Owynyo Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=8037985#edit8037985 Speechless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lhancelot Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 Assassins are working as intended. So are PTs and Sorcs. It's the 5 other classes that need help. That, or make ranked pvp include 8v8. Then all classes could bask in the eternal light of ranked pvp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owynyo Posted February 17, 2015 Author Share Posted February 17, 2015 Assassins are working as intended. So are PTs and Sorcs. It's the 5 other classes that need help. That, or make ranked pvp include 8v8. Then all classes could bask in the eternal light of ranked pvp. They're lowering PT burst by nerfing shoulder cannon. Just saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoom_VI Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 Assassins are working as intended. So are PTs and Sorcs. It's the 5 other classes that need help. That, or make ranked pvp include 8v8. Then all classes could bask in the eternal light of ranked pvp. I don't know man they where pretty quick to smack PTs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnzoForMe Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 Assassins are working as intended. So are PTs and Sorcs. It's the 5 other classes that need help. That, or make ranked pvp include 8v8. Then all classes could bask in the eternal light of ranked pvp. 8v8 was great because it offered all classes a chance to shine in a niche roll. Except dps operatives. You have never been welcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lhancelot Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 (edited) 8v8 was great because it offered all classes a chance to shine in a niche roll. Except dps operatives. You have never been welcome. In fact, these MFers need nerfed again, they actually still manage to do better than marauders in ranked! ***. And, correct. I said this exact same thing in my thread to promote 8v8 being brought back. Edited February 17, 2015 by Lhancelot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floplag Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 I think its too easy to just say "working as intended". I dont think they intended for 3/4 or more of the pvp community to be playing 3 classes. No game ever has real parity in that sense but those numbers are out of line. That having been said they also don't seem to interested in fixing it either so perhaps it is, who knows. I for one wish they would freaking say something, let us know where there heads are even if it is just to say we are happy with where things are.. it would be better than the silence and lack of feedback we have now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owynyo Posted February 17, 2015 Author Share Posted February 17, 2015 (edited) This was the last straw for me, personally. If they were the least bit competent they would've nerfed assassin somewhere. Maybe buffed Merc/Sniper a tiny bit. But no, we don't get anything. **** you, Bioware! Having an ELO system where your rating gets ****ed beyond repair if you do bad in the first 10 matches you can't have such imbalance. You just can't.... Edited February 17, 2015 by Owynyo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sithBracer Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 They're lowering PT burst by nerfing shoulder cannon. Just saying. PTs will still have some of the best burst, so it is nothing to cry over. Not to mention 10 seconds of root/snare protected hyperspeed making them unkiteable. And for all your complaining about assassins, you haven't given even one example of what an effective nerf that wouldn't affect PvE would be. Just whine, whine, whine like a little girl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owynyo Posted February 17, 2015 Author Share Posted February 17, 2015 (edited) And for all your complaining about assassins, you haven't given even one example of what an effective nerf that wouldn't affect PvE would be. Just whine, whine, whine like a little girl. Hello mr. Shadow/Sin aka Iamnotbiasedatall. Where would reducing cc immunity from 12s to 6s nerf you in pve? Where would sprint immunity nerf (No slow/root immunity during sprint, only breaks them on activation) nerf you in pve? Both were suggested in other threads. If you can't read and are just here to derail yet another thread because you want your class to stay fotm, **** off. Because that appears to be your agenda. Edited February 17, 2015 by Owynyo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sithBracer Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 Hello mr. Shadow/Sin aka Iamnotbiasedatall. Where would reducing cc immunity from 12s to 6s nerf you in pve? Where would sprint immunity nerf (No slow/root immunity during sprint, only breaks them on activation) you in pve? Both were suggested in other threads. If you can't read and are just here to derail yet another thread because you want your class to stay fotm, **** off. Because that appears to be your agenda. 1. don't assume I only play 1 character. 2. don't assume I play hatred. 3. Neither of those ideas would do anything to tone down hatred and would only make deception even worse than it already is. You clearly have no idea why hatred sins are even OP, you are just talking nonsense at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owynyo Posted February 17, 2015 Author Share Posted February 17, 2015 Both mobility and cc immunity are way too good. Infiltration can still keep their slow immunity but the cc immunity has to go. As I thought: biased and not able to discuss stuff. Try to keep an assassin off of you for longer than 2 secs as a merc in group 4v4 while having a tank tunnel you 24/7 with 50% slow. Not happening unless you stun them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neoforcer Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 They're lowering PT burst by nerfing shoulder cannon. Just saying. shoulder cannon was broken as a CD should never be .5 on any abilities it should of always been 1.5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neoforcer Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 Hello mr. Shadow/Sin aka Iamnotbiasedatall. Where would reducing cc immunity from 12s to 6s nerf you in pve? Where would sprint immunity nerf (No slow/root immunity during sprint, only breaks them on activation) nerf you in pve? Both were suggested in other threads. If you can't read and are just here to derail yet another thread because you want your class to stay fotm, **** off. Because that appears to be your agenda. For the tenth time CC immunity is not why hatred is doing what it is doing it dots spread and how dots can not be removed but by a few classes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owynyo Posted February 17, 2015 Author Share Posted February 17, 2015 (edited) Since we now have two guys with a PHD in faceroll here why don't you tell us what needs to be nerfed? Edited February 18, 2015 by Owynyo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sithBracer Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 (edited) Both mobility and cc immunity are way too good. Infiltration can still keep their slow immunity but the cc immunity has to go. As I thought: biased and not able to discuss stuff. Try to keep an assassin off of you for longer than 2 secs as a merc in group 4v4 while having a tank tunnel you 24/7 with 50% slow. Not happening unless you stun them. Once again you assume too much about me. I don't care if CC immunity goes, it's overrated and only decent against bads who don't know how to not use CC when they see a giant ball around a sin. Tthe cc immunity doesn't work against KBs, roots and slows. And if they tunnel a merc in group 4s it is not the merc's responsibility to get them off of him. It is up to the tank to taunt/guard for him and the healer to heal him up. EDIT for me misreading. Edited February 17, 2015 by sithBracer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owynyo Posted February 17, 2015 Author Share Posted February 17, 2015 (edited) A merc doesn't get tank tunneled because mercs aren't tanks. They can't guard or taunt for others-which is the point of a tank tunnel comp, to get around those 2 things. . Read again. You seem to have problems with it. Edited February 17, 2015 by Owynyo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sithBracer Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 For the tenth time CC immunity is not why hatred is doing what it is doing it dots spread and how dots can not be removed but by a few classes this. DoT spreading and making DoTs uncleanseable was one of the worst decisions BW made about 3.0, but currently this is the situation. DoTs are too easy to spread around causing pressure and self healing and they do too much damage-which is internal. How to fix this without affecting the mechanics used in PvE is the question. So far, no one has the answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Transcendent Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 (edited) And for all your complaining about assassins, you haven't given even one example of what an effective nerf that wouldn't affect PvE would be. - Remove all immunity from DPS specced Sins / Shadows. If you want immunity play the tank spec, that's wouldn't break PvE even slightly. - Tone down dots slightly (not enough to make an issue for dealing with adds in operations). - Make their utility tree as broken as every other class so you don't get all the goodies to use. - Lower the health regained by reducing the actual abilities that affect the health regain. - Reduce the amount of stuns / interupts / roots available. What did I miss... sure there is something... - Increase CD for force speed. - Increase CD for auto escape. - Reduce range on force walk ability to 20m. That pretty much covers it. Nothing in there would break PvE for the class, I can imagine the crying and bleating about everyone who has rolled it right now though, because they won't be able to faceroll the keyboard in PvP if the class was balanced properly by the combat team. Edit: And make the dots cleansable by every class. Edited February 17, 2015 by Transcendent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlightlySychotic Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 For the tenth time CC immunity is not why hatred is doing what it is doing it dots spread and how dots can not be removed but by a few classes DoT spread is a paper tiger. It posts high numbers but doesn't translate to lethality. It's the fact that it has sustained AND burst AND survivability that makes Hatred so OP. Take one of those away and it brings them in with the other classes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sithBracer Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 (edited) - Remove all immunity from DPS specced Sins / Shadows. If you want immunity play the tank spec, that's wouldn't break PvE even slightly. - Tone down dots slightly (not enough to make an issue for dealing with adds in operations). - Make their utility tree as broken as every other class so you don't get all the goodies to use. - Lower the health regained by reducing the actual abilities that affect the health regain. - Reduce the amount of stuns / interupts / roots available. -It won't do anything against hatred, it will make deception even worse than it is though. -Toning down DoTs will affect the overall PvE parses, keep up. -I don't know what you mean, but I think having to waste a utility point just so we don't have less DR than a *********** sorc and having to decide either use a useless 2 second casted mezz or wasting a tier 3 utility to bring it down to an instant qualifies us as pretty broken. -you mean the 1 stun, 1 two second root and 1 interrupt on an 18 seconds CD? - Increase CD for force speed. - Increase CD for auto escape. - Reduce range on force walk ability to 20m. -so what should the CD on our only movement utility, our only gap closer and our only root breaker be? (and keep in mind PTs get 10 seconds of hyper speed with root/snare immunity + a pull every 30 seconds) -what is auto escape? You mean phase walk? Once per arena match (which is all we honestly have time for) is too much? -Once again I assume you mean phase walk. If it is only 20m it would be useless. Pretty clear, that you never played this class either. Edited February 17, 2015 by sithBracer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nefczi Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 For the tenth time CC immunity is not why hatred is doing what it is doing it dots spread and how dots can not be removed but by a few classes For the first and last time you are right about the dots, but you are dead wrong about cc immunity. High damage dots combined with powerfull targettable dot spread, that hits like a truck, is definatelly over the top and needs to be tonned down somehow but its not the main reason why the class in OP. It is a combination of great aoe damage combined with strong single target, and great survivalability that consist of self helaing, amazing cc immunity and stealth. And the main offender here is in fact that 12sec cc immunity. 12 seconds is a lot of time, especially in arenas, and its a huge deal in a game that has so heavy emphasis on CC. Im not an expert, but from what I seen so far, winning or loosing arena is often decided by which team manages to catch one of opponents with CC breaker on cooldown and burst him down first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allexj Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 Hello mr. Shadow/Sin aka Iamnotbiasedatall. Where would reducing cc immunity from 12s to 6s nerf you in pve? Where would sprint immunity nerf (No slow/root immunity during sprint, only breaks them on activation) nerf you in pve? Both were suggested in other threads. If you can't read and are just here to derail yet another thread because you want your class to stay fotm, **** off. Because that appears to be your agenda. I have something to say on this, I'm a tanking shadow so if they reduce any of the Defense or utility based cool downs it would effectively Nerf the other two specs that shadows have so another option needs to be introduced other then nerfing the base class abliitys. So make a passive for that spec reduce the defensive cool Downs of shadow don't hit the whole class Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sithBracer Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 And the main offender here is in fact that 12sec cc immunity. 12 seconds is a lot of time, especially in arenas, and its a huge deal in a game that has so heavy emphasis on CC. Im not an expert, but from what I seen so far, winning or loosing arena is often decided by which team manages to catch one of opponents with CC breaker on cooldown and burst him down first. Not really. Currently winning is decided on who can derp faster. Ok seriously now. There are 3 main comps that you will see people use. Tank tunnel-pressure the tank who isn't able to guard/taunt for himself, during which time you try to cc the healer as well. Derp-just do as much pressure as possible and overwhelm the healer. Hard switch-switch targets to a non guarded target putting pressure on the healer, also involves CCing tank sometimes to keep him from switching guard in time. None of those comps involve a hatred assassin being stunned. A group ranked arena with 2 good teams lasts longer than 30 seconds. It can sometimes come down to the wire and a 12 second immunity (during which you shouldn't be attacking him anyway since he has a DCD on) is really not that long if you think of it that way. Hatred has the ability to put a lot of pressure on the enemy team, while at the same time the ability to hide away and heal up to take the pressure away from your healer. Removing the cc immunity will not fix either of those 2 things. Which is why I said many times, take it, I would rather have root/snare immunity instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neoforcer Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 (edited) DoT spread is a paper tiger. It posts high numbers but doesn't translate to lethality. It's the fact that it has sustained AND burst AND survivability that makes Hatred so OP. Take one of those away and it brings them in with the other classes. Dot spread puts pressure on all targets making ranked a nightmare to heals as more then one person is taking damage. Hatred has no survivability i am a deception sin and they die just as fast as sorc/sage. There the squishiest of all 3 specs. It is the damage they do not there survivability. Edited February 17, 2015 by Neoforcer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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