Merc vs. PT (please help me choose)

[Econometrix]

Please note: I also posted this in the merc forum for additional input.

 

I am looking to start a bounty hunter (first time) and would appreciate input regarding the strengths/weaknesses of the various ACs. I have limited time to play TOR and focus mainly on solo PVE with a bit of casual grouping in PVE. I have never played PVP in this game and do not see myself starting anytime soon. Here is a summary of my current thoughts:

 

 

MERCENARY

 

Strengths:

1. Ranged - I prefer the run and gun concept and have enjoyed playing sniper and sorcerer over assassin and marauder.

2. Healing discipline - Though I expect to group minimally, healing is at least a feasible option. I do not like to tank in groups as I do not feel comfortable taking on a leadership role.

3. IO > pyro PT: The IO discipline looks more interesting/interactive than pyro. Frankly, I do not see a lot to get excited about with regard to pyro. The fire theme is great. However, flame sweep and the interaction of abilities with combustible gas cylinder (as compared to IO dot spread) seem a bit underwhelming.

4. Better abilities: Good mix of offensive and healing abilities. PT has fewer abilities of which many focus on group tanking uses.

5. Supercharge mechanic looks interesting. PT does not appear to have anything like this.

6. Merc seems likely to receive a defensive/CC buff due to stated PVP limitations.

 

Weaknesses:

1. Arsenal < AP PT: Arsenal seems underwhelming when compared to IO or corresponding PT discipline, AP. Some alacrity and armor pen but not much else that seems exciting.

2. IO is currently the highest damage ST spec in PVE. Devs have stated their philosophy is that melee should do more damage than ranged. A nerf to IO might be a disincentive to play IO and could result in mercs having no viable/interesting dps options.

 

 

PT

 

Strengths:

1. Better utilities by far (75% run speed nearly 50% of time)

2. Shield tech could be fun to play solo. I suspect that shield tech actually has the best AoE of any bounty hunter discipline. However, as stated, I could not see myself playing this discipline when grouping.

3. PT has better defense than merc in general.

 

Weaknesses:

1. AP is receiving a lot of negative press for its burst in PVP. A nerf to AP would hurt as the PT currently as two fairly balanced and reasonably interesting dps disciplines.

 

 

I would also be interested in others' thoughts on the ACs' strengths with regard to AoE. Pre-3.0, merc was considered a solid AoE class. It still has a large number of AoE abilities, though most are on CDs, and the splash damage of many abilities has been reduced. As stated, I think shield tech would dominate all other disciplines when it comes to AoE.

 

Thanks in advance.

[Col_Wilson]

AoE wise... Arsenal Merc is very easy to use. They get buffs to their sweeping blasters, as well as a utility that increases the damage even more. It has no cooldown so you can use it over and over. With IO, you have to use 4 different abilities to set up and spread your dots, and for some reason DoTs don't spread if the target you're trying to spread it with dies. So, they usually don't wind up spreading because with all the set up, the target is nearly dead by the time you're getting off your final attacks.

 

Tank specs simply don't do as much damage as damage specs, so Pyro is definitely the winner for AoE when it comes to PTs. Their DoT spread is broken right now though.

 

Arsenal is essentially a ranged version of AP. The difference comes down to, as you said, ranged attacks and defensive abilities. Arsenal Mercs can put out scary numbers at range. Heatseekers does as much damage as Energy Burst, and doesn't require any set up (not even a cast!) other than hitting a target with a Tracer Missile beforehand.

 

All it really comes down to is if you like ranged or melee(ish) combat. Since you prefer ranged, I'd go with Merc. Just keep in mind that even though they did become a lot more mobile in 3.0, they're still horribly squishy so you're still gonna get picked on in PvP.

[Zoom_VI]

Tank specs simply don't do as much damage as damage specs, so Pyro is definitely the winner for AoE when it comes to PTs. Their DoT spread is broken right now though.

 

For PTs this is false. Firestorm actually has a higher base damage than Pyro's three stack flamethrower, plus it channels twice as fast. Right now running Shieldtech in DPS gear will get you the best AoE for PTs

[Col_Wilson]

For PTs this is false. Firestorm actually has a higher base damage than Pyro's three stack flamethrower, plus it channels twice as fast. Right now running Shieldtech in DPS gear will get you the best AoE for PTs

 

Even with the 20% damage debuff from tank stance?

[Zoom_VI]

Even with the 20% damage debuff from tank stance?

 

Pretty much yes. Me and Grizz have done a lot of testing with the two specs and we have figured that tank spec in DPS gear is far better at killing targets than Pyro. Pyro simply has too much setup for too little damage, not to mention being really squishy, also you must factor some of the other AoE affects available to Shieldtech.

 

I know the OP is talking primarily in terms of leveling, but for anecdotal evidence here is what four Shieldtech can do with DPS gear in PvP.

 

Pyro is only really better than shieldtech in terms of overall sustained DPS, but for leveling its garbage because the setup is too much.

Edited January 26, 2015 by Zoom_VI

[LanceCorporalDan]

Pretty much yes. Me and Grizz have done a lot of testing with the two specs and we have figured that tank spec in DPS gear is far better at killing targets than Pyro. Pyro simply has too much setup for too little damage, not to mention being really squishy, also you must factor some of the other AoE affects available to Shieldtech.

 

I know the OP is talking primarily in terms of leveling, but for anecdotal evidence here is what four Shieldtech can do with DPS gear in PvP.

 

Pyro is only really better than shieldtech in terms of overall sustained DPS, but for leveling its garbage because the setup is too much.

 

That''s hilarious man. Lol.

[GrizzMeshurik]

Pretty much yes. Me and Grizz have done a lot of testing with the two specs and we have figured that tank spec in DPS gear is far better at killing targets than Pyro. Pyro simply has too much setup for too little damage, not to mention being really squishy, also you must factor some of the other AoE affects available to Shieldtech.

 

I know the OP is talking primarily in terms of leveling, but for anecdotal evidence here is what four Shieldtech can do with DPS gear in PvP.

 

Pyro is only really better than shieldtech in terms of overall sustained DPS, but for leveling its garbage because the setup is too much.

 

To be fair we weren't really 'testing' as much as we were trolling.

 

We need to do this again, preferably when a certain guild's Sorc 4-man is around...

Edited January 27, 2015 by GrizzMeshurik

[TACeMossie]

Another thing to note about tanks is that the stance isn't bugged completely - it only provides a 10% reduction, but the tooltip is saying a 20% reduction. You can test this by using Ion Pulse/Flame Burst in Tank Stance against any random mob without debuffs. It will do ~12.5% more damage than the tooltip states it should. Because tank stance is only a 10% reduction in damage.

[BobaFaceroll]

Pretty much yes. Me and Grizz have done a lot of testing with the two specs and we have figured that tank spec in DPS gear is far better at killing targets than Pyro. Pyro simply has too much setup for too little damage, not to mention being really squishy, also you must factor some of the other AoE affects available to Shieldtech.

 

I know the OP is talking primarily in terms of leveling, but for anecdotal evidence here is what four Shieldtech can do with DPS gear in PvP.

 

Pyro is only really better than shieldtech in terms of overall sustained DPS, but for leveling its garbage because the setup is too much.

 

That's hilarious!

 

DPS gear plus a Shield (w/DPS mods?) and in tank stance?

[JonnyRay]

I know the OP is talking primarily in terms of leveling, but for anecdotal evidence here is what four Shieldtech can do with DPS gear in PvP.

Hold the phone...as a 4-man squad your K to D ratio was 316:3???

 

Somewhere about the middle of that, your opponents had to be like "SH!!! Here they come again!!"

Edited January 27, 2015 by JonnyRay

[Econometrix]

Thanks everyone for your feedback.

 

The positive notes on arsenal and shieldtech leave me a bit confused. Some simple math leads me to conclude that shieldtech would be superior for AoE. The only bonuses arsenal has for sweeping blasters include the crit/surge buff (blazing barrels) and the damage buff utility (boresights). Given the fairly high heat cost (32), I do not see that SB could not be spammed on a consistent basis.

 

AP seems to have more big hitters than arsenal, which I would expect to translate into more exciting game play when using the burst discipline. However, the difference in dynamism and damage between IO and pyro is even more substantial. I wish there was something in arsenal that "called to me."

[Ottoattack]

OP, if it is PvE you seek, play w.e you like. All PT and merc specs are competitive in end game PvE and great for running dailies.

 

If it is PvP, unless you plan to heal AP PT >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> merc IO & arsenal > pyro PT. If you really want to play a ranged non turret dps play sorc.

[Col_Wilson]

Thanks everyone for your feedback.

 

The positive notes on arsenal and shieldtech leave me a bit confused. Some simple math leads me to conclude that shieldtech would be superior for AoE. The only bonuses arsenal has for sweeping blasters include the crit/surge buff (blazing barrels) and the damage buff utility (boresights). Given the fairly high heat cost (32), I do not see that SB could not be spammed on a consistent basis.

 

If we're just talking leveling/regular PvE, groups of mobs die way before your heat is going to overload unless you're horribly undergeared, which is why I feel sweeping blasters is simpler. You can clear a group of mobs, and you can keep going to the next and not have to wait for a cooldown. Having range also helps. It's just easier to use, IMO. If you really want to go with shield tech for leveling, it seems it's been proven that it's pretty effective for clearing groups of mobs as well. But, you should also be looking at what you wanna do endgame, right? Can't switch ACs once you're done...

 

AP seems to have more big hitters than arsenal, which I would expect to translate into more exciting game play when using the burst discipline. However, the difference in dynamism and damage between IO and pyro is even more substantial. I wish there was something in arsenal that "called to me."

 

Again, heatseekers can hit just as hard as a fully stacked energy burst. Heatseekers is an amazingly satisfying ability to shoot someone with. A no cast, massive damage, and 30 meter range barrage of missiles that goes BOOM! If that doesn't call to you, then I dunno. A fully stacked arsenal railshot will also hit harder than an AP railshot, although AP railshots are easier to spam. Blazing bolts and priming shot are also hard hitting attacks, comparable to AP thermal detonator and railshot. And the only things that arsenal mercs need to actually cast out of their primary attacks are blazing bolts and tracer missile (and they can insta-cast tracer missile a a pretty decent amount of the time). When you have someone doing this much damage to you at 30 meters without having to cast, it can be pretty terrifying. Mercs are the definition of a glass cannon.

Now, I'm a PT/VG guy, but nobody can deny that mercs can do a scary amount of damage. Problem is they're still usually the easiest class to kill in the game.

[GrizzMeshurik]

Hold the phone...as a 4-man squad your K to D ratio was 316:3???

 

Somewhere about the middle of that, your opponents had to be like "SH!!! Here they come again!!"

 

Cheesy comp is cheesy.

 

Wouldn't work as well as it did against a half decent team obviously, but for your average derpmade and pug muppets....

 

Edit: KB to death ratio would've been more accurate. Kills can be bloated very easily.

 

And most of us were running with generators, I have a shield generator that I occasionally switched out to.

Edited January 28, 2015 by GrizzMeshurik