This game has devolved into a complete money-spinning rip-off.

[TravelersWay]

WoW has a much larger playerbase and therefore the subs sustain the game, with the occosional cosmetic micro-transaction and player services to fatten the balance sheets.

 

Well there you go and that's your answer!

 

Even if the subs dropped to swtor levels, I doubt Blizzard would turn around and spit in the faces of their day 1 players by making them take out their wallets to compensate for their fail.

 

Oh you bet your *** they absolutely would, unless they are planning to sunset the game at that point. Despite what people may think, gaming is a business first and foremost. It is never about the game, but about bringing in profits for whoever is making and publishing the game. That holds true regardless of the type of game being made. And don't think your beloved indie devs are any different. Sure, plenty are out there just for the love of creating something, but there are just as many out there looking to break into the industry to ... you guessed it - make money!!

Edited March 28, 2015 by TravelersWay

[Reno_Tarshil]

http://www.quickmeme.com/img/98/98b39b21ff008afaa5cba1e79fc611b2ddb64b3f44f57e792397c517768f4433.jpg

[Curbhunter]

Actually, if you are referring to WoW, they have recently stopped adding new mount models in any form except for store mounts. Every single unique mount they make will cost you either $25 or $30. Also, WoW has no F2P version to max level. swtor has the best F2P model I have ever played. (though I am enjoying the game enough that I subbed)

 

Rift by far has the best F2P IMO.... SWTOR F2P sucks you have to pay for extra hot bars in this game. having to pay for UI Is well....

[Ghisallo]

News flash OP everything about star wars has always been a money making spin off. Lucas himself would make script changes just so he could sell a freaking toy. Sorry you missed it until a video game in 2015 made u realize it but this is a 30 year trend...nothing new.

[MaximusRex]

WoW has transmog for FREE, which in this game would neatly nip the cartel market for armor sets and the extortion to account unlock them in the bud. I hear there's some sort of sound-alike in 3.2. I'll believe it when I see it. I would have thought it was too much of a cash-cow.

 

WoW has a much larger playerbase and therefore the subs sustain the game, with the occosional cosmetic micro-transaction and player services to fatten the balance sheets.

 

Even if the subs dropped to swtor levels, I doubt Blizzard would turn around and spit in the faces of their day 1 players by making them take out their wallets to compensate for their fail.

 

There is ZERO reason for a sub to spend money on the Cartel Market, that stuff is nothing but appearance fluff. But if you want to get some stuff, as a sub you get a monthly stipend, up to 600 Coins per month, that you can use.

 

Transmog isn't free, its costs gold every time you transmog a slot. Their store cosmetic gear is just a bunch of different helmets, for $15 ea, not even full sets. I don't get how you can say Blizzard is just fattening the wallet with thier exhobinetly priced items, while saying BioWare is a greed factory out the other side of your double face.

 

The delicious irony of you being a greedy liar while crying about BioWare's Cartel Market sustains me.

[CapitolNoodle]

Even if the subs dropped to swtor levels, I doubt Blizzard would turn around and spit in the faces of their day 1 players by making them take out their wallets to compensate for their fail.

 

Of course they would. Current Blizzard is not the old Blizzard. So far their current expansion hasn't had any content added since 6.0. Their 6.1 patch added a selfie cam (does nothing but takes a screenshot and allows you to send it to twatter with a hashtag) and nothing else. They are due for another $25 or $30 mount here in a month or so. Those "10 million" subs worth of money isn't going into their games. The quality of Blizzard games has been steadily decreasing since the 2009 era. Cartel Coins aren't that bad imo. Especially considering if you sub, you aren't forced into spending very many.

[ivanhedgehog]

They don't have to say it out right. The moment they say "I pay you $15 a month I shouldn't blah blah" It's basically putting up a HUGE neon sign saying I feel entitled to this.

 

when you pay the entry fee at the buffet...you are entitled to eat there. gasp!!!!!!! I know its difficult to understand..the devs added another line and are charging for those items on top of the entry fee..which isnt new. these people feel that they paid for an all you can eat so they should get one...you obviously feel different. I dont give a rats rear end either way, but have fun seeing people misusing the term "false sense of entitlement" because they like to parrot lines from smarter people

[Ghisallo]

Of course they would. Current Blizzard is not the old Blizzard. So far their current expansion hasn't had any content added since 6.0. Their 6.1 patch added a selfie cam (does nothing but takes a screenshot and allows you to send it to twatter with a hashtag) and nothing else. They are due for another $25 or $30 mount here in a month or so. Those "10 million" subs worth of money isn't going into their games. The quality of Blizzard games has been steadily decreasing since the 2009 era. Cartel Coins aren't that bad imo. Especially considering if you sub, you aren't forced into spending very many.

 

Some day people need to stop and look at Activision/Blizzard's financials. The last time I checked was before Panda land launched. Between WotLK and Panda land launch WoW was breaking even...read NOT making a clear profit. Why? They had pumped up the sub numbers so much they needed to maintain them. To maintain them their marketing budget became so crazy bloated that they were spending MORE money on advertising the game than they were on coding it ... Next in line was the cost of boxes and CD printing. When you are barely breaking even u don't get much for "regular development" costs.

 

If you were an accountant and were looking at games in terms of profit...WoW has been a paper tiger for YEARS. Problems is players on the main are gullible. They will drink whatever koolaid you feed em if its sweet enough

Edited March 28, 2015 by Ghisallo

[Ghisallo]

Every mmo turned into a complete turd recently.

This is the future, and you should get used to it. People are abandoning the genre, and the studious/corporations are in distress how to profit on their games.

It is happening to literally every single mmo.

Complaining about it is pointless. The devs are hostages to big corporate interests. It is not about the game anymore, but about the financial model.

And as you can see in SWTOR, we are getting small planets, bugged operations, but perfectly fine working cartel packs.

 

Here is the problem. .kids raised on console games don't think they should pay... MMOs want their dollars so they monkey with crap to try and shoe horn them in. The people raised on PC who are used to paying get turned off AND the console game kids still think they shouldn't have to pay.

 

In essence the game companies haven't cottoned to the fact other industries have. Look at VW. You can by a jetta all the way up to a Porcshe (yep owned by VW.). Each product has their "niche". Thanks to WoW, imo, a game making a good profit with 250k to 500k sub's is simply not acceptable anymore. Online games have to be beating or crushing their competitors.

 

Eventually this f2p MMO bubble will burst...there will be a few games left standing and things will move on with more stability from there. Until them however it is the wild west... Enjoy the ride.

[Halinalle]

Do you seriously consider that a viable way to play the game, at the atrocious rate of xp gain for non-subbers?

 

F2P Exp rate is the same subs had at launch.

What makes it different for F2Ps is restricted access to flashpoints.

Edited March 28, 2015 by Halinalle

[Sinapus]

when you pay the entry fee at the buffet...you are entitled to eat there. gasp!!!!!!!

 

...and you're complaining that, after eating at the buffet (i.e., playing the game,) you have to pay for things in the buffet gift shop (cartel market) despite the fee you pay to eat at the buffet granting you a small amount of credit (monthly cartel coins) that can be used in that shop.

 

I'm somehow unsympathetic towards your plight. I guess I'm a big evil meanie.

[Bobs_YourUncle]

Having to pay cartel coins for EVERYTHING.

 

As a player who commits to a sub every month, I shouldn't have to pay cartel coins for packs then have to pay again to use the items on another character.

 

All pack drops should be account-wide. Minor cosmetic changes should be free to subs also, or have a minor credit cost.

 

Legacy unlocks with prohibitive credit alternative costs leave no real option but to spend coins on alts. It's ridiculous. I'm all for micro-transactions, but, for instance, 240 coins to unlock a color crystal for account is stupid. At least moderate the cost some for subbers, it's not like you're not getting your pound of flesh every month, is it?

 

The money-grubbing just puts MMO players off this game. That and the stupid amount of time devoted to new ways to screw more money out of the playerbase while glaring game bugs go unfixed because what devs Bioware have are busy coding a new jetpack and sundry other fluff crap.

 

Well, they are a business. If you don't think the services they provide you are worth what they charge, don't buy. Declining profit is what speaks loudest to businesses.

[Mavolio]

Well...

SPOILERS FOR THE FINAL AREA ON ZIOST HERE.

 

^^ You've been warned.

Did someone at Bioware lose their crayons? where's the color? lol

Ummm...

 

 

*/sarcasm_on*

 

Patch notes: Crayon Colours can be individually purchased on the Cartel Market so players can "paint the town red" as they move through the content.

*/sarcasm_off*

It's a for everybody, BW makes more money and we have more things we get to do.

Edited March 28, 2015 by Mavolio

[MartinLefebvre]

They don't have to say it out right. The moment they say "I pay you $15 a month I shouldn't blah blah" It's basically putting up a HUGE neon sign saying I feel entitled to this.

 

You...you...YOU!!! I think someone should strip you of the right to talk

[Turajin]

when you pay the entry fee at the buffet...you are entitled to eat there.

... but you still have to pay for the drinks. I've never seen any "all you can eat" menu where the drinks where included. Beverages are optional, not included and thus charged seperately.

[OddballEasyEight]

Having to pay cartel coins for EVERYTHING.

 

As a player who commits to a sub every month, I shouldn't have to pay cartel coins for packs then have to pay again to use the items on another character.

 

All pack drops should be account-wide. Minor cosmetic changes should be free to subs also, or have a minor credit cost.

 

Legacy unlocks with prohibitive credit alternative costs leave no real option but to spend coins on alts. It's ridiculous. I'm all for micro-transactions, but, for instance, 240 coins to unlock a color crystal for account is stupid. At least moderate the cost some for subbers, it's not like you're not getting your pound of flesh every month, is it?

 

The money-grubbing just puts MMO players off this game. That and the stupid amount of time devoted to new ways to screw more money out of the playerbase while glaring game bugs go unfixed because what devs Bioware have are busy coding a new jetpack and sundry other fluff crap.

 

As someone who is leaving in large part because of disillusion with how the game is being run, I simply don't agree with your (IMHO false) portrayal of the game.

 

I think they've found a decent middleground for monetization in the game.

 

There's hardly anything in the game that you can't get for in-game credits.

And almost none of the credit costs are prohibitive as you claim. If you are a subscriber, then you'll be swimming in credits (unless you have absolutely no impulse control and buy every new shiny and never put in effort to get new credits).

The only people who struggle in this game and might feel forced to put actual money into the game are the free-to-play crowd.

And that's frankly fair, because they're playing the game for free.

 

The few things that ARE completely cartel coin locked have such low costs that you can easily afford them with your monthly stipend.

 

You are completely off the mark here. It's clear that you're just annoyed that you're not getting everything for free with the sub, but since that approach nearly sunk the game, I'd say it's pretty destructive to demand that back.

[ZETA_SCORPII]

The rich need a way to distinguish themselves from the poor. Welcome to life.

[Lyzarus]

If you're going to bring the 800lb gorilla into the fight, make sure you have your facts straight. Transmog costs gold for each item, every time you want to switch. There are mounts and pets to buy in the store, this is true, and so far in the current x-pac, there only some reskins and small cosmetic changes to mounts that are currently available in game. However, the number and variation on mounts that are only in the game, and only obtainable through raiding, questing, farming, luck with rare spawns etc., far outweigh the cash shop.

 

I have many gripes with Blizz, but the cash shop, isn't one of them. When you buy the games and sub, you get access to everything in the game, you just have to want to get it bad enough. Same with TOR, when you sub, you get access to everything, you just have to want to get it bad enough. For me that usually means means doing some daily's, running some flashpoints, saving credits and buyin the things off the GTN. On occasion I'll drop some coin, get some packs, and see if I get lucky, but that's a choice, I am not required to do that to get the items I want.

[HelikaonAeneas]

Actually, if you are referring to WoW, they have recently stopped adding new mount models in any form except for store mounts. Every single unique mount they make will cost you either $25 or $30. Also, WoW has no F2P version to max level. swtor has the best F2P model I have ever played. (though I am enjoying the game enough that I subbed)

 

Star Trek Online has a much better version of F2P. Its not even close.

[SammuelSK]

Hey, some MMOs nickle-and-dime more than others. And from what I can tell, SWTOR pretty high up there on the nickle-and-dimer list.

 

As far as I can tell, having played more then a few of them. Its near the top of the nickle-and-dime list.

 

Pretty *********** pathetic.

 

Star Trek Online has a much better version of F2P. Its not even close.

 

Agreed. I subbed to STO for a bit. $5(Credit Unlock) was what it cost me to play comfortably as a F2P account afer the sub ran out.

 

SWTOR.... I've used about $30 of cartel coins, and in the end I'm still running into ******** restrictions.

 

STO also lets you grind things out and earn their cartel coin equivelent ingame, So no, SWTOR is by far, nowhere near the 'best F2P model'.

Edited March 28, 2015 by SammuelSK

[Mubrak]

Do you seriously consider that a viable way to play the game, at the atrocious rate of xp gain for non-subbers?.

Wasn't today's f2p XP gain the original rate before the game went f2p and subs got a 25% XP bonus, allowing them to outlevel the planets if they bothered to do all side missions (enjoyed the game, some would say)?

 

F2P doing about everything hit level 50 close to the end of the class quest, and are level 49 or 50 when they fight the level 49 boss of their class story. Sub that do the same will be level 52+

 

But well, seeing all the hype about double XP weekends and all the calls for 12x XP. Facing the first real challenge in endgame content seems to be a good thing.

 

 

Anyway to the topic: Just play a f2p game like Neverwinter - if SWTOR were like this then you could buy endgame ops tokens in the cartel market while the dropping rate in the ops themselves would be even less, the best stuff available might even be only available from the cartel market. Same for leveling: you'd only get white and green equipment, blues would be drops in flashpoints and purple/orange would be available for special tokens that could bought in the cartel market.

 

This is the pay-2-win reality. SWTOR's scheme is really fair in comparsion: the only advantage you might buy with real life money are the level 10 / +41 color crystals and a couple of level 32 armors with purple mods, everything else is just vanity stuff that gives you no gameplay advantage.

 

The disadvantages of a preferred player that can't be unlocked are few, but enough to encourage dedicated players to subscribe: max 350k credits, cooldown on quicktravel/fleet pass, crewskill limitation to 3 crew members with 1 mission each. 5 WZs per week (unless grouped with a sub) and No Ops.

 

Subscriptions are still what pays their bills, most purchases on the cartel market would be done by subscribers as well (after all why buy cartel coins when you can't don't want to afford a subscription?). Of course everyone is encouraged to pay a bit more, that's how businesses work, but they didn't go as far as to unbalance the game so that a sub actually has to pay that "extra bit" to accomplish anything in the game.

Edited March 28, 2015 by Mubrak

[SammuelSK]

Wasn't today's f2p XP gain the original rate before the game went f2p and subs got a 25% XP bonus, allowing them to outlevel the planets if they bothered to do all side missions (enjoyed the game, some would say)?

 

F2P doing about everything hit level 50 close to the end of the class quest, and are level 49 or 50 when they fight the level 49 boss of their class story. Sub that do the same will be level 52+

 

But well, seeing all the hype about double XP weekends and all the calls for 12x XP. Facing the first real challenge in endgame content seems to be a good thing.

 

 

Anyway to the topic: Just play a f2p game like Neverwinter - if SWTOR were like this then you could buy endgame ops tokens in the cartel market while the dropping rate in the ops themselves would be even less, the best stuff available might even be only available from the cartel market. Same for leveling: you'd only get white and green equipment, blues would be drops in flashpoints and purple/orange would be available for special tokens that could bought in the cartel market.

 

This is the pay-2-win reality. SWTOR's scheme is really fair in comparsion: the only advantage you might buy with real life money are the level 10 / +41 color crystals and a couple of level 32 armors with purple mods, everything else is just vanity stuff that gives you no gameplay advantage.

 

The disadvantages of a preferred player that can't be unlocked are few, but enough to encourage dedicated players to subscribe: max 350k credits, cooldown on quicktravel/fleet pass, crewskill limitation to 3 crew members with 1 mission each. 5 WZs per week (unless grouped with a sub) and No Ops.

 

Subscriptions are still what pays their bills, most purchases on the cartel market would be done by subscribers as well (after all why buy cartel coins when you can't don't want to afford a subscription?). Of course everyone is encouraged to pay a bit more, that's how businesses work, but they didn't go as far as to unbalance the game so that a sub actually has to pay that "extra bit" to accomplish anything in the game.

 

From a subscriber's point of view:

 

Effectively speaking, we aren't getting much in the way of free content. It's hard to argue that it hasn't slowed down significantly. Has our subscription fee lowered any to balance out this loss in content output? Nope.

 

Additionally they are now selling what amounts to content patches as a 'expansion'. Has the cost of that dropped match the smaller size of the update? Nope. $10 for the first expansion, $20 for the second expansion. Increased in fact then.

 

Has our money then been spent on making the game better? Nope. The operations are still buggy FOUR months in, and the UI still lags the game to nearly unplayable levels.

 

So what is our subscription being used for? Funding the cartel market... so that we can buy more things ontop of our existing $15.... yeah, that seems like fair value.

 

From a F2P point of view:

 

Effectively speaking, in order complete endgame content you need to shell out around $20, closer to $30 if you have any interest in your characters appearence. Add to that a recurring fee of ops passes (weekly) and coin escrows's (bi-weekly). This does not include PVP. You are better off going back to being a sub, F2P is a barely viable option (and completely impossible for a new player) if you are interested in raiding as your 'fees' will total up to about a monthly sub anyway.

[Halinalle]

$10 for the first expansion

 

Source?

[Reno_Tarshil]

Source?

 

it was 10 dollars for subs and 20 dollars for others.

[BrianDavion]

You don't see the top MMO in the World doing this ****, do you?

 

http://www.1up.com/news/fancy-horse-blizzard-2-million

 

 

nope blizzard never does micro transactions! ohh wait..