Too much XP is too much - OP Companions - Badly tuned level sync

[Nerfington]

How about this: HM story content that buffs all mobs by 300%? Everything else is same, reward is the same, juts buffed mobs.

Any multiplayer game is a competition, taking on harder challenges has to give better rewards.

 

Breaking the game design seems a worse option than just giving feedback so that Bioware can fix the game design. I really hope they don't actually intend this, for companions to be invincible against champions etc. No successful game is one which plays itself, board games or computer games, at least not a single one which I can think of. The most successful games all contain real competitive challenges.

[raverbane]

If you think the game isn't challenging enough. it is in your hands to make it more challenging without calling for nerfs that might ruin the game for others.

 

Much like then PvPers in some games don't level because they wanna stay in lower brackets that are more challenging. Same principle applies here.

 

If you like your companion but think they are too powerful. Then simply turn off some of their abilities. Problem solved.

If you think you are too powerful. Then don't use some of your abilities. Or don't use the best gear. Game just became more challenging.

[IT-Ren]

I've been back in the game since Oct 2nd and came in as a subscriber. I played for a while at launch and then stopped because I was too hellbent on the game not being like SWG (pre-NGE). On top of it I was expecting KOTOR 3 and got the MMO instead. Anyway, after a couple of years figured I'd re-sub since my son started playing Star Wars Rebels on his computer. I played through 3.0 for the most part (after a few re-rolls and finally deciding on the classes I want to focus on), and enjoyed it all the way up to early release for 4.0.

 

Before the patch I was starting to understand my limits and had strategies planned around some of the tougher things I wanted to accomplish. For the most part I was successful. I usually only have between 3-6 hours to play a night depending on how late I get started. Anyway, enter 4.0; Some things I was pleasantly surprised at (the level sync and rework of the XP for core planets), somethings I was irked at (the removal of some of the item vendors, replaced completely by mod vendors), and somethings I haven't experienced yet (getting someone to 60, farming all the datacrons etc).

 

I guess I'm what you'd call a casual gamer; having a family, 3 kids, and a full time job limits my play time but I make a point to play every night when I can. Everyone has been calling the comps OP so I figured I'd do a little test and see what happened when I re-rolled my consular/shadow and see how it went. That was the class that pissed me off the most and I wasn't going to touch it for awhile. Over the weekend, playing about 8 hours on saturday and 8 hours on sunday, I got my shadow up to lvl 27. Played casually as I have to walk away from the computer from time to time to hang out with my kids etc etc, but I managed to hit lvl 27 just starting out on Taris. When I got to Taris I was already lvl sync'd for the planet.

 

My experience with the companion is maybe they're a little overpowered lol. At first I didn't mind it and I was wondering what all the ruckus was about. Then when I got on Corusant, I did knocked out all the heroic's first then did the story line and planet arcs. I didn't have to worry about health having Qyzen Fess on heals. My health didn't drop below 70 - 80% in anything I did. Did the solo flashpoint (Esseles) no problem. I did run into a problem trying to run it in tactical mode as I could barely clear the first group of mobs (took 3 deaths to clear them). So there is a point where it becomes an issue.

 

I guess my opinon is a little split. On one hand, I like that I can lvl up any of the classes just doing the class story and planet story arcs. The somewhat OP'd companions are interesting, but I definitely do feel more "jedi-like" not having to worry about a whole lot killing me, because the companion has my back big time lol. I would say if they balanced it, to take it down a notch or 2 and at least let my health get to 50% or so. I'm sure thats a tedious fix in the big picture of things so I'm not going to worry about it.

 

I'd be open to them adjusting it a little bit if they can. But if its not possible then I'm not going to worry about it. Either way the completionist in me is going to run through the storylines of all the classes and see how things go. So overall, I like all the changes and they're fun for me and compliment the amount of time I have to devote to the game. But as I said, a little adjustment would be nice as I want to feel Jedi-like running through this content, not like a player who has a god as my companion lol.

[Draqsko]

Any multiplayer game is a competition, taking on harder challenges has to give better rewards.

 

Breaking the game design seems a worse option than just giving feedback so that Bioware can fix the game design. I really hope they don't actually intend this, for companions to be invincible against champions etc. No successful game is one which plays itself, board games or computer games, at least not a single one which I can think of. The most successful games all contain real competitive challenges.

 

If you want that, get to end game, leveling content is not something you challenge yourself with in any MMO. The only challenge you'll get is grinding xp, and that's the most boring challenge there is.

 

Real competitive challenge is end game, that's why HM Ops and Ranked PvP are 65+.

[crossclaytonwow]

You know, as a fairly new player to SWTOR, i'm a little taken back at the replies given to people who are simply raising feedback about their personal experience.

 

I thought that was what the forums were for, instead ppl just seem intent on trying to strike down anything someone has to say that is taken as negative against 4.0 changes.

 

All i was doing was trying to point out that the difficulty in this game has severely lowered. I highlighted this by telling my experience with my lvl 16 sith warrior and comp.

 

I went straight to nar shadda after DK, not realising i was supposed to go to balmora first, and found that the comp at level 16 was able to stay at almost full health fighting multiple groups of level 21 mobs.

 

If you dont believe me, give it ago for yourself. statrt a new sith warrior. Does not take very long to get your ship at the end of DK.

 

If you think its bonuses or something, Start on a new server so you dont have all those legacy bonuses and datacron thingy bonuses, i dont have those bonuses.

 

I personally think that its a little silly that a lvl 16 can do this, hence my reason to feel the game is to easy now.

 

I would simply like to see a bit more of a challenge in the combat side of things, im not calling for a roll back or massive nerf or any drastic change.

 

I guess this game is not for me then. Guess i will look for something else for me and my wife to play.

 

cheers all.

Edited October 26, 2015 by crossclaytonwow

[Nerfington]

If you like your companion but think they are too powerful. Then simply turn off some of their abilities. Problem solved.

That does not solve the problem, and it has been explained multiple times in this thread for why not. Why go in circles?

 

If you think the game isn't challenging enough. it is in your hands to make it more challenging without calling for nerfs that might ruin the game for others.

This is simply not true. It's well within my hands to call for gameplay to be added back to this game, and truthfully I do not believe it will ruin it for others. I suspect it will actually save the game from dying when people realize it's absolutely boring to play a game that doesn't actually need to be played and where companions always outshine you, once the initial feeling of power relative to the old system has worn off.

[Nerfington]

If you want that, get to end game, leveling content is not something you challenge yourself with in any MMO.

I already am at end game, who said anything about leveling? Playing this as a solo RPG as I always have is now mind-numbingly boring to the point I'm just not and have stopped all week. There's no actual gameplay or challenges to put myself against, or progression to be made. As per the video, Nadia is invincible against even champions.

 

This is no longer actually a game. A game involves having to do something. It involves design so that the player is given challenges and then gets reward out of defeating those challenges. Even in Mario, which I played when I was like 5, you had to jump across the hole and avoid the enemies.

[Mikahrone]

Any multiplayer game is a competition, taking on harder challenges has to give better rewards.

 

Breaking the game design seems a worse option than just giving feedback so that Bioware can fix the game design. I really hope they don't actually intend this, for companions to be invincible against champions etc. No successful game is one which plays itself, board games or computer games, at least not a single one which I can think of. The most successful games all contain real competitive challenges.

 

It isnt. Either you want more challenge either you dont want. Going in your story insatnce and you compete with whom or what? The only competition is in your head.

 

Other people are also giving feedback. So what makes you so special to think your feedback is above everyone elses? Are you "competing" with them as well?

[Nerfington]

It isnt. Either you want more challenge either you dont want.

I already explained why this doesn't satisfy the requirements? Have you not read the thread or are you just not interested in actually responding to what other people have to say? I don't know if it's even worth repeating the explanation that we want both interesting (actual) gameplay and be rewarded for our game time competitively in an environment where we must bid against each other on the GTN etc with the outcomes.

 

Other people are also giving feedback. So what makes you so special to think your feedback is above everyone elses?

Why make up these straw men? Nowhere have I ever said that other people's feedback is above or below mine? In fact there are people disagreeing with me here literally saying not to post and just play the game as it is, did you mean to criticize them? Or is truth just not valued in your conversation?

Edited October 26, 2015 by Nerfington

[Draqsko]

I already am at end game, who said anything about leveling? Playing this as a solo RPG as I always have is now mind-numbingly boring to the point I'm just not and have stopped all week. There's no actual gameplay or challenges to put myself against, or progression to be made. As per the video, Nadia is invincible against even champions.

 

This is no longer actually a game. A game involves having to do something. It involves design so that the player is given challenges and then gets reward out of defeating those challenges. Even in Mario, which I played when I was like 5, you had to jump across the hole and avoid the enemies.

 

You can't use your companion in Operations or Warzones, and your complaint is about OP'd companions... So how are you at endgame since no endgame has companion use allowed?

[Mikahrone]

I already explained why this doesn't satisfy the requirements? Have you not read the thread or are you just not interested in actually responding to what other people have to say? I don't know if it's even worth repeating the explanation that we want both interesting (actual) gameplay and the ability to play competitively in an environment where we must bid against each other on the GTN etc with the outcomes.

 

 

Why make up these straw men? Nowhere have I ever said that other people's feedback is above or below mine? In fact there are people disagreeing with me here literally saying not to post and just play the game as it is, did you mean to criticize them? Or is truth just not valued in your conversation?

 

Im not interested. What you demonstrated quite nicly is that youre not interested in challenge. Theres no competitive play, its only in your head. Doing your story instance will not impact your "ability to bid on GTN".

 

Oh my, dissmissing others people feedback by saying "game is broken and MY feedback is THE one".

 

You see,it goes both ways. Many people dont see game as "broken" and nothing needs fixing.

Edited October 26, 2015 by Mikahrone

[Nerfington]

You can't use your companion in Operations or Warzones, and your complaint is about OP'd companions... So how are you at endgame since no endgame has companion use allowed?

I didn't say anything about operations or warzones either? I barely do them.

 

Your previous post asked about leveling, I'm not leveling and am already at end game. The changes in 4.0 (and to a lesser extent 3.0) have taken the fun out of it.

 

Companions aren't even used in operations or warzones so I'm not sure why you'd think that people were talking about that? Those of us here for the solo play, the story and progression and gameplay, are now just left with the first of those, for no clear reason that I can see. Every successful game in history which I can think of has actual gameplay in it, SWTOR no longer does with invincible companions (as shown in two videos now).

[Nerfington]

What you demonstrated quite nicly is that youre not interested in challenge.

Huh? That's the whole crux of what I and others are asking for? You're just going to decide I'm not interested because you set the goalposts at a point which doesn't match our desires and said case closed? Then say you're not interested in hearing any clarification?

 

It's like you're trying to not be worth replying to. I honestly don't know if you're trolling or just a bit off upstairs.

 

Theres no competitive play, its only in your head.

The rewards for time and effort are what needs to be competitive to feel satisfied with any handicapping option. I've said this several times now.

 

The gameplay, as the other element, must also be engaging. Or even present, beyond a companion being able to solo everything, as shown in the videos.

 

Oh my, dissmissing others people feedback by saying "game is broken and MY feedback is THE one".

Where in this thread has that happened once?

[Monumenta]

4.0 story time easy mode is fine, this obviously isn't intended to be a challenging game anymore.

[RogerApple]

I didn't say anything about operations or warzones either? I barely do them.

 

Your previous post asked about leveling, I'm not leveling and am already at end game. The changes in 4.0 (and to a lesser extent 3.0) have taken the fun out of it.

 

Companions aren't even used in operations or warzones so I'm not sure why you'd think that people were talking about that? Those of us here for the solo play, the story and progression and gameplay, are now just left with the first of those, for no clear reason that I can see. Every successful game in history which I can think of has actual gameplay in it, SWTOR no longer does with invincible companions (as shown in two videos now).

 

After a few hours of playing in game. I can't believe this is still going on. There are OTHER GAMES for you people who desire something a little different. Maybe you should seriously consider taking a break from this game and focus on something more suited to your tastes. Nice that you try to sell fear "every successful game in history has gameplay"

 

For the past three years the game been on a slow decline. I was here in early beta. I saw how many people eagerly wanted to fill the severs. Then over time it slowly shrink down. People didn't like the awful grind. I quit personally even though I wanted to play other peoples class quest. I couldn't bring myself to do the grind. You are forgetting we tried the other way for past three years. Its a proven failed business model. If people want run the company into the ground. Then go back to companions the way they were.

 

I'm just saying Perhaps all these people complaining should take a break for a month. It hasn't even literally been a week already people are complaining. At the very least let it go for a month. Just "Let it go" for a month and see how everything unfolds. Then if its still bugs you then complain again. Many people not complaining are enjoying the game play right now. Saying there's no game play and hinting it will be bad for business. You must been blind to whats been taken place here past three years. The severs haven't been exactly full.

[ZionHalcyon]

After a few hours of playing in game. I can't believe this is still going on. There are OTHER GAMES for you people who desire something a little different. Maybe you should seriously consider taking a break from this game and focus on something more suited to your tastes. Nice that you try to sell fear "every successful game in history has gameplay"

 

For the past three years the game been on a slow decline. I was here in early beta. I saw how many people eagerly wanted to fill the severs. Then over time it slowly shrink down. People didn't like the awful grind. I quit personally even though I wanted to play other peoples class quest. I couldn't bring myself to do the grind. You are forgetting we tried the other way for past three years. Its a proven failed business model. If people want run the company into the ground. Then go back to companions the way they were.

 

I'm just saying Perhaps all these people complaining should take a break for a month. It hasn't even literally been a week already people are complaining. At the very least let it go for a month. Just "Let it go" for a month and see how everything unfolds. Then if its still bugs you then complain again. Many people not complaining are enjoying the game play right now. Saying there's no game play and hinting it will be bad for business. You must been blind to whats been taken place here past three years. The severs haven't been exactly full.

 

Not to mention, people are raving about the game in other places, the SWTOR subreddit included.

[Nerfington]

There are OTHER GAMES for you people who desire something a little different. Maybe you should seriously consider taking a break from this game and focus on something more suited to your tastes.

Yes and that's what I've mostly done.

I've been gone for a year, since 3.0 when it was getting mind-numbingly easy then. I came back because 4.0 looked like a return to form for people who want a good solo play experience, and instead they've gone the other way, hence my feedback now. What's wrong with that?

 

I've put a ton of time and money into this game and really like other aspects of it, like the characters and the story, hence I'm here to give feedback. Because I want it to succeed.

 

Nice that you try to sell fear "every successful game in history has gameplay"

Well, yeah? It's meant as a constructive point? Something to be concerned about?

 

For the past three years the game been on a slow decline.

And you think this was because it had actual gameplay in it like every successful game does, and taking out the gameplay is the solution? The engine was clunky, the story releases and use of companions after reaching 50 were poorly planned and paced, map design has mostly been a sucky floor-texture-staring corridors experience, ability bloat got higher, and the game's solo end game got borderline mind-numbingly easy with 3.0 compared to the reasonable challenge of Oricon.

 

Look at the google trend stats, there was twice as much excitement at the time of Rise of the Hutt Cartel compared to now. The game was significantly more challenging back then. All the top multiplayer games are. Starcraft? League of Legends? Counterstrike? These all involve actual game play and it hasn't hurt them. Even Farmville had people making up giant spreadsheets and researching stats. SWTOR though? You literally cannot lose now, as shown in the videos, it's worse than a preschooler's educational game.

 

People didn't like the awful grind.

Nobody has asked for more grind. Personally the way the game plays now is the biggest grind ever. You literally don't need to do anything, the companion can do anything. The only reason you're in combat now is to wait it out until it's over. You don't need to think, you're not playing a game. The reason I'm here criticizing is because they turned it into an ultimate grind, and it's boring beyond any comparison.

 

I'm just saying Perhaps all these people complaining should take a break for a month.

Been gone for a year, so it seems I fit your request several-fold.

 

Saying there's no game play and hinting it will be bad for business. You must been blind to whats been taken place here past three years. The severs haven't been exactly full.

Hardly been blind. Ever since 3.0 and the borif'ication of the game, the servers have been far emptier. It seems it was such a disaster that they had to rush out emergency 12xp for a year to get people to come back. They've just gone into hyper mode of that mistake with 4.0, in my opinion. A game needs actual gameplay.

Edited October 26, 2015 by Nerfington

[Draqsko]

not to mention, people are raving about the game in other places, the swtor subreddit included.

 

dude you're back!!!

[PifferPuff]

What the title says...

 

• 1-14 : Korriban (yes i took my time)
  
• 14-17 : 1 Black Talon + Intro to group finder
  
• 17-19 : Stronghold mission + Talking to Crew skills trainers + Crew Skills Mission
  
• 19-22 : 1 warzone + intro to warzones missions + Daily warzone mission
  
• 22-24 : 1 GSF + Intro to GSF
  
• 24-26 : Intro to Bounty Hunter Week + Hutta Bounty
  
• 26- : Going to Dromund Kaas
  

Yeah, I know I don't have to do all thoses things, it's still completely silly.

 

When you add the fact that companions are OP and while under level sync, your character is also OP, you could just give level 60 characters to everyone because there's not much point going through 1-60 atm.

 

Sorry OP...what? ... Your point is ... moot now? 'cuz levels are technically irrelevant. ...And you are arguing about... what? Leveling up too quickly when you get level-sync'd down anyways?... Ooookkaayyyy...

Edited October 26, 2015 by PifferPuff

[LordArtemis]

After a few hours of playing in game. I can't believe this is still going on. There are OTHER GAMES for you people who desire something a little different. Maybe you should seriously consider taking a break from this game and focus on something more suited to your tastes. Nice that you try to sell fear "every successful game in history has gameplay"

 

For the past three years the game been on a slow decline. I was here in early beta. I saw how many people eagerly wanted to fill the severs. Then over time it slowly shrink down. People didn't like the awful grind. I quit personally even though I wanted to play other peoples class quest. I couldn't bring myself to do the grind. You are forgetting we tried the other way for past three years. Its a proven failed business model. If people want run the company into the ground. Then go back to companions the way they were.

 

I'm just saying Perhaps all these people complaining should take a break for a month. It hasn't even literally been a week already people are complaining. At the very least let it go for a month. Just "Let it go" for a month and see how everything unfolds. Then if its still bugs you then complain again. Many people not complaining are enjoying the game play right now. Saying there's no game play and hinting it will be bad for business. You must been blind to whats been taken place here past three years. The severs haven't been exactly full.

 

Frankly this game was on a decline from the day it launched. Generally speaking, F2P and the reversal of most of the draconian design decisions from the original dev team is the only thing that reversed the trend and saved the game overall.

 

I think, personally, it is more along the lines of "the game is not doing itself any favors"....it improves in one way, devolves in another, creating a very jarring experience.

[Brodoin]

I've been back in the game since Oct 2nd and came in as a subscriber. I played for a while at launch and then stopped because I was too hellbent on the game not being like SWG (pre-NGE). On top of it I was expecting KOTOR 3 and got the MMO instead. Anyway, after a couple of years figured I'd re-sub since my son started playing Star Wars Rebels on his computer. I played through 3.0 for the most part (after a few re-rolls and finally deciding on the classes I want to focus on), and enjoyed it all the way up to early release for 4.0.

 

Before the patch I was starting to understand my limits and had strategies planned around some of the tougher things I wanted to accomplish. For the most part I was successful. I usually only have between 3-6 hours to play a night depending on how late I get started. Anyway, enter 4.0; Some things I was pleasantly surprised at (the level sync and rework of the XP for core planets), somethings I was irked at (the removal of some of the item vendors, replaced completely by mod vendors), and somethings I haven't experienced yet (getting someone to 60, farming all the datacrons etc).

 

I guess I'm what you'd call a casual gamer; having a family, 3 kids, and a full time job limits my play time but I make a point to play every night when I can. Everyone has been calling the comps OP so I figured I'd do a little test and see what happened when I re-rolled my consular/shadow and see how it went. That was the class that pissed me off the most and I wasn't going to touch it for awhile. Over the weekend, playing about 8 hours on saturday and 8 hours on sunday, I got my shadow up to lvl 27. Played casually as I have to walk away from the computer from time to time to hang out with my kids etc etc, but I managed to hit lvl 27 just starting out on Taris. When I got to Taris I was already lvl sync'd for the planet.

 

My experience with the companion is maybe they're a little overpowered lol. At first I didn't mind it and I was wondering what all the ruckus was about. Then when I got on Corusant, I did knocked out all the heroic's first then did the story line and planet arcs. I didn't have to worry about health having Qyzen Fess on heals. My health didn't drop below 70 - 80% in anything I did. Did the solo flashpoint (Esseles) no problem. I did run into a problem trying to run it in tactical mode as I could barely clear the first group of mobs (took 3 deaths to clear them). So there is a point where it becomes an issue.

 

I guess my opinon is a little split. On one hand, I like that I can lvl up any of the classes just doing the class story and planet story arcs. The somewhat OP'd companions are interesting, but I definitely do feel more "jedi-like" not having to worry about a whole lot killing me, because the companion has my back big time lol. I would say if they balanced it, to take it down a notch or 2 and at least let my health get to 50% or so. I'm sure thats a tedious fix in the big picture of things so I'm not going to worry about it.

 

I'd be open to them adjusting it a little bit if they can. But if its not possible then I'm not going to worry about it. Either way the completionist in me is going to run through the storylines of all the classes and see how things go. So overall, I like all the changes and they're fun for me and compliment the amount of time I have to devote to the game. But as I said, a little adjustment would be nice as I want to feel Jedi-like running through this content, not like a player who has a god as my companion lol.

 

Why do people ignore post like this?

[Vember]

Why do people ignore post like this?

 

Probably for the same reason that you keep ignoring posts about how Bioware is incapable of making careful adjustments.

[Brodoin]

Probably for the same reason that you keep ignoring posts about how Bioware is incapable of making careful adjustments.

 

Only a Sith deals in absolutes.

[Draqsko]

Only a Sith deals in absolutes.

 

Well all the BW staff does play Imps so...

[Philip_V]

I love the idea of level sync, I just wish companions weren't as powerful. I like levelling and doing dailies to be somewhat of a challenge. There's no point in a level sync existing when you can just steamroll through everything. This game has been too easy ever since they made 12xp a thing though.

 

While I understand that people want to get through the story faster, I also don't find any enjoyment out of a game where there is no challenge. The way XP works now, you only have to do planetary and class missions, so that alone speeds up the levelling process tenfold, without making it incredibly easy to win every fight.

 

Just my two cents, for what it's worth