jedimasterjac Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 Is this game in maintenance mode, and if so, how long has it been and how long will this lack of quantity and quantity to the development of SWTOR continue? i feel we are NOT in maintenance mode, I feel we are in silent BETA mode.That they are adding things to see what is popular or not,what will generate us buying more CC,and how to handle expanding the game. Based on what happens they will make changes to the SWTOR2 using another newer better engine.(this is all rumor) Then in about 2 years SWTOR 2 will come out and This game will shut down. A lot of features they have added and was both popular and worked fine will be in the new game. things that did not work well or was unpopular will be changed. for example the new costume designer works mostly for appearance,but some games in the past you could have two or more full sets of armor one for pvp and one for pve. and a simple click of the button switches.no need to drag and drop between the two sets. or a third set designed for FP with some power differences. once they get swtor 2 ready , we get to buy strongholds and such all over again, once again helping Disney recover the 4.5 Billion they paid GL Jet fuel can't melt steel beams. Bush did 9/11. Dick Cheney made money off the Iraq war. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmmbuddah Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 (edited) well if everytime i tried talkeing to someone i got insulted id proably punch them in the face or ignore them utterly so personaly id say the fact there willing to talk at all with this toxic pit is pretty good and as for matnice mode we just came out of a expansion and theres a big udate planed for spring troll harder. btw eaware is idiotic and your varation of it more so than the normal version. Well, if you ignore your fanbase, ask for their feedback and then IGNORE them again, promise them things, and not deliver, OVER, AND OVER again, then they should expect people to be mad and a little pissed off. They deserve all the pushback they are getting atm. Edited March 23, 2015 by mmmbuddah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghisallo Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 Well, if you ignore your fanbase, ask for their feedback and then IGNORE them again, promise them things, and not deliver, OVER, AND OVER again, then they should expect people to be mad and a little pissed off. They deserve all the pushback they are getting atm. And this is completely subjective. See just because YOU feel ignored doesn't mean they ignored the majority. Just because YOU feel a promise was "broken" doesn't mean it was. Also what your expectation for what was to be delivered is not necessarily shared by the person sitting next to you. And saying "just read the forums" doesn't cut it. Forum posters are the smallest minority of gamers and by their nature such posters are usually among the pickiest among the player base. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghisallo Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 Jet fuel can't melt steel beams. Bush did 9/11. Dick Cheney made money off the Iraq war. I am going to assume this was a troll at conspiracy theorists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
annabethchase Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 Is this game in maintenance mode, and if so, how long has it been and how long will this lack of quantity and quantity to the development of SWTOR continue? i feel we are NOT in maintenance mode, I feel we are in silent BETA mode.That they are adding things to see what is popular or not,what will generate us buying more CC,and how to handle expanding the game. Based on what happens they will make changes to the SWTOR2 using another newer better engine.(this is all rumor) Then in about 2 years SWTOR 2 will come out and This game will shut down.... That's one way of looking at things. However, let's consider a different path an MMO took. Final Fantasy XI has now been running 13+ years. It was based on a highly successful existing franchise and was the first MMO by it's developer (I think). It made some mistakes (lack of solo leveling, extreme difficulty) but through consistent effort by it's developer over the years is actually still an active subscription MMO today. I actually just read an article that they have 3 story patches releasing this year. Now that literally shocked me. We're multiple years into FFXIV (attempt #2) existing. So the fact that FFXI is still receiving real content update patches is very cool to see. I must say, if we're still getting story updates in SWTOR in 2025 I'll be happy. And yes, we realistically could also have also launched another SW MMO in the new movie era by then. But that doesn't mean The Old Republic has to be dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
annabethchase Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 And this is completely subjective. See just because YOU feel ignored doesn't mean they ignored the majority. Just because YOU feel a promise was "broken" doesn't mean it was. Also what your expectation for what was to be delivered is not necessarily shared by the person sitting next to you. And saying "just read the forums" doesn't cut it. Forum posters are the smallest minority of gamers and by their nature such posters are usually among the pickiest among the player base. Well, sometimes written words are called "promises" by paying customers. That's a pretty normal thing. Maybe the best word would be "intentions", as in they "intended" to have a content update by x date. Missing it by one week, not so big a deal. Missing by a whole patch cycle is a pretty big deal and did lose a lot of active users last summer waiting on Strongholds. Feeling ignored is probably a fair word to use for PvP players right now. The reason being an expectation was created when the staff said they were going to work on a new map, asked for feedback, directly interacted with the customer base in obtaining the feedback in a wildly popular thread, and then haven't mentioned it again in months. Why is that map not on the roadmap for 2015? These things are certainly fixable, but I certainly understand how some players can lose patience when months go by without status updates on something they care deeply about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghisallo Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 But a promise is made based on the circumstance at the time it is made. RL example... "Bob, I hear you want to be on my unit. U do good work I'll get you transferred"... Before transfer happens Bobs current unit loses 3 people so Bob doesn't get the transfer. A Promise wasn't broken there circumstances simply made it impossible or impractical to keep it. A perfect example in this game at launch was the one made about cross server ranked PvP. Well that was at launch...the population dropped, there were cut backs... They needed to make a lot of new content (because the lack of content was a BIG reason for the drop) and code for the f2p transition. They are still in new content mode and just had to redo all the classes. So while it is technically possible, with a bit of effort, to keep that promise the circumstances they find themselves in means that their limited resources have to spent elsewhere. This happens all the time IRL. You would see Bob screaming " BUT YOU PROMISED ME A TRANSFER!!!!" he gets it wasn't broken, circumstances just made it impossible to keep. Why people forget such RL rules still boggles my mind. Usually however in these games they don't give specific promises in writing. They don't say "this next expansion will be at least 3 months worth of content" or "we promise to spend more development time on this topic than that" etc. The speak in generalities..." We will improve this", "we are working to fix that" etc. The nature of the "promise" there is entirely subjective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmmbuddah Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 And this is completely subjective. See just because YOU feel ignored doesn't mean they ignored the majority. Just because YOU feel a promise was "broken" doesn't mean it was. Also what your expectation for what was to be delivered is not necessarily shared by the person sitting next to you. And saying "just read the forums" doesn't cut it. Forum posters are the smallest minority of gamers and by their nature such posters are usually among the pickiest among the player base. Actually it is not subjective, when they say one thing, don't do it, then it was a lie. Simple. When they do it over and over and over and over and over, then people get mad, and they have the right to get mad. Take your fanboy glasses off please, your blindness is showing. I like the game as much as the next guy, and I give praise where praise is deserved, but I criticize where it is also deserved, and when you flat out lie to your community, over and OVER, and -OVER-, then they deserve all the complaints they get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghisallo Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 (edited) But what exactly was said... Not paraphrase...exact words.... After that you have to look at the context of the times in which the statements were made... Then look to see if that context remained the status quo. Is this anal retentive? Yes but if you read my response above this is what we deal with irl everyday.. A promise is only broken when it is A) specific and B) when the circumstances that existed when the promise was made remains largely unchanged. In other words the person has to break a promise. Circumstances changing so that the promise, sadly, becomes impractical or even impossible is not a broken promise. So if you care to answer the questions I posted first, I would be glad to see them. I am one of those people who when I see facts, they can change my opinion and I say "mae culpa." Right now I see a company that has indeed made statements that have created expectations that have not been fulfilled. In the emo filled world of gaming this is often a risky prospect. However creating an expectation is NOT the same as making a promise. From you all I have seen are claims with no details followed by the good old standby..."fanboi"... Retort when someone tries to actually ask questions or make statements based of fact and reason. Edited March 23, 2015 by Ghisallo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeres- Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 (edited) I just recently came back to this game. I started when the game was released and quit for a while. Retured this past weekend. The game isn't in maintenance mode it seems. There's content being released and from the numbers it seems the game is profitable. I would say it's doing much better now than when I left. Kudos to Bioware and everyone involved because back then it seemed the game was just about to go under. Edited March 23, 2015 by Xeres- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
menofhorror Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 Its EA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrimRita Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 I just recently came back to this game. I started when the game was released and quit for a while. Retured this past weekend. The game isn't in maintenance mode it seems. There's content being released and from the numbers it seems the game is profitable. I would say it's doing much better now than when I left. Kudos to Bioware and everyone involved because back then it seemed the game was just about to go under. If you hadn't of left, you would probably feel that the content is stale. What has been released has been paid/expansion content and what is being released is small dailies areas with no weight behind it. Including the story Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 Its EA. And SWTOR's management. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentleman_snow Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 To the people comparing this game to WoW re: content, let's remember that WoW is 10 or 11 years old and this game is what, three or four? Let's see what this game looks like at the ten year mark, if we reach it. Then we can compare it to WoW's ten year mark, content and bugwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 To the people comparing this game to WoW re: content, let's remember that WoW is 10 or 11 years old and this game is what, three or four? Let's see what this game looks like at the ten year mark, if we reach it. Then we can compare it to WoW's ten year mark, content and bugwise. That's what people said when SWTOR launched... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshenK Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 To the people comparing this game to WoW re: content, let's remember that WoW is 10 or 11 years old and this game is what, three or four? Let's see what this game looks like at the ten year mark, if we reach it. Then we can compare it to WoW's ten year mark, content and bugwise. just about every mmo that's not tor has had more content put in by now. even swg had some good pvp system ideas by this point in it that just failed due to the nge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
menofhorror Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 I can easily see why they would be embarassed even though its their own fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azudelphi Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 (edited) just about every mmo that's not tor has had more content put in by now. even swg had some good pvp system ideas by this point in it that just failed due to the nge. Battlefields (the SWG equivalent to warzones) weren't even introduced until 6 years after that game launched. Game Update 10 - June 2nd, 2009 Galactic Civil War - Planetary control game was introduced even later than warzones... Game Update 15 - January 25, 2010 Player bounties and open world pvp were about all that game had for that department. TOR has 3 more years before they reach when SWG added any pvp-centric content. Edit: Oh, and NGE came before both of those... November 15, 2005 was when NGE went live. And Restuss, the primary open world PVP point wasn't until June 8, 2006... So.... no, considering SWG went live in 2003, they did a terrible job adding new content for PVP; as bad as it sounds, SWG was actually worse for your PVP player than this game in that department. #rosetintedglasses Edited March 23, 2015 by azudelphi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 Battlefields (the SWG equivalent to warzones) weren't even introduced until 6 years after that game launched. Game Update 10 - June 2nd, 2009 Galactic Civil War - Planetary control game was introduced even later than warzones... Game Update 15 - January 25, 2010 Player bounties and open world pvp were about all that game had for that department. TOR has 3 more years before they reach when SWG added any pvp-centric content. Edit: Oh, and NGE came before both of those... November 15, 2005 was when NGE went live. And Restuss, the primary open world PVP point wasn't until June 8, 2006... So.... no, considering SWG went live in 2003, they did a terrible job adding new content for PVP; as bad as it sounds, SWG was actually worse for your PVP player than this game in that department. #rosetintedglasses I agree that many people view SWG with rose tinted glasses, but the PvP there was far superior to here. FAR superior!!! The open world flagging system and cross factional worlds made PvP happen anywhere, all the time. Bar fights, Bazaar terminals, houses, quest locations, space, key locations, guild cities...it was FAR superior to what this game has. Other than that, this game is superior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xPATRIOTx Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 I couldn't find the link but according to Forbes this game came in second behind wow for profits last quarter. I would not call that a failure. http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2014/07/19/world-of-warcraft-still-a-1b-powerhouse-even-as-subscription-mmos-decline/ Close, #4, $165,000,000 in revenue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghisallo Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 just about every mmo that's not tor has had more content put in by now. even swg had some good pvp system ideas by this point in it that just failed due to the nge. Let's look at one game that is similarly dated so we have an apples to apples comparison.... Rift. Have they released more content? It depends on what you see as content. Rift looks large with the maps and such but you progress through those maps faster. So does it have more content? Seems subjective. They you have to look at the elephant in the room... Cut scenes. I really think this is one of the big dividing lines and when someone may want to call some people fan bois, take a breath and understand something. Cut scenes take A LOT of time and effort. I have seen estimates where as much as 1/4 of the launch development budget went to them (including voice acting). So one people is saying "damn you fanboi this game sucks, there isn't a lot to do and they ignore my PvP", the person being called a fanboi is confused because they are all about the story and bioware does that part very well. I am about both but I know people who prefer playable content over story but even they have to say some of the stories and the cut scenes for them are well done. So again... Its all subjective and someone doesn't have to be a fanboi to be happy with bioware...they can just have a different priority than you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papazmurf Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 I really think this is one of the big dividing lines and when someone may want to call some people fan bois, take a breath and understand something. Cut scenes take A LOT of time and effort. I have seen estimates where as much as 1/4 of the launch development budget went to them (including voice acting). So one people is saying "damn you fanboi this game sucks, there isn't a lot to do and they ignore my PvP", the person being called a fanboi is confused because they are all about the story and bioware does that part very well. I love this part of your post. Pretty much saying different people view things with a different perspective or lens. Granted I don't think most PVPers specifically are calling cut scene guys fanbois. More like they are calling fellow PVPers who are fine with the current state of PVP fanbois. The perspective thing still holds true in that scenario as well however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
annabethchase Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 I really think this is one of the big dividing lines and when someone may want to call some people fan bois, take a breath and understand something. Cut scenes take A LOT of time and effort. I have seen estimates where as much as 1/4 of the launch development budget went to them (including voice acting). So one people is saying "damn you fanboi this game sucks, there isn't a lot to do and they ignore my PvP", the person being called a fanboi is confused because they are all about the story and bioware does that part very well. Think of it this way, even if they spent a 1/4 of their budget on cutscenes, they still had more development money than basically every MMO ever. And I don't believe the figure would be that high. Bioware knew going in exactly what it takes to make cutscenes since it's what they do in every game they make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azudelphi Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 (edited) I agree that many people view SWG with rose tinted glasses, but the PvP there was far superior to here. FAR superior!!! The open world flagging system and cross factional worlds made PvP happen anywhere, all the time. Bar fights, Bazaar terminals, houses, quest locations, space, key locations, guild cities...it was FAR superior to what this game has. Other than that, this game is superior. Yes and no. Without a doubt, the open world pvp aspect was much better... in the sense that this game doesn't really have open world pvp. But as I recall, even that open world pvp suffered from similar engine / back end problems... I mean, you couldn't even solo in that game without the dreaded rubber-banding. The rubber-banding there actually makes the graphics lag that this game's engine puts out almost bearable; but not really, they are both rather disappointing. But agreed that the open world system there was more prevalent, though even that took a strong hit as the game lost players. Edit: Honestly, the people who have complained about .5-1 second ability lag would have gone totally insane if they were bounced back positionally by 100m every 3 seconds, unable to do any other actions... Bonus Edit: Oh, and god forbid it happen on Dathomir as a pack of Rancors spawned on you with you passing safely by, only to be put smack in the middle of their aggro range. And death (for a while) had more consequence there than here... Edited March 24, 2015 by azudelphi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghisallo Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 (edited) Think of it this way, even if they spent a 1/4 of their budget on cutscenes, they still had more development money than basically every MMO ever. And I don't believe the figure would be that high. Bioware knew going in exactly what it takes to make cutscenes since it's what they do in every game they make. BUT they don't have that budget now and that's the point. People need to stoip, take a breath and say "that was then this is now." news flash boys and girls...circumstances change, a game with a launch budget of 200 million can find itself the goat....then they look at the number of players participating in each type of content through data mining and distribute their new VASTLY reduced budget to where most of the players are. as for the last bit did you know that Biuoware reps at GDC 2013 stated spcifically that they were under prssure, never running an MMO before, never having a crew that big, watching Bioware's cofounders resign... so they retreated to what thy did best.... story and custscenes....and under estimated how fast the PvE content would be consumed (they estimated 3-5 months to reach level 50) and thus they released a game with little end content? This is THEIR admission. When you look it at that way....and know how much just voice actors get paid...basically they blew 1/4 of their budget on their comfort zone because they felt the world was going to pieces around them. THEIR admission. Then the game flops after launch because of these issues, they are on a much more restricted budget... fell they need to push out more PvE content and the f2p transition etc. They then look and see X number opf PvE players... Y number of PvbP players... look at the server counts and loads.... if you are an accountant... read a computer... where are you spending your money? Edited March 24, 2015 by Ghisallo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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