oofalong Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 I came up with this single target rotation for Fury | Concentration. I believe it is pretty close to optimal for dummy parses based on math. Has anyone found other rotations or had success with something similar? I am working on more analysis and a guide similar to my Annihilation | Watchman one for this discipline; I will update this thread as I have more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madscidexter Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 Oofalong, I see a force management issue with your rotation. It begins with your 2nd concentrated slice. If you are not taking any damage then Rebuke is not generating force for you (assuming it's one of your utilities). In this case, the 2nd Concentrated Slice is using up too much of your force. This will puts you in a position where there is not enough force to activate the Slashes at the end of your rotation. Again, this all depends on the original problem above. If your are not taking damage then you are not building Centering as quickly. So, assuming that you are not the focus of attack, you will not have the force or Centering to prolong this rotation as written. As a side note - See this is where Sentinels get a bad rep. Everyone complains about the Sentinel tank, but see it's not our fault - it's Bioware's. They designed us to have maximum DPS only when we are taking damage. Here is the rotation that I have used. I will put Force pool numbers in parentheses. Force Leap +3 force (12) - Only used as an opener. Zen +12 force (12) - the max is 12, so make sure to use force spending abilities next to utilize the 3 extra force. Focused Burst -3 force (9) Concentrated Slice -5 force (4) +1 force refunded (5) Blade Storm +1 force (6) Master Strike 0 force (6) Zealous Strike +6 force (12) Force Exhaustion -3 force (9) Zealous Leap -2 force (7) Focused Burst -3 force (4) Blade Storm +1 force (5) Slash/Dispatch -3 force (2) +1 force refunded (3) Slash/Dispatch -3 force (0) +1 force refunded (1) - should actually end with 4 force in resource pool if not wasted on beginning Zen. Rinse and repeat. My 2 cents. Please feel free to rip me a new one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oofalong Posted January 20, 2015 Author Share Posted January 20, 2015 I see a force management issue with your rotation. I parsed using this rotation for about 20mins nonstop without resource issues. The cost of Raging Burst | Focused Burst is 0 with 3 stacks of Destruction | Koan so you are able to save 6 resource from your rotation. I think this explains the gap... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaramis Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 You really want to squeeze in as many Concentrated Slices as you can, as it's one of your big hitters (next to Burst). I tend to try to do one after each Burst if I have the focus for it (if Zen is up, you should have plenty of focus). I'd also pop a surge relic prior to your initial leap to get a giant Burst, in the same manner as the old smash specs did. Also, the reason for the gap is 2nd poster didn't count the fact that Master Strike in Shii-cho should build focus on each hit (so 3 in total per MS). Back to the OP rotation, mine is similar for the first 4 or 5 steps. After that it becomes a priority rotation as things come off CD at different times, and you want to ensure Burst (or Sweep for AoE) follows every Leap, and to make use of your free Blade Storms. MS and Zealous = force builders when you need them. Conc Slice is your big hitter but heavy on focus. I'm sure mine ends up looking the same as yours, but I've never really kept track I also throw TST into my rotation as every now and then I'll find everything is on CD and I don't have the focus to waste on a regular Slash, and instead use TST as it's free damage and/or I want to save focus for an incoming Leap + Burst, or Conc Slice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oofalong Posted January 20, 2015 Author Share Posted January 20, 2015 Back to the OP rotation, mine is similar for the first 4 or 5 steps. After that it becomes a priority rotation as things come off CD at different times, and you want to ensure Burst (or Sweep for AoE) follows every Leap, and to make use of your free Blade Storms. MS and Zealous = force builders when you need them. Conc Slice is your big hitter but heavy on focus. I'm sure mine ends up looking the same as yours, but I've never really kept track I also throw TST into my rotation as every now and then I'll find everything is on CD and I don't have the focus to waste on a regular Slash, and instead use TST as it's free damage and/or I want to save focus for an incoming Leap + Burst, or Conc Slice. I would be really interested to see your detailed rotation. I don't think it is possible to get more compact/concise than what I outlined. Also, DST | TST isn't great damage in this spec. I initially tried to include it in my rotation, but after some parses I was able to remove it, increase DPS and still avoid resource issues. Plus, from a multi-target perspective I think Sweeping Slash | Cyclone Slash is a better choice especially if buffed by Pathcarver | Trail Blazer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g_mK Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 (edited) Oofalong, I see a force management issue with your rotation. It begins with your 2nd concentrated slice. If you are not taking any damage then Rebuke is not generating force for you (assuming it's one of your utilities). In this case, the 2nd Concentrated Slice is using up too much of your force. This will puts you in a position where there is not enough force to activate the Slashes at the end of your rotation. Again, this all depends on the original problem above. If your are not taking damage then you are not building Centering as quickly. So, assuming that you are not the focus of attack, you will not have the force or Centering to prolong this rotation as written. As a side note - See this is where Sentinels get a bad rep. Everyone complains about the Sentinel tank, but see it's not our fault - it's Bioware's. They designed us to have maximum DPS only when we are taking damage. Here is the rotation that I have used. I will put Force pool numbers in parentheses. Force Leap +3 force (12) - Only used as an opener. Zen +12 force (12) - the max is 12, so make sure to use force spending abilities next to utilize the 3 extra force. Focused Burst -3 force (9) Concentrated Slice -5 force (4) +1 force refunded (5) Blade Storm +1 force (6) Master Strike 0 force (6) Zealous Strike +6 force (12) Force Exhaustion -3 force (9) Zealous Leap -2 force (7) Focused Burst -3 force (4) Blade Storm +1 force (5) Slash/Dispatch -3 force (2) +1 force refunded (3) Slash/Dispatch -3 force (0) +1 force refunded (1) - should actually end with 4 force in resource pool if not wasted on beginning Zen. Rinse and repeat. My 2 cents. Please feel free to rip me a new one. Focused burst is free with 3 stacks of Koan Leap +3 (3) Zen +12 (12) FB 0 (12) CS -5 +1 (8) MS 0 (8) ZL -3 +1 (6) FE -3 (3) ZS +6 (9) FB 0 (9) CS -5+1 (5) BS 0 +1(6) ZL -3 +1 (4) Slash -3 +1 (2) Zen +6 instant Slash -3 +1 another +6 from zen after= 2+6-3+1+6=12 The rotation is focus neutral and there is no place for TST in it Edited January 20, 2015 by g_mK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaramis Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Yeah, just parsed a bit by switching up TST with Slash and it worked fine. I guess I was a bit paranoid with force starvation and thought that Slash would have mucked things up, but it's not an issue and, as mentioned above, is obviously a dps increase over TST. As for rotation, I just compared to your rotation and noticed I change a few things here and there, but the end product is pretty much the same. For instance, I fit in my first Blade Storm right after Master Strike (i.e. spot 5) instead of ZL. ZL and Exhaustion I also reversed, so that I'd have a stack or 2 of Koan by the time I did my ZL and then Burst. Otherwise, I'd say the rotation is pretty spot on. I actually just spent the day playing around in Combat, so switching back to Concentration felt suddenly quite slow (no 30% alacrity with Zen), but all in all I still really enjoy Concentration and feel far less squishy in it than in Combat where I seem to simply melt under pressure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QuiveringPotato Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 (edited) Just tried this on a short 1 min 30 s parse (I don't PVE so I'm not sure how long regular parses are, I just did about 6 full rotations) on my mara and was hitting about 3,500 dps in level 60 PVP gear (missing accuracy needed for PVE and some crit, also might've been a little delayed on a couple GCD's cause I was looking at the rotation at the same time), and it felt very smooth. Nice work! Edited January 21, 2015 by QuiveringPotato Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madscidexter Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 (edited) Yeah, sorry I missed the free Focused Burst with 3 stack of Koan. Edited January 21, 2015 by Madscidexter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madscidexter Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Also, the reason for the gap is 2nd poster didn't count the fact that Master Strike in Shii-cho should build focus on each hit (so 3 in total per MS). I wasn't aware that Master Strike built force. I thought it only built Centering on each hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaramis Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 I wasn't aware that Master Strike built force. I thought it only built Centering on each hit. Doh, you're right, it is Centering. Had it in my head it was Focus for some reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyovarde Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 I swear to god I parse higher not using MS/Ravage at all and using Strike+Slash more for a lower CD on my the big hitters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horano_Heresy Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Great post, Oofalong! Will be testing this out during the weekend. Annihilation vs. Fury, which is your favourite spec to play? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oofalong Posted January 23, 2015 Author Share Posted January 23, 2015 Great post, Oofalong! Will be testing this out during the weekend. Annihilation vs. Fury, which is your favourite spec to play? I like both disciplines although I wish Anni was changed some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kennebunkport Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 what stats you have? what augments you use? full alacrity? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaos_KidSWTOR Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Argh, this contradicts EVERYTHING i've seen from the new 3.0 buff things. But, i guess if your using a Dummy that has all of the debuffs, it would work. But I tend to parse without them (mainly because the droid that you have to buy to get them costs an arm and a leg, and the things themselves cost an arm and a leg...) So I try to frontload Battering Assault... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkyEye Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 (edited) I use Force Exhaustion right after Focused Burst, cause all damage from DoTs and Crush dmg after FE ends are in Heightened Power buff. It's good for burst also... you finishing Master Strike with Crush dmg from Force exhaustion and activating Concentrated Slice instead. You get 20k dmg in 0,5s if your Crush is critical hit. Average damage from FE is around 7,5k and its my 4th greatest damage dealing skill after 1. Focused Burst 2. Concentrated Slice 3. Master Strike Rotation looks like this: http://s12.postimg.org/ryujn1qgt/Rotation_Concentration.jpg Edited January 24, 2015 by SkyEye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramtar Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 (edited) So how will that rotation work against a player that has: knock back, slows, stuns, mobility and range? Advice against a non moving, non shooting target is one thing. But, that isn't going to happen in TOR because either your going against NPCs or players that will move, and shoot back. Edited January 24, 2015 by Ramtar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oofalong Posted January 24, 2015 Author Share Posted January 24, 2015 (edited) I use Force Exhaustion right after Focused Burst, cause all damage from DoTs and Crush dmg after FE ends are in Heightened Power buff. It's good for burst also... you finishing Master Strike with Crush dmg from Force exhaustion and activating Concentrated Slice instead. You get 20k dmg in 0,5s if your Crush is critical hit. Average damage from FE is around 7,5k and its my 4th greatest damage dealing skill after 1. Focused Burst 2. Concentrated Slice 3. Master Strike Rotation looks like this: http://s12.postimg.org/ryujn1qgt/Rotation_Concentration.jpg I forgot to re-examine Force Crush | Force Exhaustion in 3.0; over the course of its damage it does more damage than Obliterate | Zealous Leap. It is indeed has the 4th highest expected damage. I will re-examine my rotation. Edited January 24, 2015 by oofalong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galamm Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 (edited) When i fury with my mara I found this rotation to be the most optimal to get the best out of cascading power windows. Rage up. Opener: Berzerk, charge, burst, force crush, ravage (clip it at 0,3s with), fury strike 1st cycle: Battering assault, obliterate, burst, scream, slash, fury strike, slash (one of those is Vicious throw below 30%) 2nd cycle: Berzerk, olbiterate, burst, force crush, ravage (clip it at 0,3s with), fury strike Just repeat those 2 cycles rage is in abundance, the most i hit with it was 4,6k with really lucky crits, otherwise it's consistent around 4,2k 4,3k in a mix of 186/192 gear. Really easy rotation out of the 3. Edited January 24, 2015 by Galamm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkyEye Posted January 24, 2015 Share Posted January 24, 2015 (edited) So how will that rotation work against a player that has: knock back, slows, stuns, mobility and range? Advice against a non moving, non shooting target is one thing. But, that isn't going to happen in TOR because either your going against NPCs or players that will move, and shoot back. Only thing what holds you in this rotation is Master Strike like in every rotation. And other thing... you must use Master Strike before Concentrated Slice, cause the 6set bonus makes Concentrated Slice auto-crit after using Master Strike. Edited January 24, 2015 by SkyEye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ardarell_Solo Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 (edited) I did an extensive Analysis of damage per activation for the relevant abilities of the rotation to determine which of them should be under Heightened Power (no proc relics and other dps boost stuff/abilities of course) Derived from that I think in full 198s, when you can afford two pieces of alacrity without sacrificing accuracy, the best rotation will be (abilities buffed by Heightened Power in blue): Zen + Focused Burst Force Exhaustion Master Strike clipped into -> Concentrated Slice Zealous Leap Zealous Strike Focused Burst Slash (Dispatch) Slash Concentrated Slice Zealous Leap Blade Storm This is with clipping Master Strike precisely, so Concentrated Slice is just under Heightened Power, which needs two alacrity enhancements. This does NOT work reliably (!!!) in 192 gear with less alacrity possible (cause alacrity augments are a dps loss in this spec), so atm the best rotation after my testing is: Zen + Focused Burst Force Exhaustion Concentrated Slice Master Strike Zealous Leap Zealous Strike Focused Burst Slash (Dispatch) Concentrated Slice Slash Zealous Leap Blade Storm I'm aware that in this case you push Master Strike's strongest last tick out of the Heightened Power window, but its first two ticks are stronger than any alternative for that GCD. Force Exhaustion HAS to be under HP, no excuses, Concentrated Slice as well. This choice is also due to the fact that Master Strike needs to be used under Zen since it's the only ability that will still build Centering - and the additionel Centering from Master Strike is needed to reliably make Zen available every time. Another thing: Blade storm does less DPS per activation than Slash, it's a pure resource management ability now. BTW: If your alacrity is buffed (Commando raid buff) you can even get Zealous leap in the second block under Heightened Power. Edited January 26, 2015 by Ardarell_Solo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oofalong Posted January 26, 2015 Author Share Posted January 26, 2015 (edited) ... Another thing: Blade storm does less DPS per activation than Slash, it's a pure resource management ability now... Are you sure? While I may be modeling it incorrectly, even with Force Flagellation I calculate that Blade Storm does more damage - only 1.25% more though - than Slash. Maybe you got lucky rolls or I am bad at math Edited January 26, 2015 by oofalong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ardarell_Solo Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 Are you sure? While I may be modeling it incorrectly, even with Force Flagellation I calculate that Blade Storm does more damage - only 1.25% more though - than Slash. Maybe you got lucky rolls or I am bad at math Maybe both? ;-) I tested it on 15 parses, so yeah, I'm pretty sure... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kopalame Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 (edited) I have been doing a fair bit of analysing of the rotation and have been using something slighty different from yours. Concentrated Slice applies its damage very quickly, which actually makes you able to fit it in inside the Heightened Power window as the fourth GCD after Focused Burst with no alacrity. However that is cutting it very close, in fact for me sometimes it will be inside and sometimes outside the window. When it's outside it's by no more than 0.1 seconds. When cutting Master Strike on the other hand there's a bit more room and I'm able to fit it in almost every time. Making use of this would move up Master Strike to position 3-4 and Concentrated Slice to 5, as well as the second Concentrated Slice to either 11 (because of CD) or 12 (to make use of fourth GCD in window). 11 is probably the best idea to be sure it fits inside the window. In a real fight various delays will easily move the Concentrated Slice in position 5 out of the window of course, but on a dummy I think it should give the best results, and with a little alacrity it would be safer in a real fight, even putting the 2nd one in position 12. Edited January 27, 2015 by kopalame Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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