history repeats itself. Commando dps pvp yet another thread.

[stevenisousith]

It seriously boggles my mind that we are reaching another expansion every class gets quick fixes as soon as they complain but mercs/commandos are always shelved.

So my question to the devs is why can you fix any other class during even smaller patches but you cant fix the state of commando/merc dps in pvp. this week every time i play my commando i have 3 to 5 people targeting me my survivability is really bad. so bad that i am dieing 10 to 15 times per match. And i have been playing this class since

1.6. In australia where i come from a FAIR GO for everyone is the australian dream and way of life. So i ask how much longer do we have to pay asubsciption to a game. Thats clearly flawed?

Last point is we had told the devs for the last 2 years about pvp commando problems so Why has it not been fixed yet?

[Transcendent]

Because of their metrics.

 

Honestly don't know what answer you are expecting, they seem to think the class is absolutely fine as it is.

[Fordbird]

I'm having the same problem...lol. We've always been squishy, but now it's to the point that every other player knows it, and we are the first focused no matter what the group makeup. I am targeted before heals, before sages, before everyone and rightly so. I have the choice of being stunned and killed, or stunned, releasing and then killed. From what I've read form unconfirmed sources, this will not change in 4.0. I am going to finally hang up my pvp assault canon and use my mando for pve content exclusively. It's a shame to, because I have no interest in rolling a sorc, so I guess no pvp for me.

[Frenesi]

It's actually funny to see, how many classes compete for 'we get targeted first" spotlight. 4 out of 8, to be specific.

[ForceWelder]

It's actually funny to see, how many classes compete for 'we get targeted first" spotlight. 4 out of 8, to be specific.

 

Yes they do.

 

But the other three have nothing to worry about if a merc / mando are on the team. They will not be the first targeted. The other three classes are the fall backs.

 

In every arena match I have played with a merc / mando involved, they are the first target. Regs or rank it doesn't matter.

[ForceWelder]

I'm having the same problem...lol. We've always been squishy, but now it's to the point that every other player knows it, and we are the first focused no matter what the group makeup. I am targeted before heals, before sages, before everyone and rightly so. I have the choice of being stunned and killed, or stunned, releasing and then killed. From what I've read form unconfirmed sources, this will not change in 4.0. I am going to finally hang up my pvp assault canon and use my mando for pve content exclusively. It's a shame to, because I have no interest in rolling a sorc, so I guess no pvp for me.

 

Yes, I have all but done the same. My merc / mando only occasionally get used in PVP and then only in 8 v 8. As soon as an area pops, I leave. What is the point after all of playing a match I will be dead in 10 seconds later?

[Transcendent]

What is the point after all of playing a match I will be dead in 10 seconds later?

 

Free comms for laying on the floor? Doesn't require much effort either

 

"What does this button do? Oh nothing, I'm dead. This one? Nope, still dead? Wow all these DCDs to use. Can't I'm dead. Well this is fun.... wait, nope, I'm dead."

 

If I'm honest, I think snipers are in a slightly worse position than Mercs, not by much, and definitely not in 4.0.

[Jherad]

It's actually funny to see, how many classes compete for 'we get targeted first" spotlight. 4 out of 8, to be specific.

 

Name 2 classes (mirrors excluded) without an anti-focus defensive ability of any kind.

 

Hint: There are only 2.

 

Out of those 2 classes, which one has the fewest stun breaks?

[Sevarn]

Name 2 classes (mirrors excluded) without an anti-focus defensive ability of any kind.

 

Hint: There are only 2.

 

Out of those 2 classes, which one has the fewest stun breaks?

 

There are 4 classes with no anti focus cooldown, mercs, snipers, juggernauts and powertechs.

 

Powertechs get away with it because hydrolic overrides will get them out of trouble against bad teams. A double stun will kill them.

 

Juggernauts are currently the number one targeted class in ranked, only because of the lack of mercs and snipers of course. Still, 0 anti focus abilities and easily killed through cooldowns.

 

Mercs of course are in such a bad state now they are not worth playing at all in ranked, doesn't look like this will change in expansion unfortunately.

 

And finally snipers. In a wierd spot tbh, bad in solo ranked, godly in team ranked. With the new (boring but powerful) ability in 4.0, snipers will be one of the better PvP classes all around I think.

[DariusCalera]

There are 4 classes with no anti focus cooldown, mercs, snipers, juggernauts and powertechs.

 

Powertechs get away with it because hydrolic overrides will get them out of trouble against bad teams. A double stun will kill them.

 

Juggernauts are currently the number one targeted class in ranked, only because of the lack of mercs and snipers of course. Still, 0 anti focus abilities and easily killed through cooldowns.

 

Mercs of course are in such a bad state now they are not worth playing at all in ranked, doesn't look like this will change in expansion unfortunately.

 

And finally snipers. In a wierd spot tbh, bad in solo ranked, godly in team ranked. With the new (boring but powerful) ability in 4.0, snipers will be one of the better PvP classes all around I think.

 

Saber Reflect is an anti focus CD as could covered escape be considered one as well.

[TyrellJonez]

Mercs are finally getting a defensive buff. Rocketback and something that gives us 15% to defense when we hit supercharge.

 

Most only focus on the 45 second CD change for HO, but i think its a minor nerf. CHASE the merc will become finding out who the morons are on the other team who will just tunnel and ignore being shot at and killed.

 

"but defense is useless in pvp" Not quite true. It stops white attacks. Those are the melee ones. The ones that hit the hardest. The ones who rocket/charge to you and beat your face in. they have a 55% chance of hitting your defense and taking a whopping 50% damage reduction BEFORE you pop energy shield. Add in Stabilized Armor and it becomes folly to focus a merc if your melee because of all the damage reduction.

 

If your good, you will use these new tools to make people over commit to kill you (because lets face it, if its 4 people focusing you reguardless of class, your going to die) or ignore you and you can melt their whole team with Dots or DFA and sweeping blasters.

 

Most people will disagree with me. thats fine. I've been ************ for more defense since 1.1 when tracer missle got nerfed. Bout time we got even a LITTLE attention. Only 3 damn years later.

[Jherad]

Saber Reflect is an anti focus CD as could covered escape be considered one as well.

 

Precisely. They're not *great*, but they are something. Merc has absolutely nothing defensively which would dissuade a team from just continuing to blow them up. PT can at least spec for a second stun break.

[Sevarn]

Saber Reflect is an anti focus CD as could covered escape be considered one as well.

 

You're confusing defensive cooldowns with anti focus cooldowns. They're not the same thing. An anti focus abiity is something that forces enemy's to target someone else. There are only 2 anti focus abilities in the game, vanish and God bubble. Sorcerers got the bubble, sins ops and marauders got the vanish. Everything else can be nuked through.

 

I guess a well placed phasewalk could also be considered anti focus.

[Frenesi]

You're confusing defensive cooldowns with anti focus cooldowns. They're not the same thing. An anti focus abiity is something that forces enemy's to target someone else. There are only 2 anti focus abilities in the game, vanish and God bubble. Sorcerers got the bubble, sins ops and marauders got the vanish. Everything else can be nuked through.

 

I guess a well placed phasewalk could also be considered anti focus.

 

I'm pretty sure 99% dmg reduction on maras qualifies for "god bubble".

[Sevarn]

Precisely. They're not *great*, but they are something. Merc has absolutely nothing defensively which would dissuade a team from just continuing to blow them up. PT can at least spec for a second stun break.

 

Yeah the big issue with Mercs is that they literally have nothing defensively. While a jug may have no anti focus abilities, we at least have strong defensive cooldowns and can dish out some pain before we go down.

 

Actually I think a vanish at this point would be great. An original anti focus ability would be nice but a vanish would push mercs into viability right now.

[Sevarn]

I'm pretty sure 99% dmg reduction on maras qualifies for "god bubble".

 

Nah, its the same as guardians focused defence, will buy you about 5 secs, then you're dead. They won't stop focusing you.

[DariusCalera]

You're confusing defensive cooldowns with anti focus cooldowns. They're not the same thing. An anti focus abiity is something that forces enemy's to target someone else. There are only 2 anti focus abilities in the game, vanish and God bubble. Sorcerers got the bubble, sins ops and marauders got the vanish. Everything else can be nuked through.

 

I guess a well placed phasewalk could also be considered anti focus.

 

Actually, I'm not. Saber Reflect causes people to switch off the jug/guardian because they don't want to catch one of their own crits in the face. Most people know that when it is activated to switch to another target for its duration. Hence, an anti focus ability.

 

When Covered Escape is used people are, or should, to switch to another target until the roll is complete and the Entrench portion ends. Wasting GCDs on attacks that are going to miss or be severely reduced in effectiveness because of the Roll/Entrench is pointless. The ability is causing attackers to break their focus on the sniper/slinger and move on, at least for a few seconds, to someone that is not as protected.

[Sevarn]

Actually, I'm not. Saber Reflect causes people to switch off the jug/guardian because they don't want to catch one of their own crits in the face. Most people know that when it is activated to switch to another target for its duration. Hence, an anti focus ability.

 

When Covered Escape is used people are, or should, to switch to another target until the roll is complete and the Entrench portion ends. Wasting GCDs on attacks that are going to miss or be severely reduced in effectiveness because of the Roll/Entrench is pointless. The ability is causing attackers to break their focus on the sniper/slinger and move on, at least for a few seconds, to someone that is not as protected.

I'm not trying to sound condescending but it sounds like you don't play ranked at all. I main a guardian and I have, not once, in over 500 games this season alone, seen people stop focusing me when saber reflect is popped. And that's with the ability talented for 2 extra seconds. Same with covered escape.

 

Getting people to focus in ranked is tough, having them switch targets for a 3-5 second cooldown, which doesn't stop all damage, is pointless and will probably lose you the game.

Edited September 25, 2015 by Sevarn

[DariusCalera]

I'm not trying to sound condescending but it sounds like you don't play ranked at all. I main a guardian and I have, not once, in over 500 games this season alone, seen people stop focusing me when saber reflect is popped. And that's with the ability talented for 2 extra seconds. Same with covered escape.

 

Getting people to focus in ranked is tough, having them switch targets for a 3-5 second cooldown, which doesn't stop all damage, is pointless and will probably lose you the game.

 

Of those 500 games, how many times has your reflect sent back a 10k crit, or greater, back into an attacker and allowed you to get an easy kill because they didn't know enough to switch off? Or, at the very least, stop attacking you.

 

I can guarantee that the above has happened far more than once because, as I said, people didn't know enough to switch off. Of course, these same people are the ones that decide to keep attacking a sorc/sage after they've bubbled.

[Sevarn]

Of those 500 games, how many times has your reflect sent back a 10k crit, or greater, back into an attacker and allowed you to get an easy kill because they didn't know enough to switch off? Or, at the very least, stop attacking you.

 

I can guarantee that the above has happened far more than once because, as I said, people didn't know enough to switch off. Of course, these same people are the ones that decide to keep attacking a sorc/sage after they've bubbled.

 

How many have switched targets when I pop saber reflect? 0. By the time they've realised i've used it, they only have to wait about 1 sec before its over. It is not an anti focus ability, period.

 

As for the second point:

Nuking a guardian through saber reflect = no big deal, everyone does it

Beating on a sorc while he's bubbled = retarded

You can't compare these things, completely different.

 

Edit: I have destroyed powertechs with saber reflect but there is nothing they can do about if you time it right, its already too late. Powerful defensive cooldown against some classes, but not an anti focus cooldown.

Edited September 25, 2015 by Sevarn