LordArtemis Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 (edited) Is there a term for affected by the nerfs to the slot machine but not really caring eitherway overall? Sure. It's probably called being normal lol. Like I said, for most fair minded folks I would speculate it is not the machine by itself that is the issue....it is this on top of all of the other mistakes and missteps over the last 6 months. It just seems like even some ardent "defenders" have had enough. Edited January 25, 2015 by LordArtemis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reno_Tarshil Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Sure. It's probably called being normal lol. Like I said, for most fair minded folks I would speculate it is not the machine by itself that is the issue....it is this on top of all of the other mistakes and missteps over the last 6 months. It just seems like even some ardent "defenders" have had enough. Thanks aside from my Cert issue I really don't care either way about everything going on surrounding this, was just trying assess where my stance was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Thanks aside from my Cert issue I really don't care either way about everything going on surrounding this, was just trying assess where my stance was. I think it is pretty fair to say that this one issue, by itself, is not that big of an issue if everything else was in line. But it is this, plus.... Bosses that do not drop loot Bosses that can be exploited Lockouts from solo FA Fixes to bugs caused by 3.0 that made things worse Introduction of Disciplines with the expansion Disciplines being unbalanced and unpolished Charging for abilities that folks already had or had already purchased Disciplines changing abilities only because they "did not fit dev vision" Constant server problems Constant lag problems Release of the buggy underdeveloped expansion, followed by a vacation Lack of proper communication across the board ...and that doesn't even come close to covering the mistakes over the last 6 months. They just can't seem to get their act together, and lately they have been stepping on their feet over and over again with no end in sight. I just think some folks have had enough. Even I was willing to let all of this pass, but this nerf was the last straw for me. I am simply not putting up with this level of ineptitude any longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkSaberMaster Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 /Agreed. It was them, not us, that decided to put mats into the loot table. If they had not done that... then they would not have had to nerf the slots back to the stoneage. Once they realized their mistake, they went in the extreme opposite direction. What I found by combing through LinkedIn is that there has indeed been a lot of musical chairs and seat assignment changes in the management team at Bioware over the last 9 months. The people that led the development and release of RoTHC and GSF (which were generally well accepted by most players) have moved on to other things. Whoever they put in charge of Strongholds and Revan expac projects .... clearly is not up to the task. And I'm sorry, but the Community Support team has lost their way, with no signs of recovery that I can see. I simply do not trust anything they say moving forward. A shame really. They were on a really good roll for a while, but they have lost the recipe (or the cooks are completely clueless). For players, the end result is the same..... game getting worse after each patch. When issued two feet, and with it generally accepted that to walk well.. you need two feet.... the last thing you should be doing is taking an assault rifle to your feet. I have thought about it for a few days now, and while I still enjoy the game... I'm going to stop plugging game time cards into my account. Once the sub expires, then I will simply play my other MMOs and give this one the little digital birdie. I will not play it free, I will not play it subbed. Not because I have any emotional attachment to the slots, but rather on principle. I really don't care much about the slot machine one way or the other, but I do care about a lack of integrity. I get that they have to be careful what they communicate and how.. but I'm sorry.. it is not a license to lie to the players. Nor is it a license to wrap every bug in waffles and toss them around the forum as CM-Facts. If they cannot even figure out in advance if something is going to have a negative impact on the game, then things will get progressively worse. Because they clearly are lost, and have no idea where they are. If they cannot figure out how to actually balance something that is so simple to adjust without resorting to draconian measures, then things will get progressively worse. Because they are clearly lost and have no idea where they are or what they are doing. If they can be so dishonest in their communications to players on basic and fundamental inquiries about "is something working as intended or not", then what exactly is the point in playing their game, much less putting money into it? IMO.. no point at all. The silence this week, in the face of widely discussed dissatisfaction with how they have handled this latest debacle ----> extremely telling IMO. So with that understanding... I'm going to perma-log out of the forums and let my game time lapse. I wish the best of luck to those that choose to stay and struggle through the growing ineptitude on the part of Bioware. I will miss discussions with some of you who have been here a long time. Many great discussions and disagreements mixed in with the usual player hyperbole-de-jour. Cheers. Wow. As others have said. For Andryah to quit, y'all really ****ed up. She has been the most ardent defender of the game (debatable if that was good or bad), and y'all caused her to say adios. Think about it, EAware. Think about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthDymond Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 (edited) -snip- Cheers Andryah, hope you find a good fit among the MMOs out there. For subscribers/customers, obviously it's 100% a personal call on what you want to spend your money on and what factors matter to you in making that decision. But I have to say that for me, the issue of how well a video game company 'communicates with their players' is way, way down on the list (although not as far down as what the specifics are on a slot machine's reward probabilities). I'm far more concerned with the overall product they put out - how fun and engaging the game itself is. I'm not saying that this game is flawless by any means, whether its significant issues like the Enemy Within bug and the Ability Delay/Lag problems we've had, or minor annoyances like capes clipping through mounts, there is plenty of room for improvement. But at the end of the day I still just find logging in and playing this game to be fun - certainly enough fun to justify spending $13 a month on at the very least. ...Of course I also don't play on Harbinger so that alone might skew my experiences more towards the positive than the situation a lot of players find themselves in. Edited January 25, 2015 by DarthDymond Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heat-Wave Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Wow. As others have said. For Andryah to quit, y'all really ****ed up. She has been the most ardent defender of the game (debatable if that was good or bad), and y'all caused her to say adios. Think about it, EAware. Think about it. Sad to say, I doubt they'll hear it... At the moment they seem to be tone deaf... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThorgrimLutgen Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 They need to wise up to this mess. I do not think this issue is going away any time soon, people are wanting answers and heads it seems. Can it be fixed? Probably, sweeteners always make the shallow happy. Will people trust them in the future? I doubt it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Sad to say, I doubt they'll hear it... At the moment they seem to be tone deaf... Or timid....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Djiini Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Don't worry, guys, I'm still here to defend the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heat-Wave Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Don't worry, guys, I'm still here to defend the game. Be sure to turn off the lights when you leave... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuriDogshin Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Cheers Andryah, hope you find a good fit among the MMOs out there. My wife and I are enjoying FFXIV. And the first character I designed is super pretty without looking like a **** star. Totally different than SWTOR, tho, but maybe for me it will be better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthDymond Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 My wife and I are enjoying FFXIV. And the first character I designed is super pretty without looking like a **** star. Totally different than SWTOR, tho, but maybe for me it will be better. I played a bit of FFXIV back in its 1.0 version before the whole Realm Reborn reboot. It was a pretty game even back then, but really didn't do much for me beyond that. Tried about 20 minutes of the new version on a friend's account, but while the class system seems pretty cool and, again, it is a really pretty game in terms of art design, it didn't grab ahold of me. I've found I only like MMOs that take place in universes I'm already familiar with - when I'm first encountering a new setting I prefer the tighter narrative you're more likely to find in a single-player game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spatnatz Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 I bought 2 slot machines at about 3 mill each (one for me, one for stronghold). So I didn't necessarily have to spend any real dollars for this product. But, obviously someone else had to spend CCs, and possibly money out of their own pocket as well, to get those slot machines. At least they were able to successfully convert their cartel coins to credits...and they say selling gold is illegal? The CM does just that for many players. But nonetheless, I now have bought two 3 million credit bricks. And I'll probably never get that money back, I just have to hope to god that they fix those to be somewhat useful again. Thanks, Bioware... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuriDogshin Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 I've found I only like MMOs that take place in universes I'm already familiar with Well, you do get to ride chocobos in FFXIV, and so on. The lore is not a broad and deep as Star Wars, but it's there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draqsko Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 Well, you do get to ride chocobos in FFXIV, and so on. The lore is not a broad and deep as Star Wars, but it's there. We call them Orobirds in SWTOR.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuriDogshin Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 (edited) We call them Orobirds in SWTOR.. BioWare's Austin team is an everflowing font of creativity, technical expertise, and business acumen. I suspect Square Enix stole the idea for chocobos from SWTOR. Using their secret time travel machine. Edited January 26, 2015 by BuriDogshin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draqsko Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 (edited) BioWare's Austin team is a everflowing font of creativity, technical expertise, and business acumen. I suspect Square Enix stole the idea for chocobos from SWTOR. Using their secret time travel machine. The Japanese probably already have a time machine, they're certainly smart enough to have invented it. And probably wise enough not to tell anyone about it. Edited January 26, 2015 by Draqsko Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max_Killjoy Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 The Japanese probably already have a time machine, they're certainly smart enough to have invented it. And probably wise enough not to tell anyone about it. Anyone who finds out, doesn't find out, if you get what I'm saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSeventhJedi Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 The biggest BW white knight/apologist is leaving? I never thought I'd get to ask this, but Andryah, can I have your stuff? I'm sure you've got a lot of it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 As an addendum to my immediate prior post: I think they should consider adding some additional drops to the machines, these could be as rare as or even slightly rarer than the rancor. (.0009 OR .09% with the feeling lucky buff for the Rancor). what these would be would be 'Jackpot Crates' which are similar to the 'grand acquisition' packs that have been sold. Where-in the player who hits this jackpot is given a full set of armor, or perhaps a rare speeder, crystal, etc from the pack the machine represents. These don't even need to be bound because their infrequency would be high enough (again, I suggest slightly harder to get than the Rancor) that they would not be a significant addition to the GTN or a players wealth if sold. Looking at the Contraband Packs I would conceivably (So, lets say at odds that are an order of magnitude greater than the Rancor, so instead of .09% use .009%) recommend that they have the potential to drop any of the following: Red Blade Set Thana Vesh Set Restored Triumverate Set Recovered Hero Set Each of the three relaxed Sets. (Jumpsuit, Uniform and Vestments) White-Black Sabre crystals (individually not as a set) The Cartel Skiffs (Individually) The Aratech Speeders (individually) Music Therapy Probe Portable Relaxation Unit Revan Statue Various pets, emotes, moods (perhaps this reward comes with several in the jackpot crate) Weapons (individual weapon from all the weapons in this pack, can leave some omitted of course) What this does is gives players a chance to get a really neat jackpot (beyond a reskinned vehicle) with significantly difficult odds that encourages them to play the slots. I know that I would certainly take to converting a portion of my credits, every time I earn more, and use them to feed aslot machine because I may be able to fill out my collections. Since a number of items are still omitted,there is still a reason to buy the packs when you put them on sale, the slot machine would not eliminate this need/market for your real world currency Catel Market packs. But a broad enough/rare enough selection is chosen that you pique the players need/greed to have the results. Since there is also a suitably large number of potential rewards, it gives the slot machine a significant life span. More as you release each generation of Slot Machine to make up for another prior (never the current) shipment from the Cartel Market. So not only does this provide an enticing currency sink, tweak the reward/pleasure centers of your players but it does one more thing. It really encourages more player interaction in areas where slot machines can be found. The community is encouraged to make their strongholds/guild halls public if they have these devices. This is a benefit then to players who do not yet have them. The eventual variety of the machines makes for new and interesting social hubs for players. The number of special Jackpot Crates and their widely varying contents encourage player interaction and chatter as they hit their jackpots and open the crates. This gives more ipetus for players to purchase and decorate their Strongholds. Quite frankly my entire purpose formy strong holds was to maximize out the bonus for conquest points and I didn't care at all how I decorated. I just filled hooks until I had the bonus. I would frankly beencouraged by this syste to at least make ONE ofmy strongholds look nice and I would dedicate space within it to my 'casino' and it would be made open to the public.. all thngs I do not do presently because there is no point to it for me (and many others). The slot machines can be an excellent method for you to really increase the fun of the game, make Grade 11 (and future grades) more accessible to players, increase the rate at which currency is 'flushed' from the system higher allowing perhaps for some other 'less fun' money sinks to be scaled back further and overall increasing the 'fun to play' aspect of the game. You increase social hub activity, and you make those social hubs PLAYER driven. So, for your consideration.... I like this, give it the same feel as opening packs...hence hitting the same reasons we sink so much money into packs, but instead sinking credits into a time filler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 As time passes the options to fix this debacle become less abundant IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icycola Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 Wow, take note Bioware. Andryah is one of your most level headed and forgiving fans. If your losing this kind of player, you should be concerned IMO. This is a message straight to Bioware.....get it together. Your screwing up too much. Stop with the silence, put out that letter, face the music, return the cert drop rate to what it was and get the 12XP event rolling again. Get off your butts and so something about this. This is likely NOT going to just go away. ^^ Wow. You hit me right in the gut with those powerful truths. Games are supposed to be fun and what just happened and is still happening because of their refusal to communicate makes everyday less and less fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 (edited) ^^ Wow. You hit me right in the gut with those powerful truths. Games are supposed to be fun and what just happened and is still happening because of their refusal to communicate makes everyday less and less fun. I concede that two things are possible, even likely perhaps. 1) The forum does not likely represent a game player majority. 2) Most folks could lack caring either way. But, that said, they did make the change based on what I see as an even smaller portion of the community, and one can argue this community can represent the players as a proportional comparison, a sample size perhaps, using averages. It is not crazy, IMO, to speculate the many of the problems that game has had (especially ability lag) and introducing disciplines was quite a bit for players to take all at once. This problem may not effect everyone (some folks may not even be aware this machine exists) but it is likely they were affected by the lag and disciplines. So when you combine that with this issue I believe you begin to represent a sizable portion of the playerbase. And that is the problem IMO. At this juncture I expect that feelings game wide are not as positive as they should be. They need to do something fairly quickly to turn that around. Edited January 26, 2015 by LordArtemis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amarinth Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 (edited) /Agreed. It was them, not us, that decided to put mats into the loot table. If they had not done that... then they would not have had to nerf the slots back to the stoneage. Once they realized their mistake, they went in the extreme opposite direction. What I found by combing through LinkedIn is that there has indeed been a lot of musical chairs and seat assignment changes in the management team at Bioware over the last 9 months. The people that led the development and release of RoTHC and GSF (which were generally well accepted by most players) have moved on to other things. Whoever they put in charge of Strongholds and Revan expac projects .... clearly is not up to the task. And I'm sorry, but the Community Support team has lost their way, with no signs of recovery that I can see. I simply do not trust anything they say moving forward. A shame really. They were on a really good roll for a while, but they have lost the recipe (or the cooks are completely clueless). For players, the end result is the same..... game getting worse after each patch. When issued two feet, and with it generally accepted that to walk well.. you need two feet.... the last thing you should be doing is taking an assault rifle to your feet. I have thought about it for a few days now, and while I still enjoy the game... I'm going to stop plugging game time cards into my account. Once the sub expires, then I will simply play my other MMOs and give this one the little digital birdie. I will not play it free, I will not play it subbed. Not because I have any emotional attachment to the slots, but rather on principle. I really don't care much about the slot machine one way or the other, but I do care about a lack of integrity. I get that they have to be careful what they communicate and how.. but I'm sorry.. it is not a license to lie to the players. Nor is it a license to wrap every bug in waffles and toss them around the forum as CM-Facts. If they cannot even figure out in advance if something is going to have a negative impact on the game, then things will get progressively worse. Because they clearly are lost, and have no idea where they are. If they cannot figure out how to actually balance something that is so simple to adjust without resorting to draconian measures, then things will get progressively worse. Because they are clearly lost and have no idea where they are or what they are doing. If they can be so dishonest in their communications to players on basic and fundamental inquiries about "is something working as intended or not", then what exactly is the point in playing their game, much less putting money into it? IMO.. no point at all. The silence this week, in the face of widely discussed dissatisfaction with how they have handled this latest debacle ----> extremely telling IMO. So with that understanding... I'm going to perma-log out of the forums and let my game time lapse. I wish the best of luck to those that choose to stay and struggle through the growing ineptitude on the part of Bioware. I will miss discussions with some of you who have been here a long time. Many great discussions and disagreements mixed in with the usual player hyperbole-de-jour. Cheers. You've said it better than I could. I sent Bioware the cliffnotes version with my subscription cancellation, but I just didn't have the willpower left to post an elaborate version on the forums, so I'm glad that you did. If they cannot even figure out in advance if something is going to have a negative impact on the game, then things will get progressively worse. Because they clearly are lost, and have no idea where they are. It's become obvious over the past few months that the people in charge are completely out of touch with the state of the game and the needs of their playerbase. Changes are rushed into patches without care for balance and when those changes are called into question the subsequent communication from Bioware ends up being more confused than the changes themselves. Edited January 26, 2015 by Amarinth formatting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 IMO, instead of having cantinas they need to have a player summit. Grant it, this would probably be difficult and expensive, but perhaps they could charge admission. The idea would be that they would allow players, in attendance, to vote on specific questions Bioware poses to the audience, and the audience would also be able to post their own questions. A moderator could choose the most frequent questions to be answered by the panel. The third phase would be the solution phase, where Bioware would take the highest voted options and then put it to the audience to post suggestions for those options...again, the most common would be posted and discussed. Player summits like this have been known to be quite effective in the past, and often put the development staff on the right track. My first suggestion? New management and QA. Both are desperately needed IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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