This game has devolved into a complete money-spinning rip-off.

[Nickious]

Now I want a taris Stronghold next to a toxic lake with ghostly screams in the distance.

 

This here is a prime real estate on Taris. It comes included with its own toxic mout, with its own Rakghoul infested creatures and many assortments of other mutated creatures. Every hour, you can hear the delightful screams of another victim who succumbed to the plague. Underneath your property, are custom rakghoul tunnels if you should ever come under attack. I've been assured they were abandoned by Rakghouls... mostly. On top is a panic.. err breathtaking balcony with a view of Taris's unnatural beauty.

 

Reserve a piece of toxic paradise today!

Edited March 28, 2015 by Nickious

[Anaesha]

This here is a prime real estate on Taris. It comes included with its own toxic mout, with its own Rakghoul infested creatures and many assortments of other mutated creatures. Every hour, you can hear the delightful screams of another victim who succumbed to the plague. Underneath your property, are custom rakghoul tunnels if you should ever come under attack. I've been assured they were abandoned by Rakghouls... mostly. On top is a panic.. err breathtaking balcony with a view of Taris's unnatural beauty.

 

Reserve a piece of toxic paradise today!

 

How many rooms and what is the asking price?

Edited March 28, 2015 by Anaesha

[Nickious]

How many rooms and what is the asking price?

 

7 rooms for starter. A couple of rakghoul infested vict... err I mean unemployed laborers can dig into the foundation for an additional couple of rooms. We are offering a 25% off discount of 5 million if you clear out its.. current host. 35% if you ionize the surrounding area. It helps clear out unwanted pest.

Edited March 28, 2015 by Nickious

[Papazmurf]

7 rooms for starter. A couple of rakghoul infested vict... err I mean unemployed laborers can dig into the foundation for an additional couple of rooms. We are offering a 25% off discount of 5 million if you clear out its.. current host. 35% if you ionize the surrounding area. It helps clear out unwanted pest.

 

Sounds like quite the deal. Where do I sign up?

[Ghisallo]

Do you seriously consider that a viable way to play the game, at the atrocious rate of xp gain for non-subbers? Besides, you're wrong. you can't get to 60 without buying Revan.

 

WoW has transmog for FREE, which in this game would neatly nip the cartel market for armor sets and the extortion to account unlock them in the bud. I hear there's some sort of sound-alike in 3.2. I'll believe it when I see it. I would have thought it was too much of a cash-cow.

 

WoW has a much larger playerbase and therefore the subs sustain the game, with the occosional cosmetic micro-transaction and player services to fatten the balance sheets.

 

Even if the subs dropped to swtor levels, I doubt Blizzard would turn around and spit in the faces of their day 1 players by making them take out their wallets to compensate for their fail.

 

I really don't understand what you are talking about here tbh. SWTOR makes the lion's share of it's profits off of micro-transactions. Subscribers don't really have any need to engage in the use of microtransactions. Both groups have to buy the expac. So you can chose to be a microtransaction player or a subscriber and if you want as a subscriber also engage in microtransactions.

 

I also think you miss something about WoW. Their financials have become far less transparent since they bought themselves out from Vivendi, BUT until then it was pretty clear that WoW was making a lot of money bu had A LOT of expenses to go along with it. Yeah they have a lot more subscribers BUT they also spend a metric butt ton more on marketing than anyone else and they are constantly expanding into new markets (which is another big expense). I mean hell the launched in Brazil and still kept losing subs. They admit that while the launch of the new expac had them go from 7.4 Million to 10 million they expect a step drop in subscribers, especially in Asia.

 

When you compare games you can't just say "hey they have more subscribers thus they are better off" you have to say "okay they made this much money and spent this much money... who had a better ROI?"

 

I don't pretend to know who had the better ROI but you really seem to be making assumptions and a lot of fluff statements to justify a very subjective position.

Edited March 28, 2015 by Ghisallo

[Nickious]

Sounds like quite the deal. Where do I sign up?

 

Contact your Taris's local Sith Alchemist and plague containment officers. Only a little paperwork for a few terms and waivers. No big deal, just some small stipulations to sign and agree to such as

 

( assumed risk such spontaneous death, rakghoul transformation, if you are a registered a rakghoul victim donor, your consent for experimentation for the good of your fellow sith).

Edited March 28, 2015 by Nickious

[AlrikFassbauer]

At one point in the past, EA bought Zynga.

[cool-dude]

Eh.....The cartel market has never had anything that great, nor that important to the game itself. If you want to play an mmo that is a huge money sink, you should play War frame. In that mmo, you had to spend money to play another class, to use a different weapon you did not start with, to have extra ammo in case you run out, you pretty much had to spend real money to do anything inside the game, and the games enjoyment was based on how much money you were willing o spend.

 

With that said, if anyone thinks this is bad, SWTOR has spoiled them.

Edited March 28, 2015 by cool-dude

[lightSaberAddiCt]

Oh, no, I think their whining is just as asinine as the rest of you. I just meant about the whole 'having to get SoR to hit 60' being something I think is pretty dumb.

 

Sorry, I should've been more clear.

 

Oh yeah I agree there. But it is only until next lvl cap, and SOR will be free, if not sooner.

[ivanhedgehog]

The rich need a way to distinguish themselves from the poor. Welcome to life.

 

they dont need it, they want it..they have a false sense of entitlement to it

[Lunafox]

I agree with the OP about many things. Especially the part where we, as subs have to pay for slight makeover things, like a change of eyecolour, especially once you buy the eye colour. I can see bigger things being charged for, like change of race/species, but minor junk like hair, eyes, skin tone...that should be free for subs. Subs really should get a few more perks in my thinking.

 

I'm ok with paying to unlock the outfits, so that all your toons across all servers can wear them. That's ok. But minor stuff like physical tweaks on a toon should be available to subs for free.

[Reno_Tarshil]

I agree with the OP about many things. Especially the part where we, as subs have to pay for slight makeover things, like a change of eyecolour, especially once you buy the eye colour. I can see bigger things being charged for, like change of race/species, but minor junk like hair, eyes, skin tone...that should be free for subs. Subs really should get a few more perks in my thinking.

 

I'm ok with paying to unlock the outfits, so that all your toons across all servers can wear them. That's ok. But minor stuff like physical tweaks on a toon should be available to subs for free.

 

Or credits.

[Lunafox]

Or credits.

 

Yeah, I'd be ok with in game credits. That works too.

[Darth__Reaver]

Every mmo turned into a complete turd recently.

This is the future, and you should get used to it. People are abandoning the genre, and the studious/corporations are in distress how to profit on their games.

It is happening to literally every single mmo.

Complaining about it is pointless. The devs are hostages to big corporate interests. It is not about the game anymore, but about the financial model.

And as you can see in SWTOR, we are getting small planets, bugged operations, but perfectly fine working cartel packs.

 

 

This should be posted on every single thread as a reminder.

[Draqsko]

Star Trek Online has a much better version of F2P. Its not even close.

 

As far as I can tell, having played more then a few of them. Its near the top of the nickle-and-dime list.

STO also lets you grind things out and earn their cartel coin equivelent ingame, So no, SWTOR is by far, nowhere near the 'best F2P model'.

 

STO is run by PWE, the BIGGEST MONEY GRUBBING PUBLISHER OF MMOS IN THE WESTERN WORLD.

 

Seriously, literally ALL of their games are pay to win.. Yeah you can buy Zen with dilithium.. but it's a hilariously stupid exchange rate compared to swtor. Last average I've seen was 157D = 1Z, for 20 USD you get 2000Z. So for you to get 20 USD worth of Zen using Dil you'd have to grind Dil @ 8k per day cap for almost 40 days.. ( 157 * 2000 = 314000, 314000 / 8000 = 39.25 days).

 

We’re very excited to announce the brand new Tier 6 Command Battlecruisers that will be released soon. With the release of our anniversary update we added the awesome new Command Captain Specialization tree and Command Bridge Officers. These new starships will allow you to truly take advantage of these new Bridge Officer abilities.

 

Availability

 

Command Battlecruisers will be made available in the C-Store very soon. These starships have three variants per faction and are available in three ways:

•Individually (3000 ZEN each)

•Faction Bundles of all three variants at a discount (6000 ZEN each)

•A Super Bundle that includes all three variants for all three factions at a huge discount (12000 ZEN)

 

Lol, best P2W game there is... for the publisher. Seriously, 2 months of mind-numbing grinding to get 1 ship... Or drop 30 bucks on it and have it today.

[TravelersWay]

when you pay the entry fee at the buffet...you are entitled to eat there. gasp!!!!!!! I know its difficult to understand..the devs added another line and are charging for those items on top of the entry fee..which isnt new. these people feel that they paid for an all you can eat so they should get one...you obviously feel different. I dont give a rats rear end either way, but have fun seeing people misusing the term "false sense of entitlement" because they like to parrot lines from smarter people

 

Well, it is entitlement. Been that way for years. Before cash shops became mainstream (F2P has been around as long, if not longer than the subscription model), your only choice for playing an MMO was to pay monthly, and hence everything added to the game was included in that, so it's only natural for many people to continue to assume that if they are paying a monthly fee, they should have access to everything that gets implemented in the game. What they fail to realize is that the price of the subscription has remained static over the last decade, while the cost of developing these games has increased exponentially.

Edited March 29, 2015 by TravelersWay

[SammuelSK]

STO is run by PWE, the BIGGEST MONEY GRUBBING PUBLISHER OF MMOS IN THE WESTERN WORLD.

 

Seriously, literally ALL of their games are pay to win.

 

That's nice, but at the end of the day an opinion. The company may, shocker, want to make a profit but with STO they do not FORCE you to buy things as F2P. Every single item is OPTIONAL, and the game allows you to make cash shop currency ingame.

 

Yeah you can buy Zen with dilithium.

 

Yes, you can earn the cash shop currency ingame... and as a F2P player going from a SUB it cost me $5.00(dilitium equiv) to be endgame ready.. You can't do that in SWTOR. Instead, if you want to wear high end armor, cash shop. If you want a title, cash shop. If you want to color match, cash shop. Whatever, those are optional but the content itself being hidden behind a paywall is not. Raid, PVP, Flashpoints, Guild repairs, the credits you earned as a sub. its all hidden behind CM fees. At the end of the day, I spent nearly $30.00 worth of SWTOR's currency, and am still blocked off from progressing in endgame. If I wish to continue, I must pay more, as the big ones are recurring costs.

 

Lol, best P2W game there is... for the publisher. Seriously, 2 months of mind-numbing grinding to get 1 ship... Or drop 30 bucks on it and have it today.

 

Factually incorrect opinion, STO runs events constantly that earn you huge lump sums of dilitium. Finishing off the reputations, again, huge sums of dilitium... all that can be converred into cashshop currency. Ships(T6) (aka the best) are also given out as event rewards incidently.

[Djiini]

Factually incorrect opinion, STO runs events constantly that earn you huge lump sums of dilitium. Finishing off the reputations, again, huge sums of dilitium... all that can be converred into cashshop currency. Ships(T6) (aka the best) are also given out as event rewards incidently.

 

But you still get ahead more by paying. Say, by paying, you get a bunch of cashshop currency, then you can do the event and convert dilithium into more...right?

 

I don't play STO, this is just an observation.

[Draqsko]

Yes, you can earn the cash shop currency ingame... and as a F2P player going from a SUB it cost me $5.00(dilitium equiv) to be endgame ready.. You can't do that in SWTOR. Instead, if you want to wear high end armor, cash shop. If you want a title, cash shop. If you want to color match, cash shop. Whatever, those are optional but the content itself being hidden behind a paywall is not. Raid, PVP, Flashpoints, Guild repairs, the credits you earned as a sub. its all hidden behind CM fees. At the end of the day, I spent nearly $30.00 worth of SWTOR's currency, and am still blocked off from progressing in endgame. If I wish to continue, I must pay more, as the big ones are recurring costs.

 

 

 

Factually incorrect opinion, STO runs events constantly that earn you huge lump sums of dilitium. Finishing off the reputations, again, huge sums of dilitium... all that can be converred into cashshop currency. Ships(T6) (aka the best) are also given out as event rewards incidently.

 

As a F2P player in STO, you can only refine 8k D per day, it doesn't matter how much you get since you need to refine it.

 

The currency is given out as dilithium ore, which must be refined (up to 8000 per day) using the ship's Inventory Asset tab.

 

So yes, it would still take you 2 months to get that ship. Also, bear in mind, that Zen is only Zen that other players put up for sale on the brokerage, if no one buys any Zen to sell, there is none to buy so having all the Dil in the world won't help you.

 

An alternative method of gaining Zen is the Dilithium Exchange, at which refined dilithium can be traded for Zen with other players at a player-determined rate (kept within a range of 25-500 dilithium per Zen).

 

And combined that with the fact that when people don't buy Zen, PWE manipulates the brokerage so the price goes up and basically forces you to pay cash. I watched it in PWI, heck I have 200 Zen there still on my account, and prices went up 50% since I stopped playing. I logged back in last year to see, the game was dead, yet Zen on the brokage was higher than ever. Combine that with the fact that the best gear is only availible from the cash shop, costing thousands of dollars or billions of coins in game, and then seeing the same thing starting to happen to Neverwinter and now STO...

 

Yeah it's an opinion, but I gave them the benefit of the doubt with PWI and played it for 3 years. There's a reason why I left to come to SWTOR, because I want to play a game where you have to earn the best gear in game, not throw your wallet around. It's pay to win, and that's the road all their games go down, seen it too many times. As the saying goes, fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.

[FerkWork]

Thanks everyone who mentioned entitlement my liver hates you now

#swtordrinkinggame

[AshenK]

its clear to me that every p2w game out there is a rip off and tor being one of the biggest ones around. i warned people back in the day about what tor would be like with a p2w system but no one heard me out.

 

games need to go back to the old system. pay to play with no cash shop, all items should be gotten in game as rewards. more so as a customer devs should make items that are both found in game and given freely as a thank you for supporting the game.

[Draqsko]

its clear to me that every p2w game out there is a rip off and tor being one of the biggest ones around. i warned people back in the day about what tor would be like with a p2w system but no one heard me out.

 

games need to go back to the old system. pay to play with no cash shop, all items should be gotten in game as rewards. more so as a customer devs should make items that are both found in game and given freely as a thank you for supporting the game.

 

The only thing you're paying to win in SWTOR is a fashion show. Sorry, but there is nothing in the cash shop that gives you a stat advantage over someone else.

 

The best gear in the game (198 PVE gear, and Ranked PVP gear) is only availible through playing the game. You can't buy it from someone else, you can't craft it, you can't get it from the cash shop. Pretty sure that's the total opposite of pay to win. Heck alot of games let you buy top tier gear with in game money from other players, which you can't even do in SWTOR. So it's not even pay to win with in game credits either.

[midianlord]

Oh no! The Old Republic has turned into...an MMO!

 

 

AAAAAAAAAAA!

 

Not a real MMO worthy of the platform, no.

 

The Sims + Second Life + StarWars skin =/= MMO just because masses of credulous little blinkered consumers need to convince themselves that they're getting any kind of real value for their money.

 

Shut up and BUY MORE CARTEL COINS!!!!!

 

That'll show them!

[Anaesha]

The only thing you're paying to win in SWTOR is a fashion show. Sorry, but there is nothing in the cash shop that gives you a stat advantage over someone else.

 

The best gear in the game (198 PVE gear, and Ranked PVP gear) is only availible through playing the game. You can't buy it from someone else, you can't craft it, you can't get it from the cash shop. Pretty sure that's the total opposite of pay to win. Heck alot of games let you buy top tier gear with in game money from other players, which you can't even do in SWTOR. So it's not even pay to win with in game credits either.

 

^This. ANYONE who thinks TOR is pay to Win needs to have their heads examined because TOR is anything but Pay to Win.

Edited March 29, 2015 by Anaesha

[SammuelSK]

But you still get ahead more by paying. Say, by paying, you get a bunch of cashshop currency, then you can do the event and convert dilithium into more...right?

 

I don't play STO, this is just an observation.

 

As a F2P player in STO, you can only refine 8k D per day, it doesn't matter how much you get since you need to refine it.

 

Nope. As a sub you are still capped at 8k. As a lifetime sub you get a bonus mission that nets you another 1k refinement for a total of 9k. I believe that that extra 1000 is tied to subscription rewards incidently. Don't know, didn't sub for long enough to earn it.

 

 

So yes, it would still take you 2 months to get that ship. Also, bear in mind, that Zen is only Zen that other players put up for sale on the brokerage, if no one buys any Zen to sell, there is none to buy so having all the Dil in the world won't help you.

 

Thats nice, but thats not an issue. People buy/sell it constantly. GW2 potentially could have the exact same problem one day, but its not today or anytime soon.

 

And combined that with the fact that when people don't buy Zen...... (etc)

 

More opinion, and conspiracy level ********... so they gave you zen and they are bad guys for doing it? Whatever.

Edited March 30, 2015 by SammuelSK