Remove the Lightside/Darkside restrictions on color crystals.

[obsidiankatana]

The restrictions have no basis in the lore. None. Anyone who argues to the contrary doesn't know Star Wars lore. They are lost.

 

The restrictions make absolutely no sense. At least, if Jedi couldn't use red, and Sith couldn't use green/blue, you could argue that such a decision was rooted in the visuals set down in the films (it's still not lore), but that's the not the system at work in TOR.

 

Here, you've linked colors to morality, which means that -- arguably -- NPCs should know what our character has done based on the color of their sabers alone. So, the Jedi Council should be well-aware of every scumbag Jedi wielding red. Couldn't it be argued that, with such a readily-available visual aid in identifying corruption, there should be a lot fewer of these 'dark Jedi' in short order? Wouldn't they be purged from the knights?

 

The system is sheer lunacy. It plays out like something that was designed by a drunk person; by an individual who wasn't thinking straight. Its implications are both profound and perplexing. If what TOR has in place was at work in Star Wars:

 

A) Dooku's lightsaber would have exploded in Anakin's hand the moment he disarmed the Count.

 

B) Vader could never have ignited Luke's lightsaber in RotJ.

 

C) And, most obviously, Anakin's blue saber would have ceased functioning the moment he started slaughtering younglings.

 

It is a foolish system designed by fools. It is as simple as that.

 

Let's not tarnish the films by associating them with this absolutely obnoxious system.

 

Comparing game to movies then asking others not to do the same. Amusing.

 

Anyway, it's a game. Calm down. I will put money down that there was no giant argument about lore reasoning behind the restrictions at the Bioware office. It was a flavor decision to add flavor to the game. Jedi makes dark decisions? You can use dark-side sabres (red) or neutral colors (yellow/orange). Sith makes light decisions? You can use light-side sabres (blue/green) and neutral (yellow/orange). That's the entirety of the reasoning. Stop over-thinking it so much.

 

And at the end of the day? It's a game. So chill out.

[Gvaz]

You stupid bioware:mad: I want to do w/e I want whenever I want it. I wanna be able to be dark sided but wear light sided gear. I wanna be a dark Jedi but have a blue/green light saber. You did a bad job bioware in having restrictions and not letting me do w/e I want in game. I can't look the way I want to and so now I am quitting. This game will fail if you don't let me do w/e I want w/e I want!

 

While I'm laughing at the hyperbole, this guy is right.

 

There's no real reason to deny us the colors and all the major reasons given so far are asinine and fail under scrutiny

[SansSariph]

I hate everything about how color crystals work right now.

 

Artifice should be able to make every color with the rare colors (purple being the obvious one, also orange which IS craftable, but not until 400, and even more exotic choices) requiring more materials.

 

Having stats on color crystals is completely asinine. I will never use the yellow-on-black preorder crystal again, which is sad.

 

Restricting on alignment is even more stupid. If I kill a Jedi and loot their saber, why can't I use it as a trophy?

 

What if I'm not even using a lightsaber, and want blue blaster bolts?

[KaosPeppers]

How i think it should work.

 

Green and blue, abundant in republic areas. Occasionally in republic areas.

 

Red and orange, abundant in empire areas. Occasionally in republic areas.

 

Purple and yellow, abundant in neutral areas.

 

Lightside Rewards.

 

Light 3 and above. Harmonius green/blue crystals. Lighter green and blue crystals.

 

Max lightside. Insightful green and blue crysals. Harmonius crystals inverted, colored core with white glow.

 

Darkside rewards.

 

 

Dark 3 and above rageful red and orange. Deeper darker red and orange crystals.

 

Max darkside Hatefilled red and orange. rageful crystals with their colors inverted.

[cdstephen]

All arguments pertaining to lore and enemy recognition make absolutely no sense when applied to blaster users, so yeah...

[SerikFox]

A dark Jedi guardian is still a Jedi Guardian and should be able to use a blue saber.

 

A light-sided Sith (who by the way makes decisions that Jedi would still call dark) is still a sith, and should be using a red saber.

 

The system effects non force users as well.

 

The system makes looting and rolling a pain, as the player does not know if it is the color crystal in the item that is restricting him from using it, or if it is the item itself. (This is especially painful at the commendation vendor)

 

 

Some arguments against changing this system are:

I wont be able to tell my enemies in pvp as well.

• Under the current system, the colors are not locked to factions so this argument is , meaning the current system gives an unfair advantage to maverick players. According to the pvp argument.
  
• In pvp the enemy has bright red names, the mouse changes on clicking, their portrait changes, weapon color should not be a factor.
  
• The armor and color schemes for each faction are different enough that weapon color should not come into play.
  

 

Its Against lore and not Iconic to have Darksiders with blue or green lightsabers and Lightsiders with red or orange lightsabers.

• In the lore the color Crystals are tied to faction not to morality, Jedi use green and blue, Sith use red.
  
• Lore states that color has more to do with coincidnece then actual choice
  
• Prime examples of exceptions to red=bad green/blue=good: Adi Galla, General Grevious, Exar Khun.
  
• Players tend to sway towards the iconic color of their faction anyway, and this current system prevents them from doing it.
  

Its a consequence of the choices you made deal with it:

This Argument is invalid

• A color crystal is a color crystal, it has nothing to do with morality.
  
• Under this argument Sith Corruption is a consequence, and the option to hide it should be removed.
  
• The Lightside/Darkside system is already grindy enough, this should be one thing thats left to player descretion
  

 

 

Its just another restriction, I am honestly holding off on my dark jedi because i dont want him using a red/orange saber. I want him using a blue saber.

 

 

A possible compromise would be: Crafted crystals have no alignment restrictions placed on them.

 

You have my vote. I'd use red given a chance, but I'm always lightside.

[AJediKnight]

I support the OP. The current system makes zero sense, either from the point of view of the films or the established lore. It's pure, unadulterated crap.

[mminczes]

Exar Kun used a double bladed BLUE lightsaber.

 

/thread

[ElanJo]

I'd forget all arguments except for an argument from effect.

 

THe restrictions put in place a result whereby most Jedi will use blue or green and most SIth will use Red. It creates a game world more in line with the movies.

 

For this reason I kind of agree with the restrictions even tho you can point to the odd EU character or argue that they don't make logical sense.

[Wren_Atticus]

A dark Jedi guardian is still a Jedi Guardian and should be able to use a blue saber.

 

A light-sided Sith (who by the way makes decisions that Jedi would still call dark) is still a sith, and should be using a red saber.

 

The system effects non force users as well.

 

The system makes looting and rolling a pain, as the player does not know if it is the color crystal in the item that is restricting him from using it, or if it is the item itself. (This is especially painful at the commendation vendor)

 

 

Some arguments against changing this system are:

I wont be able to tell my enemies in pvp as well.

• Under the current system, the colors are not locked to factions so this argument is , meaning the current system gives an unfair advantage to maverick players. According to the pvp argument.
  
• In pvp the enemy has bright red names, the mouse changes on clicking, their portrait changes, weapon color should not be a factor.
  
• The armor and color schemes for each faction are different enough that weapon color should not come into play.
  

 

Its Against lore and not Iconic to have Darksiders with blue or green lightsabers and Lightsiders with red or orange lightsabers.

• In the lore the color Crystals are tied to faction not to morality, Jedi use green and blue, Sith use red.
  
• Lore states that color has more to do with coincidnece then actual choice
  
• Prime examples of exceptions to red=bad green/blue=good: Adi Galla, General Grevious, Exar Khun.
  
• Players tend to sway towards the iconic color of their faction anyway, and this current system prevents them from doing it.
  

Its a consequence of the choices you made deal with it:

This Argument is invalid

• A color crystal is a color crystal, it has nothing to do with morality.
  
• Under this argument Sith Corruption is a consequence, and the option to hide it should be removed.
  
• The Lightside/Darkside system is already grindy enough, this should be one thing thats left to player descretion
  

 

 

Its just another restriction, I am honestly holding off on my dark jedi because i dont want him using a red/orange saber. I want him using a blue saber.

 

 

A possible compromise would be: Crafted crystals have no alignment restrictions placed on them.

 

No.

 

Why?

 

Because it is one of the FEW things that make light/dark side decisions matter.

[stephenjohnp]

Certain colours should be Side specific as far as I am concerned. Red, blue etc.

[KaosPeppers]

Certain colours should be Side specific as far as I am concerned. Red, blue etc.

 

I feel like if you took the restrictions off more players would choose their sides colors.

 

My guild has 6 dark jedi that i know have red sabers, who all say they hate being forced to use red.

[Rainingqtips]

I don't know that the restrictions need to be removed but the dark side gets shafted when it comes to (early level) colors. Dark side gets red/orange/yellow. Light side gets blue/green/yellow/orange. Orange is limited access too because they cannot be crafted until 380-400 artifice and so once you outlevel the crystal you are stuck with red/yellow until you can loot another weapon with an updated orange crystal.

 

I would probably move orange to dark restricted and crafted/accessed earlier. Move purple into the void left by orange (ie. craftable at 400 artifice and can be looted off earlier sabers/blasters). I feel purple is more Sith-like but I can only imagine the rage that would occur if it was dark side restricted.

 

That gives you...

 

Dark Side - Red, Orange, Yellow, Purple

Light Side - Blue, Green, Yellow, Purple

[Soulchilde]

Orange has no restriction.. I use one and my Consular is Light V... I disagree and I like the restriction and I hope Bioware keeps it in

[norfpole]

good sith still make no fn sense

[orional]

good sith still make no fn sense

 

Bad jedi makes no sense either.

 

I do not possess the philosophical "sophistication" of a Berkeley professor, but it should be brazenly obvious that both "good sith" and "bad jedi" are contradiction in terms.

[crazyhorsek]

I agree... as long as red remains sith only.

[Keldain]

For me, as a Dark V Sith warrior, I think it's totally appropriate that if I killed a high-ranking Jedi with lots of Jedi friends that I would take their blue lightsaber and use it to kill more jedi just as an "up yours" to the rest of the Jedi Order. But instead my all-powerful, corrupt and evil killing machine of a Sith is forced to say "Oh no, I couldn't possibly do that - it's just not my color!".

 

It's dumb.

 

It's even dumber to restrict the use for non-force users toons.

[Keldain]

I feel purple is more Sith-like but I can only imagine the rage that would occur if it was dark side restricted.

 

Well, yeah - especially since the only time we've ever seen a purple bladed lightsaber on-screen it was wielded by a member of the Jedi Council...

[Moricthian]

Completely agree. Being able to make my lightsaber whatever color I wanted was an awesome feature in the KOTOR games. Why BW is pointless limiting this with moral restrictions and make Purple and Cyan crystals impossible to find is beyond me. Edited January 4, 2012 by Moricthian

[Costello]

I agree with the OP.

 

It wouldn't be as bad but there only appear to be 5 colours in the entire game even though I keep seeing people with purple sabers.

 

We have light as Blue and Green. Dark as red and maybe Orange. And then Yellow which appears to be neutral. But given nobody likes yellow or Orange they can't really be called. And then it turns out that such are light/dark dependent though strangely it only seems to be light sabers that suffer from this. I never see a blaster that is darkside only.

[Tiron_Raptor]

Orange is neutral.

 

The part that really makes the whole 'morality restrictions' thing stupid is that it applies to BLASTERS as well. The Green/Blue = Good, Red = Bad was purely a lightsaber thing: in space, for example, imperial ships generally fire green while rebels fire red. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-W1ONO2Uxo demonstrates this well. On the ground, almost ALL Blasters are Red! One exception is that in the prequels, a lot of the republic stuff fires blue.

 

The point being, however, that the particular scheme the color crystals are locked to was pretty much unique to lightsabers even in the movies, but on here, lightsiders are locked out of red no matter if they're a trooper or a sith warrior.

 

I'll also add that generally, the accepted lore was that the reason the sith used red crystals generally, was because the red crystals were synthetic: the jedi generally controlled the sources of natural crystals, so the sith had to MAKE theirs!

[JerichoStar]

I wholeheartedly agree. It is really my singular complaint about this game. The LS/DS restrictions on crystals is lore-breaking, pointless, and well, too restrictive for those of us who like choices. This is also odd, considering Bioware is a company that generally makes RPG's with a focus on player choice and not arbitrary restrictions.

 

On top of that, I agree, there should be more colors available. Silver, aqua, cyan, pinkish, etc.

[Derper]

One of the greatest things about the Knights of the Old Republic series is that you were free to use the colour crystal you wanted. No need to give all your wealth away or kill kittens to get a pretty lightsaber.

[Foxtrotmikelima]

I recently came into possession of a Red Lightsaber at Light 2.. Thats right, a Red Lighsaber. I eventually changed it as I have a thing about running around with two different colored lightsabers. But it was not required of me to be Dark anything to hold this Orange Lightsaber. Dont quote me on this, But Im almost certian I picked it up at the Nar Shaddaa Commendations vendor...I do know it was a Commendations Vendor I got it from, just dont recall who.

 

Even my Guildies were like *** when they saw me running around with it.

 

Hope this gives someone hope they can still wield a Red Lightsaber while being light side and vis versa.

Edited January 4, 2012 by Foxtrotmikelima