BDragonSith Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 I don't see why people are so against level sync. It just means that you can go back play missions on your favorite planets without it feeling stupidly easy. It's not like their forcing you to go and replay stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alltooeasyactual Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 What's the point of levels now? It sounds to me like you misunderstand the point of having character levels in the first place! Character level (in ALL RPG's, not just MMO's like SWTOR) only and has only ever served one purpose : Progression gating. Why is progression gated? So that a linear story can be told in a seemingly open game world. Oh, and so you cannot just jump to then end of act IV and 1 shot Diablo for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atalantia Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 Dont worry you can still take 3 friends to Tattoine and camp the quest hubs, if you have pvp gear you get to keep all the expertise. So you can still take your gank squad there to kill characters 30 plus levels lower than you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTGolding Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 I thought this patch/expansion was the end of SWTOR, but so far I've only seen praise from people ingame and on other media. And I'm still trying to understand why level sync is bad, Weird because other than players praising the new story content I have seen very few that are happy with the rest of this patch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralgur Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 (edited) Maybe it'll make sense later, but this sort of kills the whole higher levels come back to help lower levels idea. Yeah yeah, higher levels have better gear, so they can be more helpful than a comparable leveled player who is actually in the area due to their level. You are indeed forced to play at a level in the appropriate range of the area. This change was going to be met with love and hate en equal measures. I can see this having the unintended consequence of making it so that higher level characters who are in the area for WHATEVER reason will be more highly sought after than those trying to level up. Those heroic/elite/whatever you call them missions now just got harder to complete by newbies going through for the first time. Just a thought. It may turn out that this isn't really an issue. Who knows. People find interesting ways to use game mechanics to their advantage. Edited October 21, 2015 by Ralgur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morningstation Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 I would love to see the stats on subs vs f2p and for and against level synch. That would be really telling of where everyone stands and why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alltooeasyactual Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 I cancelled my sub just because of this while I liked most of the other things. You may be the first person in history to successfully unsubscribe from a free to play game:p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alltooeasyactual Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 I would love to see the stats on subs vs f2p and for and against level synch. That would be really telling of where everyone stands and why. I'd rather see the stats on cartel market sales vs successful GTN sales vs illegally purchased credits :D:D:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max_Killjoy Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 I don't see why people are so against level sync. It just means that you can go back play missions on your favorite planets without it feeling stupidly easy. It's not like their forcing you to go and replay stuff. Level 60 character, downsynced to 56 on Oricon, loses about 14000 hit points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lemu_Bindo Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 Weird because other than players praising the new story content I have seen very few that are happy with the rest of this patch. Weird because I asked in the fleet chat is it was good and lots of people said it was great, fantastic, good, etc. Played about 2 hours and didn't saw a single complain. I myself am enjoying it, which is the only thing I care about. Even from a pessimistic point of view I don't see the evil in level sync. Eh, maybe I'm not neckbeard enough or have enough free time to spend hours analyzing every little detail until I find something to whine about. Level 60 character, downsynced to 56 on Oricon, loses about 14000 hit points. Oh my God, this... this just changed everything. BRB, going to rethink my life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralgur Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 Why not give people the option to level sync or not level sync. Why is it forced? THAT is the question. They didn't want high levels helping lower levels finish the elite missions that you can't ever get a damn group for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClaytonL Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 it actually changed my preferred play style. i had fun doing low level or lvl 50 HM FP's solo . for decorations etc.. thats what i liked to do when i needed a break and just wanted to go out and smash something. i get it, that FP's now have a solo mode, but i can forget about doing HM's solo. some might like it... i don't. since i don't do operations and never will, that was my very own "endgame" .. too bad. now i am not going to do any flashpoints at all anymore, have to see if i can find something else ingame.. *shrug*. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alltooeasyactual Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 They said the same thing about flying in WoW. Guess we know how that turned out. This is a false equivalency argument as: a) WoW is not a free to play game b) WoW has subscribers c) WoW's drop in subscribers is due to market saturation (notable f2p alternatives) and general jadedness of the player base that played and subbed for the past 10 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alltooeasyactual Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 how does it make sense that darth jadus which is supposed to be the most powerful sith next to the emperor is 1 shoted by a level 60 agent ... makes sense of course. Because like Yoda told you, the dark side is only stronger in YOUR mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DalrisThane Posted October 21, 2015 Share Posted October 21, 2015 (edited) I thought this patch/expansion was the end of SWTOR, but so far I've only seen praise from people ingame and on other media. And I'm still trying to understand why level sync is bad, MY MATH IS WRONG ON PURPOSE FOR CLARITY On a lower planet, instead of 1 hit kills, with downscaling, it's 3 hits to kill, say.... So, if I want to do an achievement of kill 5,000 take used to take, I dunno, 2 hours with 1 hit kills (refer to 1st line)... with downscaling, taking 3 hits per kill... it'll take me 6 hours. In neither case am I in danger of dying on, say, Tatooine, but it DOES adds 4 hours of slog... That's one example re: Achievements Anyhow, I've chosen to say "screw it" over slogging re: some achievements, so, that's that much less stuff for me to do. As it stands, I'm doing Space Combat (!) for half an hour or so a day, waiting for the bugs in Chapters 1-9 to be worked out before risking doing story content where "choices matter". I'm a story player, so there's that coming, soon as it's fixed and "safe". TIP = For Space Missions, killing Tier 1 ships with Tier 7 gear hasn't changed in case people want their 5-10 minutes of God Mode in SWTOR... Edited October 21, 2015 by DalrisThane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nika_Alexandrov Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 (edited) Honestly I agree with the idea of level sync being a stupid move. What about those of us who want to run things quickly alone and yet are forced to relieve the difficulty of the quests? How fair is it to be forced to group with other players just when you want to do something quickly without the hassle from before? Seems to me that the people who are paying for the game should have more choices instead of less choices being given. What if someone's doing the shroud quests and their level is grossly underpowered because of this as it may very well be in my case (running around on taris just do that one quest yet I'm now underpowered for it) Edited October 22, 2015 by Nika_Alexandrov Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lozan Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 My one and only issue with the level sync is that it is a cookie cutter set of stats for everyone, rather than working as a reverse bolster, which it should. This makes gear almost completely irrelevant save for secondary stats (which affects gear in a weird way, i.e. pvp gear having more crit or alacrity than your 224 pve piece). On top of that, I feel weird without my standard numbers. I needz my big numbers. I don't wanna feel like a level X twink. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breso Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 I like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghisallo Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 It actually wouldn't be bad IF it was done differently. Example, another game I play will auto sync you down for certain thing in the group finder. Things is you get what amounts to a bonus reward for simply doing so daily and another bonus, without daily limit, if you are a "needed" class in the group finder. Usually it's a tank that's needed but I have seen healers occasionally needed as well. Yeah dps only gets the daily because there is enough dps. However since there is NO new PvE content, the open world stuff is not designed to be done by one person and the FPs actually bolster up... There is no reason to have a "bonus" for doing it. In essence it is a take it or leave it system and leave it in this context means cancel subscription Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muljo_Stpho Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 (edited) My one and only issue with the level sync is that it is a cookie cutter set of stats for everyone, rather than working as a reverse bolster, which it should. This makes gear almost completely irrelevant save for secondary stats (which affects gear in a weird way, i.e. pvp gear having more crit or alacrity than your 224 pve piece). On top of that, I feel weird without my standard numbers. I needz my big numbers. I don't wanna feel like a level X twink. Yeah. Sync applies a cap to your character's mastery, endurance, and power stats. The caps actually cut off gains from buffs, stims, adrenals, and relic procs as well, I think. It also seems to cap out health at a value that corresponds to a lower endurance value than what endurance is capped at. (Why?!) So beyond those capped mastery, endurance, and power values all that really matters are what you can equip in terms of crit, accuracy, alacrity, defense, shield, and absorb. I'm not sure what exactly to suggest as an alternative... Perhaps the sync system needs to look at the difference between the cap and what you've got equipped and assign you a bonus proportional to that difference? (Rough example that may or may not be something they can work with: if the average item rating expected to be equipped by characters actually at that level is X and your equipped gear has average item rating Y and the difference between the cap value and the equipped value for a stat was Z, perhaps you gain X/Y multiplied by Z points over that value. Suppose that target rating X =100, equipped rating Y = 200, and the difference Z is 1000 (probably not accurate for these numbers). Then you're gaining 1/2 of 1000 = 500 points over that cap.) And it needs to apply all the buffs and everything else as another bonus on top of that capped value. Hmmm... Ah, here, let's draw from this post of mine to help out with this: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=8599122#post8599122 So my character that I checked those numbers with wore roughly 190 rating on fleet. I know from recently snagging a few armorings for a level 52 character that the green quality stuff sold for level 52 is 138 rating. The difference between what my character had equipped and the Ilum level 52 sync's cap on mastery is 3784 - 2289 = 1495 mastery. 138/190 * 1495 = 1086. Hmm, 3375 mastery instead of 3784. Not actually losing much there... The idea could probably use some fine tuning. Maybe they set these soft caps even lower so that adding a fraction of the difference back lands somewhere closer to the hard capped amounts. Like if the mastery soft cap for Ilum was... Well, the lowest I can get this to go is if the idea of a soft cap is removed entirely and it's just X/Y times the equipped amount of the stat. That would give my character in that previous post 2748 mastery on Ilum, 459 points higher than what they've currently got as a hard cap. It's kind of a tough balancing act. Wanting gear to not appear to be rendered less relevant by the sync but trying to land at values that don't disturb the current balancing of planetary heroic content difficulty (which is already manageable solo anyway). I suppose they'd also need to consider what to do if the equipped rating Y is lower than the planet's target rating X, since X/Y would effectively be a bolster then. It might be odd if a character can run around in gear that was appropriate for Dromund Kaas and get their equipped stats boosted up proportionally to be comparable to a higher level planet's expected gear. But then again, it's only affecting mastery, endurance, and power so this abysmally geared character would not be benefiting from any higher secondary stat points than what they've got equipped. Edited December 12, 2015 by Muljo_Stpho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leonlotus Posted January 13, 2016 Share Posted January 13, 2016 I totally agree with the original post. Level Sync is stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GalacticKegger Posted January 13, 2016 Share Posted January 13, 2016 (edited) /signed. Forced level sync ... forced single player story (note my use of the word player and not observer) ... forced solo mode & tactical flashpoints ... forced one-size-fits-all ... forced, forced, forced . . . F*** forced. Edited January 14, 2016 by GalacticKegger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nika_Alexandrov Posted May 18, 2016 Share Posted May 18, 2016 It is stupid, and not just because you are forced down to levels consistent with the planet you are on supposedly but also because one keeps getting xp even when they really shouldn't be. I mean c'mon now a level 31 marauder closing in on 32 on dromund kaas without having even done chapters two or three? Really shows lack of critical thinking not weighing the pros and cons of a decision first before shoving this out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentKitty Posted May 18, 2016 Share Posted May 18, 2016 I disagree For me lvl-sync has been one of the best things that they have added to SWTOR. For me it is my easier to enjoy the story and go back to earlier planets in this way. I can also lvl alts together with my husband and we both will have fun fighting our way through different quests even if our characters have different lvl:s. I also really enjoy having all the earlier H2:s available as weekly content, there are so many of them that I have never seen before, now I am running through them with my lvl 65 char and a comp with high affection. Different people like different things as always, I really enjoy the level sync and I am glad the introduced it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiil Posted May 18, 2016 Share Posted May 18, 2016 /signed level sync is stupid imo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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