Skettitangles Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 So it's been drawn out and long winded but the devs actually have listened to the communities feedback and implemented some of the suggestions made for the improvement of the class. The Annihilation spec mess is probably the worst case of the devs ignoring the community so far. The class really just needs a proper fix for Annihilation and possibly some access to better self heals to bring us up to par with most of the other ACs in the game. Future operations design could be a little kinder to melee as well. Marauders are still a fun spec to play and can be great in the right group compositions and in the hands of good players. I hope the devs continue to tweak the class and pay the needed amount of attention to the community to at least make Annihilation fun to play again as I feel we are not far off being where we should be as a class Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonzenaattori Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 (edited) So it's been drawn out and long winded but the devs actually have listened to the communities feedback and implemented some of the suggestions made for the improvement of the class. The Annihilation spec mess is probably the worst case of the devs ignoring the community so far. The class really just needs a proper fix for Annihilation and possibly some access to better self heals to bring us up to par with most of the other ACs in the game. Future operations design could be a little kinder to melee as well. Marauders are still a fun spec to play and can be great in the right group compositions and in the hands of good players. I hope the devs continue to tweak the class and pay the needed amount of attention to the community to at least make Annihilation fun to play again as I feel we are not far off being where we should be as a class Oh yeah for sure I completely agree... When you factor in the fact that Sentinel was nerfed pretty badly and we were given a pathetic lie "Duhh, we're bringing every class' damage down!" - Well, yeah I suppose it ain't bad at all. Honestly though, I've kinda lost the will to care about this whole 'err mah gerd sents are so weak' bandwagon... 90% of the sentinel's don't even know the cause of why sent Watchman/Anni is weak atm and they try their best to figure it out. Good luck to them, me, I'll happily reserve my right to ****, just wish devs would stop BS'ing Edited May 15, 2015 by Bonzenaattori Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skettitangles Posted May 15, 2015 Author Share Posted May 15, 2015 The response time and wording of a lot of the devs communication hasn't been great but it's been there at least for the most part. Call me naive I guess but I think they're trying to be genuine and trying to address our ongoing concerns as best as they can. Anni/watchman mara/sents still have a valid reason to be outraged and melee classes still get no love from the PvE content so there's still a lot that needs to be improved upon in the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Svarthrafn Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 I'd like to see a small CC immunity window much like other classes get for all three mara/sent specs, and maybe a boost to sefl-healing capability (without having to take a heroic utility) OR some reduced cooldown on a DCD or two. Other than that, if you accept that in PVP you have to mostly abandon berserk, you can play a mara good enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skettitangles Posted May 15, 2015 Author Share Posted May 15, 2015 I'd like to see a small CC immunity window much like other classes get for all three mara/sent specs, and maybe a boost to sefl-healing capability (without having to take a heroic utility) OR some reduced cooldown on a DCD or two. Other than that, if you accept that in PVP you have to mostly abandon berserk, you can play a mara good enough. Agreed. Anni and Carnage need what Fury got with Gravity Vortex. Some reduction to cooldowns on DCDs would be awesome and in line with what a lot of other classes get. The incoming option to take Predation off the Fury system would be great if it wasn't a 30 second cooldown but I'm gonna give it a try in Fury spec anyways. If I was PvPing in Carnage I'd leave Predation as is and forego Berserk. Not sure how to work in a marauder self-heal but fresh suggestions as to how this could be done would be welcome. Maybe a set bonus additional proc triggers a small self heal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DynamiCtagez Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 Defensive Forms didn't become a passive. They ignored the request. What they did by spreading the utilities up is a straight up nerf to PvP, because noone takes these utilities. Still tons of useless utilities, root break on camo not baseline or at least tier 1, Contemplation still no passive, only a single mobility utility that's not in heroic, leg slash utilities not merged. Sure, they totally listenend. Our utilities and mobilty are a mess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sloasdaylight Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 Defensive Forms didn't become a passive. They ignored the request. What they did by spreading the utilities up is a straight up nerf to PvP, because noone takes these utilities. Still tons of useless utilities, root break on camo not baseline or at least tier 1, Contemplation still no passive, only a single mobility utility that's not in heroic, leg slash utilities not merged. Sure, they totally listenend. Our utilities and mobilty are a mess. This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atlanis Posted May 16, 2015 Share Posted May 16, 2015 Defensive Forms didn't become a passive. They ignored the request. What they did by spreading the utilities up is a straight up nerf to PvP, because noone takes these utilities. Still tons of useless utilities, root break on camo not baseline or at least tier 1, Contemplation still no passive, only a single mobility utility that's not in heroic, leg slash utilities not merged. Sure, they totally listenend. Our utilities and mobilty are a mess. I salute you sir for netting the Dark side getting the better of you. I have to agree with everything you say. I would just add a little flaming here and wouldn´t hide my position on Bioware Austins ability to fix the Sent/Mara. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aluvi Posted May 16, 2015 Share Posted May 16, 2015 There have been some positive changes that have been implemented ham handedly, and some negative changes that were touted as "buffs" but instead were nerfs. Every time they give us a possibly really good utility, it ends up being not really viable because it's in the Heroic tier. I don't think the problem is going to really be marauders though. The problem is the OP FOTM classes. PT and Inquisitor (both ACs) are just out of control. I know there were nerfs to Assassins, but it was not where they needed it. We told them that 17 seconds of CC on medium length cooldowns (1 min and 2 min) was too strong. For a tank it's fine, but for every Assassin spec? Too strong. What did BioWare do? Nerfed the range on Death Field. BioWare has a long history of looking at player feedback, ignoring it, and then doing something that either doesn't help or is completely unnecessary (or both). I never heard anyone being very vocal about Annihilation heals pre nerf (when it was 2%). I never heard any Marauder say that they wanted Annihilation to be a dot spread aoe class. Yet both of these things happened, for no good reason. Never did I ever hear anyone say "Death Field range is too big". Radius, yes maybe, but range? No. The reason is simple: you have to get into melee to apply one of your dots as an Assassin, so you're there anyway. What this DOES do is make it harder to stop things like node capping, which they now simply cannot do from 30 yards, whereas a Jugg, Marauder.. every class really, except them, can. No one asked for all the Carnage changes. We were HAPPY with it pre 3.0. A few tweaks, the addition of the new ability to replace force scream, and a little more damage on Massacre, and hey we would have been good to go. Instead, Ravage and everything else is nerfed like crazy. I'm hitting for about the same amount, sometimes slightly more, on my big hitters (Devastating Blast / Vicious throw), than I did in 2.X. Now that would be FINE, if I didn't see Assassins pushing TRIPLE the dps that they used to in warzones, along with tons of self healing, CC immunity. It would be fine if I didn't see snipers (which in their defense, snipers need help elsewhere so I think this is fine, but it's a valid example) doing 16k and 8k back to back hits. It would be fine if Powertechs didn't have the ability to kite a marauder non stop while pushing 2K single target dps, and some of the craziest burst in the game. But those things all exist. The problem is, BioWare doesn't have a clue how to balance it's own game for PvP. This is THE WORST balance we have had since the game launched. Hell, I think launch was probably better. I'd like to see old school, 100% crit bonus / auto crit smash added to the Fury spec. I think that, coupled with the other changes, would give us one fun and viable pvp spec for solo ranked, and make us a class to actually be feared again. Maybe it was OP back in 2.0, but if PTs and Inquisitors are not getting nerfed, then it is not OP now. I doubt that will happen though, since BioWare has explicitly stated that they would rather nerf than buff. Also, for the love of god... why not put the CC immunity on berserk? That makes so much more sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CameoCream Posted May 19, 2015 Share Posted May 19, 2015 No. They haven't. Their response has been: "Oh you think we should do this?" "Well screw you its our game we'll do something else which is totally stupid. See we dont need your feedback!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fpolk Posted May 19, 2015 Share Posted May 19, 2015 Here is what watchman needs I don't know about the utilities, but combine force melt with force leap make it say burning leap. Make it a 12 sec dot and make cauterize 6 sec with a CD once again and give it the reset proc for the slashes. Keep the burning sweep and also give watchman back the 2% heals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skettitangles Posted May 19, 2015 Author Share Posted May 19, 2015 No. They haven't. Their response has been: 10m range root back. Cc immunity off ability activation similar to jugg. Predation off Fury system. Merge of undying rage utilities... These changes were all asked for and implemented or are incoming. I'm not saying the way they have been implemented in the utility tree has been done well but they were all ideas that were asked for by the community since 3.0 launched. Annihilation discipline is a mess since 3.0 and I think it has been handled extremely poorly by the devs so I can understand the negativity surrounding that spec right now. BW are losing a significant section of the SWTOR community and will continue to do so until they can get this class properly balanced. They do listen to our feedback and attempt to implement some of our ideas. We need to keep pushing this forward and testing out everything to keep them on track. It's not ideal and it's not always fun but someone's gotta do it right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atlanis Posted May 19, 2015 Share Posted May 19, 2015 Sketti is the only one who is happy with the changes, so how much does Bioware pay you for posting positive about something that 99% think is crazy pile of brown sof mass? I would be interested in earning some extra money Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skettitangles Posted May 19, 2015 Author Share Posted May 19, 2015 Sketti is the only one who is happy with the changes, so how much does Bioware pay you for posting positive about something that 99% think is crazy pile of brown sof mass? I would be interested in earning some extra money Perhaps if you read my posts you'd acknowledge that I am not happy with the way the devs have changed this class. Perhaps if you were in control of your emotions you'd be less inclined to troll and flame and more able to contribute valid posts on this forum instead of making outlandish claims. Perhaps if you tried a little more you'd discover aspects of the class that you were previously unaware of and use them to your advantage in warzones and operations. You have zero proof to share that the class is being deleted and zero proof to share that I get paid by BW to post what I post so if I'm wrong... Prove it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthVillain Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 Nah I still say keep changes to smash and make force rend a passive for smash and have smash spread rest of dots less management on dot specs like all other classes that have dots especially when youre not a ranged class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ardarell_Solo Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 Here is what watchman needs I don't know about the utilities, but combine force melt with force leap make it say burning leap. Make it a 12 sec dot and make cauterize 6 sec with a CD once again and give it the reset proc for the slashes. Keep the burning sweep and also give watchman back the 2% heals Not bad! And probably the easiest way to implement a playstyle that's close to 2.10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kadra Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 Here is what watchman needs I don't know about the utilities, but combine force melt with force leap make it say burning leap. Make it a 12 sec dot and make cauterize 6 sec with a CD once again and give it the reset proc for the slashes. Keep the burning sweep and also give watchman back the 2% heals This would probably be one of the most elegant solutions I have heard so far. Nice thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jauvtus Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 Here is what watchman needs I don't know about the utilities, but combine force melt with force leap make it say burning leap. Make it a 12 sec dot and make cauterize 6 sec with a CD once again and give it the reset proc for the slashes. Keep the burning sweep and also give watchman back the 2% heals +1 for Burning Leap, maybe the best idea ot replace Force Melt so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenesi Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 (edited) Funny thing is, they listened with Annihilation as well. You called old rotation boring? Here comes the new one. Is it ****ed up beyond measure? Yes. Is it "interesting"? I would never call something that chaotic boring. You guys got what you asked for. Next time, just like in fairy tales, think better. Edited May 23, 2015 by Frenesi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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