aquariuseffect Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 IMO simply Starkiller aka Galen Marek Beat me to it! I was going to light a fire by pointing out that Galen Marek was easily the most powerful jedi/sith. Definitely not the wisest. Canon has Obi Wan as the wisest of all Jedi. If you go by supposition, it is believed that Plageuous(sp) created Anakin Skywalker out of the force, equating him quite literally to god... immaculate conception and all. Plus he's a Muun, so he's like an intergalactic Jewish species. Great with money and all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oonkeh_ Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 Beat me to it! I was going to light a fire by pointing out that Galen Marek was easily the most powerful jedi/sith. Definitely not the wisest. Canon has Obi Wan as the wisest of all Jedi. If you go by supposition, it is believed that Plageuous(sp) created Anakin Skywalker out of the force, equating him quite literally to god... immaculate conception and all. Plus he's a Muun, so he's like an intergalactic Jewish species. Great with money and all. It was stated that canonically, Starkiller/Galen Marek's Force Potential rivals Darth Sidious's. Not that he was as powerful as Sidious - he never attained it. Starkiller died, and his clone is destined to die (he's not seen in any of the OT). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zamfire Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 Beat me to it! I was going to light a fire by pointing out that Galen Marek was easily the most powerful jedi/sith. Definitely not the wisest. Canon has Obi Wan as the wisest of all Jedi. If you go by supposition, it is believed that Plageuous(sp) created Anakin Skywalker out of the force, equating him quite literally to god... immaculate conception and all. Plus he's a Muun, so he's like an intergalactic Jewish species. Great with money and all. In terms on Force Knowledge then I don't see who could rival Darth Plagueis. And yes According to Cannon, Luke was the most powerful Jedi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain_Zone Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 It was stated that canonically, Starkiller/Galen Marek's Force Potential rivals Darth Sidious's. Not that he was as powerful as Sidious - he never attained it. Starkiller died, and his clone is destined to die (he's not seen in any of the OT). There is another theory I heard about Galen Marek/Starkiller. That somehow his soul was able to inhabit the clone body similar to how Palpatine extended his own life. He has all of Marek's memories, which most clones do not. That is why there has only ever been one fully successful attempt to clone a Jedi. By "FULLY", I mean that clones of Jedi tend to go insane i.e. Joruus C'baoth. Or Luuke Skywalker (The clone that Mara Jade killed to fulfill Palpatine's last command to her through the Force). The Starkiller clone of Galen Marek did not go insane, but the Dark Apprentice clone did. That points to the possibility that Starkiller is actually Galen Marek's soul in the clone body. Like I said, this is only a theory. As to him not being in the OT, I do believe that if or when they make a 3rd TFU, that Juno may become pregnant and instead of joining the Rebellion publicly, they may retire to a world someplace that's masked from the Force to raise their child, or maybe he will be working behind the scenes in the OT timeframe and you never know when he'll pop up again. lol I've noticed that ExU authors have a way of explaining 2 second screenshots to place ExU characters in certain places at certain times. Including showing Soontir Fel at the Battle of Endor. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coloroutloud Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 Actually, you're quite incorrect. Luke was actually very experienced in the force by the time of RotJ. He was not "new" at all. Read his EU that is set during the timeline of the OT. About Mace Windu "besting" Sidious. He won the lightsaber duel, but he didn't defeat Sidious. In the RotS Novel which is considered as canon as the movie itself, Sidious bent Windu's lightsaber blade with a lightning surge even while he was holding back. Mace Windu STRUGGLED to keep his defenses against a Sidious whom was feigning weakness infront of Anakin - to turn Anakin. If Sidious, par the novel, had wanted to destroy Mace Windu outright with the force.. he would have there and then. No other force user has ever bent a lightsaber blade with lightning. Again Darth Caedus wasn't as powerful as people were making him out to be. He was nowhere near Sidious's level of Force Expertise (Sidious knew ALL Force powers and Lightsaber forms and could create force powers on the spot, he mastered each lightsaber form to be exact). In the EU Caedus attests that had Luke intended, Caedus would have been dead in seconds. I read the EU involving it. Caedus was no more than a Vader-level Sith. Luke was even holding back in the duel where Caedus managed to wound him, and that was all he was able to do. Wound. And he still could not win because he simply was no where near Luke or Sidious's measure of power. Compared to Abeloth, Caedus isn't even that much of an impressive Force user - Abeloth DOMINATED Luke who was going all-out the second time they fought, so much as to make Luke look like an amateur, which was what Luke did to Caedus and what Sidious did to Luke prior. Unlike Caedus, Sidious could destroy planets. That's a huge gap between the two in terms of force power. If all that is true, why was he destroyed by vader and luke and what appeared to be such easy terms for the movie wise? I would like to know where you get more information on palpatine describing his power cause i cant seem to find anywhere that describes the amount of power he has. They all just say, not much is know about his training, etc. I'm not saying he is not the most powerful, but im not saying his, and i am very curious to read into palpatine now. If you can recommend me to where i may read more about his power and lightsaber forms, i would be much obliged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperface Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 I would say Luke Skywalker. Hands down. He threw away his lightsaber, telling Palpatine to **** off, brought Anakin back and with it bringing the force back into balance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crawelc Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 According to Kotor 2 Kreia said that any jedi/sith of that timeline paled in comparison to the ones from thousands of years earlier. I dont see how any of the jedi/sith from that point forward could be more powerful than the ones she was speaking of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paperface Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 (edited) According to Kotor 2 Kreia said that any jedi/sith of that timeline paled in comparison to the ones from thousands of years earlier. I dont see how any of the jedi/sith from that point forward could be more powerful than the ones she was speaking of. Well, if it's not Lucas-canon, im not quite sure they ever existed... Edited December 14, 2011 by Paperface Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crawelc Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 I believe she was talking about Naga sadow's prowess with a light sabre, I may be wrong about which sith lord she was talking about but it was in the valley of the sith in kotor 2, that was a lucas arts game so how could it not be cannon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kraniumbrud Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 Isnt it canon that DArth vader is the most powerfull sith, atleast potential vise? Light side..yoda ofcause... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oonkeh_ Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 (edited) I believe she was talking about Naga sadow's prowess with a light sabre, I may be wrong about which sith lord she was talking about but it was in the valley of the sith in kotor 2, that was a lucas arts game so how could it not be cannon? You mean Tulak Hord. And Kreia was a character you find out was leading you on from the start - she sews lies and exaggerates claims.. in other words, she's a liar for the sake of it and knows it'll fulfill her end - suffice to say, her lying backfires and she's ultimately killed by the Exile who did not want to embrace what Kreia (aka.. Darth Traya.. 'Betrayer') had planned for her. She failed as a Jedi, and was mostly responsible for Revan's eventual fall to the dark side and betrayal of the Republic due to ideologies and the philosophy she taught Revan. She failed as a Sith Lord, and ultimately gave Darth Nihilus a purpose who went on to consume the Miraluka homeworld; both him and Sion turned on Kreia because of her Jedi philosophy even in her Sith Teaching. She failed as a Gray Jedi because she was wracked with the idea that she could destroy the force and her perception of the Galaxy was horribly warped and unhealthy that she resorted to said vengeance. She was quite selfish; not wise, and needlessly cryptic when in comparison to someone like Revan (who eventually turned out to be the more interesting character and ultimately fulfilled a much greater purpose). No, the Ancient Dark Lords were not the most powerful. They were exceptional for their time. As such, Sidious wouldn't have become so powerful that even the Ancient Dark Lords knelt before him if it were true. Edited December 14, 2011 by Oonkeh_ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurav Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 As far as Jedi go, I would have to say Yoda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crawelc Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 Thanks for the great reply lol. I never took in to account that everything she told you was meant to twist you around her finger just a little bit more. I dont agree that she was failed though, everything she set out to do with you in the game she accomplished except the very end. She got rid of the jedi council and both the sith, she only failed when it came to getting rid of the force. Also I think between her and Joilee in the first game we had a pretty clear definition of the two ways to be a "grey jedi" mostly good or mostly evil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axsagon Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 k lets talk and jadge all about, facts , sidous was strong sith yes but he wasnt so powerful like you saing about him, he was a master of manipulation that fact. but not more then it . Jasen solo was the strongest jedi befor he got to the dark side and after he was the stronger sith ever y? couse he new all the force thechnics the shater point is one of the rere one that only mace windu new that how he beat sidius , thtat fact . now his mestake was to learn bane skywaker the force power of to hide from the force and bane learned this to luke his father ,whene they fothgt whit Jeson they fothg bouthg luke and bane and he was destracted by the big battle that he used batele meditation on it and his gol was not to beat luke and bane ,his gol was to tourn bane to dark side, and read the fate of the galaxy how luke and bane toke the tore on the alll Jasec learnd to get to the dark side then say how sidius is strong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dathmesican Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 k lets talk and jadge all about, facts , sidous was strong sith yes but he wasnt so powerful like you saing about him, he was a master of manipulation that fact. but not more then it . Jasen solo was the strongest jedi befor he got to the dark side and after he was the stronger sith ever y? couse he new all the force thechnics the shater point is one of the rere one that only mace windu new that how he beat sidius , thtat fact . now his mestake was to learn bane skywaker the force power of to hide from the force and bane learned this to luke his father ,whene they fothgt whit Jeson they fothg bouthg luke and bane and he was destracted by the big battle that he used batele meditation on it and his gol was not to beat luke and bane ,his gol was to tourn bane to dark side, and read the fate of the galaxy how luke and bane toke the tore on the alll Jasec learnd to get to the dark side then say how sidius is strong Huh ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siegewulf Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 I don't know if you mean to limit this to Jedi/Sith exclusively but I'd place Thrawn as the most intelligent, at least top ten. As far as knowledge of the Force? I'd go with Yoda, maybe Bane (He created the rule of two but he doesn't really strike me as that intelligent and the rule of two was flawed), Vergere seemed to have a pretty solid (though warped) knowledge of the force as well. You also have people like Exar Kun and such. It's hard to say really because a lot of these characters are only mentioned in the novels and not really explored. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siegewulf Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 Jacen was never the strongest Jedi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axsagon Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 read the yujan wong war and who won the war and how then you will have yore winer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TorNAth Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 (edited) I think.... This Guy: http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Sith_Emperor Just read the Sith Lord of Nathema part. Edited December 14, 2011 by TorNAth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axsagon Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 sory about my english lol but just try and count the all force powers that Jacen new Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oonkeh_ Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 (edited) k lets talk and jadge all about, facts , sidous was strong sith yes but he wasnt so powerful like you saing about him, he was a master of manipulation that fact. but not more then it . Jasen solo was the strongest jedi befor he got to the dark side and after he was the stronger sith ever y? couse he new all the force thechnics the shater point is one of the rere one that only mace windu new that how he beat sidius , thtat fact . now his mestake was to learn bane skywaker the force power of to hide from the force and bane learned this to luke his father ,whene they fothgt whit Jeson they fothg bouthg luke and bane and he was destracted by the big battle that he used batele meditation on it and his gol was not to beat luke and bane ,his gol was to tourn bane to dark side, and read the fate of the galaxy how luke and bane toke the tore on the alll Jasec learnd to get to the dark side then say how sidius is strong Unfortunately, Jacen was no where near the most powerful Jedi ever. That's Luke, read into Luke's EU feats and you'll find that he's god-tier.. which means he's above everyone else in terms of power except for Abeloth, who man-handled Luke in his more recent incarnation. Luke dominated Jacen Solo (Darth Caedus) utilizing telekinesis alone, pinning him against a wall. There wasn't even a duel before that point. Jacen Solo, as a Jedi, couldn't spar with the entire Jedi Council like Luke could while not even breaking a sweat, defeating them all in the same spar. Jacen, again, is not Luke's tier. I read into it, and it clearly shows Caedus admitting to himself that if Luke went all out, he'd have killed Caedus on the spot in a short duel. Caedus simply was no match for Luke. You're exaggerating Caedus' feats. It's canon in both EU, novels and G-Canon (movies), that Sidious was the most powerful Sith Lord ever. He had the intelligence, the finesse, cunning, the skill and the force-power to back him up. I could list the many, many feats he accomplished; but it would waste time, as i've already posted it in this thread (read back a few pages) and those aren't even all his feats. Those are the facts that are backed by both the novels and the EU on Sidious. So unfortunately, he was as powerful as I mentioned before Luke surpassed him. I think.... This Guy: http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Sith_Emperor Just read the Sith Lord of Nathema part. What the Sith Emperor (Darth Vitiate) has done, Sidious has done and more. Vitiate required a ritual and the aid of a hundred enslaved Sith Lords to consume a planet. Sidious only required thought alone, consuming the 15 billion populace of Byss in comparison to Vitiate's "millions". Edited December 14, 2011 by Oonkeh_ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TorNAth Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 What the Sith Emperor (Darth Vitiate) has done, Sidious has done and more. Vitiate required a ritual and the aid of a hundred enslaved Sith Lords to consume a planet. Sidious only required thought alone, consuming the 15 billion populace of Byss in comparison to Vitiate's "millions". If Sidious is as powerful as you say he is (I have never read any of the books and have no intention to do so), then why did they need the Death Star? Couldn't he just "consume" the rebelion forces? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayla_Felana Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 (edited) If Sidious is as powerful as you say he is (I have never read any of the books and have no intention to do so), then why did they need the Death Star? Couldn't he just "consume" the rebelion forces? 1.They didn't need the Death Star at all, it was a symbol for the Empire, a symbol of fear. 2.He only gained that ability after Return of the Jedi, when he was reborn. Edited March 30, 2012 by Rayla_Felana Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
undeadsithdread Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 What the Sith Emperor (Darth Vitiate) has done, Sidious has done and more. Vitiate required a ritual and the aid of a hundred enslaved Sith Lords to consume a planet. Sidious only required thought alone, consuming the 15 billion populace of Byss in comparison to Vitiate's "millions". If Sidious is as powerful as you say he is (I have never read any of the books and have no intention to do so), then why did they need the Death Star? Couldn't he just "consume" the rebelion forces? because t has do with "only togather can we turn (luke) to the dark side of the force". the whole point of battle of endor was about luke corruption while destroying the rebels as bonus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayla_Felana Posted March 30, 2012 Share Posted March 30, 2012 If all that is true, why was he destroyed by vader and luke and what appeared to be such easy terms for the movie wise? I would like to know where you get more information on palpatine describing his power cause i cant seem to find anywhere that describes the amount of power he has. They all just say, not much is know about his training, etc. I'm not saying he is not the most powerful, but im not saying his, and i am very curious to read into palpatine now. If you can recommend me to where i may read more about his power and lightsaber forms, i would be much obliged. He was torturing and playing with Luke, and was wholly concentrated on him, this was the biggest mistake Sidious ever made next to letting Obi-Wan and Yoda go on without relentless searching, He had forgotten the very reason Anakin became Vader in the first place, to save his wife, his loved ones, that was always his dream, and here was Sidious slowly killing his son, he forgot about Vader and completely dismissed his presence, this proved to be his first death. Read Dark Empire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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