OddballEasyEight Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 You guys said at the cantina event that you looked at the data and saw that people were playing the machine too much and neglecting crew skills (not exactly but that's the jist of it). Take another look now. Are people playing the machine? Is it working as intended? (ie. is it a "fun" thing that people are having fun playing?) Because if the data shows you that people are hardly touching the machine, that might be a clue as to whether or not you overnerfed it. Look at it this way: If nobody is using it, then that is a complete waste of time and effort that went into its development. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kryand Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 (edited) Honestly I don't understand how the slot machine could ever be considered fun no matter what rewards it gives. It could drop 198 gear tokens and a BoE copy of whatever the most expensive GTN item sold in the past 24 hours was, and you'd still be standing there right-clicking your mouse. Fun............. Edited January 25, 2015 by Kryand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DakotaDoc Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Honestly I don't understand how the slot machine could ever be considered fun no matter what rewards it gives. It could drop 198 gear tokens and a BoE copy of whatever the most expensive GTN item sold in the past 24 hours was, and you'd still be standing there right-clicking your mouse. Fun............. Well, "fun" is relative to the person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OddballEasyEight Posted January 25, 2015 Author Share Posted January 25, 2015 (edited) Honestly I don't understand how the slot machine could ever be considered fun no matter what rewards it gives. It could drop 198 gear tokens and a BoE copy of whatever the most expensive GTN item sold in the past 24 hours was, and you'd still be standing there right-clicking your mouse. Fun............. On some planet they juggle geese. To each their own. I know for certain that alot of my older relatives wonder why I find playing games on a computer "fun"... Edited January 25, 2015 by OddballEasyEight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reno_Tarshil Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Honestly I don't understand how the slot machine could ever be considered fun no matter what rewards it gives. It could drop 198 gear tokens and a BoE copy of whatever the most expensive GTN item sold in the past 24 hours was, and you'd still be standing there right-clicking your mouse. Fun............. It created a social enviroment where friends and guildies to come by and hang out around another, the sounds of you winning or hitting the jackpot making you feel good inside. It was quite fun, to see a stronghold alive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neglience Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 (edited) There are quit a few peoples playing the machines. Not the extent like there was no other thing to do in swtor, but they are used. Their intentions made it clear, it should have been a fun item which a players uses from time to time. Edited January 25, 2015 by Neglience Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jankiel Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Bleurgh, I was not to write anything about this again but... Fun thing about the machines is that they were having queues(QUEUES!) on the guildship with people waiting in line to get their chance to play or by checking out other peoples stronghold to get this. Very fun and original way to get the community to interact. I don't get it thou why won't they go the middle ground? I mean I can agree that the nerf was needed but this was overkill. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsillah Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 You guys said at the cantina event that you looked at the data and saw that people were playing the machine too much and neglecting crew skills (not exactly but that's the jist of it). Take another look now. Are people playing the machine? Is it working as intended? (ie. is it a "fun" thing that people are having fun playing?) Because if the data shows you that people are hardly touching the machine, that might be a clue as to whether or not you overnerfed it. Look at it this way: If nobody is using it, then that is a complete waste of time and effort that went into its development. Considering that I've seen a few of these new mounts from the slot machine I would say people are still playing. Complaints on the forum are an indication of an issue, not a representation of the player base. The same goes for your personal experiences or mine for that matter. You seem to think that hardly anyone uses them anymore. I simply don't know if that's a correct assumption, especially since you haven't really got data to support this but I am pretty sure BW looks at their metrics. The problem though is that metrics are reactive and not pro-active. Sometimes it's better to prevent issues than to fix them especially when the problem was completely and utterly avoidable like in this case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkwords Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 (edited) I was in glee when I saw the slot pop from one of the CC packs I PURCHASED with REAL money and tried it out immediatly. I played my 99 chips in the am, then 99 more in the pm. I gave several keys to close friends to play also. It was fun to be able to recoup some of the millions I have spent since launch to learn crafting skill items that I had let slide. I think I sold 2 new crystals on the GTN, sent one to a friend for his B-day and used a lot of the Jawa Junk to make things for my hubby's chars as he is a new player and for me to ensure my minimum Conquest points for the week. The cartel certs were great also because I am an avid SH decorator and I was able to get items for that and even a long-yearned for Hoverchair. Now it sits untouched and just another pretty, flashing accoutrement among the others in one of my SHs. As I run by it during my visits, it reminds me to trust noone and to never, ever buy another CC pack over my 600 monthly allotment. That is all... . Edited January 25, 2015 by Darkwords Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draqsko Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 There are quit a few peoples playing the machines. Not the extent like there was no other thing to do in swtor, but they are used. Their intentions made it clear, it should have been a fun item which a players uses from time to time. The slot machine is being used as much as a refridgerator is being used at the south pole. The one on my guild ship is still there, no one touches it. Before, someone was always using it on and off, and half dozen or more people would be just sitting around the room hanging out while waiting for queue pops or whatever. Strongholds finally felt alive and vibrant because people had a reason to go (use the slots), but also because people started going, others who never used the slots would hang around too because humans are social creatures. The slots was our first "mini-game" for a stronghold, and it certainly shows what strongholds could be for housing if they just included more of this kind of stuff. That said, right now it's completely useless and a missed opportunity because no one who has more sense than money will use it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OddballEasyEight Posted January 25, 2015 Author Share Posted January 25, 2015 (edited) Considering that I've seen a few of these new mounts from the slot machine I would say people are still playing. People bought tons and tons of tokens before the nerf. The tokens can't be sold back... Did you expect people to just throw them away without using them? The few mounts I've seen on my server (and it is few... 2 so far) have come from people who bought tons of tokens because they read the price was going to be increased in the patch last wednesday. And then they didn't have anything else to do with the tokens than use them on the slot machine. Apparantly 2 of them got lucky. (and yes, I know this because I asked them in /w) Edited January 25, 2015 by OddballEasyEight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsillah Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 People bought tons and tons of tokens before the nerf. The tokens can't be sold back... Did you expect people to just throw them away without using them? The few mounts I've seen on my server (and it is few... 2 so far) have come from people who bought tons of tokens because they read the price was going to be increased in the patch last wednesday. And then they didn't have anything else to do with the tokens than use them on the slot machine. Apparantly 2 of them got lucky. (and yes, I know this because I asked them in /w) It's still all conjecture. You and I have no idea how many people are still using the slot machines and that's my point. You simply assume that they are not because it supports your view that they have to change them again, but it's still just an assumption. Sure you ask them to look at their metrics but they do that, I am just saying that's too late. You don't release a bear into a crowd and wait to see how many people it kills before you decide whether or not it's a good idea to release a bear into a crowd. BW lacks common sense it seems. I am pretty sure if they had released the slot machines with a lower win chance and prizes like mounts and not stuff you can put on the CM it would've generated some interest and if people complained it rewards were too low or uninteresting then you can bring out another slot machine with better chances and rewards. But I cannot escape the reality that most players don't come to this forum and that just because we have a personal experience and talk to a handful of people like friends and guildies about it, that that represent the reality of the general player base. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ksilvante Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 (edited) It created a social enviroment where friends and guildies to come by and hang out around another, the sounds of you winning or hitting the jackpot making you feel good inside. It was quite fun, to see a stronghold alive. This I can understand. People screaming it killed the economy were just being greedy imo. Other than a social thing this was a monumental mistake. It gave people who wanted everything for nothing just that and others a perfect farm for mats, etc. No matter what they did past that point they were utterly screwed because they will NEVER, ever please the people playing this game. They could fix every single issue tomorrow and still people will be screaming how the game is unplayable. My opinion yes but gained from reading tons of threads on these forums over the last week in a attempt for comparison. Edited January 25, 2015 by Ksilvante Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mariojediwookie Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 My guess is the main objective of the slot machine was to give rep. That it does perfectly. So as you say it is worthless once you attain max rep (which is done rather quickly) but everyone will always play the slots for a set amount of time to attain max rep. Saying no one uses it, that's saying everyone has max rep which I know is not true. Amazingly some of my guild members had yet to even use it as of this week. I think it's pretty obvious this is all they want it to do now. They experimented with the idea of it being a way to introduce more grade 11 mats and found it caused more damage than anticipated. My guess is whatever they decide to change it won't be for the current slot machine it will be for the next one. Gotta have a reason to make you purchase after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icestar Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 I hope they spend more time fixing bugs and making 16 man ops fun again then spending more time on this slot machine. They made a misstake, they changed it and now it is time to move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsillah Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 I hope they spend more time fixing bugs and making 16 man ops fun again then spending more time on this slot machine. They made a misstake, they changed it and now it is time to move on. You make a good point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ksilvante Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 I hope they spend more time fixing bugs and making 16 man ops fun again then spending more time on this slot machine. They made a misstake, they changed it and now it is time to move on. Thank you. Now if only everyone else could understand that.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikegrijsen Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 bla bla bla bla... its an mmo! You are not supposed to get things so easy.. I hope they change nothing. If you want things, play the game! You want creds? Do dailys! You want better gear? Do ops! Cry me a f***ing River! please unsub already so the rest of us can enjoy the forums again... Jeeeeeeez Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draqsko Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Thank you. Now if only everyone else could understand that.... I understand perfectly, and agree, we should move on and pressure Bioware to rework the crafting system. The slot machine revealed many of the deficiencies of the current system. But until then a balanced slot machine would greatly help. Personally, I think every material outside of rare mats dropped from bosses should have a gathering node. I can't think of an online game besides this one where that wasn't true. Every mat outside of boss drop mats was harvestable from a node regardless of potential other methods of acquiring them. I'd also love if they junked the schematic system and went for a recipe system where you could alter the stats based on the materials used in crafting. But I guess that's me wanting to go back to the golden days of MUDs and crafting systems like http://www.olwydd.com/systems/tanning/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkwords Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 bla bla bla bla... its an mmo! You are not supposed to get things so easy.. I hope they change nothing. If you want things, play the game! You want creds? Do dailys! You want better gear? Do ops! Cry me a f***ing River! please unsub already so the rest of us can enjoy the forums again... Jeeeeeeez Screams the gouging crafter... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draqsko Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 bla bla bla bla... its an mmo! You are not supposed to get things so easy.. I hope they change nothing. If you want things, play the game! You want creds? Do dailys! You want better gear? Do ops! Cry me a f***ing River! please unsub already so the rest of us can enjoy the forums again... Jeeeeeeez Based on this post, I'd recommend this.. They should remove crew missions entirely, and make all mats gathered only through crew missions have gathering nodes. You want mats? Go farm nodes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curbhunter Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Slotgate 2015, but what they did was bait and switch. Did I spend monies to get slot machines No, but I understand why they are pissed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OddballEasyEight Posted January 25, 2015 Author Share Posted January 25, 2015 It's still all conjecture. You and I have no idea how many people are still using the slot machines and that's my point. You simply assume that they are not because it supports your view that they have to change them again, but it's still just an assumption. Assumption based on observation and investigation. The two I've met who had the mount both said they got it from using leftover coins from before the nerf. The two guilds I'm in had slot machines in the guild stronghold/ship and those were well used before nerf, unused now. I had 3 slot machines in my own stronghold and had people asking to be invited to use them left and right, nobody going to my stronghold since the nerf. Asking around in general chat on fleet, I've not heard of anyone yet that plays the machine any more (other than to use up the coins they bought before the nerf, but most have already done that). Point is that they should look at their metrics again. It will show that the use of the machine is abysmally low and that should tell them that the machine is not useful as it is right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KremlinKOA Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Based on this post, I'd recommend this.. They should remove crew missions entirely, and make all mats gathered only through crew missions have gathering nodes. You want mats? Go farm nodes. Too easy Nodes plural per blue and purple mat? nah Node. 1 Node per mat that will respawn 30 seconds after being harvested... in a different, RNG determined, location. Go out and explore, find the rare material. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Well, I think it is past time to improve crew missions. This machine only made that more apparent IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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