Guildships COST 50 MILLION CREDITS!?

[BuriDogshin]

Actually running dailies with friends while laughing about things of voice chat, possibly drinking slightly alcoholic beverage while doing it, could be fun for many.

Especially when you play little micro-games throughout, like "let's kill this gold before it can get an attack off," or running with two DPS and DPS companions without ever stopping to heal.

 

And trying to complete a weekly or FP as fast as possible is a mini-game in its own right. Blazed through 5 GF tactical FPs last night on a gunslinger and a sage healer, it was a blast.

Edited July 29, 2014 by BuriDogshin

[Darkheyr]

Are you talking about dailies, or about spending time with your friends?

 

I mean yes, I could do both. Or I could spend time with my friends doing something else, with more inherent fun factored into the equation.

 

And again, if 100 hours (or 50, or 200, depending on what you do and want) of repeting the exact same content over and over is your idea of fun, good for you. I'm not claiming that somebody, however unlikely, could not have fun with that.

 

Don't delude yourself, however, that its a majority.

[BuriDogshin]

And again, if 100 hours (or 50, or 200, depending on what you do and want) of repeting the exact same content over and over is your idea of fun, good for you. I'm not claiming that somebody, however unlikely, could not have fun with that.

 

Don't delude yourself, however, that its a majority.

I was not the one who made the statement about what "most" people like or dislike.

So please take your own advice, since I do not seem to need it, and you do.

[Darkheyr]

Sure. Whatever. If its fun for you, have fun with it. Not stopping you.

[Racjel]

Remember that flagships are here for a purpose.... it will be so called Conquest "events". Wonder how "small guilds" wil do in those due to them being small but we still lack info about the mechanics

 

Some people expect everyone to be able buy there guild ship the first day its released

[Darkheyr]

If some people are able to buy them the day they are released, where is the harm in everyone being able to do so? Again, its not my prefered solution, but it really is a hollow argument if there ever was one.

 

 

And again - the ship itself is content, not just Conquest. There's a substantial amount of people interested in the ship itself who couldn't care less about conquests.

[BuriDogshin]

Remember that flagships are here for a purpose.... it will be so called Conquest "events". Wonder how "small guilds" wil do in those due to them being small but we still lack info about the mechanics.

On the PTS planets seem to be divided into sectors; there is a notice that pops up when you enter a sector saying which guild controls that sector.

 

Just speculating here, but it may be that guilds can only control a limited number of sectors, and there may be enough sectors for small guilds to get one. Even with that, there may be some pretty intense competition between the top guilds for "prime real estate," whether that's to get buffs in an area a guild does a lot of stuff in or to simply advertise the awesomeness of your guild to potential new players.

 

We'll see later this week when Guild ships and Conquests go live on the PTS.

[AshlaBoga]

The problem with the huge guilds is that they won't be that huge because of the 500 member limit and each character counts towards it.

 

^This.

 

SWTOR doesn't allow for big guilds without cheesing it (putting your non NiM Ops alts in a 2nd or even 3rd guild).

[well]

Sure. Whatever. If its fun for you, have fun with it. Not stopping you.

 

Some may have fun others are bored from it. I do them and it is boring to me. This bull about earning it by buying it is garbage. Some have been spouting that nonsense. Some keep saying how easy it is to get credits. Then it isn't much of a accomplishment. This has just gotten to be nonsense. People really need to get their heads out of rectal defilade. It is a game. People play to have fun. Personally I would rather have a 73 Duster with a 340 and 4 speed . I don't think I'll be seeing them in the game anytime soon.

[TalantM]

Guys. 10 people. Oricon dailies, 82k per run. CZ dailies, 36k per day. 118k per day. We'll be lenient and subtract 10 k for repairs, so 108 k per day.10 people, 1.18 mil per day. 4o ish days to guild ship. Assuming nobody crafts.

 

The oricon and CZ dailies give basic coms. cz gives 8 and oricon gives 20 or 30 per day, so that is an isotope 5 every day or 2. lets assume 2. an extra 70 k per person every other day works out to 153k per day. so 1.53 mil per day on average. 32 days to guild ship.

 

Money boss in SNV drops like 400 k, i know snv is long but sm SNV is hilariously easy, especially if it's boilstered, and that's a decent boost.

 

So, for an hour, hour and a half of dailies from each guildie each day, who can be grouped up to make things go faster than that, it takes about a month to get a guild ship. And that's the really lazy and slow, farm less, craft less way of doing things. I've been part of groups of 4 that make 280k in about 15 minuites. Were dedicated people so inclined, that's a mil per hour. 2 hours a day of that and a guild of 4 people gets all the money they need for thier guild ship in 25 days. A guild of 8 in 13. A guild of 12 in 7.

Edited July 29, 2014 by TalantM

[TheSeventhJedi]

Especially when you play little micro-games throughout, like "let's kill this gold before it can get an attack off," or running with two DPS and DPS companions without ever stopping to heal.

 

And trying to complete a weekly or FP as fast as possible is a mini-game in its own right. Blazed through 5 GF tactical FPs last night on a gunslinger and a sage healer, it was a blast.

 

My group has scavenging races. One wears a ridiculous alacrity suit because it helps him scavenge faster. Sages in the group make things very interesting with pulls.

[BuriDogshin]

My group has scavenging races. One wears a ridiculous alacrity suit because it helps him scavenge faster. Sages in the group make things very interesting with pulls.

I was thinking of doing that, not just for scavenging but also for reverse engineering and force-feeding gifts to companions. Finally, a use for the tanking gear the com vendors sell!

Yeah, I think I'll eventually make a high alacrity Legacy set for "gettin' the chores done with." I have plenty of spare alacrity enhancements and those and some alacrity augments is all I'll need.

[DarthTHC]

If some people are able to buy them the day they are released, where is the harm in everyone being able to do so? Again, its not my prefered solution, but it really is a hollow argument if there ever was one.

 

And again - the ship itself is content, not just Conquest. There's a substantial amount of people interested in the ship itself who couldn't care less about conquests.

 

There is absolutely no harm in everyone being able to obtain them at release. I think it would be pretty awesome, honestly, if every single guild that wanted a flagship could get at least the base model at release.

 

In a shocking turn of events, everyone has the opportunity to obtain them at release.

 

The people who can obtain them at release fall into a few categories:

 

1) They had one or few members who had hundreds of millions of credits each, because they put in the effort over however many years of playing this game to acquire those credits, and just bought 'em one.

 

2) They read the guild flagship announcement way back in March and, way back in March, they started planning and undertaking effort to obtain one, which might have also included not dumping every last credit they had into slot machines in pursuit of a Rancor. (Yes, BioWare staff laughs at you for those sorts of behaviors.)

 

3) They realized at the 11th hour - days ago - that Holy Force Choke, Vader, these sumbritches is expensive! And they put together a plan to immediately do that it takes to earn one by release.

 

What they did not do:

 

a) Nothing

 

b) Nothing + complain

 

There still may be time for motivated guilds with active members to achieve a guild ship before release. What do we have? Almost 3 weeks? 21 days? That's 2.4 million a day, or 16.7 million a week. For a guild of 12 active players, that's 200,000 a day or 1,400,000 a week per player. Absolutely possible, but becoming less so with each passing procrastination day.

 

If there's anything that learning stuff instead of going to college taught me, it's that procrastination leads to 11th hour grind sessions. If you chose not to start in March, well, it's not like your homework is due on 19 August. You can actually set your own deadline, right?

 

Anyhoo, yes, it would be really, really awesome if every guild that wanted a flagship at release did the research and then undertook the effort to acquire one at release. They can. They just need to be in the game doing it instead of on the forums... erm, not doing it.

 

So who do you want to be today? Do you want to be the guild that buckled down, took off the skirt, manned up, rose to the challenge, and knocked it out of the park? Or do you want to be the guild sitting planetside watching conquest messages scroll across your screen putting yourself through yet another round of shoulda, woulda, coulda?

Edited July 29, 2014 by DarthTHC

[BuriDogshin]

Do you want to be the guild that buckled down, took off the skirt, manned up, rose to the challenge, and knocked it out of the park?

Guild ship or not, I am not taking off my skirt. You do not want to see that, trust me. Even my wife doesn't.

[well]

Lord love a duck . It is like a fertilizer convention. You really have to watch where you walk:eek:

[RobNightfall]

I respectfully disagree

 

I think it would surprise how few players have more than 5 million credits to their name. Most players I know have enough credits to cover repair bills and swapping mods around. They do not struggle with credits but they do not amass large quantities either.

 

Some enjoy the mini-game of acquiring MMO currency, most don't. I am not saying it is difficult to do if one puts their mind to it, just that most do not put their mind to it.

 

This (including the tone of being respectful). Most people no longer want to spend hours grinding credits, and while credits are "easily" made, the making of them is a grind. I a have job, I'm looking for a new girlfriend (i.e. dating), I go to the gym, and I have a social life. Most of the people I routinely play with are the same. This will place people who have either a) more free time or b) more money than sense above your average player. Most games are moving in the direction of being accessible to casual players, and this game has been in the lead on that. Pricing guild ships at 50 million is a backwards step and, as others have posted, it will probably end up costing the game subs.

Edited July 30, 2014 by RobNightfall

[DarthTHC]

This (including the tone of being respectful). Most people no longer want to spend hours grinding credits, and while credits are "easily" made, the making of them is a grind. I a have job, I'm looking for a new girlfriend (i.e. dating), I go to the gym, and I have a social life. Most of the people I routinely play with are the same. This will place people who have either a) more free time or b) more money than sense above your average player. Most games are moving in the direction of being accessible to casual players, and this game has been in the lead on that. Pricing guild ships at 50 million is a backwards step and, as others have posted, it will probably end up costing the game subs.

 

How is making credits a grind?

 

Start a new character. Once it gets to Fleet, take Slicing, Scavenging, and Bioanalysis. Play the game. As you play the game, use Slicing, Scavenging, and Bioanalysis to harvest whatever you come across. Might take you 10 seconds off your path to get to a node. Oh well. Sell the results on GTN.

 

Do not spend credits except to train the skills you will use. Do not train skills you will not use. Use quest rewards or planetary commendations or looted gear. Never buy from GTN.

 

By the time you are done with Corellia and Chapter 3 of your Class Story, you will have 2-3 million credits, maybe more.

 

Where in that did you "grind"? You just played the game.

Edited July 30, 2014 by DarthTHC

[PifferPuff]

Are you?

 

Lets take a smaller guild with a group of people that want the flagship and are willing to work for it. They can raise the money in 2 weeks.

 

15 players that can run dailies.

2 hours on a weeknight for 250k

4 hours over the weekend for 500k.

 

15 x 250k x 10 week days == 37.5 million

15 x 500k x 2 weekends == 15 million

 

Total raised: 52.5 million.

 

Don't want to run dailies? Run some ops and sell MMGs. Can't run ops? Do some crafting instead. Don't have enough time to dedicate 2 hours a night? Take 4 weeks to get a flagship instead of 2. Don't have any level 55s? Raise money through regular questing and take 2 months instead of 2 weeks.

 

Players and guilds lack money because they spend it instead of make it.

 

Well now, here's a constructive post as to how to make credits quick and easily. /applaud

 

And, incidentally, this 50M credit price tag is not an insurmountable amount to accumulate, and is likely a chief motivation designed inline with what the devs intended.

 

Think about it... The Flagship is a high-hanging fruit. A goal that would take time and effort to achieve, but achievable none-the-less for those guilds that want it enough. It would help foster more activity from a guild's members to do something together...a common goal... like this: "hey guys, we want to get the guild flagship, so we're asking for volunteers. We're gonna group for some TfB SM (to the weekly or full run) for anyone who wants to come and help donate to the fund. We're also gonna group for dailies, so let's get in on that too! And any other ideas to make this dream a reality, please speak up!!"

 

The endeavour would also help identify those players in a guild that are likely officer material, and also reveal mooches all at the same time. It would inspire smaller guilds to grow, and work more towards a shared goal. It would help larger guilds to discover their more active key members (or those who have the potential) who really are more for their guild and helping the team out. It would allow for a renewed interest in having guild ops/FP runs. Long nights over TS/Mumble/etc with drink, chat and jokes -- good times. A chance to get a guild's less-active participants to come out and get their feet wet.

 

This is actually a good thing. So, I think some of the naysayers here are missing the point.

 

And as a side note, I am one of those players who (in addition to being a member of a large guild) have a solo guild that I use mostly as a mats bank that I founded way before the legacy bank was announced. Between my toons and guild bank, I have easily over 10M mostly sitting collecting dust (I probably have closer to 15M - 20M -- if I seriously check all my toons). Also, I usually try to keep a reserve of at least 5M credits on my main, 500K - 1M on my 55 alts, and rarely drop below that. I grinded most of my earnings, and learned not to spend it on frivolous things, so I'd always have some credits for those things I really want/need. And ... That is just me. Nothing special here. Not a Crafting wizard by any stretch of the imagination. Just your average rough-and-tumble gamer.

 

imho, 50M is a fair and reasonable amount, for the reasons I listed above. Honestly, I half expected the flagship to be some stupid low amount like 5M - 10M. LOL. But, I'm actually elated (and a bit excited) to see that it is going to be valued higher. And with the ~80M worth (or so I am told) of extras (plus tokens - jawa or otherwise - to redeem for furnishings) to deck out with, it will make the flagship like a pet project that a guild can grow in incremental steps. One that grows over time, and one that gives a sense of shared accomplishment, ownership, and fosters loyalty within the guild.

 

I foresee for some that, ultimately, the guild flagship (and its relative difficulty in obtaining and furnishing) will serve to build, enhance, and enrich the bonds of friendship that will stand the test of time, long after the game's servers have shut down for the last time. And, the guild flagship would serve as the vehicle to get them there.

 

Anyways, just my two cents.

 

 

 

EDIT:

/snip (too long to quote. Just clicky clicky)

QFT. This guy gets it. /applaud Edited July 30, 2014 by PifferPuff

[slafko]

Guys. 10 people. Oricon dailies, 82k per run. CZ dailies, 36k per day. 118k per day. We'll be lenient and subtract 10 k for repairs, so 108 k per day.10 people, 1.18 mil per day. 4o ish days to guild ship. Assuming nobody crafts.

I ran four Czerka dailies to help a guidie with XP yesterday. Four daily quests, selling drops and reputation tokens yielded a bit over 46k. Taking into account we were teamed and shared credits and loot, I'm thinking you can safely use 50k in your calculations.

 

Add another 55k from The Black Hole, which can be cleared in less than 15 minutes and you're around 180k every day. Whole run should take less than an hour.

 

After that, do a flashpoint, get the daily reward + drops and 10 planetary comms reward, buy four purple armorings and sell them for 40k+ each.

Edited July 30, 2014 by slafko

[Aries_cz]

After that, do a flashpoint, get the daily reward + drops and 10 planetary comms reward, buy four purple armorings and sell them for 40k+ each.

 

People are actually buying the planetary comms armorings? Huh. Guess that is why I never mastered GTN, I simply fail to understand why would someone buy certain things, when they are so easy to get otherwise...

[slafko]

I too was surprised when I found out how easy it is to sell Makeb vendor armorings. Hilts and barrels not so much; I just ignore those now. Best sellers are Might and Resolve arrmorings; they can easily be sold for over 40k.

 

My guess is people buy them for their fresh lvl 50 characters. Even those that have bought 4-set bonus armorings with Classic comms still need four armorings to be fully geared. And with that gear, getting from 50 to 55 is child's play.

[Will_Chokabich]

The only people this is going to affect big time are really small guilds. At 55 you can do 200k worth of dailies. Spread that across 5 toons, that's your guild ship in 50 days. That's also assuming your guild isn't already sitting on a treasure trove of goodies. C'mon you plebs, you can't expect a total hand out all the time.

[Darkheyr]

And, incidentally, this 50M credit price tag is not an insurmountable amount to accumulate, and is likely a chief motivation designed inline with what the devs intended.

 

Think about it... The Flagship is a high-hanging fruit. A goal that would take time and effort to achieve, but achievable none-the-less for those guilds that want it enough. It would help foster more activity from a guild's members to do something together...a common goal... like this: "hey guys, we want to get the guild flagship, so we're asking for volunteers. We're gonna group for some TfB SM (to the weekly or full run) for anyone who wants to come and help donate to the fund. We're also gonna group for dailies, so let's get in on that too! And any other ideas to make this dream a reality, please speak up!!"

 

Or it could, you know, cause people to simply think "***!?"

 

A credit grind, no matter what for, will never be reason for instead activity in some guilds. I mean, our own guild has that money, and we still won't spend it on a guild ship because its leaps and bounds beyond a reasonable price for anything. Another guild I know was freshly formed - a roleplaying concept guild wanting to do some RP as a Harrower command crew. As it stands, unless prices drop, they'll probably disband again because they'll not devote that much boredom towards another 50 million credits, and another guild just using the Ziost Shadow is getting mighty crowded.

 

That too is a possible consequence of what you call "A goal that would take time and effort to achieve, but achievable none-the-less for those guilds that want it enough."

 

I play to have fun. Grinding dailies and minimizing credits spend on the activity I actually enjoy is not fun, for me. Investing dozens of hours into dull and boring activities is unreasonable for a great number of people.

 

 

For the big guilds it will... actually do nothing. 300k per player? Donate, be done with it. But for some inexplicable reason, a small guild has to invest 50+ hours of grind per player.

[slafko]

Small guilds wanting Capital ships for peanuts is okay. But their logic is flawed.

 

Remember how your characters got their small ships? You do? Good. Because they didn't get them the second they've stepped off the landing pad. They got them after hours of play and successful negotiation of main storyline quests.

 

Did Qui-Gon whip up some new spare parts for Padme's damaged ship? He did not. He went on a side quest. Did he whine about it not being fair that they had to resort to child labor to fund their repairs? He did not. He strapped that little brat in that cockpit, wished him well and was done with it.

 

This is a frakkin' Capital Ship. It's not supposed to cost peanuts. It's supposed to cost credits and time and effort. That's how frakking ships work.

 

My country doesn't have an aircraft carrier. The UK has two, even Italy has two and the United States of Freedomfighters have like twenty. I mean seriously, where's the balance in that? Why should only big and rich countries have cool toys? I'm pettitioning the United Nations to give one aircraft carrier to Croatia right now. We don't even need aircraft; we'll just sail it up and down the coast and if Italians start being mean to us again, we'll cram it full of Albanian refugees and dump them at Ancona. Small countries need to have capital ships! *stomps feet*

Edited July 30, 2014 by slafko

[well]

Small guilds wanting Capital ships for peanuts is okay. But their logic is flawed.

 

Remember how your characters got their small ships? You do? Good. Because they didn't get them the second they've stepped off the landing pad. They got them after hours of play and successful negotiation of main storyline quests.

 

Did Qui-Gon whip up some new spare parts for Padme's damaged ship? He did not. He went on a side quest. Did he whine about it not being fair that they had to resort to child labor to fund their repairs? He did not. He strapped that little brat in that cockpit, wished him well and was done with it.

 

This is a frakkin' Capital Ship. It's not supposed to cost peanuts. It's supposed to cost credits and time and effort. That's how frakking ships work.

 

My country doesn't have an aircraft carrier. The UK has two, even Italy has two and the United States of Freedomfighters have like twenty. I mean seriously, where's the balance in that? Why should only big and rich countries have cool toys? I'm pettitioning the United Nations to give one aircraft carrier to Croatia right now. We don't even need aircraft; we'll just sail it up and down the coast and if Italians start being mean to us again, we'll cram it full of Albanian refugees and dump them at Ancona. Small countries need to have capital ships! *stomps feet*

 

Yes. I didn't pay for it. I even got a Droid Friday. No charge.