The harm PvPers do to PvE

[Khevar]

Have auto target on, have someone flagged run in front of you while you don't have a target, and hit an attack.

 

The system has just decided you want to be ganked (when chances are you wanted to hit another mob in range, like you had been doing the last 50 levels) because someone flagged ran in front of you (knowing exactly what would happen).

 

What should happen is a "no target in range" error or whatever error you typically get if you hit an attack and there's nothing to shoot. This should happen unless you are flagged yourself (or click/tab target them).

Thank you. So the actual issue (as brought up earlier) is auto-target.

Edited July 23, 2014 by Khevar

[Kunda]

Have auto target on, have someone flagged run in front of you while you don't have a target, and hit an attack.

 

That sounds a lot like you willfully attacking a flagged target, actually.

[Darth_Wicked]

Thank you. So the actual issue (as brought up earlier) is auto-target.

 

It's not auto-targeting.

 

As I mentioned earlier in this thread, I was once using Lightning Storm on my Sorcerer during the Gree Event, followed by Chain Lightning.

 

All over the sudden, I got flagged and ganked by three or four imperials. I can only assume one of them, possibly while using stealth, was too close when I used Chain Lightning and got attacked in the process.

 

Regardless, I don't use auto-targeting.

Edited July 23, 2014 by Darth_Wicked

[Khevar]

It's not auto-targeting.

 

As I mentioned earlier in this thread, I was once using Lightning Storm on my Sorcerer during the Gree Event, followed by Chain Lightning.

 

All over the sudden, I got flagged and ganked by three or four imperials. I can only assume one of them, possibly while using stealth, was too close when I used Chain Lightning and got attacked in the process.

 

Regardless, I don't use auto-targeting.

Interesting. There's got to be something else going on. (Or it doesn't happen all the time.) I wasn't able to reproduce this exploit, and I tried with 4 different classes worth of AOEs.

 

Did you have a companion out? Any chance that could be a factor?

Edited July 23, 2014 by Khevar

[hadoken]

That sounds a lot like you willfully attacking a flagged target, actually.

 

Sure does in that testing environment. Now picture you're fighting 5 mobs and you're hitting an attack (or have one queued) as one dies (due to a lucky crit) when someone runs in front of you flagged.

[Darth_Wicked]

Interesting. There's got to be something else going on. (Or it doesn't happen all the time.) I wasn't able to reproduce this exploit, and I tried with 4 different classes worth of AOEs.

 

Did you have a companion out? Any chance that could be a factor?

 

Fairly sure I was.

 

Also, I meant to say earlier that I was ganked by four Republic players, not Imperials, seeing I was with my Sorcerer. Regardless, ever since then, I just do the dailies for the Event with advanced classes who's spec is single-target based.

[mikebevo]

It's not auto-targeting.

 

As I mentioned earlier in this thread, I was once using Lightning Storm on my Sorcerer during the Gree Event, followed by Chain Lightning.

 

All over the sudden, I got flagged and ganked by three or four imperials. I can only assume one of them, possibly while using stealth, was too close when I used Chain Lightning and got attacked in the process.

 

Regardless, I don't use auto-targeting.

How long ago? At one time you could be flagged merely by people running through AoE, but that was fixed a long time ago. I believe it was still broke during the first Gree Event. I remember getting flagged with flyby. However, I know it was fixed before the last rakghoul event.

 

If I remember correctly it was broken at launch, they fixed it, then broke it again at some point. Right now I can say without doubt it is extremely difficult if not impossible to get flagged unless you target and damage another player. I have really tried.

Edited July 23, 2014 by mikebevo

[Vashy]

This is happening a lot on Ebon Hawk. There are entire guilds that are camping the Gree event with the intent on *********** with people in the PVE area of illum by running into AOE and in front of people that are using single target attacks.

 

I would like a 'DON'T FLAG ME EVER' button.

[BuriDogshin]

If you want Open World go to a PVP server. .

Not an option for many of the PvE-server griefers - they'd get ganked by griefers on a regular basis if they did.

 

And you know it's true. Players who are lousy at PvP resort to greifing PvEers: it's the only way they can get a win.

Edited July 24, 2014 by BuriDogshin

[Kalfear]

I'm sure he does, he just doesn't care. He and a few others in this thread are more interested in blaming the players that get flagged by the jackholes giving PVPers a bad name.

 

Well couple things here

 

1) Ultimately its the players themselves targetting the flagged players

 

YES these flag players are exploiting bad code and bad design, no arguement what so ever.

But thats on EA to finally fix this expoit they been using during the Gree event since the very first gree event.

 

Baffles me watching players turn on each other and get down right insulting and ignorant to each other because EA will not stop a well known and overly expoited exploit during the gree event (which seems to be when this behavior at its worst)

 

Personally I blame EA.

This exploit the flagged players using to swarm champions is very well known.

EA should have fixed this issue years ago (not an over exaggeration on the time line either) but for some god forsaken reason they refuse to address it and I have no doubt what so ever that their refusal ultimately costs them subscriptions and customers.

 

But lets be clear on a few things here (that you have said and Ive seen said in game)

 

1) These are not PVPers. Exactly how much do you have to suck at PVP that your forced use a exploit to flag PVErs who are already engaged in fights that ultimately have potential to wipe them out on their own. with out interference.

 

These not PVPers. These are greifers. These are just players with really crappy skills and abilities who try to bring others around them down to their lowest level. Real PVPers wouldn't be caught dead with these types. So please do not refer to these griefers as PVPers. They are as much PVPers as some level 5 F2P is a hardcore Raider.

 

(PS: Here is an example of how "brilliant" these types are.

Playing as my sorc (who is flagged by choice more often then not) and Im fighting Champion (my group mates were already dead from rushing gank squad while they fought Champion) so I ran right in front of Champion,

 

The oh so brilliant griefer followed me

Up goes my bubble that makes me immune to attacks for short period

Droid cant hurt me but is this nice juicy griefer standing right there still pounding on my bubble (guess "immune to this attack" didn't quite register)

So guess who became droid chow

Guy dies in seconds, I let bubble drop, force speed and my sheild bubble later Im out of combat and alive!

 

THATS how smart those griefers are

 

Please do not confuse them with real PVPers who understand not only their abilities but how to properly utilize their surroundings to their advantage as well)

 

2) I seen ALLOT of complaints today by players who take the 2 dailies inside the pvp area and then complain when they are killed.

 

ITS A PVP AREA, it tells you when you enter its a PVP area.

If you don't want to PVP, don't take those 2 missions

 

Closing

 

Ultimately the fault a person lags is his own

Yes its BS how the griefers exploit bad code to get you to make that mistake

But in the end its still your responsibility to be aware of who you targeting and attacking

Accidents happen

My commando got flagged today because I was filling in as a make shift healer in a group of 4 dps'er ansd group mate wasnt careful who he attacked.

He got flagged while I was healing him

Which flagged me

It sucked yes

but its still our fault in game

 

But if EA would just make it so in PVE areas unflagged players can not effect flagged players of either side unless they willingly turn on their PVP flag, all these headaches and drama would disappear over night

 

Well except for the griefers of course.

They would go back to being outright owned in warzones and mutual PVP contested and they would be whining up a storm about how unfair they cant gank with impunity is.

 

Them upset is a effect Im so willing to endure!

[Kalfear]

It's not auto-targeting.

 

As I mentioned earlier in this thread, I was once using Lightning Storm on my Sorcerer during the Gree Event, followed by Chain Lightning.

 

All over the sudden, I got flagged and ganked by three or four imperials. I can only assume one of them, possibly while using stealth, was too close when I used Chain Lightning and got attacked in the process.

 

Regardless, I don't use auto-targeting.

 

was that a typo?

Sorc have lightning storm and chain lightning, not rep characters

So if you were attacked by 3-4 imperials that can only mean it was a typo or you were in the PVP area of Ilum where its a Free For All and all players can attack each other.

 

So if you were in the PVP area

ummmm no bug required

you accepted the terms of free for all pvp by entering the pvp area.

 

There are 2 missions clearly marked pvp in that area and going there means you agree to PVPing

[LordArtemis]

Yes, folks can avoid being flagged. Just like they could avoid being flagged when they had the AoE flag thing in place. You could simply stop using AoE abilities when flagged folks were near.

 

But though that is good advice, that does not mean this should not be changed. The ability to attack flagged players if you are not flagged on a PVE server needs to be removed. You should have to flag to attack, and that process should be a "right click on portrait" choice, unless you wander into a PVP zone (and receive a warning).

 

That would remove ANY chance that someone could trick a player into a flag. And that is how it should be on a PVE server IMO.

[Darth_Wicked]

How long ago? At one time you could be flagged merely by people running through AoE, but that was fixed a long time ago. I believe it was still broke during the first Gree Event. I remember getting flagged with flyby. However, I know it was fixed before the last rakghoul event.

 

If I remember correctly it was broken at launch, they fixed it, then broke it again at some point. Right now I can say without doubt it is extremely difficult if not impossible to get flagged unless you target and damage another player. I have really tried.

 

If memory serves me right, it was around the time the Gree Event returned following the release of 2.0. Around Summer 2013 perhaps? July?

 

was that a typo?

Sorc have lightning storm and chain lightning, not rep characters

So if you were attacked by 3-4 imperials that can only mean it was a typo or you were in the PVP area of Ilum where its a Free For All and all players can attack each other.

 

So if you were in the PVP area

ummmm no bug required

you accepted the terms of free for all pvp by entering the pvp area.

 

There are 2 missions clearly marked pvp in that area and going there means you agree to PVPing

 

I guess you missed this...

Fairly sure I was.

 

Also, I meant to say earlier that I was ganked by four Republic players, not Imperials, seeing I was with my Sorcerer. Regardless, ever since then, I just do the dailies for the Event with advanced classes who's spec is single-target based.

Edited July 24, 2014 by Darth_Wicked

[Kalfear]

Yes, folks can avoid being flagged. Just like they could avoid being flagged when they had the AoE flag thing in place. You could simply stop using AoE abilities when flagged folks were near.

 

.

 

Yeah but big difference between the two LA

 

1 asks the player to simply play smarter

the other tells the player they cant use some of their class skills and abilities

 

drastic change between those two situations

 

But yes, as I said, in the end EA needs to fix this (like they should have done years ago already)

 

I mean its not a hard fix

 

if your in PVE zones you can not affect or interact with any flaged players unless they remove their flag or you intentionally turn yours on.

 

This would eliminate ALL abuses and screw ups

and as a added bonus would finally put the emphasis on the flagged players to change to non pvp before joining group (cant tell you how tired I am of flagged players joining groups thinking its ok if you get flagged and forced to waste 5-10 minutes in cantina to drop flag).

 

Win Win imo if they would just make the required fix.

 

But the two situations you mentioned are worlds apart in comparison with each other.

[Kalfear]

If memory serves me right, it was around the time the Gree Event returned following the release of 2.0. Around Summer 2013 perhaps? July?

 

 

 

I guess you missed this...

 

did miss that

much better

 

sorry but after the amount of complaints I heard on general today by PVEers who thought they should be allowed to go into the PVP area to quest and still be left alone, I take nothing for granted.

 

But least I did ask if it was a typo

Heh, I could have just gone off deep end instead LOL!

Seems to be the way in game and on forums lately

[LordArtemis]

Yeah but big difference between the two LA

 

1 asks the player to simply play smarter

the other tells the player they cant use some of their class skills and abilities

 

drastic change between those two situations

 

But yes, as I said, in the end EA needs to fix this (like they should have done years ago already)

 

I mean its not a hard fix

 

if your in PVE zones you can not affect or interact with any flaged players unless they remove their flag or you intentionally turn yours on.

 

This would eliminate ALL abuses and screw ups

and as a added bonus would finally put the emphasis on the flagged players to change to non pvp before joining group (cant tell you how tired I am of flagged players joining groups thinking its ok if you get flagged and forced to waste 5-10 minutes in cantina to drop flag).

 

Win Win imo if they would just make the required fix.

 

But the two situations you mentioned are worlds apart in comparison with each other.

 

I think that's fair, though I might argue about how different they are...after all, both are indications of smarter play...avoid AOE, avoid autotarget. But yes, one is abilities, the other is a game mechanic so I see your point.

 

I guess the most important point I made earlier and want to emphasize is that the same kind of arguments were made when folks were asking for the AOE flag ability to be removed. You could be smarter and be careful with your AOE use....but in that case Bioware agreed it was too easy to grief players.

 

And I think this is one of those cases as well...I do not present that as an argument toward your opinion or anyone else, naturally. Just a clarification on mine.

Edited July 24, 2014 by LordArtemis

[Kantaso]

For all those defending the PVP rights, may I go to a PVP server and demand that no one attacks me because I want to PVE? Is there a flag I can flagged myself as PVE only so no one can attack me? Think about it before you reply, because this is exactly what PVP lovers are asking us to do in a PVE server. Edited July 24, 2014 by Kantaso

[Code_Airwolf]

This was a fun thread to read.

 

My only addition to this conversation is, I tend to like auto-attack to mow through mobs quicker, and if I'm close to a strategic point or need a rest then I am careful on the last kill to not trigger it. Depending on what character I'm playing, auto-attack can be a longer range attack and cause more problems than characters with short ranged attacks, and I find the same with certain companions as well. So there's that.

 

But, I shouldn't have to turn off auto-attack because auto attack will also automatically target other players. It shouldn't consider other players an NPC via auto attack, unless I'm actively flagged and wanting to target other players. On a PVE server, there should be no ganking of players because of a random auto-target during NPC mobs. But that's just my two cents....could be a penny, I know it's not worth much.....

 

I did learn a good tip by reading through this thread that perhaps I'll turn off auto-attack and bind next target which will allow me to move through mobs almost just as fast and avoid triggering a PVP incident. It's pretty much what I did on a previous MMO, anyhow, so I'd be comfortable doing that. I'm wondering if auto-attack should be off by default. Especially considering it's probably one of the top 5 things new players will do in a group that gets a team possibly wiped.

Edited July 24, 2014 by Code_Airwolf

[Kantaso]

Code can you help me and explain how to do what you just wrote so I dont accidentally target a PVPer on PVE server.

[Code_Airwolf]

Code can you help me and explain how to do what you just wrote so I dont accidentally target a PVPer on PVE server.

 

I would, but it'll be the first time for me doing so in this particular game as well, so I'll be scouting around in Options settings myself next time I'm in game. Somebody else might be better equipped to answer that Q much quicker than I.

[Draqsko]

I would, but it'll be the first time for me doing so in this particular game as well, so I'll be scouting around in Options settings myself next time I'm in game. Somebody else might be better equipped to answer that Q much quicker than I.

 

How to turn off auto-target

 

I believe what you are looking for is a setting in the preferences in the Controls tab. Look for "Auto Target Closest Enemy". It is not a new setting but I think patch 1.2 turned it on as a default. I know it was turned off on my characters but when I logged in after 1.2, I noticed that I was auto-targeting mobs when I clicked an attack. I broke a few Crowd Controls before I figured out what was happening.

 

So check that setting in your preferences and uncheck it to stop that behavior.

 

How to keybind target next/nearest/previous enemy

 

It's in preferences > keybinds > targeting.

[Code_Airwolf]

Thanks, Draqsko!

[jorill]

my favorite part of the gree event is everyone complaining in the forum about the pvp aspect. Its much more entertaining than the actual event itself

[Vashy]

Anyone that defends pvpers ganking pvers through exploiting bad code is part of the problem.

 

I want a 'DO NOT FLAG ME EVER' button.

[TUXs]

Anyone that defends pvpers ganking pvers through exploiting bad code is part of the problem.

 

I want a 'DO NOT FLAG ME EVER' button.

Omg...drop the drama...they aren't "exploiting", they're taking advantage of lazy people. It's wrong, but stop dramatizing it. And please, STOP calling them "PvPers"...they're greifers, jackholes or gankers...the last thing they are is a PvPer.