up. Therefore shutting the scoundrel down and tunneling his tank is a very common tactic in team ranked as I have experienced. Because of this the only tank the scoundrel can play with (facing good enemies) is more or less the assasin tank.

 

2nd (mostly affecting regs and solo):

You are easy to nail down, root a scoundrel healer and he dies. Scoundrels lack of rootbreaking tools and scamper can not be used when rooted. Evasion is a very valuable defensive and should not function as a rootbreak. It does not count, if you use it to break roots you have one defensive less and will probably eat soe very strong hits/dots.

 

The other two are triage (does only work against some roots and requires a gcd, nothing for emergencies) and your aggro reduce which is not that good of a talent in comparison to some other tier choices.

 

A stun is the scoundrels worst nighmare. We eat 100% damage while stunned and have no ''oh ****'' button apart from our breaker. the sage has two, bubble and phase walk.

 

3rd:

Ridiculously low single target heals.

There is nothing more to say here, UM should at least heal for 2k more and kolto pack should have a stronger hot, EM should heal for 1k more.

 

4th:

You are totally unable to do any meaningful single target healing on the move. Your two mediocre single target heals are stationary casts and apart from that you only have your hots on the move.

 

 

 

 

All in all the scoundrel is still a very good class, it is totally cool in regs, underperforming in solo and mostly viable in team ranked (very good against pressure, mediocre against hard swap and horrible for tank tunnel)

[Kai-Del_Serromis]

I think people should be careful about how they talk about healers not dying. I guarantee you that Mercs and Operatives die A LOT as healers; what people are really talking about is the Immortality of the Sorc healer. Which, I do have to admit, is close to OP. That's the only class I see healing in Ranked anymore

 

They are not totally unkillable, it takes coordination; and since I usually PVP in a pre-made it's not a huge issue. The thing is, though, my pre-made HAS a Sorc healer because we know how powerful it is compared to the other two healing classes.

 

I'm not going to say nerf it, because quite frankly, I like it. And usually when Bioware nerfs something, they over-nerf it. Soooooo....