KTap Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) From what I understand from the stream, they are lowering our damage to be more in line with how long they want fights to be. Our current gear will be doing less at level 60 than it is now If you equip the 198 gear (the new bis) and are level 60, your DPS will be similar to current 55s with 186 gear (from Dulfy notes). This means people will be doing less damage for weeks or months than we currently do. Imagine the rage when this goes live and people are seeing lower numbers... it will be glorious I'm not a fan of this personally, what do you guys think? Edited October 31, 2014 by KTap Title more precise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenjaNav Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 It's just a number... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
altaboy Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 As long as I can kill things before they kill me... I won't care! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KTap Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 It's just a number... I know, and we'll have to get used to it I suppose, but I personally like seeing numbers going up with new levels/gear, not down Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loadsamunny Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) As far as PvP goes, this is good and bad. For tanks, this is good. It means the RNG isn't as decisive now. Damage mitigation values will round out over the course of a longer fight, and variance won't be as high anymore. For focusing healers, this is bad, because lower damage numbers combined with bigger heals means that healers will be even more important to focus than ever, AND they will be a lot harder to kill. This also means Sorcs and Sages become even more OP with bubbles and self heals. Edited October 30, 2014 by Loadsamunny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KTap Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) This is good, and bad. For tanks, this is good. It means the RNG isn't as decisive now. Damage mitigation values will round out over the course of a longer fight, and variance won't be as high anymore. For focusing healers, this is bad, because lower damage numbers combined with bigger heals means that healers will be even more important to focus than ever, AND they will be a lot harder to kill. This also means Sorcs and Sages become even more OP with bubbles and self heals. They didn't mention healing, it's possible that they're bringing that down as well to compensate? Who knows Edited October 30, 2014 by KTap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarathAnno Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 I have to admit I am not a fan of this. Watching my damage numbers drop and then slowly crawl back to where they are now is going to be extremely unsatisfying. I'm especially bothered by the idea that at level 60 in 186 gear I'll be doing less damage then I currently do at level 55 in 180 gear. Meaning I'll have to go through the gear grind again just to get back to where I am now. I do understand why they are doing it but it flips the hallmark of an MMO, character advancement, on its head in a very unsatisfying way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KTap Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 I have to admit I am not a fan of this. Watching my damage numbers drop and then slowly crawl back to where they are now is going to be extremely unsatisfying. I'm especially bothered by the idea that at level 60 in 186 gear I'll be doing less damage then I currently do at level 55 in 180 gear. Meaning I'll have to go through the gear grind again just to get back to where I am now. I do understand why they are doing it but it flips the hallmark of an MMO, character advancement, on its head in a very unsatisfying way. I agree. I can see where maybe when every attack or heal is doing 10k+ that this would be an issue with too big of numbers on the screen, but we're not even close to that atm. Seems like they could just add more hp to bosses to compensate for the dps increases, and not give us the dissatisfaction of doing less with better gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CmdrShpd Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 I have to admit I am not a fan of this. Watching my damage numbers drop and then slowly crawl back to where they are now is going to be extremely unsatisfying. I'm especially bothered by the idea that at level 60 in 186 gear I'll be doing less damage then I currently do at level 55 in 180 gear. Meaning I'll have to go through the gear grind again just to get back to where I am now. I do understand why they are doing it but it flips the hallmark of an MMO, character advancement, on its head in a very unsatisfying way. Well, the point of doing damage, is not to maximize some arbitrary number. The point of doing damage is to kill enemies. As long as enemies are being adjusted to the new lower damage levels, it shouldn't matter that some arbitrary number is lower than it used to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KTap Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) Well, the point of doing damage, is not to maximize some arbitrary number. The point of doing damage is to kill enemies. As long as enemies are being adjusted to the new lower damage levels, it shouldn't matter that some arbitrary number is lower than it used to be. I'm sure they will be adjusted just fine. However, given a choice, would you want to be doing more or less damage than you currently do (assuming the fights lasted the same length, etc)? Yes, it's an arbitrary number, but I think psychologically most of us want to see increases, not decreases. Edited October 30, 2014 by KTap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrellma Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 As long as they balance around it, it will be fine. I'm happy with it, otherwise in the next level cap you'll see things like "LF DPS for SM (whatever op). Must have 90k DPS." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levram Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 If you equip the 198 gear (the new bis) and be level 60, your DPS will be similar to current 55s with 186 gear. Yes, I watched the LiveStream and this is correct. DPS numbers in min/max 198 gear at Level 60 will be very close to DPS number in min/max 186 gear at Level 55 pre-3.0 (i.e. right now.) I think this is a positive change. It will extend the life of DF and DP nightmare mode and the DPS checks will feel similar at Level 60 as they do now. None of the current content will be any more "facerolly" at Level 60 than it currently is. Nightmare TFB and S&V will continue to be able to provide some good practice grounds for up and coming progression teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CmdrShpd Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 I'm sure they will be adjusted just fine. However, given a choice, would you want to be doing more or less damage than you currently do (assuming the fights lasted the same length, etc)? Yes, it's an arbitrary number, but I think psychologically most of us want to see increases, not decreases. A week after 3.0 hits, we will all have forgotten what numbers we used to be hitting (not really, but close enough) and I don't think anybody will be bothered by it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KTap Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) As long as they balance around it, it will be fine. I'm happy with it, otherwise in the next level cap you'll see things like "LF DPS for SM (whatever op). Must have 90k DPS." Dps hasn't been going up that quickly This is just my opinion, but I would like there to remain a noticeable increase with new levels/tiers of gear. Maybe even as little as 200-300 dps/hps/etc (from 186 gear @55 to 198 gear @60), but an increase nonetheless. Edited October 30, 2014 by KTap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianDavion Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 the devs awhile back noted DPS had skyrocketed a bit higher then they liked. we've known this was gonna happen for awhile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CmdrShpd Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 One thing I am wondering now is - will pre-level 60 content now become more difficult if I decide to level a new toon after 3.0, or is basically everything in the game being altered around the new lower dps levels? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
znihilist Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) One thing I am wondering now is - will pre-level 60 content now become more difficult if I decide to level a new toon after 3.0, or is basically everything in the game being altered around the new lower dps levels? It wouldn't make sense for that content not to be re-balanced or we would find ourselves in a situation where older content is harder than new content even with the level difference! So expect an HP decrease with tweaking any mechanic based on interrupting or cleansing. Edited October 30, 2014 by znihilist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technohic Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Pvp wise it's fine so long as healing and tanking matches the drop. Power creep is not exclusive to DPS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KTap Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 It wouldn't make sense for that content not to be re-balanced or we would find ourselves in a situation where older content is harder than new content even with the level difference! So expect an HP decrease with tweaking any mechanic based on interrupting or cleansing. I heard from a friend that another mmo just did something similar to this and it caused massive problems with things before max level. Blocking people from progressing/1 shots/etc. I would assume they are aware of how this could affect leveling and are balancing it accordingly, but who knows Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CmdrShpd Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 I heard from a friend that another mmo just did something similar to this and it caused massive problems with things before max level. Blocking people from progressing/1 shots/etc. I would assume they are aware of how this could affect leveling and are balancing it accordingly, but who knows That would be my hope and expectation as well, but it would be nice to get some clarification on this (I'm assuming that it was not clarified in the stream, but I was not able to watch the whole thing so I'm not sure). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phesojss Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 The reduction in cool downs on cleanses and interupts will need to be adjusted for many boss encounters in operations especially hard modes. The current mechanics such as cleanses for HM nefra and interupts for the coruptors at Draxus will not be doable under the proposed changes. This is shaping up to be a complete mechanical disaster that will resonate horribly. Bugs are one thing, they happen what is shaping up is much worse and confidence destroying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elfa Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Level up to 60 become weaker today! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwena Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 I don't really care about "big numbers", I just care how fast stuff dies. But I'll be honest -- if I notice stuff dying more slowly (= harder, longer fights) when I'm in the exact same gear, I'm not going to be a happy camper. Most of my characters aren't DPS so don't kill stuff all that fast to start, and I fear my squishy new Assassin will not be nearly as effective and fun if mobs take too long to kill. If they are indeed going back and reducing mob HP on leveling planets, then it shouldn't be a problem. But hopefully any area that isn't an Op/FP will be included, too. Otherwise, I foresee mostly level 50/55 dailies in my 3.0 future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakexeNex Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 This all seems bad but been there b4 in Lotro when they raised levels caps and lowered dps on legendary weapons. After some retraining it is soon forgotten. The only part of this that bothers me is perhaps too big a bite too soon. Lowering gear stats on 3.0 and then introducing the skill tree changes on the next update would have been less of a shock than throwing it all at us at once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChroniKill Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 They mentioned during the stream that in levelling content things would generally die faster, so I guess they'll be lowering HP. Yo me, it doesn't make much difference. I don't feel better about myself for doing 2k or 3k, provided that I compare myself against peers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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